Are those type of money chats strange?

[Furla22]

Please be gentle. I am a late 40s childless woman in a relationship with a man in his early 60s, he has adult children and young grandchildren. He has his property and planning to retire soon. I am happy in my job and work partly abroad. Due to my family arrangements (long story) I bought a large apartment cash and will be soon renovating. I also have other properties. We are not married. DP would like to get married. I don't. My DP is not happy that we keep our finances separate apart from household expenses. He often asks what my plans are with my other properties etc. We live together in a rental - (long story) it is due to work distance and convenience, all outcomes of covid. The apartment I bought I will be refurbishing from my own and my family money, it is in my name only. He wants to contribute to refurbishing (despite not planning to live there). DP also wants us to get back to his house. I don't, because it is his ex marital home, not much has changed there since his divorce over nearly 18 years . I do not feel I need to live there.
I also have an elderly mother (I am the only child) who has a comfortable place and I plan to look after her on a more structured basis. Cutting story short, I do not understand why my DP gets so angry at our finances being separate? Why does he want to contribute to a refurbishment of a property where his name is not on the deeds? Why does he push for marriage his age? There is a lot of 'money chats' around what my plans are. In all honesty I do not have many money plans as I still feel young and with time to make those decisions. DP gets very animated I do not want to consolidate any assets with him etc. Surely he should be happy I am not with him for money (his house/ pension) and take comfort from that rather than getting upset. I welcome your thoughts.

@TattoedLady what you said crossed my mind many times and I realise I am repeating myself here but I constantly wonder why? Why a person who has their own assets already, instead of managing them (selling, buying perhaps something smaller and getting rid off existing debt to enjoy life that is left over 60, to share experiences of travel etc), is so fixated about only one thing - merging assets or getting in debt late in life with me to buy another property? That being via marriage or property purchase. Why want more if you already have enough (unless it's not enough), why not focus on life. Look around what is the world we are living in? We are only here for a moment. I am such a joyous person deep down inside and always been full of laughter and fun. Today I am sad, entangled and fearful. But getting back to my question THE WHY is what is bothering me.
Everyone here says it is about his children and about what will be left for them. Surely my DP must realise that I can write my will and decide who is going to get my assets. I have never ever mentioned his assets as part of ours. I was always very clear about keeping it separate for security and due to our age. I remember a strange conversation back in a day when we still could have a child together where he was adamant we need bigger house first before a baby (bigger than 4bed he already had). I said to him that considering our age and additional mortgage we would have to take on, it would mean that whilst we had a little child, he would retire and I (having at that point still over 20years until my retirement) would have to pay this mortgage on my own. So the outcome would be: him sitting at home enjoying or not the late parenthood, me working and paying off the mortgage, being a carer for him, part time mother, and housekeeper. My DP didn't think there was anything wrong with that. Fast forward 20 years I would retire and yes I would have a child, elderly partner who may or may not be in good/ bad health, a massive house I never wanted and all my dreams and hopes gone. erm NO!

My DP has been saying for nearly a decade how 'we are never building anything together and it is because of me' to which I was always saying but is having our own little family with a baby and shared experiences together not the most beautiful thing to build? memories and legacy? My DP will then say - he means properties. I think we have different life energy and we do not match. I stupidly stayed in this out of fear and hope. 'Oh one day it will change.' @Oblomov22 I think your question rings a loud bell my end - yes I am in denial (less and less so now). That is why I come over here for words of wisdom, clarity and sanity. I know some of you will be rolling their eyes - oh god she goes on about it - but others will know how difficult it is to just jump, specially when you are a bit more mature. It is also very difficulty or perhaps most difficult to understand and come to terms with the fact that someone we invested our feelings and time with could have such motives.

Have a read, this may also help
medium.com/on-the-couch/the-sunk-cost-fallacy-how-to-detach-from-a-long-term-relationship-ad14e862ded4

Oh OP, I think the man is trying to tie himself to you financially to benefit from you, and also to be able to benefit by 50% if you split up. Don't be bullied into anything you're not 100% comfortable with.

Ask him 'why'

Why do you want to merge finances?
'To build a future'
How will merging finances help to build a future'
'It just will'
How will it, what are the benefits?

Rinse and repeat. You need to know how he feels it will benefit the relationship. He can't just say 'because it will' that's not an answer. Push and keep prodding him for an answer. I strongly suspect you won't get one as it's all to do with how it will benefit him, rather than you both as a couple

Well I'd hazard a guess that the 'why' is very easy...your property assets are worth more than his. I mean, they have to be - you have multiple properties, he has one.

And all of your assets, whether purchased in your name only or not, stand to become marital assets if you marry him. That means if you were to divorce a judge will take into account all the properties that you own, together or separately. You could say that you fronted the capital to purchase your own properties but the courts will most likely look at the 'marital asset' principle first. Even if you both, as a couple, never lived in these properties but mingled them as capital or as guarantee against a new joint mortgage, or he contributes to the reno, you're getting into risky territory. If, by some mystery, he survived you in life, he could claim that he was financially dependent on you and make a claim against your estate...say, if you have a will but didn't provide for him. And anything you jointly own goes to him if he survives you. So you see, your assets are worth quite a lot to a pensioner who seems overly concerned with your money.

If it was about creating a life together he'd see you already have that, and if it was about creating a little family together he'd have done that years ago. If you were my (only year or two!) older sister I'd tell you to protect your assets because you stand to lose far more than a relationship. Find your joy again.

@WizardOfUK prodding - good idea, may do again. I used to do a bit of that a while ago (stopped now). It went a bit like this: he would say the benefit be me living in a big house to which I would respond but I do not want to live in a big house. on and on and on.
In the end it felt as if my DP thought I will change my mind mid 40s and say "you were right, I so want to live in a big house in a middle of nowhere and whilst you are at home I have to commute 2h one way each day! (cynical here)' - mind you I used to commute that.

conclusions: I am thankful to all who shared their opinions here and will keep this thread open. Feel free to come back and add/ share your thoughts.

As for men in late 50s / early 60s I would love to hear from more experienced ladies - what is out there? Are they all pretty much the same grumpy moaners?

He's taking the piss OP, tell him to fuck off. Sorry, but in a nutshell...

Even if you put to one side all the money issues Op, this man doesn't seem to bring anything positive to your life. You're still young and he's just totally focussed on security and care in his old age, no fun, no sex and endless nagging at you to do as he wants.
I know it's hard to start again but you have so much you could be enjoying if you'd break away from him, you still have some good years to do as you like without worrying about caring for someone else. If you have money then think about all the lovely things you could be doing with it! Get away from him and go and live

They're not all the same, OP.
My Mum met the live of her life in her early 50s and they had nearly 30 happy years together.
Pragmatically though, it does help if you take steps to ensure you have a big social circle! Mum met her chap at a national convention thingy for her hobby.

I am back. Nothing much has changed but I wanted to leave you with a thought that really confused me.
I asked my DP recently what his dreams are. He just got a new job with above all excellent pay and terms and I thought he will be happy and excited, dreaming about all sorts of travel, places, things. Instead he says he isn't excited at all and that his dream is to pay off the last bit of his mortgage on his house. He says this mortgage stresses him out. Mind you he had it for 30 years but now suddenly since he met me (independent financially woman) the last year of his mortgage on high salary is super stressful. Next was a continuity of the dire tribe about how (because we have separate finances) we will never own a house together and we will never have our own kitchen etc. I pointed out that in previous sentence he just said that mortgage stresses him out so how come in the next sentences he wants a house with me.
Apparently I don't get it and what he wants is me not have my own place but buy out right together with him. Because I quote 'That is what all normal couples do'' (here we are kind of back to my October post above)
Most important - I do not want to buy a house.I have my own place. Am I suppose to sell what I have and like and buy a house with him I do not even want? Absurd! If anything I could consider another apartment in London but not a house in the countryside.
It really is like a scratched record here. I realise that but today my question is when will this grumbling about buying together end?
I hear about how his other friends bought a house and this and that. Great but I am me not his other friends. Why it is so difficult for him to understand that I do not want to buy a house with him?
This whole buying house together is some sort of commitment measure of all sorts. It almost feels like oh you don't buy a house with me therefore you don't love me.
All thoughts welcomed.

I don't know what more you want us to say - he sees you as his potential nurse with a purse for his old age.

if you don't want to buy a house with him, tell him that, and if he keeps on nagging about it, dump him.

You sound like a catch, why stick it out with someone who keeps trying to push you into things you don't want?

He's after cash and a carer. Do not cave and risk your money and assets.

All thoughts welcome you say?

Why do think anyone might have anything to say that hasn't been said already?

For whatever reason you seem to want to stay with this man. Even though he annoys you and his motives seem questionable. Do you envisage the relationship being better in 10, 20 years' time ?

No, I thought not. So why are you staying...

I completely agree with this.

@ShellsOnTheBeach I agree with you and I agree if anyone would say my behaviour is annoying but equally some would agree it is difficult to just walk away. Answering your question (valid question) - I guess what really puzzles me in this why would a man go on and on about buying a house if his partner made is abundantly clear that she will not buy with him. Why not just accept it and move on? I guess I still struggle with accepting what is going on. I am sure we all been there at some point in life. Hoping something will change, or worse like me, thinking perhaps I am being harsh maybe I should. Then gut feel screams and I slap myself. It is not like have children together and I will be looking forward to making home together, Sunday lunches etc. This house would be a dread. Away from everything and everyone, constant cleaning, him getting older, me too. Mid/late 40s I think I still have a lot of fun ahead of me right?
I think I come here and ask these questions seeking some reassurance. Ultimately if I am here and moaning abut the situation, it means I am aware and progressing towards a solution. It is just taking me a lot longer than some and I seek reassurance. Each of your thoughts is valuable because it makes me self reflective. Really is helpful. Thank you.

sorry lots of typos - fast typing!

He's not accepting it because he thinks he can wear you down into agreeing.

Look, I'm sure he likes you, but he is absolutely seeing you as someone he can milk for money, either for himself for his children.

We have said this again and again and again.

You are so young compared to him. He is so grasping. He is desperate for your money and your properties. And if having your money isn't enough, he wants you to look after him in his old age as well.

I am really shocked that you are still with this man after everything everyone has said. I know it's hard to detach from a relationship, but for fuck's sake, this man is just seeing you as someone who can fund his lifestyle.

Put an end to it now!

@determinedtomakethiswork thank you for your comment. You are right. I am young and independent yet I feel old, sad, exhausted and miserable because I can not see future for this.

I will be updating here.

For now one more question to all here: How should a man in these circumstances behave?
What should be happening if the relationship was healthy/ normal/ average for our age group?

Answering imagine I am your friend, sister, daughter and you are patient with me.
I realise I drive all and myself mad with this but trust me this is my only outlet here.

He ought to listen to you and NEVER try to push you to do something that you are not comfortable with and which is not in your best interest.

You might want to read Women Who Love Too Much

Nurse with a deep purse

@N4ish yes there is that chance that I may care for my mother and him at the same time. I remember him mentioning how my Mum could live with us (?!?!) I found the idea bizarre why would my Mum move away from her comfortable large apartment where she has friends etc and I visit her to a house in the middle of nowhere that is so unfamiliar to both her and me? Whether it is his ex marital house he owns or another house he wants us to buy (not us! only himself!)
Only now that I read all the comments here again I realised that in fact it all starts making sense. Hypothetically my Mum moves into the house with us and I end up looking after 60+ and 80+. What about me? Where is my work, pleasure, my life here in this? Plus don't you think that he would then start asking me to sell my Mum's place and put the money towards paying down the mortgage. The same mortgage for the same house I do not want. Then fast forward a decade and if something happens the money will dilute in the mortgage, I will be left with nothing and his children will get the house. Am I getting it right in my little head?

Took that to heart and practiced. No direct answer.
Him: Oh because we will live in a big comfortable house. Me: But I don't want to live in a big house. Him: But I want because I suffocate in flats.
Always about him. How he will have a garage and how he needs a hobby room and a large garden. Not a garden but large garden because he wants to have BBQs for his friends. Oh you mean the same BBQ where I will be cooking and serving. Me: yes, there are these great catering companies that do everything so the hosts can enjoy the BBQ with their guests. They provide everything. Him: when so and so had a BBQ they didn't have that service. Me : I know but we would, wouldn't we?
Carer, cleaner, Gardner, cook, housekeeper, nurse, purse, what else?

For now one more question to all here: How should a man in these circumstances behave?
What should be happening if the relationship was healthy/ normal/ average for our age group?

I am a little confused why you are asking this. He hasn't been behaving well at all to you for year and years. He cheated you of a child and now wants to cheat you of your property and assets. Anything else you need to know?

How should be behave? Respect your opinions to keep your finances separate. Stop badgering you as if you do not have a mind of your own. When you wanted a child, make it clear to you that was not in his plans so you are decide whether to stay with him not string you along until it is too late in all senses of the word.

I am so angry for you. But you need to accept this for yourself because I don't why you need to continue to turn this over and over. What scrap are you hoping to find? Game over.