To think most men aren’t cut out for relationships?

[Curiousturle]

Most men don’t seem to be good at being partners, let alone the cheating, affairs, constantly on the look out for younger, prettier models etc ? Given half the chance most would shag around and so many look at porn, use sex workers etc. Many are selfish, don’t pull their weight at home etc

Coming from a family with lots of brothers, being more friendly with guys than women and being married, I disagree a little. I think it depends on the guy. I only know one who has cheated, I disagree with his cheating but there were circumstances around it and our whole friendship group argued with him and explained how disappointed we were in him for doing that. (The majority of the group are guys and they all said they had thought better of him)

I think a lot of men are tarnished with the same brush sadly. Yes there are immature men out there who are rubbish in relationships, need to grow up and stop messing around but there’s also so many good guys who don’t do that and don’t stand by their friends who do it either .
I also think there are lots of women who cheat too and are definitely not cut out for relationships but it’s probably not talked about as much.

Maybe you need to look at the common factor in all of the relationships you’ve been in to see if that’s where the issue is. I agree with those above who say that you are wrong. My husband, my father, my brothers,,and many other men I know are good, honest decent men, in happy committed relationships.

I think the same is equally true about women. The best ones at relationships don't tend to be single for long.

I agree that most men are not suited to long-term monogamous relationships. I also don't think that in general men have the urge to procreate in the same way that many women do. I don't come across many men who dream of getting married or being fathers, but loads of men who dream of having sex. This is not a bad thing. There's no reason why they should want to be faithful husbands or involved Dads. Being in a relationship is not aspirational for many men. They would prefer to have lots of sex, with different people and not commit to children. And that's a perfectly valid way to be. Doesn't mean they are not good honest and decent men.

Agree with the OP

My ExH and his 3 brothers have all cheated more than once.

I have had countless married men hit on me over the years, some of these men were considered wonderful husbands and fathers and it shocked me to my core.

My friend got into a distance relationship a few years after her serial cheat of a H was sent packing. After about six months she felt she could introduce him to her children and they met him two or three times over the next six months. Her family and friends were so happy for her, he was such a nice guy and treated her so well..........until she discovered he was married with three children. He was so bloody good at playing it out, we were all conned by him.

I’m not sure where this idea that the ‘good ones’ are ‘taken’ by 17 comes from.:…

Why would being single at 30 mean you’re bad at relationships? I can’t really think of any men I know who were in their relationship before 30 - they were establishing their careers (long degree + ten years postgrad is the norm).

The implication that marriages only end for good men if they’re widowed or cheated on is also just…..bizarrely judgmental.

So odd to form such sweeping opinions with a clearly narrow experience of life.

OP there are lots of good men, just as there are lots of good women. I would have said the majority of people aren’t great at relationships; the mature ones have insight and work at it. The immature ones think there’s such a thing as a ‘good one’ that will have been snatched from their grasp by the age of 25……

To be fair, I was on of the hookup sites a couple a couple of years ago looking for a FWB ( who I have met, lovely lady), and there plenty of married women looking for discreet extra marital sex, hotel hookups etc, certainly not every other person, but a good 30% seemed to describe themselves as bored in their marriage

There's some truth in this but this does all seem to be premised on the idea that women are fundamentally good and men flawed.

A lot of women are difficult to live with on a long term basis. But that just seems t o get overlooked or excused. Lack of accountability applies more to women in my experience.

@Casper10

Defo wasn't saying women are perfect. Far from it

However the topic of the thread is about men so I was talking about them.

Maybe if you want to discuss about women you can start your own thread?

So true.
Little snakes.
DP works for a global manufacturer all the salespeople are well known for being loose. In fact, let's call a spade a spade, workplace-work events are a hotbed of both men and women married or not being loose. Boys' and girls' nights out are the same, I've worked in hospitality people are indirectly and directly crossing boundaries all the time.
It's literally like Sodom and Gomorrah. You cannot trust anybody.
I think men and women mirror each other, both parties are useless. At a recent spa day in Windsor, a woman entered the sauna and proceeded to slag off her husband despite the fact he'd paid for both the MIL and the wife. Later on, we met her in the bar. She continued to moan about him and men in general. Men over 30 are fat, lazy, etc. I just thought, yes you are attractive but you're a snake, so not trustworthy.
Most men don't leave because of chores, or dinner, most men don't give a fuck about chores. What they do care about is life being liquidated in a split, then access to children once every 2 weeks on a Saturday. My mate was telling me about his wife on constant girl's nights out, barfing in the toilets, crashing around. It's not uncommon. But he stays and tolerates it.

I think society has poor boundaries, and too many conflicts of interest to make being in a relationship smooth sailing.
Dp is a good egg, Eastern European with old-fashioned values. but even she is still distracted by the other. It's frustrating sometimes.

I agree with some points.
I'd say a lot of men have an issue with some form of vice.
Alcohol
Drugs-coke- 2 friends have confessed to being on the drug 24/7-a friend was actually caught having a key whilst putting his baby to bed.😐
Gambling
Porn/prostitutes.

Being in a relationship is not aspirational for many men. They would prefer to have lots of sex, with different people and not commit to children. And that's a perfectly valid way to be. Doesn't mean they are not good honest and decent men.

this how been my experience so surprised to see so many saying men want relationships mine experience has been the opposite of that!

I'm a woman and I'm effing useless at relationships.

Not my experience. I have some failed relationships behind me but I've not encountered serial cheating or use of sex workers or porn as an issue in my relationships, they failed due to more benign compatability issues

One of the reasons women bother with men is because many women can't afford to be solo parents so they need the financial backing of a man to raise the child. So they get together and stay in unsatisfactory relationships, for the convenience, for as long as possible. Some cheat, others just quietly resent each other for years.

This is awful really, for both parties,
I can’t imagine what for a woman to say me , “I used to for your resources to raise my children “,

Some men are good at relationships just as some women are also good at relationships.

Some women are not good at relationships also like some men aren't good at relationships.

I had great relationships when younger, lived with men, engaged, longer term. As I've got older I tend to bail after 4-6 months. Maybe I'm a commitment phobe? Who knows?

I know a cousin of SIL who seems to go for unsuitable men (like her current boyfriend), she was dating a lovely man but I think he was 'too nice' for her, and she ended it.

I'm currently chatting to a man from a sort of dating app (Thursday) seems a real commitment phobe and another who seems normal and nicer.

Men watch porn that’s normal, if your bar for “good” man who can be in a relationship is no porn then that’s insanely high. Men have different needs. Don’t tolerate cheating.
As for not “pulling their weight”, that means whatever the women they’re with want it to mean, obviously plenty of women are reasonably happy with men who don’t do their “share”, so that’s not really the blanket issue it seems just because it’s an issue to you and some other women. Just don’t get with the men you don’t like.

The important thing to living with and having good relationships with men is to accept that men and women are fundamentally different deep down and thinking otherwise is just setting yourself up for constant disappointment.

@Hrpuffnstuff1

I don’t think men see porn as a vice any more than masturbating to fantasy in their head. The important thing I think is men who have a passion or hobby are less likely to develop addiction issues.

There was an interesting study I read that said that the more estrogen a person had the more likely they were to express dissatisfaction with a relationship. Weird but true (even in lesbian relationships). So maybe it’s all chemical and those chronically unsatisfied with men truly can’t help but become that way over time?

@springsally

Thats because only a certain subsection of women actually think their is a “crisis in masculinity”. For men there is no crisis, to be male is to be masculine, nothing can change that, there is no crisis.

Probably they’re more preoccupied with solving the crisis of women pointing out some crisis they don’t think is a crisis.

Isn't that Internalized Misandry ?.

I'd say that on the whole I don't agree with OP's premise.

But, as i have got older, i have noticed that the % of men i know that are at least unconsciously misogynistic is much higher than i had always assumed.

I had always thought it was a minority, but in truth i think it's much more like 50/50.

Many of these I think are just carrying on with roles/attitudes that they have grown up with/been used to (their wives/partners likewise), rather than them being active misogynists.

But the effect is still the same:

• they all have jobs that rule their families


• their free time is prioritised above the families


• the mental family load is borne by the women in most cases

This thoroughly depresses me, and makes me very concerned for my DD's future.

In our house we've always been a partnership. And we've been very clear to our DCs that this is how families should work. But there's no guarantee that they'll find someone who thinks similarly (or that they won't find someone who grinds them down eventually).

I can only hope that the increased exposure and discussion around misogyny, coercive control and emotional abuse continues enough that they feel comfortable confronting/escaping any bad situations they might find themselves in.

So if we buy into gender stereotype like ‘men watch porn that’s normal ‘ then we know also that men like ‘ desiring ‘ and many women seek to feel ‘ ‘desired’

your statement about men and porn is no different to me saying many women ( not all ) like to Show their nude bodies online and men thinking a ‘good ‘ woman is one who doesn’t let others see her naked body online is setting his bad way too high.
Both using porn and ‘ being porn’ can use the age old excuse men use if there being no physical contact!!!
yet we all know. Wry very few men are ok with their wives or gfs showing their naked body to other men
so why the hell should women accept men doing the exact same thing in reverse. Just waiting to sit back and laugh at the hurdles people will jump thru to try and justify oh but it’s different . No it’s not !
if it’s ok for a man to get off to anonymous women it’s ok for his partner to let other men get off to her IF she chooses and he can’t justifiably say a thing … after all it’s harmless fun , right ….
min fact , considering so many men say porn is their business and keep it secret I see no reason a woman needs to tell her partner if she publishes her nudes not showing her face.

Regardless of how many women would like to do that it’s should absolutely be accepted as fine by men who use porn !!!