How do I live with a very private partner?

[Franklyfrost]

I’ve been going to couples therapy and recently had a session where my partner couldn’t turn up. In this session the therapist pointed out that my dp was extremely private. I’ve realised that she’s right.

The main problem we were having is that I would feel unhappy about something, communicate this to dp and he would say the problem was not what I thought it was but my reaction to it. For example, he turned up 7 hours late from a bike ride with friends without letting me know. This left me looking after the kids all Sunday long. The problem for him is me taking issue with this rather than his failure to inform me of his change of plans. His take on what he wants from our relationship is ‘I ask you for nothing and you ask me for nothing’.

I’m interested in replacing the word ‘a-hole’ with the word ‘private’ in my thoughts about dp. With the bike ride example he would find it intrusive to have to tell me he’d be home later, he never tells me where he’s going when he goes out or when he’ll be home from work, he never communicates how he feels, yesterday he took offence at the insurance company asking why he didn’t want to renew his policy (he refused to answer even if the poor call handler just needed to tick a box), also yesterday he was outraged that his father asked him to bring a very minor, valueless item he needed for a repair when he was going round to visit his parents because it was an imposition on his autonomy.

He is intensely, perhaps pathologically, private. He doesn’t want to hear how his behaviour makes me feel and doesn’t want to discuss how he feels. I don’t think that is ever going to change. What is this? How do I live with it? Has anyone come to terms with having an extremely private partner? Is it some sort of psychological disorder? Please no ‘leave now’ comments, life is complicated and now is not the time to leave.

Nothing about your original post screams 'privacy' to me. It sounds like selfishness or lack of commitment. He would call it 'freedom' and 'autonomy'. How can you possibly raise children with a partner who won't tell you what time he will be home? It's irresponsible on his part and leaves you shouldering all the responsibility. If he values his freedom so much, he shouldn't even be in a relationship. I doubt you will get anywhere with this man as he does not want to consider your point of view.

Does he logically understand there are consequences for actions and behaviour?

Does he have friends? I guess he does if he went on a bike ride with them. If he repeatedly kept friends waiting for hours presumably they'd get fed up with his behaviour and not put up with it? So does he respect their time?

He can act within the social boundaries need for work I presume or he would be fired?

So, what are your boundaries? It's hard to do everything at once so start with one thing. Clear times for plans discussed and kept to.

For example:
Being more than 30 minutes late to a family activity is unacceptable apart from in an emergency. After 30 minutes he needs to tell you how late he will be so that you can decide whether to wait for him. You will be leaving without him after 45 minutes if there is no communication.

That's the practical boundary set - he may think okay, no problem - you just do your thing.

Then you set your emotional boundary - I don't want to be with someone who repeatedly lets me down on planned events.

These are just examples - you set your own boundaries and consequences.

At the moment he's very clear about his needs and boundaries - you are not setting out yours.

He thinks I should feel loved because he loves me.

He patently doesn't though.

In shorter terms - you may never be able to get him to respond emotionally in the way you want him to, BUT you should expect a level of respect in his actions towards you which you are not getting right now.

Op can you explain why you are so focused on talking about feelings - his and yours , and why you say so little to him about actions?

You ( and your counsellor ) seem to be caught in a cycle of trying to get him to say how he feels or getting him to acknowledge your feelings, which he is not going to do. Or trying to get him to say “ I love you “ or “ I want to stay married to you “.

When the main issue actually seems to be how he behaves.

He opts out of parenting.
He avoids his share of his Houshold duties.
He is a selfish son.
He has opted out your marriage completely ( if he was ever in it ).

Could he be on the spectrum op? Some people who are autistic (not everyone) have very different ways they believe people should act/ behave. Especially if he doesn’t see it as an issue, could it be that he doesn’t realise why it’s an issue?

Im a very private person IRL (more open online as its anonymous).

My own parents dont know I had cancer 10 years ago, no one (except DH, my boss for time off and doctors) in my real world life knows I TTC for 10 years and my child is the result of IVF for example because they where deeply personal experiances, your partner however is just a straight up asshole.

I have never treat people like that I ESPECIALLY wouldnt treat my DH like that... there is ZERO fucking reason not to tell someone your going to be late (not that he was late he was off living his life while you single handly take care of the responsabilities) thats just plain rude regardeless of if you are 'private' or not.

Theres also no reason to be 'offended' at being asked by your parents to do them the simple favor of fetching something you have when you already planned to go over.

What you DH is doing is living his own life with zero regard for how it effects you the person who has to co-shoulder his responsabilities or anyone else - he is just plain selfish.

Unless I’m unreasonable in my requests.

Of course you're not. Nobody with any sense whatsoever would think you were being unreasonable. He just wants you to think you're being unreasonable, because if you believe that, it means he can keep on behaving exactly how he wants. You are being massively taken advantage of.

Btw he completely invalidates your feelings and perspective when he says, 'My behaviour isn't to blame. The way you see things and react is at fault'. He is giving himself carte blanche to behave however he likes, whenever he likes. You have said that you don't want to leave him but you are wasting your time trying to 'understand' him. He is actually very transparent, not complex at all. He is selfish and determined to live his life on his own terms without considering other people.

At first reading this I thought he had no feelings, however if he gets angry or annoyed that's still a feeling. So I think he has no feelings for you whatsoever. Keeping you waiting doesn't register, as he doesn't care how it impacts you, the same with sex, he wants it and it doesn't matter a bit to him if you enjoy it or not, it's not that he's choosing not to care, sounds like it doesn't even register to care. Things like getting annoyed at you asking him not to put a spoon in the dishwasher is such an odd thing for someone with no emotion, to have an emotion about. Or is it because it impacts him, and he doesn't want to not put it in the dishwasher?

What I think I mean (& I'm not being nasty) is that you are nothing to him, not even worth considering, it's almost like you don't exist to him, he treats you like a human doll which isn't alive, so he doesn't have to consider your feelings. Would you worry about keeping a doll waiting, would you think to tell a doll you'll be late?

This is way, way more than just being a private person.
“I ask you for nothing and you ask me for nothing” is not a relationship.

either it’s some sort of pathological disorder but that would be really quite rare

Pathological disorders are not rare, estimated 10-15%, through SPECT scans the understanding of brain structures is increasing and potentially more people will be formally diagnosed. It just means that talking therapies will have little impact if pathological. Even if it's trauma bases he would have to invest significantly and want to change but he is very far away from wanting his life to be mutually beneficial to his partner.

@Franklyfrost - You said you wanted to try and understand your partner's behaviour, so I'm going to offer a few suggestions:

Look up "avoidant personality"/"avoidant attachment". Explore "fear of engulfment". Here are a few links to start with:

www.attachmentproject.com/blog/avoidant-attachment-style/
www.womenshealthmag.com/relationships/a40168467/avoidant-attachment-style/
goodmenproject.com/featured-content/when-your-relationship-triggers-engulfment/

This is your husband. He will not be a reliable witness to his childhood. He will not be able to open up to you unless he wants to get help; and right now it is far safer and easier for him to believe you are the problem.

Finally, the gestalt statement of only being able to work on yourself isn't quite as narrow as you might think. Working on yourself - dealing with your own issues - can often assist someone to leave unbearable circumstances because they finally understand that they are not responsible for them, they can't change the other person, and that self-work is ultimately the work of liberation.

OP, what is it you want from this thread? Is it support to stay and try to work things through? Was it to vent? It sounds like you're right and he's never going to change. You don't want to leave. There's not much else that you can do other than find a hobby and something that makes you feel alive and happy (away from your kids) and focus on that so it fills some of the hole he's clearly not filling.

Thank you everyone for your replies I’ve read them all, many of them more than once. It’s good to have some leads to follow and plenty of differing points of view to chew over.

His behaviour is so strange. I would think perhaps somewhere in the realms of Schizoid personality disorder.

Link:
www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/schizoid-personality-disorder/symptoms-causes/syc-20354414

Regarding the sex thing, it’s not necessary to tick every box to be diagnosable.

I am not a professional. I only propose you read the symptoms of that OP, so you can have this narrative you need before you will accept his behaviour is profoundly wrong and unacceptable.

Even if he is unwell, he would need qualified professionals, not a wife and children.

You may simply have to accept he is incapable. No deep justifications and narratives needed.

You have a duty to look after your own well-being too, not just the children. You would be modelling, strength, independence, principles, and boundaries for them.
Everything you do now is preparing them for the future. Do not prepare them to develop a complex slave mentality, that’s abuse.

He isn’t “very private”. He’s a selfish controlling arsehole. If he genuinely did not want anyone at all to know his daily whereabouts or touch any of his things then he shouldn’t have gotten into relationships or have had children.

I’m sorry OP, but he isn’t going to change. No amount of couples therapy will change him.

This is not a healthy dynamic and atmosphere for you and your children.

I completely agree.

There’s being private or having trauma or additional needs etc

And there’s being a dick.

The fact that he’s not even trying to meet you half way or take you’re feelings on board proves that he is in fact just a dick.

You say you “think” you love him, and that’s what keeps you in it…

What does love look like to you if you had to define it?
Does any part of your mental vision of love involve getting love back, if so, what would be some examples of that?
Is it still love if you are with someone who treats you badly? Or is it an emotional trauma bond? Is love pain for you? Then you have mislabelled a feeling as love that isn’t love.

I just read your OP - didn't read any replies. But the example you gave of your DH turning up 7 hours late from a bike ride struck me as really inconsiderate and selfish, not about being a private person. It was very unfair not to let you know that he was running late - and not just slightly late, but 7 hours late! For all you knew, he could have fallen off his bike and been in an accident. A quick phone call or text would have taken about 30 seconds. But he's acting like a single man, not someone with a wife and children. He has no interest in your feelings - seems like he just gets irritated when you raise the issue and blames you for over-reacting. It sounds like he sees nothing wrong with his behaviour so I don't imagine he's going to change. This may not be a good time for you to leave but I don't see a future for you with this man.

Might be better to live in separate houses but continue to be in a relationship.

Oh sweetheart, he's never going to change because he doesn't believe he's in the wrong about anything. For yours & children's sakes, you DO need to leave him. He's deeply selfish, disrespectful & abusive. Life is far too short & precious to allow yourself to be beaten down like this by an excuse of a man who you 'think' you love & who 'probably' loves you.

You know, your relationship seems like such hard work, so unfulfilling. It shouldn't be like that. It shouldn't be causing you so much hurt. You should be partners, facing fand what it throws at you together, supporting each other, leaning on the other when you need to.

Do you think your counselling sessions have helped at all? Is he coming to any kind of understanding? Are you? Or is he just going through the motions because he believes he has to? Perhaps you should have some sessions on your own, with a different counsellor. Explore your feelings and why you are willing to put up with this, and have done for so many years.

life and what it throws at you......

I really am dumbfounded at what some women will tolerate, especially with a top drawer creep like this one! It’s truly shocking.

I’m wondering now if being in this forum too long might desensitise one to extremes of behaviour?

I hope there are not too many men who read these pages… if I were such a man “a special top drawer creep”, all of this would inspire me that it’s possible to behave in truly diabolical, bizarre and abusive ways, and still have a woman looking after your children, cleaning your house, and coming home to a nice hot dinner and all the sex you want. Just wow. Who knew, I really had no idea! Reading this forum has been so eye opening!!! Is anyone else having a similar experience reading this? This is all so dangerous.

You don't want to leave yet, fine . But think long term its the only solution that will make you happy.
Meanwhile i guess you just don't rely on him (so if he needs to be back for five for you to leave at 6 you habe ab alt plan), you stop trying to confide and connect and look to your friends and family for that, and you let him bury himself behind his wall until youre ready to go. At ehich point he'll be surprised and wont understand why