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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

DH has arranged to spend Christmas with his parents….on his own

277 replies

Jisforjuggling · 30/11/2021 04:51

This might just be the end of us.
The ILs live in a different country and don’t speak English. We stayed with them just before the first lockdown and he has managed to visit twice since (albeit once was for a funeral). We are booked to visit in feb half term. DH wanted to go for NY. I can’t. It’s a day travelling each way to get there and back and I have work commitments that just make it not worth while. I said he could take DC for the last week of the holidays. This would be the first time has has taken the children on his own and he knew I was apprehensive. I don’t trust his manipulative overbearing mother. This was huge for me. DH presents me with the flights he is proposing to take. He has turned this into an 11 day trip which also involves cancelling 2 long-standing holiday plans. I said no. I agreed to 6 days, 7 at a push. He says I’m being unfair and preventing him from seeing his parents. He sent me a text last night saying he has booked to go on his own for a week over Christmas. In 11 years we have never spent Christmas with his family….in his words ‘they don’t really celebrate Christmas’. It’s never even been discussed as an option. I’m considering telling him if he goes through with this we are finished. (Yes, iceberg and tip are valid comments).

OP posts:
ClaudiaJ1 · 30/11/2021 09:17

@Greenmarmalade

If you split, he’ll have the kids 50-50. He’d be able to let his mum look after them whenever he chose, on his days/nights.

Just be aware of this in your decision making.

I think you’re well justified in splitting up.

Not true. She can stop him from taking the children out of the country.
KittyKattyFosterMummy · 30/11/2021 09:20

I would make him tell the children he won't be there for Christmas.

ILoveYou3000 · 30/11/2021 09:22

@Livelovebehappy

girlmom21 It was the comment re op stating she was apprehensive about him taking them alone. Why would she not trust their father, her DH, to look after them properly? That suggests controlling behaviour, and I sense that that is the over riding decision for her refusal, not the longstanding holiday plans she then mentions. Spending 11 days with their ‘manipulative and overbearing’ grandmother is not going to scar them for life.
She's explained why. Her husband has a difficult relationship with his parents (EA) and MiL is manipulative, with a history of putting the children in unsafe situations and OP doesn't believe her husband will be able to stand up to his mother and protect the children fully.
ancientgran · 30/11/2021 09:24

OP you sound like you hate his parents and not much more positive about his country. If that is clear to him it must be hard, it is OK to moan about your parents/family/country/culture whatever but it is hard to listen to someone else being negative about them.

It is a confusing "rule" but I think it applies to lots of people. My husband had a difficult (understatement) relationship with his mother but he wouldn't stand for anyone else running her down.

Do you think it comes across to him that you are negative about his parents/country? Remember this could impact your children as well as they are also connected to his background.

I'd reiterate to him that the kids can go but you need to agree on dates and let him think about his next step.

FedUpAtHomeTroels · 30/11/2021 09:27

I'd leave him to it. I wonder if he's seeing time with his family and in his home country through rose tinted glasses after living away so long. He may well need this time alone with them to bring back to him why he doesn't live there, close to them. Take loads of pictures over Christmas and keep him up to date. I have a feeling he won't try this again after a boring time with the parents. Did you say they were abusive when he was younger? I may be imagining this.

Oldraver · 30/11/2021 09:27

Dont give him an ultimatum over this as if he decides not to go it will be not be because he's decided it's the right thing to do, and you will be back on the ultimatum merry go round.

If he cant see that fucking off and leaving the children at Christmas is wrong you can then make a decision if the relationship has had it's day

Isthatthebestyoucando · 30/11/2021 09:27

You say there is no coercive control, but then paint a picture of a guy who punishes you with his absence, and only when you don't seem to care does he get over himself and join you and the children. I would have struggled after the holiday he didn't join you on, only to join you when you and the children went anyway. These games are what form the patterns of control, they just don't bother you to the extent that he was relying on.

ZeroFuchsGiven · 30/11/2021 09:31

I would absolutely love to hear the DH's side of the story.

bucketsoflove · 30/11/2021 09:31

It would be the end of my marriage, and I say that as someone who lives a long way from family and spends most special events with in-laws instead of my own family.

What kind of father chooses to spend Christmas Day away from primary aged DC when there are alternative dates available?

You sound very sensible OP in not pandering to his nonsense in the past - you don't have to put up with it at all and I suspect your life would be so much easier without this man child in your home.

Isthatthebestyoucando · 30/11/2021 09:32

@Jsku

OP - you do realise that if you divorce, he’ll get the kids half of the time and can travel to see his family whenever he wants. And you’ll get half of Christmases with your family.

It sounds like you think it’s completely normal that you have been with your family for the last 11 years for Xmas. It also sounds like you think you are the only one who can decide what happens with the children.
You didn’t agree to 10 days, but 7 was OK.
Really.

In your H’s place I’d simply booked the 10 days - as there must have been a reason (availability and cost of flights) - why he looked at those tickets. You’d then could chose to come or not.

He is being unreasonable just going on his own. Maybe he has given up on the relationship.
But you both seem to match each other on the unreasonableness.

They already had holiday plans that the 11 days would clash with.
girlmom21 · 30/11/2021 09:33

@Livelovebehappy

girlmom21 It was the comment re op stating she was apprehensive about him taking them alone. Why would she not trust their father, her DH, to look after them properly? That suggests controlling behaviour, and I sense that that is the over riding decision for her refusal, not the longstanding holiday plans she then mentions. Spending 11 days with their ‘manipulative and overbearing’ grandmother is not going to scar them for life.
OP's also suggested that she's previously put them in real physical danger.

The issue with the 11 days was that they'd have had to cancel other plans.

astoundedgoat · 30/11/2021 09:34

@Margotshypotheticaldog

I would say he doesn't actually want to spend Christmas away from you all, rather he was hoping to manipulate you into going with him. And I would also agree with pp, he probably has a sense of loyalty to his parents regardless of how awful they are. Actually when the parents are awful, the feelings are usually even more complicated and overwhelming. I would let him go, tell him I'm disappointed at how he's gone about it, but I understand the need to see parents. I'd arrange a lovely Christmas day for the kids, lots of fun activities either side. And I'd send him pictures to update him and have the kids phone him. When he returns (if he goes) I'd sit down and talk to him. I predict he will feel very differently about his decision after spending the holidays with his parents.
I full agree with this.

He has very complicated feelings about his parents and I imagine feels bad about the fact that in 11 years he has never once spent Christmas with his family, only ever yours. He may not WANT to, but he can still feel guilty and conflicted. My DH has a less negative set of feelings but still feels that conflict between guilt and not actually wanting to be there. Right now my DH is refusing to decide about going to his home country for a week after Christmas and it's nearly December!

Leave him be. Be kind. Don't back him into a corner about it. He has made a bad and impulsive choice, but he KNOWS that already without you being mean about it too. Offer him a gentle out where he can back down with his dignity intact. He probably won't go, but he will if you fight him about it.

Fairylights25 · 30/11/2021 09:34

Actually a court will decide if it is safe for the children to leave the country with their father, not the dh or his family.

RedHot22 · 30/11/2021 09:34

By ‘holiday plans’ do you mean an actual holiday? @Jisforjuggling

Or just something you had planned over the Christmas and NY holiday period

Double3xposure · 30/11/2021 09:35

I’d be amazed if this man wants his kids 50:50.

He has never cared for them alone.

He’s leaving them at Christmas for a week to prove a point.

He thinks his wife is the default parent.

He abandoned them on holiday because he was in a mood.

He resents his wife working full time ( presumably because he has to do some childcare / housework ).

Not exactly father of the year.

astoundedgoat · 30/11/2021 09:35

Also, OP, you can't seriously suggest leaving your husband because once in 12 years he has tried to see his own parents over Christmas. I know it's complicated, but still. That sounds really bad!

NameChange2PostThis · 30/11/2021 09:35

@Jisforjuggling wake up! Your DH’s Christmas holiday arrangements are a symptom of an unhealthy family dynamic. His (and your) relationship with his parents is actually not the real issue here.

Why does your DH have the right to unilaterally announce - and by text! - that he’s leaving you to manage the kids and house - and during a school holiday! - and during a traditional family celebration!? How fucking dare he?

What would happen if you just decided to piss off on holiday and leave him to it?

Where is your anger? Your outrage? He’s happy to dump all responsibilities on you, and to upset your children in order to spite you. He sounds like a feckless man-child, and you are enabling this behaviour.

Sorry, but your marriage sounds bloody awful. Nothing you have posted indicates he has any love or care or respect for you or your children. I’m sorry Flowers

Give him an ultimatum.
Tell him to piss off back to his mammy and not to bother coming back.
Or stay - and start treating you and your children with respect. Starting with a massive apology for being a selfish dick.

Cacee3029 · 30/11/2021 09:37

Definitely man-child like behaviour!!

FairFuming · 30/11/2021 09:39

It sounds like this is the straw that broke the camels back. I'd tell him to go, no ultimatum or threats of leaving but use the time and space to decide if the marriage is still working for you.

Fahrted · 30/11/2021 09:39

OP, he's being childish and silly.

In your position, I would wave him off for his Christmas trip, and would get on with having a lovely Christmas with your DC. Tell them one of their grandparents is ill, so their father has to visit them. I don't think he'll be that much of a loss to you over Christmas - the main thing is for the children not to be made anxious, but there's no reason why they should be, if you're matter of fact about it and treat it as if it were normal.

I can't comment on social media as I don't use it, but I'd encourage the children to ring/email/whatever (would also facilitate this). Not for his sake, but for theirs.

If he wants to make the decision to be away at Christmas, that's his funeral. He'll probably have a rotten time and regret it.

And to the poster who said you should have learnt his native language, OP: I take it they have never learnt a language, or else they would appreciate that it is verging on impossible to "learn a language" just like that.

LuneyTunes · 30/11/2021 09:48

I think you're being a bit selfish about refusing to see your own in laws

Darbs76 · 30/11/2021 09:51

If you’ve always spent Christmas with your family I don’t see why he can’t take the kids for Christmas. I let my children to India with their dad one Christmas as I’ve had all the other years. Glad I did as their grandfather died a few months later unexpectedly so glad he got to show them his home town / the sights of India etc

girlmom21 · 30/11/2021 09:52

@Darbs76

If you’ve always spent Christmas with your family I don’t see why he can’t take the kids for Christmas. I let my children to India with their dad one Christmas as I’ve had all the other years. Glad I did as their grandfather died a few months later unexpectedly so glad he got to show them his home town / the sights of India etc
He doesn't want to take his children for Christmas. He's booked to go alone.
ClaudiaJ1 · 30/11/2021 09:52

@LuneyTunes

I think you're being a bit selfish about refusing to see your own in laws
@LuneyTunes Read the OPs posts. She is not refusing to see the in laws at all!!
LuneyTunes · 30/11/2021 09:53

You want to ostracise him from.his family. You don't like them, you don't ever want you or your kids to see them. It's convenient for you to have excuses not to go. I bet he's ashamed by your hatefulness for his family when you've said yours live close by and you see them regularly. #preparing to be flamed