I want to get married, DP doesn’t. What happens now?

[AngstyMcAngsty]

I’ve been with DP for a few years and things are great between us, except for the massive elephant in the room. He is so hesitant about getting married. We live separately and both have kids from previous relationships. He’s divorced and I’ve not been married before. I believe he loves me and he knows I love him, but this is now causing an issue between us. It’s got to the point where I’m seriously having to think about ending things because it’s upsetting me. I don’t want to though because he’s almost perfect in every other way. Oh wise mumsnetters, what would you do in this situation?

When you say the kids are getting older etc

How old are they actually?

@AngstyMcAngsty

He’s already asked me to move in to his but it wouldn’t work logistically due to the respective kids’ school locations. We’ve also looked at buying a house together somewhere closer to mine, again location is the issue. Moving in together isn’t the main issue it’s the marriage that’s important to me.

But moving is difficult so what's the point of marrying??

Paradoxically if you’re thinking about dumping him just because he won’t marry you, that shows you don’t really think enough of him to spend the rest of your life with him. And if he knows you’d dump him for this, he’s probably worried you’d dump him for other spurious reasons and if you were married he’d lose half his assets thereby depriving his kids. If I was him I wouldn’t want to marry you either.

My DP earns much, much more than I do, so I don’t think I’ll be losing out financially

And how would he feel about this, maybe putting 50 % of his assets/ pension at risk ?

@AngstyMcAngsty

I know some people are saying we should live together first etc, but I’ve done the cohabitating thing and don’t want to do it again. As others have said once they get their feet under the table why would they rush to get married?

You've mentioned the 'looking after' aspect.

What if he ring-fenced all his assets for his children before marrying?

Mid to late teens

Bloody awful age to move away from schools or blend families

Don’t op. Just don’t

Your argument is that you have cohabitated and it didn’t work. He married and it didn’t work. That’s stalemate.

But practically you need to think this through for your children’s sakes. Blending late teens into one family is going to be messy. Even if they get along. Add in the fact he has far more money and there will be inequities.

The biggest issue you face married or not is about the difference in income and lifestyle. If you don’t want any financial contribution from him then it will just be an unequal relationship between you and him and your respective children. That’s before considering what happens if either of you cannot work. Which would negate a prenup.

This is the talk you need to have. Then decide if marriage or living together is the next step.

These are huge steps you are taking. Not just for yourselves but for your children. Deal with the practicalities, financial and emotional, not the romantic.

If you feel there has been any future faking then that’s a real red flag.

Basically if he was open to marriage at the beginning and now isn’t it’s either:

1. Future faking where he said what you wanted to hear in order to get you I totally he relationship. Which is manipulative and emotionally abusive.
2. He’s changed his mind. If that was down to a change in circumstances external to the relationship and he was open about that/explained it with being asked as you went along that might be ok, depending what the exact details were. Or he’s changed his mind based on the circumstances of the relationship, so there isn’t the necessary depth of trust or feeling there. I wouldn’t be able to continue in a relationship where the scope was fixed and limited like that. It’s just gotten to it’s natural conclusion.

To be honest, I’d say he might have some avoidant tendencies or be carrying some hurt from part relationship he hasn’t dealt with yet. Neither bode well for a happy long term relationship, married or not. And if he doesn’t see
Those things as an issue and want to proactively heal them himself with therapy or whatever, there’s nothing you can do to deal with them for him or prove you are “worthy”.

I’ve only know one man who said he didn’t want to get married change his mind without losing someone he loved as a life lesson.

That person has been married before and his wife had said she wanted children before they married and changed her mind after. In his next relationship he said he didn’t want to get married, but changed his mind after their child was born.

If its not physically possible for you to live together, he is right not to marry!

• without being asked

Actions do indeed speak louder than words and from your posts OP your DP sounds like a really lovely person. You say he’s generous and treats you well, and has asked that the two of you move in together. That doesn’t sound like someone that isn’t committed to you.

I think it’s interesting that you weren’t married yourself to the father of your children (you say you’ve never been married?) So it’s curious that you’re so set on marriage this time. What is the attraction this time that it didn’t have last time? I think lots of people would say it’s more important to marry when you’re planning to have children, rather than in a later in life relationship!

I also noticed this comment:
“I feel a little bit of resentment that he doesn’t want to marry me because of what happened with his previous marriage. It makes me feel like he doesn’t trust me, or perhaps I’m not good enough”

Are there feelings of jealousy or rivalry here that by not being married to your DP you’ve not ‘got’ what his ex had? That your relationship might be seen by others (or yourself) as not as valid?

“My DP earns much, much more than I do so I don’t think I’d be losing out financially”

Right - but he would be. So you can see straight away the problem from his point of view - if you really love him why do you need a legal statement that says you’ll receive some kind of financial settlement if you choose to divorce him?
If you love him so much perhaps a better commitment to him from his POV would be for you to forego that possibility.

Be real - if you earned “much much more” than him and had already been divorced how would you see someone wanting to marry you as an act of commitment even though you live apart?
I don’t blame him for cringing at the idea.

@Tarne

Oh for goodness sake op, he doesn't want to marry you because he doesn't want you to have any share of his assets but he does want wifework done ie cooking, cleaning, childcare, home and garden maintenance and laundry and sex on tap!

Never move in with a man in those terms!

Stop him coming round to yours so much.

Find someone who wants to marry you and share their assets with you in a fair exchange of services to your union and future.

Unfortunately he has shown his hand and it is not in your favour and so that ells you he wants to use you not have a fair and equal partnership.

There is no coming back from that utter humiliation.

How on earth have you come to that conclusion??

I wouldn't marry someone I hadn't lived with. And no, staying over at each other's houses doesn't count as you've both got your own space to retreat to. You have no shared commitments and responsibilities for running a household.

The fact he's suggested living together says more about his commitment to you than a ring and certificate. Also, there might be implications down the road, when it comes to dividing up your estate between the two sets of kids. I'm not sure how difficult it is to keep premarital assets separate.

So I can see why he doesn't want to get married in the circumstances. But perhaps as a compromise you could get engaged?

Maybe he doesn’t want to get married again because his divorce ruined him financially? Also, would you continue to live apart if you became engaged? It sounds like both of you would be better financially if you did not marry.

Divorce is such a massive head fuck.

The point of marriage (IMO) is to protect women who stop working to raise shared kids.

You've had your own kids. You don't need the protection.

I would let it go in your shoes.

I will never understand women who need a man to marry them. I don't get it. It seems like the most needy thing ever...PROVE you love me, PROVE you want to be with me, PROVE you are committed.

He treats you well, is generous and good to you. WHY do you need a ring on your finger? He sounds like a good egg. You would dump him if he doesn't marry you? You sound like a small child stamping her foot to get what she wants. You cannot force someone to get married!

@FabulousMrFifty

My DP earns much, much more than I do, so I don’t think I’ll be losing out financially

And how would he feel about this, maybe putting 50 % of his assets/ pension at risk ?

This ^

I left my ex husband a few years ago, it was my choice but we managed it all very amicably. He bought me out the house we jointly owned and I only took my half of that. I didn’t even attempt to touch his savings/business etc.

I applied for divorce once we’d been separated for 2 years.

We have 3 children together. We’re both now with other people. I have a new baby with my partner and my partner has made it clear he will propose to me one day, and I’d happily remarry. Whereas my ex husband has made it clear to his new partner that he would never remarry or live with a woman again, purely because he wants to protect his house and finances from any potential future break up. He is a much higher earner than I was so has far more to lose financially. I however, have very little to lose, I rent a house and have very little savings.

You might find he’s wary about marriage due to the financial side of things.

OP marriage is mainly necessary to protect the lower earning party when children come along. You’re both independent financially and have children - it makes no sense to marry. Especially when you don’t want to live with him.
And if he has more assets he’s likely to bear the majority of the impact. I can see why he doesn’t want to get married.

Don’t throw away a good relationship for a piece of paper. Relationships as parents with children are different from people just starting out. Maybe if you do live together after a few years it makes sense? But not the way things are now.

I think many people are wary of getting married when their first marriage hasnt worked out. He is obv wary of losing his assets ,and feels happy with the way things are .If you love him then you have to accept him on those terms ,generally speaking .He is under no obligation to marry again .If marriage is important to you you may have to rethink the RL

I don't blame you for wanting the commitment that marriage shows. And the legal protection. And I dont blame him for being wary. I would not take anything forward in this situation - he either needs to get over his fear or let you move on.

By hesitant I mean that he brought up marriage very early on in our relationship and it felt like we were or be same page but as time goes on he seems very comfortable
@AngstyMcAngsty this bit jumped out at me.Why bring marriage up at all,especially early on in your relationship.

Seems to me hes dangling a carrot in front of you.
He wants the comforts of having s wife,without actually having to marry you.

I’m in a similar position and it surprised me that marriage became important given I’d said I’d never ever get married again.

I’ve done lots of soul searching on it, trying to work out why it became important after 8 years.

For me, it seems that I actually want and need the feeling that we are totally in it together. Travelling on the path together. Obviously I know divorce exists, I’ve been through it, but still I feel there is a ‘next step’ in being fully committed to a life together, being a true partnership. The vows we say as part of a wedding ceremony are not irrelevant (to me at least). It’s easy to say it’s just a piece of paper, but I feel that there is something deep about that commitment that I want to feel is absolutely clear and shared as we move towards old age. We all have fear of loneliness and abandonment, all of us, and having this ‘status’ of man and wife, committed until death do us part, at least in intention, will bring me comfort. And ironically, freedom.

It’s not entirely rational but then life and love often isn’t totally rational.

@hamstersarse

I’m in a similar position and it surprised me that marriage became important given I’d said I’d never ever get married again.

I’ve done lots of soul searching on it, trying to work out why it became important after 8 years.

For me, it seems that I actually want and need the feeling that we are totally in it together. Travelling on the path together. Obviously I know divorce exists, I’ve been through it, but still I feel there is a ‘next step’ in being fully committed to a life together, being a true partnership. The vows we say as part of a wedding ceremony are not irrelevant (to me at least). It’s easy to say it’s just a piece of paper, but I feel that there is something deep about that commitment that I want to feel is absolutely clear and shared as we move towards old age. We all have fear of loneliness and abandonment, all of us, and having this ‘status’ of man and wife, committed until death do us part, at least in intention, will bring me comfort. And ironically, freedom.

It’s not entirely rational but then life and love often isn’t totally rational.

I have similar feelings but I also feel like being married means sharing all of your lives and putting each other first.

But the OP doesn’t want to cohabit and they’re both putting their own kids first. They have other responsibilities and their relationship isn’t the most important thing.

I will never understand women who need a man to marry them. I don't get it. It seems like the most needy thing ever...PROVE you love me, PROVE you want to be with me, PROVE you are committed.

I don't think marriage is right in every situation, this being one of them, but...it's needy to want someone who claims to be committed to you to want to prove it?

You would have no issue with a man saying, "Of course I love you, of course I'm committed, of course I'll always be there....but don't ask me to do anything to prove it!"

I’m not sure why so much stock is placed discussions early on in a relationship about marriage and children. These are always notional and theoretical. Even if they weren’t people can change their minds as they come to terms with the realities of their relationship. Dominated in this case by children and differences in income.

I don’t think you are ready for a realistic discussion about marriage given where you both are in your lives. If I was in his position I would have to say it’s not yet and if you want something more definitive then it’s a no.