AIBU Would you be worried about this friendship?

[Lucyofthemichealcar]

Background:
Married for 11 years and together for 17.
H very outgoing, fun loving and flirty but never had concerns. Similar personality to me, so a bit of flirty banter is fine so long as we both respect the line.
Since married neither or us go out as much and since kids deffo not.
Both of us have male and female friends. Being friendly with a woman doesn't bother me but the dynamic between these two has always seemed different but cannot put finger on it.

H and his work friend.
I would say she definitely fits into my H's 'type'. They teach together. They are in different departments so it does not sound as if they speak every day or every week but they do seem to catch up face to face at lunch or over messenger if it has been a few weeks. She goes back to the US every summer and as far as I know they go weeks then with no communication so they are not always in each others pockets but it seems in the school they are very much viewed as a pair, so get paired up to chaperone school events and over the years they have organised several trips together as they both say if they are stuck with colleagues for a week it needs to be someone they get on with and like and apparently because they trust each other to organise and not mess things up when carting around 50 odd teenagers. Looked at messages from her when I was in the throes of pregnant paranoia and the chat is friendly but mundane. Not even flirtatious. She asks after me and H about her partner. The tone is how he talks to all his other friends. We have had her round for dinner and she has also done the same and we have went for drinks together. All very nice and above board. Done the odd favour like making us a whole load of meals when our kitchen was getting renovated and doing a food shop when we had covid or helping with looking after cat when we were away but I just can't shake a feeling she does it all to look good to H. She is very American and brings round baking, goes all out at christmas and since I have known her has always given me and the kids gifts (all our birthdays are in Late Nov/Dec so they are birthday/xmas gifts). Her and H also always exchange birthday gifts but they are stupid cheap items as part of a running joke from work. She seems keen to be friends with me too and suggested going for a wine or doing a gym class but as I said something always seems off and never felt entirely comfortable around her in the 9 years her and H have been friendly.
She has a BF of 12 years but they have never married and don't cohabit which seems strange.

Why am I concerned?
Aside from being pregnant and crying at the drop of a hat, what has made me question it all is that three weeks ago my H stayed at her house overnight. She got a phonecall at work to say her mum had passed back in the states. Her partner was away on business and she had a meltdown at work. H brought her back to ours but she said she wanted to be at home, pack and get the first flight home. H took her back to her place. He came back after dropping her off and asked me if I minded him staying to keep an eye but i think he had pretty much made up his mind while I said yes or not. He stayed the night in her spare room and then drove her to the airport at 3am. At the time I did feel like she could have reChed out to other friends but i suppose if that was me I would be all over the place too. She and her BF came by a few days ago with a restaurant voucher for the two of us to say thank you for being there for us. We have two kids and I am seven months pregnant with our third. Is it hormones or should I be worried?

H sensed I wasn't okay when he came back after dropping her off and I said how I felt and he said there was and never had been anything between them that I could check through messages etc if it put my mind at ease but I don't know. Have asked friends in the past and they have said it is a bit of an unusal one but probably because as a society we generally are uspicious of male female friendships unless they have been sustained through childhood and adolescence.

AIBU?

OP, this woman makes you uncomfortable, you don’t need to justify to anyone on here why. You have never warmed to her and I am a great believer in following your gut instinct.

Speak to DH and tell him how you feel, your hormones are not helping but DH should address your concerns. As for chaperoning on school trips, unless they both teach the same subject one or other must be volunteering to go on residential trips, it is certainly not compulsory if it’s not your subject.

Personally, something seems a bit off here but only your husband can answer any questions you have,

i would also report your post with the letter as it could be outing.

I personally don't think any woman would like to be in this situation.

She seems awfully keen on impressing everyone who is associated with your husband. Really though she must have sensed your disaproval of her, most women take the hint but she keeps on advancing.

I think she knows what she's doing, she knows she's attractive to your husband, she's attracted to him and she knows he will find her adorable if his mother, children and friends all love her.

She sounds marvellous.
And everyone thinks she is the victim of her loviness, including the posters on here.

She's as bright as a button.

Totally agree with this, if something (or someone) seems too good to be true it usually is.

I think she has grown up with American giving culture, that you (OP) find that alien and offputting, and that unfortunately you have a naturally slightly paranoid personality. She hasn't done anything wrong - it's really unkind to blame her for being grateful for the help she received after her mum's death. Personally I wouldn't want my partner to fail to help a friend in need.

I also think her efforts towards you might be to throw you off the scent that she does in fact have designs on your husband.

This.
I just can't begrudge anyone a friendship and especially not in circumstances such as this.

If something is off for you, then keep an eye on it, but in all honesty, given the circumstances, I would have been disappointed in my DH if he hadn't done as you described. When I was pregnant, I would not have had the energy and so I would have looked to him. We are expats and our friends around us are like family, even if only temporarily. She has no one around her. I have friends who would react like this, and whilst I wouldn't personally, I would never judge her for that.

I am also a teacher, I connect more with two male colleagues than any females, and we are paired up regularly, so understand that.

Honestly, if you are genuinely worried, then monitor the situation. But as it stands, I cannot see that anything is wrong.

Sorry posted too soon.

If you are worried, monitor the situation. But from your posts, I don't see anything beyond you not liking her.

Doesn't sound like anything, it's probably be user you can see she's his type so you feel threatened.

That letter seems like someone who is incredibly grateful for being
supported during what must have been one of the worst moments of her
life

That letter could equally be seen as someone who is trying to cover up her actions., very gushing and theatrical to my mind.

This letter I should imagine will be branded about by the op along with her husbands actions of sleeping in the spare bedroom till 3am (why he had to go to bed I don't know) she wanted to quell gossip, with the thank you letter.
She sounds a confident woman perfectly able to easily make friends and influence people such as your MIL and his friends suuely there must have been other support for her.

She is leaning on your husband and monopolising his time at work and now it's creeping into your home life.

She sounds predatory to me, and not pleasant, sometimes attractive women have to have a little more understanding and empathy towards the SAHM, whose pregnant and who lives with a man who feels it entirely acceptable to sleep over at another woman's house, surely your husband must know all of this and his friendship is getting a little uncomfortable for you.

People are not being truthful, if their own husband found someone attractive and were getting this level of intrusion into their marriage they would not be keen.

Lots wrong with this but can I just pick up on your last point? Where has it been mentioned that he finds her attractive?

H and his work friend.
I would say she definitely fits into my H's 'type'

Op wrote this and I'm guessing she kind of knows whether her husband finds her attractive.

He's not befriended Carol whose been teaching for forty years has he, for some reason he's become friendly with an exiting, attractive and extroverted American woman who seems the sun shines out of her arse.

Maybe he's a little enamoured by her.

Wouldn't his messages to her be flirty or suggestive? OP says they're not. Just because she's his type doesn't mean there's attraction there.

Lots wrong with this but can I just pick up on your last point

Why is there ?

We don't know this woman from Adam or her intentions.

What we do know is op is married with 2 children and one on the way and is acting protectively against her family unit.

What does this 'friend' want, just frienship, well I think she's putting quite a lot of effort into this friendship, travelling to Wales to meet his mother, baking cakes he loves, buying presents, developing friendships with his old aquaintences and engineering her work life to be in his company more on trips away.

Couldn't she just back off and find a friend that doesn't have a wife in the background that clearly is giving her daggers.

Personally I think it’s a cultural difference. We British stiff upper lip vs American more open. The letter was written to both of you and you are very included.

Yes she has a friendship with your husband but is careful to include you and is proactive in trying to forge a friendship with you as well.

I certainly don’t think your DH has done anything wrong. I really don’t think you can make assumptions as to why she hasn’t married her partner either.

She’s in another country, it’s an easy colleague friendship, she includes you and wants you as a friend as well. She’s just a bit more “forward” and American.

I can understand slightly how this may irritate you, but kindly I think it’s you and not her really. But I absolutely don’t think you have anything to worry about in terms of her and your DH as long as you don’t make a mountain out of a molehill and drive an unnecessary wedge between you and your DH.

Do remember the different cultures when you judge things as this may help you rationalise things.

Please OP do not listen to half of them on here. People joke about MN users and the majority are level headed people but on threads like this some are trolls and vipers who just want to stir shit or take your words and twist them.
Let's look at the facts you have presented.
You think she is your husband's type. You think. Your husband has not said this from what you have said but you THINK this. Have you had anything to suggest your husband is her type? She has a major long term BF. I think it is safe to say he is her type.

You consider yourself as pretty if not prettier than her. So she isn't going to be winning in that sense.

Your husband has helped her on a few occassions over the course of a 9 year friendship. That is pretty average for friends. He is not leaving you to go see her or do things at the drop of a hat either by the sounds of it. You are worried she has that power over him but has this actually happened. I think her mum dying can be classed as an exception and he came back to ask you and initially brought her to your house first. This all suggests he views you as someone who is on friendly terms with her too.
He stayed at her house over night but only to get some quick shut eye in the spare room until the early hours to drive her to the airport when her partner was unable to do so, you live close by and her mum died. I believe nearly everyone on here has said this was an occassion not to worry. You said he text her twice to check in. I would say this is normal, he wasn't phoning her everyday etc.

She gives gifts to you and your children. You have never told her to stop but sent nice messages saying thank you which suggests to her you ate happy enough with the situation. They are gifts that shows she listens to you as they are things you have said you like. As other Americans on her have said that is how they can behave. You have never told her they are too much, she is not a mind reader. You also disliked that she gave your childten sweets and said your husband was talking about your children behind your back. I'm sorry your husband was probably just talking about his children to his friend. The behind your back is a bit of a tell tale line that you like to control and know everything that is going on and this is one thing you cannot..ironically were you actually on closer terms you probably would but you cannot force grown women to be friends.

She wants to be your friend, you are put off that you and your husband are not both friends with her but then rebuff her attempts to do so, why? I think.you are over analysing her niceness to suit your own agenda and twisting it.

You seem to use her generosity when it suits you. You took up her offer for.your MIL to stay at her house and then were annoyed when your MIL expressed her gratitude. It seems like you are quite controlling. When she went to visit she wasn't just visiting to see your MIL she was on holiday in the area. Depending on how far away you live from your in laws if I was in the area and my friend asked me to drop something off 10 miles would not seem that much of a hassle.

You are annoyed she met a friend of his you have not. Circumstances allowed this to happen, it isn't like he has purposefully not introducing you to this friend. Imagine you found out about this because your husband told you. In all likelihood he introduced them knowing they had that state in common. You do seem to get upset and annoyed about silly things.

With regard to school trips. High schools often run the same trips every year. If there are a large number going then you often have two or more staff organising it and they will run it year in year out. I don't know what subjects they teach but in my school we are encouraged to have staff from a range of departments and faculty involved as all our trips have been interdisciplinary so that the majority of pupils are eligible to go on it which increases uptake and which in turn pushes down the price per person of the trip. It is not some massive scam to spend time together. Knowing school trips your DH and his friend probably share rooms with other colleagues on the trip with them who are of the same sex. Trust me when I say absolutely nothing will be happening on a school trip.

I think the sharing of her letter was out of line. You may not communicate the way she does but she is clearly hurting and to share what was a personal.note to you and DH on a public forum is mean and immature. That she came round with her BF and wrote to and had a gift for you both shows she views you as a couple and she and her partner are hugely appreciative of the support she got that day. She invites you as a couple to her house and it seems all the times your DH and her have socialised out of work it has been with you there too I fail to see why you think she is manipulating anything.

She appears to have been consistently nice all the time you have known her. She is not trying to get your husband to meet her alone or constantly come to see her. There is nothing to worry about.

You are only presenting your choice of one sided facts about her which I feel.is purposefully giving us a skewed picture so we side with you.

You are blowing this out of proportion IMO.

@Onthedunes christ do you want a kitchen aid to really get in there and stir it.
What does this woman want? God she probably just wants someone to be friends with at work and having got to know the person and got.on well.with him likely though she could extend that friendship.to his wife.
From what OP said she didn't go to Wales to specifically see his mother but was on holiday there and dropped in.
She isn't going to drop off cake he doesn't like is she. I imagine she is similar to myself.likes baking and then thinks oh shite I have a while cake but no one in my house to eat it. How do we know she is developing friendships with his friends? It sounds more like the husband was using her to help his friend get settled in a new state. Surely you are not stupid enough to see OP is drip feeding the information she thinks makes this woman look bad.
As I said in the previous post it is highly unlikely she is engineering her worklife to run a trip with him. The probably organised it once and will be running that trip until they retire or leave also for all we know it is the husband who is asking to tag along but ofcourse it is MN so let's blame the unmarried woman.

Couldn't she back off and find a friend without a wife jn the background? Honestly. Have either OP or her DH given any indication they want her to back off. By the sounds of it OP is very two faced. Vicious on here but very nice to this woman in person and via text.
While she hasn't taken up on her offer of gym or wine, as a mother of two young kids i would just assume she was busy and didnt have the time and would not have read into it as a rejection of friendship. She has accepted her gifts constantly over the years, sent messages thanking her for them invited her to her house, went to hers as well, went for drinks as couples, stop and talked to her in the street, taken up her offers of giving her house for people to stay, accepted food when ill, had her look after their cat, seemingly being okay with her husband staying over, going on trips last minute. Why would this woman have any reason to think she is disliked so much by her friend's wife?
We have no idea if this woman has other friends she relies on just as much. Though given her family is far away and have been ill and passed away recently she likely views her friends like family and is perhaps more invested in them and treating them as such than they may expect or be used to.
However OP please tell your husband about your dislike of her, she shouldn't be wasting her time or.money trying to build a friendship on someone like you who is so horrible about her.

@Jadersbw

I'm not stirring just being truthful.

I'm not saying op's husband is sleeping with her but it seems their emotional attatchment is growing and to many women this can be upsetting.

For nine years op has been civil to this woman, when her true feeling were dampened down to keep the peace with her husband.
Op has every right to not be friends with this woman, you can't get on with everyone, nor should you be forced to.

Op tell your husband, whether he choses to wind down his involvement with her is something you will have to negotiate.

Good luck and don't feel bad about having these feelings, there are many on here who would feel the same, irrespective of what faculties their spouses were part of.

You have had some mean replies on here op. It tends to go that way on MN with all the cool people who do not mind their partner having a close friendship with another woman whose pupils think they are a married couple - or so they say. That does not make you a sociopath. What a ridiculous comment. You are feeling vulnerable and somewhat isolated by the friendship. You have come here for support and whilst I don't agree with everything you have said, you are pregnant and in need of support.

I would not be happy about this situation. I think the issue of culture does arise in that she is very open indeed and we are somewhat closed and still have a somewhat stiff upper lip culture.

You should not be pushed or bullied into accepting what is uncomfortable for you. You are expecting another child. She needs to back off. Her relationship of course is her business but she needs to butt out of yours, concentrate on her other relationships.

Dear OP,

I think if I were in your shoes, I would feel the same. However I admit I am fairly controlling, overthink at times and a little insecure. I feel that whilst pregnant the insecurities would be heightened. All these little actions of hers are adding up and making you feel uncomfortable.

Have you spoken to your husband about this? I would speak with your husband and hopefully he will reassure you, take your feelings into account and back off a little with her. Your husband should help address any insecurity you have in your relationship.

I have always been told to trust the other half- so even if she wants something, doesn't mean your husband will want her.

I don't think anything is going on between them in all honesty but have a civilised talk with your DH. Wish you the best.

I'm sorry op that you are getting a hard time from some of the posters here. Actually I would trust your instincts here. There is another long thread on here that sounds like it has similarities with your situation. The husband of the op had a close friendship with his female colleague. This colleague did her best to ingratiate herself with the Op and her children (dressing up as Elsa from frozen for their birthdays, organising social events etc) The op stated that she'd never been entirely comfortable with her husband's friendship with this woman but put up with it. Turns out they'd had an affair and he confessed to loving the ow.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/4514006-My-husband-loves-someone-else-as-well-as-me?

Shes turning your words round on you so if you think it's mean then....

Have you considered that she is just a nice person? They do exist. Some people have a strong sense of community and doing things for others, some are perfectly nice but insular and rely on or help only their one person. That sounds like the difference between the 2 of you. There isn't anything wrong with that but clearly some of your posts do come across that you don't recognise this and/or look down on her for this which is a shame.

In all other areas of life now, women are encouraged not to accept "be kind" without regard to their own boundaries. Why should we accept and tolerate things that make us uncomfortable? This goes for the man who wants to sit beside you in the cafe or this woman. The sex makes no difference. Everyone's boundaries are different.

I'm about torn on this one. I had a partner of 14 years, he was good looking outgoing flirty & popular with everyone he had lots of female friend as I have male friends but there was one in particular that I really didn't like! She wasn't the prettiest or the most outgoing but something about her really made my hackles rise! And I was absolutely right.

OP. With every post you sound worse.

She sounds lovely.
You do not & this is from your perspective.

If your dh could read what you have written here, he would deeply question you. Deeply.

OP I am sorry there have been some very mean posts on your thread. Some people just really enjoy a pile on. I am sure most of these 'mean girls' would be horrified if their own DH was as enmeshed with another woman as yours seems to be. She is not so bloody lovely if she keeps advancing into your marriage when you are clearly trying to hold her at arms length.