Needing support for those days after first finding out about husband's infidelity

[Sazdun]

Okay third time lucky. Unfortunately some of you will have followed what happened to me yesterday and finding out my husband of 8 years was unfaithful. There have been super kind people who have reached out and from the bottom of my heart I thank you. I wish j could buy each of you a well deserved wine or chocolates. I still can't find it in me to reach out to my IRL friends or find the words but I am meeting my friend tomorrow and lets hope I can by then. My original thread has been put up so I can get some of the helpful info people posted but no more replies can be made. My follow up thread has since been deleted because it is a thread about a thread. I did not know this is not something you are supposed to do. Anyway I have started this to keep anyone who is helping me stay updated or for anyone going through the horrible or similar same thing to get some helpful advice. Some people have questioned if I am infact real. I am. I am a 38 year old mum of two who has been with her husband since she was 23. I was concerned about his relationship with another woman but while I came on here yesterday thinking I would get feedback on how to approach my feelings and deal with my husband, I got angry and stood up for myself. I never ever thought it would lead to this. So if you doubt me or what to pull every little thing I type please don't, predictive text is a bitch. This is my life, my girls lives and I just need support and help.

I think you and DH should move away somewhere new for a fresh start.

@Rogue1001MNer yeah a great deal of what he said felt similar to what I have thought and like you said @abctogether it is easy to get swayed and yes there is no easy fix. Had not even considered H's mental health, I struggled after DD1 but he was friendly with her before that. Oh I don't know. Emotionally exhausted. OW' H actually handed me a bottle of wine as I left and told me I needed it. Think i might have a glass. He probably is quite a decent guy after all, just doesn't sugar coat things. I always considered him really abrasive but strangely feel that he is the person who is going to be most honest and truthful in this whole shitshow. Turn up for the books if OW H and me become friends after all this.

Just don't suggest 'mental health' to your husband. He'll latch onto that and it'll be a new way to make everything all about him. He doesn't sound depressed to me. He told you he was emotionally fulfilled once he had OW as the 'missing piece'. I'd just leave the mental health idea out of the equation.

I agree, OW's H seems like a decent person. Although I doubt that he knows when OW is lying. He just knows that she lies, and sometimes he catches her.

I think from your recent posts you have made the decision to stay. But you don't know how to action that decision other than the OW shouldn't be in your lives.

You went to see her husband and he had a way of dealing with it- it was a liaison that happened when they weren't together, they became friends, He monitored it, it was all above board so it never became an issue. In fact it was an asset as they talked about stuff he didn't give a crap about so it relieved his ear. What I found interesting was despite the fact he decided everything was above board he still despised your H. You don't hate someone for being a hypocrite to others, you hate them because they are a threat to something you care about. He also stated they will still see each other at work you can't stop it. That made me think maybe he has tried to stop it but was unsuccessful in doing so.

I don't agree with the husband that it was all above board. To me the incident 8 years ago is significant but can be overcome because it was a physical encounter that could mean nothing. However the 8 years of friendship and emotional support has spun to the point where he is over reliant on it- to the extent the emotional connection between them fills a void in his life. That is the very essence of an emotional affair. I bet the OW too probably feels similar to your husband.

But what I do disagree with you about is that is love. It's not love, it's over reliance, addiction but it's not love. Because if it was and they both felt it- they would have acted on it. It's an addiction to the feeling each gives the other. An addiction is something hard to break, he might need counselling to overcome that addiction. But in the coming years he will be able to overcome and replace with a healthier persute or person to 'fill that void'.

I know it's early days and you are still in the angry stage of grief of your relationship (which is perfectly understandable) you will eventually move on from that stage and I'm sure you want a strong partnership where you are his sole concern and love. I think in order to do that you need to acknowledge with him that that is your goal. But then I think professional mediation is needed to give you both a space to air your feelings and form a plan.

Everything your husband said to you can be boiled down to one sentence: "my wife doesn't understand me." That's why I call him pathetic. It's such a cliche.

To respond to the pp who suggested we are all angry bitches trying to ruin your marriage: I think most of us commenting have been around the block a few times and recognise manipulative behaviour when we see it. Because we were once manipulated, gaslighted and emotionally abused, we know it when we see it happening to someone else. We don't need to hear from H, we are looking at you and seeing a woman who has been very badly treated for a long time.

So there's that. There's also the fact that the appropriate response to the way you've been treated is anger. Fury. Outrage. And if you're not expressing that anger, it gets picked up by the people around you and they express it for you. It's a form of projection. I don't think it's that we are getting a kick from trying to split you and H up - I'm certainly not. I'm not hoping that you'll divorce or get revenge or anything like that. What I hope is for you to find your voice, your anger, and to start getting what you want and deserve, whether that's in your marriage or out of it. I can totally imagine OW's H laughing and applauding you when you "showed some backbone". I would have been the same.

I agree with that @beastlyslumber
And also would point out that although there have been some LTB comments, the majority on here just said it's for @Sazdun to decide, and we'll support no matter what she chooses.

But posters can see just how unfair all this is, and as we're not there in rl to champion OP, we're encouraging her to find someone in her circle to do it for her and - more importantly - for her to do it herself.
There is an element here of us seeing the more she can assert herself, the more people in her rl will respect her. And (again, more important), she'll respect herself.

And just to reiterate, this is all a SHIT situation, not of @Sazdun's making and we want to support her through it in a way most beneficial to her and her DC.

Yep, very well balanced post here. We never know what's going on in another person's mind. To claim that the OW is manipulative and scheming or the DH is abusive or evil is just extrapolating hugely from what's been told here, speculation going well beyond what OP has said. It might be true, but then again, there are plenty of other possible explanations as well. I'd want to be bloody sure before taking a LTB step, not just relying on people's "reckons".

@abctogether
I think she should leave him, not because I love the drama. I wish she had said on day 1 she was finished with him and there had been no more installments on the thread.

The reason I think she should leave him is because I can't think of many more unbearable pains than the pain of knowing your husband cheated, loves someone else and is now pining over missing them.

I have read 100s of threads on here from people who have never got over the pain, it doesn't seem worth it to me

Yes, if she is going to "forgive" him ... this would be the best thing. Away from the "friendship group". This whole saga makes me so furious. The wet lettuce should be looking for another job, not whining about his lost bestie. I wish I could meet him. I want to punch out his lights!

I said he was evil, I'm not sure about that. I think he is just a thick, calculating wet lettuce all rolled into one.

I'd be gone. Not trying to get him to "pick me" to show the other woman I'd won. I'd rather win a lucky bag at the fair.

I am so proud of you for getting your points across to hubby and OW.

Hubby trying to turn it on you and your personality for him speaking to someone else is terrible. Sounds more of an excuse to me.

Also not much about the remorse for having the affair prior to your wedding and why that happened!

OW clearly liked the attention, I wouldn’t trust her and hubby needs to get a new job. I wouldn’t trust him not to just communicate with her at work like he did was his affair period with her (that was all al work, including a kiss actually at work!) and he can continue his emotional support from her at lunchtimes and in emails. It needs to be NC and tell him if there is any contact between them then that’s it. I’d also say if that were the case you’d move away and start again elsewhere on your own and find a nice new partner and step parent for the girls.

Also, did you tell OW husband that your husband has told you that he loves OW and can’t stop loving her? I suspect he would change his position on some of his comments if he did know.

It very much sounds as though some counselling is needed asap if you want to try and work through this.

it must have been very hard to hear that he would view her departure from his life like a death. Also that she completes him. You also pointed out that he loves her and he didn’t move to deny this.

Perhaps your H is far weaker than you imagined him to be.

Understandably you are in turmoil. If it were me, and I thought I might be able to try and find a way forward, I think it’s crucial that you get help and guidance in understanding where you both are with the situation to see if you can navigate your way through this maze.

Perhaps it will give you both clarity, hopefully it will lead to a path forward as that’s what you seem to want. If it doesn’t then you will at least know you tried and you won’t have the “what ifs” hanging over you. He does sound very self indulgent with everything being about him, hopefully he may actually come to see this and face it with appropriate counselling.

None of this is going to be easy, but you’re not in an easy place at the moment and whilst he is telling you his feelings, I wonder how honest he’s even being with himself.

"He's so self centered that just having his feelings validated by someone is so important that he will feel like someone has died when she isn't there to listen to his drivel."

He really is so selfish he could implode.
OK, so lets say he has fallen in love with his "therapist".
& even if has finally been forced to saying he will cut contact, won't he then either long for what he has lost, or ruminate his loss.
It will be difficult to respect him after this.

I realise more of my anger is towards her than him
I just don't get this.

Her DH is right. She's not the OW. She was a fling 8 years ago and she didn't know the truth about you. You can't put the blame on her. She thought your H told you and it's not her fault he didn't. Your anger towards her is misplaced. It sounds like she has had your back for years.

Your H is an idiot and needs to sort out his feelings. Therapy would really help.

I wonder if his feelings for her are a form of transference? She has basically been his therapist/councillor for 8 years which might also explain why he can't quite articulate how he feels about her. I'm not trying to get him off the hook, but it's something to consider.

I just want to add another thing.

There's a mn phrase I really like, and no one's said it, but we're all urging the same thing...

"Don't do the 'pick me' dance"

@Sazdun What a difficult day you had!

It doesn't sit well with me when you start blaming yourself, for example, not being a good listener. Great, if you want to improve on that, like we all should, but this is not the time to blame yourself or doubt yourself. You are the wronged party here. H cowardly justifies his actions by subtlety shifting blame. He may not have intended to gaslight you, but the result was the same. Please remember this is not your fault.

You seem to be in a big dilemma. Clearly you wish to stay. At the same time you seem to be desperately seeking people (from your conversation with H, OW or OW's H) to say to you that 'H loves OW', as if you want to punish yourself with more damaging information. I am with @Littlepaws18 that H's feeling for her is not love in true sense, but over-reliance or addiction. It's unhealthy obsessive friendship.

If you are to stay together,

1. Your H must stop whimpering about his feeling for her or loss of the friendship. He doesn't seem to understand that his 'honesty' is killing you. His lack of empathy here is the issue.

2)You and H must cut social contact with OW. You already told OW to stay away. Your H agreed to cut contact with her. So you must stay away from her, too. There is nothing good coming out of further encounters. OW and OW's H have different dynamics and history from you and your H. It sounds impossible now, but OW should become someone you greet politely and briefly on the streets in a few years time.

3)Counselling.

We in adult monogamous relationships trust our partners to keep strong physical and emotional boundaries. We trust our partners to recognize a slippery slope and to step back accordingly to protect their fidelity.

H has repeatedly put your marriage in danger. He has always had weak boundaries for OW. He chose to damage your relationship with his initial PA/EA, and when the opportunity arose, he opened another door to OW inside your marriage. This time he developed a deep emotional reliance and passion for her, which has had a devastating effect on your self-esteem and relationship.

In many cases, inappropriate emotional connections are based on the feelings of validation engendered in the betrayer by the affair partner, as opposed to being a true love for the AP. In my view, this began as validation but has grown into something much deeper. It’s long-term. H feels that OW completes him, and the loss of her is like a death. He has admitted loving her, and I believe that he does.

H employed a good bit of blame shifting today. I heard it as: ‘Sazdun, for years you’ve been very supportive in a practical way. Although I never addressed with you my need for a more active listener/missing emotional connection, I decided to pursue OW for that role. I discovered that she completes me, and our dynamic provides great safety that enables me to freely express myself. Despite our previous secret sexual affair and my subsequent lying, I felt entitled to bring her close to us and to develop my emotional connection to her. But that’s no reflection on you—I just needed both of you.’

Sazdun, no matter how much H deflects blame, please do not accept fault. You are not responsible for his poor choices.

Would I stay under these circumstances? Absolutely not. I’m not about to watch my H pine for his lost love who completes him. If you do stay, Sazdun, you need to build a recovery structure that covers all the bases. H will need to dig deep in individual counseling to examine his character flaws that enabled his faithless behavior. And you would benefit from individual counseling as you navigate this hugely challenging situation. You also need to get to the bottom of why you’ve been settling for so little.

[BTW, OW’s H is wrong. He assumes that H views OW like a brother, but doesn’t have all the information. He doesn’t know H is in love with his wife….that she is the puzzle piece that was always missing.]

No one on this thread should judge you for forgiving for trying again with your H although I do think it's a good place for accountability as I fear in any reconciliation you will be completely gaslit by the pair of them.

Personally I'd move and expect H to change jobs to increase any chances of success.
At least you know you tried everything then.

@Sazdun can you forgive his affair with her pre marriage ? Has that discovery changed things for you? Do you want your husband to go to counselling to help him know if he is in love with OW or not? Can you tolerate the fact that it is OW who was the missing piece in his life and not you?

I know you want your marriage to work. I actually feel you should give it a go and both of you should have individual then couples counselling to help work through your feelings. I feel if you don't give it a go, it may haunt you going forwards.

By doing that you may well conclude you can't have there people in a marriage but then you would be able to make peace with it. Or he may realise that he doesn't OW after all and he can find fulfillment within his own little family . For what it's worth I don't think your H is horrid or manipulative- be seemed to have been fairly honest. But can you live with the truth?

I agree with @MsDogLady especially on the issue of trust and fidelity.

I don't know whether it's love or addiction. I think possibly neither. H and OW obviously both love talking about themselves and their 'issues' so maybe it's a kind of mutual narcissistic supply.

He says you weren't listening, or your relationship wasn't " like that".
But you were busy bringing up his babies, & already on the back foot, trying to get by with your "strong persona"..., & already double guessing, with your insecurities & gut telling you there was something out of sync with him & OW.
Dont let him blame you, dont let him undermine your self esteem, & what you know to be true.
Did he try the confidences, little nicknames & private jokes with you?
He needs a good slap

So you not agree he’s been having an emotional affair recently?

I agree that OP has decided to stay in her marriage and that’s your right to choose, OP. All the best. I find it very sad that your husband doesn’t seem to be considering your feeling in this latest exchange on his emotional affair.

I think it was totally wrong of you to enter OW’s house unannounced to talk about that.
I agree she doesn’t want to go anywhere, etc etc but she owes you nothing. Zilch. Any discussions you want to have should be with your husband.

if you want to go to her house to speak to her about this, you need to inform her and be invited. Doing this has crossed a line, no matter how close you were previously.

So now he's moved to DARVO - deny, attack, reverse victim and offender. This situation is now your fault apparently. You don't give him the emotional support he needs, you don't understand him like she does. Well isn't that convenient?

He's so completely selfish I can't see how this can be resolved. You quite naturally want her out of your lives, but he will make you pay for that because - he needs her!! No he doesn't actually, he wants her.
He will now be so miserable and self righteous and blame you for spoiling everything. The only future he will be happy with is you getting back in your box and letting them get on with their enmeshed relationship.

Honestly he's so vile - he's a liar, a massive hypocrite, selfish, entitled, ughh!

Don't accept any blame for his appalling lies and manipulation. None of this lies at your feet, it's all on him.