I don't think I will be allowed to see my new grandchild.

[Chopinandchampagne]

Some of you may remember my previous threads regarding my relationship with my daughter and SIL.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/4145356-SIL-and-money-issues?msgid=109152806#109152806

It has been a difficult year, following the death of DH, with lots of firsts to get through, but I have just about survived, with a lot of support from DD2 and DD3, DH's family and friends. And, earlier in the year, DD1 told me she was expecting DGS1 in early January. This time she told me very shortly after the pregnancy was confirmed, and was clearly thrilled saying that 'new life' was coming after DH's death. She was delighted to find out that the baby is a boy, as SIL particularly wanted a son, after two daughters.

I had thought that, if there were any positives from DH's death - and it is hard to think of any, as I loved him so much - the family might be reconciled and healed. And I was very happy to hear about the baby, although a bit concerned, given the two previous emergency C sections (although I kept my concerns to myself).

DD1 has now moved to Ireland, having purchased a small holding with her inheritance from DH's aunt, as DH drafted his aunt's will so that his share would go to his DC if he were to predecease her. DD1 had sent me photos of the new property, says how much they love it over there, it feels 'so right' etc. They went for about a month and have now returned to the UK for the birth. I thought all was fine with my relationship with DD1, we were having natural conversations, FaceTimes with DGD1 and DGD2, ending conversations with 'I love you; etc.

I had enjoyed picking out some Christmas presents, which I thought they would enjoy. With the DGDs, I have sent presents which I knew they would appreciate, for DD1 some cashmere hat, gloves, scarf etc, and socks for baby, as I know it will be cold on the small holding, but also a food hamper, chocolates and candles sent jointly to DD1 and SIL, saying with love from Mum etc.

I spoke to DD1 on Friday and I could tell that there was something wrong, as she seemed more tense, less relaxed. She started by saying that she thought I should claim a refund for the hamper, that I had wasted my money, as the ham was too dry and not as good as supermarket ham. I thanked her for letting me know and said I would do so. She said the chocolates had too many additives, so they couldn't eat them (I had chosen dairy and soy free ones, as DGD1 had an allergy to dairy), so I said fine, just regift or donate them. They are generally happy with the DGC's toys, although I shouldn't send anything else. I said I understood, and was conscious that they wouldn't want too much stuff to take back to Ireland.

Then I asked her about how she was feeling and how the 36 week scan had gone. It seems that the baby is small (10th percentile), although appears healthy, but she is very worried about the birth, which is understandable, given the history. She wants a natural birth and is terrified of intervention. She thinks some of the medical staff are horrible and referred to one who asked her last time if she wanted a dead baby on her conscience, after she refused medical advice to have an elective C section. I made reassuring comments. She also said that she might not tell anyone when she went into labour as she didn't want to worry anyone, such as SIL's grandparents (last time she sent me messages before the birth and we spoke afterwards).

We then had a discussion about Ireland. They have run into some problems to do with the Forestry/Agricultural Commission which are preventing them from obtaining a felling licence and flock number, which they need to purchase animals. It seems that not all of the land has been conveyed to them and they have fallen out with the solicitor, whom they feel has been negligent. SIL spent a long time composing a letter and was angry when he only received a brief reply from the solicitor.

Anyway, after all that, I said that I and her sisters were looking forward to seeing the baby, especially after not seeing DGD1 as a baby, and DGD2 because of lockdown. She went a bit quiet and was non committal just saying Mmm, we'll see, I need to have the baby first. I pressed the point and she said 'SIL is my husband'. I said 'Yes, I know'. She said that I had tried to make her feel guilty over her treatment of DH and that she didn't feel guilty. She repeated this and then said that I had said that I was going to write SIL a letter in the summer and that it might now be too late. I was genuinely taken aback by this.

For context, before I visited in the summer, we had a heated conversation where I said that she had hurt DH (and me) by not telling him about the birth of DGD1 for 14 months or her marriage and by moving without telling us. I admit I was angry as I felt that DH had been cheated of precious time with his granddaughter, although I said that I knew she hadn't known that he was going to die. I said that I thought that she had been emotionally abusive in 'ghosting' us and I didn't want to form an attachment to my DGCs if there was a risk of it happening again. It would just be too painful. It made me afraid of loving them as I would wish to. DD1 had referred then to the incident, some years before, where I had made SIL leave my house (they weren't married then), as I felt he was bullying her. I said that it was all a long time ago and that 'Dad didn't do anything wrong, did he?', to which she replied 'No'. She said that SIL had told her not to be in contact.

I subsequently said, in another conversation, that I had been angry, but that I wasn't any longer, and that it would be nice if we could go out to lunch together, just the two of us, when I visited, and to start rebuilding our relationship. I duly visited, had what I thought was a very pleasant day with the family at a local attraction, then lunch with DD1 then next day. I said I thought that the previous day had gone well and she said that SIL had told her that he did not want me to visit too often (this was the first time I had visited since DH's funeral). I said that I was sorry to hear this and was there some way of resolving matters; that the 'incident' was all a long time ago, that it was time to move on, and that DH's death put disagreements into context. She said maybe I should say that to SIL and it was him I should be taking out or talking to. I said I would be happy to talk to him, but I doubted that he would want to go out with me, maybe I should write him a letter. So I floated the idea of a letter in a private conversation with DD1, but did not say that I was definitely going to write one and, upon reflection, I thought that it might be too much of a hostage to fortune.

During this lunch, which was mostly pleasant, and focusing on neutral topics, DD1 repeated again that she had cut us off because SIL had told her to, that she had had to choose and would always choose SIL. I said that I had made SIL leave my house on that occasion because I was trying to protect her, especially given her previous abusive relationship. She said she had not told SIL about this ie the previous relationship and she was not sure if she would behave in the same way as I did. She said she appreciated that I did not know that she would marry SIL at the time. I said that I understood that, in the final analysis, she would and should put her family first, but I thought she should also have some loyalty to her original family. After that, we returned to everyday topics and I thought we had both had a pleasant lunch, 'cleared the air', and that we were moving forward in rebuilding our relationship. However, it seems I was wrong.

When we returned to the house after lunch (for me to call a taxi back to the hotel), SIL went off to his workshop without speaking to me or saying goodbye. I went to the workshop and said goodbye and gave him a hug. I found it a gruelling trip without DH but went away thinking it had gone well.

Anyway, back to the present, I was blindsided by DD1's comments in the conversation to the effect that I should have written a letter and that it might be 'too late'. I said what did she think I should say in the letter. I said that it was all so long ago, that I had apologised to SIL, that we had met since then at DD1's 21st, that he had said we were 'ok'.DD1 said she didn't want anything that would upset her after the birth. I said that I would never do anything to upset her after the birth. I said that I was nice to SIL, praised him for his DIY skills and as a father, that I behaved in a civilised fashion, sent him cards and gifts, what more could I do, I couldn't make him like me. At this stage DD1 was clearly agitated and said she had to go and that she would speak to me another time. I said 'Alright darling, good bye'.

So I feel both devastated and empty at the same time. I had thought, after the most hellish two years, when I had to watch my beloved DH die and then lose his aunt, whom I was close to. When, more recently, my MIL nearly died, my sister in law has had major surgery, and I have lost one of my closest friends (the funeral is this week), I had thought that I had just about survived. I keep giving myself a talking to, saying come on, just one more step forward, nearly there, nearly the end of the year. And now this.

I apologise for the length of this post, but I would be grateful for any advice as to how handle the situation. Part of just feels like giving up, but I obviously don't want to lose DD1 again, and I am worried about the birth of DGS and would have wanted to be a support, not an aggravating factor.

@Chopinandchampagne

If you know their exact location in Ireland, I would strongly urge you to try to contact local leaders - Principal of the local National School, parish priest, the public health nurse (HSE should be able to tell you how to contact the PHN for the area they live in), local GPs, local pharmacist, and you could even try to contact their solicitor, who seems to have got the measure of this abusive horror of a man.

You need to say that he is domineering, controlling, and that you fear your daughter and the children are all being isolated and kept from any sources of support they might need in Ireland. Don't talk about the gifts. Don't talk about any hurt you are feeling. Mention the number of children and the fact that there will shortly be another baby who is to be born in the UK and who will possibly go under the local health network radar in Ireland, mention the ramshackle house, the wildly unrealistic idea about making a living on a smallholding, and your concern that they are in need of the basics of life.

Do you happen to know if she is receiving any pre natal care? If you are not sure about this, please mention this too.

Worst case scenario, you might have to contact the local Gardai to do a wellness check.

Please start trying to get phone numbers/contact information for all of these people.

Good point from mathaniety that a baby born in the UK, as well as the older children not going to school, may go under the radar as far as the relevant Irish authorities are concerned.

I don't agree that gift-giving has anything to do with "knowing someone as a person". My Mum and I are extremely close and she does her best to pick out things I'll like but she often gives me things that aren't to my taste or interests. Not because she doesn't care or doesn't know me but because she finds picking out the perfect gift challenging. I love that she always tries so hard, it doesn't matter to me what she actually sends.

I would never write a message like the one above. Its so rude. Please either ignore it completely or give her a very bland response - "Sorry to hear you didn't like them. Thanks for telling me." Grey rock. Don't be pulled into conversations justifying yourself or telling her that she's hurt your feelings. She will use it to curry favour with SIL.

LB is probably furious that dd has a few "luxuries" in their miserable life.Had you sent money he would have taken it.
As it is, she has something confortable & "useless" to him

Also, she says "she feels you dont know her at all"
Well no, you dont, the daughter you raised would never have had a child & not announce it for over a year, amongst many other damaging behaviours.

And also the gifts were not for him but for your daughter. He really is the worse kind of abuser.
I don’t know how you can deal with him.

So sorry @Chopinandchampagne what a horrible letter to send, the intention was clearly to wound. I think cancel any pipeline gifts & send a breezy response suggesting she give them to charity or a refuge as others have suggested. Then do your best to detach from the cycle & focus on your other DDs.

@StEval

Op Have you heard of Karpmans Drama Triangle? I think *@blahblah789* is correct in trying to get you to look at your own role in this. You are not an observer looking in at the victim vs persecutor, you are enmeshed in the triangle. Your DD is playing the role of victim, LB the persecutor and you the rescuer. They then both make you the victim of their joint abuse. The roles can move around. Please look up the roles. Rescuers get reward from feeling needed and wanted and being the knight on a white horse charging to the rescue ( inappropriately), interfering and over zealous in order to feel good about themselves. This allows LB to persecute both DD and you in order to feel good about himself and DD has got you dancing to her tune and the satisfying " poor me" role of the victim. You are involved in their lives and projects to an astonishing degree and this allows LB to abuse your DD and both to financially and emotionally abuse you. Please get another therapist who knows about this type of interaction in toxic families ( sorry) and step away.

@Chopinandchampagne This! Wishing you well OP x

Just because someone has a different opinion it doesn’t mean they are a troll. I thought blah blah made some good points. So did the OP it seems. Let’s not be so dismissive and rude eh.

I have been thinking of you this morning OP , and the message.
I think that your dd is stuck in a very childish way of relating to you, like a teenager everything that goes wrong is your fault.
I am very much struck by the feeling that happy people who feel loved and have good lives do not send messages like this to their nearest and dearest. She can’t acknowledge any of the difficulties of LB so projects her buried anger onto you. She sounds really angry and very resentful of you, her mother who has been so accepting and loving, who is grieving and still trying to be present as a mother.
She has in her head turned her Dad into someone who supported and understood her, and you into the villain.

I feel that there is nothing at all you can do but properly step back and disengage. As a pp pointed out, you need to remove one part of the dynamic that is shoring up the relationship. Without you to focus her anger on, perhaps she will start to feel angry with LB, and angry about her life now.

Big step back. No gifts, no passively accepting texts. She needs to properly grow up now and stand on her own two feet. Be unavailable. Do what your other daughters have done and disengage. All the fluttering around her is doing is feeding the beast, and hurting you. Simply retreat, spend time with your other dds, and accept the situation. I think you will then get a flurry of more messages with pics of the grandchildren, and then more anger. Keep still and solid and keep your distance.

She really needs time away to grow up and to feel the reality of her life with this terrible man.

Have you told your other dds about the message ?

I have to agree in part with @blahblah789 - but I still think that was a rude and ungrateful email she sent you, @Chopinandchampagne.

I have a sister, and had a mother, who were very keen on buying gifts that THEY liked themselves, but that weren't really my taste or appropriate. I was never as blunt or rude in response as your DD has been, but I did have to have a word because neither of them had a huge amount of money and I hated to see them wasting it on buying presents for me that didn't bring joy. I didn't want them to spend MORE - it wasn't about cost at all! - just to maybe ask what I might like if they weren't able to think outside of their own likes.

However, I'll say it again, I was NEVER as rude as that email!

The one thing I do note is that she doesn't actively ask for money. She isn't so crass as to say that she would rather have had the money - just that there were other gifts that would have been more useful/suitable. Maybe there was an undertone of "money would have been better" but, given how blunt she was with the rest, I'm surprised she wouldn't have just said that.

The PJs not being cotton might be being a bit precious, or the kids might have skin sensitivities. The candles - well, I don't like most scented stuff, regardless of cost, so that would be a "not for me" gift too.
BUT - whether she actually does like them, or not, I believe firmly that LB will be ruining ANY joy she might have had in them by bitching about "if your mother wanted to waste her money on us, she could have at least sent us something we NEED rather than pointless candles that is just like burning money anyway!" That will make your DD feel guilty about liking anything you've sent, which will turn into resentment that you've sent her something that's making her feel guilty and making LB be a shitty bastard about it- and she's just sent all that negativity straight back to you. Which is wrong of her - but I don't think she's in a "normal" headspace, if you see what I mean.

Now - I agree with those who say cancel the cashmere. It's only going to inflame the situation, so if you can stop them going to her, do it, please.

You are a lovely, kind, generous woman - but you're not dealing with sane rational people here and they are LOOKING FOR ways to be resentful. So stop giving them ammo - stop sending stuff.

Another scenario - I live in Australia, my family is all in the UK. We have an arrangement whereby they tell me how much they want to spend on the kids' presents, I buy the kids what they like, what we don't already have, and what I can cope with - and they give me the money for it. We have a video system so they can see their presents being opened, so they see the gifts they have paid for, and the joy they bring. But it saves double ups, unsuitable gifts, postage costs and hassle for them, so it works.
If you're still keen to give stuff to your DGC (which is understandable) then I recommend it as a system - it might sound incredibly controlling, but it really isn't! It benefits BOTH sides.

And then lastly, and again - Step Back. Let them come to you if they want to - stop putting yourself out there to be shot down. Focus on your other DDs - let your DD1 know you're always there for her, but don't chase her any more.

[quote SpringCrocus]@blahblah789
I think you've made your point.
Maybe stop , now?[/quote]
In their defence, I think they've made a reasonable post.

Whilst @Chopinandchampagne needs support and advice, she herself isn't averse to opposing viewpoints.

Another scenario - I live in Australia, my family is all in the UK. We have an arrangement whereby they tell me how much they want to spend on the kids' presents, I buy the kids what they like, what we don't already have, and what I can cope with - and they give me the money for it. We have a video system so they can see their presents being opened, so they see the gifts they have paid for, and the joy they bring. But it saves double ups, unsuitable gifts, postage costs and hassle for them, so it works.
If you're still keen to give stuff to your DGC (which is understandable) then I recommend it as a system - it might sound incredibly controlling, but it really isn't! It benefits BOTH sides.

That works for 'normal' families.
Don't know what the odds would be for the money actually being spent on the children.

[quote Offmyfence]@blahblah789
*

I did read it.*

But still thought OPs presents by comparison were unthoughtful?

Again, dds behaviour is disgusting. Sil seems at best incredibly manipulative and at worst abusive. Yes the gift they gave ops dh was horrendous.
That doesn’t renounce the fact that what op gave was unsuitable.

Unsuitable? Or is DD being deliberately obtuse?
*
*
To the other poster who asked, I think it was worded perfectly because she asked if op could get a refund, stated the gifts weren’t what was wanted or needed at that time, explained her preferences and reasonings for it for ops future reference, pointed out they were extravagant and expensive and said they don’t want her wasting her money. Her tone may not have been the best admittedly but I don’t understand how any of that is rude or upsetting.

Perfectly worded? But her tone was not the best? Can it be both?

Nor do I understand how so many people think it’s acceptable for the people they care about to waste their money on gifts that will be sold on or given anyway. How is it better to lie and pretend you love something, setting the tone for future gifts, future lies and more wasting money than have one honest conversation?

Do you think the DD cares about her mother? Do the think the DD cared about her dying father? Do the think the gift to her dying father was the reflection of a caring DD?

I also don’t think it was bad that dd said about feeling hurt that op doesn’t seem to know her, honest communication is key to any and all relationships, they’re trying to rebuild the trust but she shouldn’t tell her how she feels?
Clearly I’m in the minority but I would hate to think of anyone wasting money on something I’d just give away, that I wasn’t comfortable enough to have an honest conversation or that I couldn’t have a conversation about my own feelings because we were both walking on eggshells.
Honesty= trust= releasing some of the distrust caused by sil in her ear

Some things are more important than money and the year her DM is dealing with the death of her husband, is not the time to decide "honesty" is what's important. Not over bloody Christmas presents! So, the money is spent already, it can't be unspent, you don't think DD could've just been grateful this year and saved some ideas for DM for next year that would be within her exacting standards?

What do you think DD would've gratefully received and been pleased with? Cash? So she can buy her own things? Because DMs are never ever going to be good enough?

You like the OPs DD seem totally money motivated? All "if my mother didn't know me" and got me the wrong things. You both sound like completely spoilt brats.

I wonder what fabulously thoughtful presents the DD is getting for her DM this year. Her DM would welcome a bit of warmth and love, not to be criticised for every good deed she's done.

[/quote]
It can be both. Tone is the overall attitude or feeling, the context of their relationship means the tone is very negative. If they had a good relationship it wouldn’t have that undercurrent with the wording.
Personally I think dd is too preoccupied with managing and keeping herself and her children safe in an abusive situation to put enough thought into much else.
I think that when trying to start afresh and rebuild that it’s the perfect time for honesty because it sets the precedent for the future.
Fully understand that op has had a horrible time and it might not have been the time for it but you’re talking about a woman who’s been socially and physically isolated away from everyone but her dh for what seems to be a long time, all of her social and communication skills will have begun to mimic his, it took me 7 months of domestic abuse counselling before his influence wore off, I imagine it’s the same scenario.
Definitely not cash, they’re only just getting to know each other again, personally I’d have asked if she needed anything for the new house.
It has nothing to do with monetary value, I asked for some pens that aren’t biros and a £7 book this year, neither of which screams spoilt. I don’t care if or what people spend on me, but I would hate to think of them spending money that they’ve earned every year on things that I might end up just giving away.
Dd absolutely should be treating her dm with love and kindness, I’ve said repeatedly her behaviour is awful but op clearly does not want to step back or go low or no contact with her which means the only way forward is to figure out how to coexist which takes time, patience and understanding of each other’s point of view

[quote SpringCrocus]@blahblah789
I think you've made your point.
Maybe stop , now?[/quote]
I’m not in any way attacking the op.
I’m responding to people asking how or why I’ve said things and have made judgements on my character based on my opinion.
I’ll continue to explain my reasoning when it’s been asked for or is needed.

Gosh, so many replies, thank you! I am feeling calmer this morning and your responses have really helped me. I am now thinking that maybe I should have sent them some charity goats for Christmas, as a temporary substitute for their real flock !

Just replying randomly to various points..

The reason DD has come back to the UK for the birth is that she is registered under the care of a consultant at her local hospital. I imagine that it would have been difficult to swap, so late into pregnancy, and the nearest hospital in Ireland is an hour away, so not ideal in the event of another emergency. I am sure that they will be on the official record, as they will want to claim child benefit.

Regarding what happened with the purchase/solicitor and, reading between the lines, I think that if the woodland is transferred to them, they will have to pay back a fairly large EU grant but, if it is not transferred, they won't be able to use the land and it won't be a big enough plot to qualify for fresh EU grants or to obtain a flock number, which they need to purchase livestock. They also need to have some sort of farming qualifications, which they may need to pay for.

DD does seem very worried about money. For example, when we spoke about gifts, I asked if the DGDs would like some lego, but she said not, as they had SIL's old lego, then mentioned, at least twice, the value of second hand lego. I worry that she doesn't have access to money, despite the large legacy, and I doubt very much that she has a credit card. It worries me that LB may also be exercising financial control, but there is nothing that I can do about it. As various posters have said, she currently chooses to be with him and to choose him over everyone and everything else.

StEval - I am interested in the Karpman's Drama Triangle you mentioned and have done a little research. It does sound as though the 'rescuer' is similar to the 'Caretaker' mentioned up thread. I found it all very interesting. I would say that I am probably a 'fixer' and sometimes have a tendency to try to sort out people's problems for them, rather than letting them learn and grow by encouraging them to sort out their own problems. I think this partly stems from my childhood where other family members leant on me, probably more than they should have done, and partly from my former profession as a lawyer, where you are usually there to sort out other people's problems. I think that is a lesson which I will certainly take away from this thread.

I was interested in the number of comments about my doing the same thing, getting the same results, being stuck on the merry go round etc, all of which I recognise as true. It must be very frustrating when posters give up their time to provide wise advice and then I just pop up again, with the same problem, in another guise. I suppose I thought that DH's death might have changed things but, unfortunately, it appears that I was wrong.

With regard to the presents, I suspect Twillow is right in thinking that it causes DD anxiety, because she knows that anything received from me will prompt a barrage of criticism and anger from LB. He doesn't want DD to receive anything 'personal' from me, but he is happy to take any money which may be on offer.

I haven't replied to DD's message yet, but I will reply later today and will keep it short and sweet, as advised. I am not going to rise to the bait. That is the second lesson for me to learn, not to respond when I am angry, emotional or tired. I like the suggestion of a response along the lines of one to a work colleague whom you don't want to upset.

Cancel the cashmere if only for being prime food for moths (Uniqlo thermals would be more suitable for damp decaying Irish farmhouse!)

Is honestly stop trying so hard. Diptyque candles and white company pjs are extremely generous. She’s being ridiculous. When will enough be enough?

I'm another who thinks that @blahblah789 has a point, or that at least her post indicates an issue that most posters, in telling the OP how lovely she is, are not addressing as bluntly.

Being given a present, especially a thoughtful one, is a message as to who the giver thinks you are or who the giver wants you to be. I find it enormously irritating, though I smile and say thanks, when my mother, for instance, gives me presents which are all about the daughter she wishes she had, or reflect her misrecollection of some fleeting enthusiasm I had in my teens (well over 30 years ago) -- she's always insisting that she knows me better than I know myself. I smile and say thanks, obviously, but that bond of civility has broken down in the OP/DD's case.

The OP's DD is alert to every little indication that her mother has 'got her wrong', or is insisting that she knows her better than the DD knows herself, or that LB has forced changes upon her which are not the 'real her' 'But you were vegan!' 'I don't like my grandchildren eating roadkill squirrels!' 'You're just going along with LB's mad idea of an Irish smallholding that's not who you really are!' etc.

The DD is probably deriving a form of satisfaction from smacking down all of these with 'You're WRONG about me!' and it drives her even deeper into her relationship with LB, who 'gets' her, and hitting out at this woman who, every time she is knocked over, gets back up and starts hovering needily again (from the DD's perspective), showering her with unsuitable presents, making her feel bad about having 'stolen' grandchild time from her dying father and punished her mother in her bereavement, asking her for proofs of love and loyalty the DD, for whatever reason, doesn't want to give etc.

It's like having an emotional weeble punchbag, who, whatever you say or do, gets back up every time and starts hovering again, sending unsuitable presents that seem like reproaches (luxury warm clothes which imply a worry about how warm the children are at home, scented candles which flag up basic living conditions etc) and carefully not commenting negatively over your living arrangements etc. but with concern oozing wordlessly from every pore.

I agree with everyone who says the OP needs to step away for everyone's sake.

Very best wishes, OP.

I was interested in the number of comments about my doing the same thing, getting the same results, being stuck on the merry go round etc, all of which I recognise as true. It must be very frustrating when posters give up their time to provide wise advice and then I just pop up again, with the same problem, in another guise. I suppose I thought that DH's death might have changed things but, unfortunately, it appears that I was wrong.

Entirely your prerogative of course, and as long as the thread is in some way helpful that's the main thing. As we all know, real life is messy, and doesn't tie up neatly like a soap opera.

I guess the people for whom I think this must be frustrating, are your other daughters. It must worry them to see you being hurt time and again, but seemingly unable to step away.

I wish you all the best, OP.

I guess if the woodland is transferred over then you will be asked to pay back the grant! It will be an emergency of course.

Please stand firm when they come demanding emergency money over the house/land crises.

Take a leaf out if DD2 & 3 books and dial back the contact.

Bland and distant is the way forward for your sanity.

I'm sure DD1 and LB like to busy as it stops DD1 from taking stock of what a shitty life she actually does have for LB he needs a money making scheme on the go all the time so he doesn't have to work (a small holding will come has a huge shock) and easy money is his god.

I also hope you stand firm when they come to you for money to pay back the grant, and sort their issues.

Just remember, even if you feel like giving money is helping DD, it won’t be. It is giving LB more and more control, and dwindling your reserves, which you may find you have more of a need for if/when DD escapes LB

I teckon the reason they're so ungrateful for the gifts is that they're annoyed you wont just give them cash.
But they cant say that so it comes out in a passive aggressive moaning ungrateful way

Yes, agree, do not give them money. Xx