AIBU Would you be worried about this friendship?

[Lucyofthemichealcar]

Background:
Married for 11 years and together for 17.
H very outgoing, fun loving and flirty but never had concerns. Similar personality to me, so a bit of flirty banter is fine so long as we both respect the line.
Since married neither or us go out as much and since kids deffo not.
Both of us have male and female friends. Being friendly with a woman doesn't bother me but the dynamic between these two has always seemed different but cannot put finger on it.

H and his work friend.
I would say she definitely fits into my H's 'type'. They teach together. They are in different departments so it does not sound as if they speak every day or every week but they do seem to catch up face to face at lunch or over messenger if it has been a few weeks. She goes back to the US every summer and as far as I know they go weeks then with no communication so they are not always in each others pockets but it seems in the school they are very much viewed as a pair, so get paired up to chaperone school events and over the years they have organised several trips together as they both say if they are stuck with colleagues for a week it needs to be someone they get on with and like and apparently because they trust each other to organise and not mess things up when carting around 50 odd teenagers. Looked at messages from her when I was in the throes of pregnant paranoia and the chat is friendly but mundane. Not even flirtatious. She asks after me and H about her partner. The tone is how he talks to all his other friends. We have had her round for dinner and she has also done the same and we have went for drinks together. All very nice and above board. Done the odd favour like making us a whole load of meals when our kitchen was getting renovated and doing a food shop when we had covid or helping with looking after cat when we were away but I just can't shake a feeling she does it all to look good to H. She is very American and brings round baking, goes all out at christmas and since I have known her has always given me and the kids gifts (all our birthdays are in Late Nov/Dec so they are birthday/xmas gifts). Her and H also always exchange birthday gifts but they are stupid cheap items as part of a running joke from work. She seems keen to be friends with me too and suggested going for a wine or doing a gym class but as I said something always seems off and never felt entirely comfortable around her in the 9 years her and H have been friendly.
She has a BF of 12 years but they have never married and don't cohabit which seems strange.

Why am I concerned?
Aside from being pregnant and crying at the drop of a hat, what has made me question it all is that three weeks ago my H stayed at her house overnight. She got a phonecall at work to say her mum had passed back in the states. Her partner was away on business and she had a meltdown at work. H brought her back to ours but she said she wanted to be at home, pack and get the first flight home. H took her back to her place. He came back after dropping her off and asked me if I minded him staying to keep an eye but i think he had pretty much made up his mind while I said yes or not. He stayed the night in her spare room and then drove her to the airport at 3am. At the time I did feel like she could have reChed out to other friends but i suppose if that was me I would be all over the place too. She and her BF came by a few days ago with a restaurant voucher for the two of us to say thank you for being there for us. We have two kids and I am seven months pregnant with our third. Is it hormones or should I be worried?

H sensed I wasn't okay when he came back after dropping her off and I said how I felt and he said there was and never had been anything between them that I could check through messages etc if it put my mind at ease but I don't know. Have asked friends in the past and they have said it is a bit of an unusal one but probably because as a society we generally are uspicious of male female friendships unless they have been sustained through childhood and adolescence.

AIBU?

OP, having read all your posts, this is a tricky one.

On the one hand, working in a staff room is one of those work spaces where good friends are so helpful (according to my teacher friends).

But your gut is warning you and I am a great believer in that too.

I think him telling you he is heading off for trips leaving you with 3 young children is not on.

In my experience teachers really enjoy these trips and and there is no shortage of teachers who are game.

Often it is teacher friends who sign up for the trips, whilst pruning out any students that might be challenging!

I think the fact that he has gone to the spare room, is so furious with you, and has not spoken to you in four days, his pregnant wife, is extraordinary.

He is really very upset, isn't he.

I don't think you should be telling him who he talks to in work, but his reaction seems disproportionate.

Hard for him to argue that she is not a factor in your relationship if what you have said has caused him to move out of your bedroom and not spoken to you.

I think you need to sit down and talk to him, but I would be wary of him after such a reaction.

I think him TELLING you he is heading off on trips, which are holidays, is an extraordinary way to behave in a marriage with 3 children.

You were wrong in your response, but I can't blame you not being one bit impressed.

Did you ask if he has feelings for her? Maybe strictly there is nothing going on - but it seems like he cares more about her than he lets on.

I agree with @billy1966 this would be a huge overreaction on his part if she were just a work friend.

I have no helpful suggestions for what to do, I would be raging and the fact that you have 2 kids and another on the way means you can't just up and leave him to think about his priorities. Very difficult situation.

As previously said OP you need some couples therapy. Stress from unplanned pregnancy plus what is hopefully hormone induced controlling behaviour is going to ruin you marriage otherwise. Financial issues are the leading cause of relationship breakdowns, its natural this is going to cause strain. Fixating on your husbands colleage isn't going to help.

DH is being unreasonable, I work in a secondary school and I can honestly say the teachers who have young children almost never put themselves forward for trips abroad as there is an endless queue of single teachers or teachers whose children are grown-up available.

I would be asking him, why this trip is so important that he’s felt it necessary to ignore you and to sleep in the spare room. I might be wrong, but I can’t help thinking he’s deflecting.

If my DH started demanding that I not see any of my friends outside of our professional capacity I would leave. In fact I did just that when he started accusing me of having an affair with a friend who I supported through a very difficult time in his life.

My DH started to question why it had to be me who he talked to, why couldn’t it be someone else, how I clearly wanted to move where we moved to because he lived closer to there than where we lived… And the list goes on.

I ended the marriage, and 10 years later me and the friend are still friends, have never slept together or done anything inappropriate.

People seem to think that as soon as a partner is unhappy with their partner’s friendship then the partner should put them first and ditch the friend.

Personally unless they’re actually having an affair nobody has the right to tell anyone else who they can and can’t be friends with.

You sound incredibly controlling and frankly nasty about this woman.

And really, how judgemental to wonder why she isn’t married. Why should she?

I think I would be worried about his ability or willingness to reasure the op.

He clearly must know how vunerable op is at the moment, a heavily pregnant woman who has valid concerns about his friendship with a colleague, regardless of what others believe his boundaries should consist of towards this 'friend'

It is quite clear op is feeling hurt and confused by all of this and what does he do, stonewalls her and denies affection by sleeping in the other room.
The silent treatment is for him to shut op down and control the situation enabling him to have his own way, now and in the future. Very cruel and not someone who is thinking about the health of his wife and unborn child.

His defiant statement of further school holiday trips is him reiterating he will not be controlled, even though that may mean op being left alone with 3 small children.

I would be concerned that this man is not as pleasant as he seems.

Op is understanding that now.

Others on here think op is controlling, I've got a feeling that may not be the case.

@Eightiesfan this is exactly what my teacher friends have told me.
They love these trips, skiing, NY, The Camino, the great wall of china.

Some fantastic trips with bunches of great teens.

Certainly wouldn't be something a man or woman with young children would usually be doing.

I think@Onthedunes also makes a great point, he is deflecting and shutting the OP down.

She is heavily pregnant.
He comes home and he TELLS her he is doing this next year, no discussion and she is understandably upset.

His reaction to her upset is to move out of the bedroom and ignore her for days?

He's a piece of work.

If he hasn't done anything, he certainly is behaving like a man who has thought about it.

He certainly isn't a kind man to his pregnant wife.

You are perfectly reasonable to ask him not to volunteer for a shindig to New York.

His recent behavior to you is nasty.

You need to understand that Americans are culturally different and can seem OTT at times, but your insecurity in this will be what causes a rift in your marriage.

She sounds like a really nice kind woman, who is very thoughtful. She suffered the loss of her mother, yet you're complaining about him spending her night to get her to the airport for a 3am flight.

I think they're close colleagues, not just casual friends, but because she's young, pretty and liked by your husbands friends and others, you're feeling insecure and jealous.

Now, I don't want to say absolutely nothing is happening, because I have known of family friends having an affair and deceiving their spouses under their noses...BUT you have no evidence and unless you get any, then you need to pull back on what you're doing. You can't just go on a hunch or suspicion ...as its baseless...your husband will be resentful towards you... which won't be nice...he's already in the spare room.

I do understand being left with 3 young kids is difficult, but try and draft in some support for that. You'll raise your blood pressure and stress levels by being so obsessed and stalking her social media.

Your DH just told you that he's off on a holiday to New York and leaving you with 3 kids??? And doesn't think that completely irresponsible??

There have been threads here from women who's DH's want to go on week long holidays with male friends leaving the wife alone with kids - and it's been pretty unanimous that the DH IS being unreasonable.

You're pregnant and his only priority should be you. The fact he's not finding a way to compromise and putting his own ego over your legitimate concerns that YOU shouldn't be left alone with 3 kids for a week. I work in an environment with a lot of travel and the people with kids always find a way to avoid long trips. Because most people don't want to leave their families unless they absolutely have to. Not on a voluntary basis.

You dealt with it wrong as now he can make you the bad guy. What you should focus on is him being irresponsible volunteering for a non compulsory school trip while you are left behind. Has he ever made plans to take YOU away for a long haul holiday to New York, given he knows you were desperate to visit?

His reaction is far too defensive. Even if he resents being told what to do, he can have empathy to understand WHY you might be concerned. The fact he has completely dismissed all your concerns is the red flag. If he's happy to bring children into the world with you, share finances, a life and enjoy your commitment and love - he can also be happy to put himself in your shoes. Marriage is a commitment - and family should absolutely always come first. Creating a negative atmosphere at home that his kids can see/sense is madness. Over what exactly!? You not being happy him going on a holiday to a place you're dying to go, with another woman, while you look after 3 kids for a whole week?

I think you should take the kids to your family or on a little break (if you can afford it). Whatever is happening is not good for them to witness and you both need space to understand WHY this has blown up. He married you so knows if you've ever been this way before. So you get the benefit of doubt that since it's the first time you've raised these concerns - he listens to you, and finds a compromise. If he can't do that, then... he needs to be very sure what exactly it is he's damaging his marriage over. Not sure telling your kids, friends and family that he's divorcing mummy because she didn't like ONE of his friends would make a compelling story.. He has as much if not more to lose than you do.

Also- affairs don't always start with lust and a drunken shag. They can also start with a shared intimacy that grows in time. Marriage is tough, raising 3 kids is tough and if a friendship is taking away precious couple time, and allowing someone else to share some of it, then priorities are wrong. It's like we don't suspect our neighbours of robbing us but still wouldn't share our bank details with them. You don't need to distrust someone in order to want to protect yourself.

Also, you should not have to deal with this hostility while you're pregnant with a tough medical history. I really would go stay with people who can love and support you for a bit. You're about to being a third child into this world and need love, understanding and kindness. All the stuff we put into vows. If he can't be that person for you now - find others who can. You and your baby and your health take priority over his feelings at this point. Take care of yourself OP.

Lucy, your H is punishing you because you are standing in the way of his upcoming NYC adventure with his fun friend. He is trying to manipulate you into shutting up and backing off. It’s very troubling that he feels entitled to dismiss and upset you during your pregnancy.

His signing up to travel across the Atlantic, leaving you to juggle 3 children for a week while he enjoys your dream destination with this woman speaks volumes about his priorities.

They have clearly bonded by sharing a variety of experiences—in the trenches together at school/school trips, during the loss of her mother, etc. It’s natural to be attracted to the ego validation such a connection can engender, so it’s crucial to keep strong boundaries to protect fidelity.

Lucy, I am so sorry that your H is treating you with such contempt. I hope that you have a loving support system to reach out to.

I would be doing anything I could to reassure my partner in this situation, not get angry and grey rock them. My husband would be doing anything he could to be getting out of an overnight trip as he wouldn’t want to be away from his family. It’s horrible of him, sorry OP,- but your gut is there for a reason.

@Lucyofthemichealcar, how are things today?

The lady based on your original analysis, seems a good friend.

He seems to care about the friendship, and if roles were reversed and it was a male colleague would your perspectives be any different op ?

I think your DH sounds like a lovely friend to a seemingly very nice lady.

She's been through a tough time and your DH supported her.

It's clear you are very jealous of this friendship, but your DH really has every right to be annoyed when you tell him you don't trust him. A marriage should be based on trust, the minute you try to control who he sees, your relationship is doomed.

This may well be pregnancy hormones, your DH seems to have tried to reassure you on many occasions when you have commented on their friendship, there is only so many times this can be done before it get incredibly frustrating , especially if you have done nothing wrong.

You either trust him or you don't. You need to work that out, not start controlling his friendships, I'm not saying that nothing is going on, but it's not the answer to restrict who he sees.

Every time you post op, I can hear your husband's words of logic being voiced by you, he's manipulative.

I've found these 'logical when it suits me types' never really see your point of view until the tables are turned and they learn the hard way.

What would that entail....

Firstly, getting a job and sharing childcare costs and a cleaner to help at home.
You find a lovely male friend at work who happens to be attractive, and who finds you attractive.
Bake him cakes, meet his children, befriend his friends, however distant on facebook, add them. Take him to meet your mother, meet his mother offer her gifts and your time, even if she lives in another county.
Be there for him, for all emergencies even in the middle of the night and phone him up for any advice on diy and car advice, even though you could actually ask your husband.
Make him feel needed, important and special, gushing letters also included.
If work holidays are possible make sure to pair up, leaving husband with the kids alone, he'll love it.

You will have a lovely friendship that can make your husband feel second best and remember to not even allow him to voice his concerns till at least 9 years have gone by and then and only then listen to him and ignor.
Carry on as before.

You have the makings of a crap marriage, but at least it will be fairer.

This man is going to end up with the marriage he deserves.

I'm still in your corner OP. His behaviour towards you, the pregnant mother of his three children, is disgusting. He is prioritising over you and I'd be livid in your position.

I take it she's not going to be the baby's Godmother?

My friend is coming around tomorrow night so I can help him out with something. We’ll probably have a glsss or two of wine. He’ll probably give me a hug goodbye. Not sure what time we’ll finish - might be quite late.

He will almost certainly buy me a thank you present and write me a card for helping me.

His pregnant wife will almost certainly thank you me
next time I see her.

Unbelievably we are it having an affair and we are two people of the opposite sex who are friends.

I cannot believe some posters on here saying she “seems like a nice lady” From my point of view both DH and Friend seem manipulative.

DH brings friend to OPs house
She wants to go home
He drives her to her house
He drives back home
He then drives back to spend the night with friend to drive her to the airport.

The whole, do you mind me spending the night conversation is where I struggle to believe this is innocent. He had no reason to stay overnight in her spare room. She is a grown woman who could have called a cab to take her to the airport, or , DH could have picked her up at 3am, there was a absolutely no reason to stay overnight at her house, leaving his pregnant wife and children alone at night.

DH and ‘friend’ are emotionally connected at the very least, much more than he is admitting to. His juvenile excitement about the NY trip is the same as when my 17-year-old son arranged to go to Reading festival with his friends, one of which was his current crush.

@Eightiesfan - not sure if you missed it - but the woman’s mother had just died and he was driving her to the airport at 3am to go home for her funeral!

No, I didn’t miss it. I understand her mother just died, but in every case that a colleague has suffered a bereavement, and there have been several, I don’t believe anyone would have done what OPs husband did.

I’m not suggesting that anything happened, and I agree it was a nice thing for him to offer to take her to the airport, BUT but I think his response of driving home, just to tell OP he was going straight back to stay in her spare room until 3am to take her to the airport is questionable.

Surely it made more sense for him to stay home and then drive back to her house to pick her up, there was absolutely no need for him to have a sleepover.