Is it ever possible to beat a narcissist at their own games?

[MeltdownCentral1]

Is it? I just want justice.

No, that’s what they want you to do and what they get off on.

I’m following with interest …

Yes, i think it is in certain circumstances. I feel like get one up on my ex quite often because I know him so well, give much less of a fuck than I used to and I'm cleverer than him

I guess it depends what kind of ‘game’ is this you are talking about OP.

Here are a few things which might help.

1.Games need rules. Ns aren’t interested in any ‘rules’. The rules are what they decide as they go along.

2.Most people want a win:win. Ns prefer win:lose, advantage them. They may be prepared to go lose:lose.

3.Nothing is ever resolved (the game is never over).

Im not sure if Ns can be ‘fooled’. Maybe temporarily eg if they are fawned over or flattered : ‘the fooled john and the manipulative prostitute’ arrangement come to mind. But mostly I think they are far too suspicious, even paranoid, of people’s motives. So mostly only very short-term. If you were super super clever it might be possible in certain circumstances but what would it be for, as energetically the price is high.

Generally though you can’t win if you play their game as they won’t play unless they have the advantage …. Id say mostly it’s best to walk away.

No , they thrive on drama. The best way is to disengage and ignore as much as possible.

The only way to win against a narcissist is to refuse to battle at all.

This! And live your live well and happy without them.

Justice can mean lots of things. I did fight a nasty narcissist colleague - for justice - I went to war. I actually got her sacked.

Was it worth it? Not really. I had the satisfaction. A few people understood but kept quiet about their support or me; most took her side. My life was hell for 2 years and I lost a lot of trust in people … even more as the years have gone by and I’ve met a few more nasty pieces of work …

God no. Why would you even want to? Don't lower yourself.

This is kind of how it works for me. I can tell when he's trying to create a drama and take preemptive action to disarm him. It has taken many years to get to this point. I'm hyper vigilant. And I have less to lose than I used to because I care so much less. It takes the power away from him.

PS. As they are FUNDAMENTALLY deluded - what Scott Peck calls “People of the Lie” - they will always believe their version of reality and see themselves as the victim rather than the protagonist. However insane, untrue and impossible, it makes no difference.

I doubt it, it’s something they’d enjoy as it’s drama and about them

I guess we have no context, and also the word is bandied around quite freely.

But the best thing I’ve done with my Ex who is narcissistic is to put up boundaries and stick to them. We share a child so I had to, to protect myself. I could battle and try to make him ‘lose’ but the drama, energy and possible kickback would be awful. It’s best not to care.

Justice is recognising that you don't give a shit any more.

give a shit about the battle anymore

Opt out. Don't bite. Ever. Take control away from them with a wall of silence. Block on everything. It's the only way to take power back. It sucks to deal with when you take the leap, but it gets easier to live with every day.

But Watchkeys you might give a shit if big things were at stake. Usually it might not be, after all narcissists are usually very petty when it comes down to it. But maybe sometimes it would be bigger things. I’m not talking about minor romantic relationships here. As a PP said, some context might be relevant.

The only way a narcissist ever gets beaten is if they come up against an even bigger one.

Where possible I do believe the best strategy is to “step aside”. You know the whole “Never wrestle with a pig, you both get dirty and the pig likes it” thing.

(but still, some Ns are also big players and get away with too much in the world and so sometimes there’s a way of fighting, usually walking away speaks volumes, it’s a tricky one)

@StrawberryFurl

What sort of 'big things'? Laws are for justice. For personal matters, walking away from narcissists and the problems they create is the only way forward. Like we tell the kids about the bullies. Rather than 'Only fight with them if they really piss you off.'

I think I gave a good example.

Watching with interest.

have walked away on a few of Nc’s battles recently. It’s how I stay away is the question

Nope. But life can stop them in their tracks.

My hideously, narcissist GM died following a massive stroke in June 1984. She told me that I was dead to her in May 1984 because as a 17 year old I went on a school trip to London that my parents saved for over many weeks to pay for rather than spending that school holiday week at her house.

Which one? If someone breaks a rule, you report them to the authoritative body in the matter. That's not about dealing with narcissists, that's just basic life.

There's nothing special about dealing with a narcissist. It's like any other unhealthy behaviour pattern; you stay away from it.

XH is a narc. After our separation, had a fling with the Dr that treated xh's erectile dysfunction. XH insisted he was gay as he was kind. Hé wasn't, or if he was, hé hid it well!