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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Have i just been an idiot and destroyed things?

803 replies

abersterol · 05/10/2021 16:00

A year ago today I met the man I am currently with. He’s 39, I was 35 last week. When we met I was very clear I wanted to settle down and have a family. He said the same. He has a job that means he works 7am to usually half 8 (this is relevant I think).

In short, we’ve had brief sex twice, both times for about two minutes and then he stops. We’ve had other intimacy, he goes down on me and I on him, he’s hard when we kiss and he’s into cuddling and is quite affectionate that way. I’ve asked him why he’s reluctant to have proper full sex (we’ve done it twice and the last time was in may). I’ve asked him literally everything I could think of, gone through all the possible anxieties, worries or concerns he may have from sti to performance and everything in between. I’ve sat and held his hand and said whatever the issue is I’m here to work through it with him. I’ve also asked outright if he just doesn’t like sex. His answer is always the same: he wants sex, he wants that with me, he doesn’t have a reason why we haven’t developed that side to the relationship and he can’t promise me when we will do it but he knows he wants to at some point. So what happens is I leave it, a week or two, then obviously we do other things and he ejaculates with a blow job and things carry on, but I start feeling upset about the fact there’s no progress with sex and no answer as to why we are no doing it. He recently told me the last time he did have sex was 7 years ago. He’s not had a relationship for a long time and the longest has been much shorter than ours at a few weeks/months. I wondered if he was worried about performance but I’ve asked sensitively about that too and he says not.

That’s issue one.

Issue two is that since June I’ve been trying to book a short break from Saturday to Monday, to go away for a long weekend together. He’s not keen on taking time off/started a new job recently so said he doesn’t know if he can etc. I’ve said it’s just one day of annual leave. He’s said he can’t go abroad or go far as he just doesn’t want to do that right now with work. I’m not exactly sure why as his colleagues go away and they’re in the same role but he seems to find it all stressful. Eventually he agreed to ask to take a Monday off in October and so I booked somewhere an hour away, just for a change of scenery. It turns out he didn’t ask work/couldn’t take it off in the end. He’s not suggested another weekend or even said let’s just have a night away on a Saturday instead which I would have thought was a compromise. I know this is a bit of a first world problem and if the relationship is good then maybe I should stop complaining about something like this, but I guess it had upset me he didn’t want to find any extra time to share together. Again with this I was very patient, he said he did want to go away but didn’t know when etc etc. So I emailed him some dates and hotels and asked which he liked. He said he liked one of them and so I said I would provisionally book. Then he makes zero steps to organise it with his work or suggest an alternative. It makes me feel a bit messed around.

All this came to a head a few nights ago. We’d had a nice meal and come home and were watching a film, kissing etc. I suggested sex and he just stopped and shook his head. I asked why and he shook his head and didn’t answer. I got really upset. Said we’d had a nice night, if you want sex like you’ve said then why aren’t you doing that… it escalated.

I said it wasn’t normal to say you want sex and then not do it. I said he was weird for not wanting to go away together and do something nice and that most normal people in an adult relationship would appreciate me taking time to fit in with them and find somewhere nice to go for a two night break once in a year. I said he was selfish for not listening to me or compromising, said he was making me miserable and why couldn’t he at least understand that as a couple he should be honest and if he wants us to be together he needs to understand that you have to compromise. I said it was obvious why he had never had a relationship before. I said he was a bastard for playing games (no idea if he is but it felt that way). I asked him if he just wanted to break up because I couldn’t understand why he would treat me this way. I also raised the fact that in summer he would only see me briefly on a Sunday night for a few weeks and wouldn’t go for a meal or do anything as he had an interview coming up. It was a huge interview to be fair to him but I found it all a bit odd and extreme and said it was hurtful at the time.

He got upset and then defensive, said he does compromise to be with me because he spends all his free time with me outside work …that is mostly true he does but I said that’s not compromising, that’s just having the relationship. He said he would usually work later than he does it it wasn’t for me, so therefore it was a compromise Hmm

It ended with him saying I clearly thought he was inadequate and therefore he couldn’t meet my needs and I had been horrible to him and that changed how he felt now.

We had some breathing space and reconvened when calmed down but even then he was reluctant to actually talk about things rationally. He didn’t say much and I still have no idea when he wants sex other than he told me that the last two weeks he was too tired after work. He didn’t explain the last 11 months though.

Aside from these things we have had a lovely relationship. I do love him. He’s said the same to me. We’ve had some lovely times and I honestly thought he was the person I would be with.

Have I ruined it this by flying off the handle and saying horrible things in anger? I feel terrible and he is saying he questions the whole relationship after how I snapped. I am conflicted because I know I have been so patient and loving and kind in the past about these things. I’ve told him i support him and there’s no pressure and I’ve generally tried to be lighthearted about trips away and sex but obviously have mentioned it intermittently as time has gone on. He’s a nice person but his reaction to my outburst seems to be to ignore why it happened and to have a reason to withdraw further rather than sitting down together and having a chat about how we can work on things. Have i messed this all up? I also feel desperately sad at the thought of starting again at this age. It scares me. I probably sound pathetic here but IRL I have a good job and I’m usually quite together and positive :(

OP posts:
ChargingBuck · 13/10/2021 12:34

I don’t think he was a narcissist or a nasty man but I am starting to think he was incredibly self centred and didn’t even see it.
He never acknowledged, let alone met your needs.
He was happy to lie to your face, in order to keep you servicing his needs.

all this time I’ve treated him like a serious partner, listened endlessly to his work worries, family worries, his hopes for his career and his day to day things
See?
All about his needs.

The last few weeks he said I was very controlling and wanted things my way. That hurt as I couldn’t be more accommodating to him. I simply raised things that were important in any relationship and he seemed to hate me/us for that.
When his future faking & stonewalling were no longer effective in keeping you at a distance, he ramped up the abuse (& lying & withholding are abusive) to active manipulation & coercion.
Here, he was telling you that your entirely valid & reasonable needs were out of line.
That you were a bad person for expressing them.
That his expectation is that you would back down & continue accepting his breadcrumbing, & continue tolerating the situationship 100% on his terms.

He was DARVOing you, Aber.
He is SO controlling! - so take note, that is why he called YOU controlling - to deflect your attention from his awful behaviour, & make you blame yourself for it.
That is a really twisted way to behave.
www.banyantherapy.com/darvo/

Don't feel like a mug.
So many of us have been there - pouring our all into an undeserving man.
You're lucky you've seen the light only 1 year in Flowers

abersterol · 13/10/2021 13:00

Thanks @ChargingBuck the thing is he was amazing in lots of ways. When I was very very poorly in summer he didn’t everything, I couldn’t fault him. He’s also been supportive about my work and was consistent with phone calls and organisation of meeting and seeing each other. It just never felt like a commitment and there was so much odd stuff going on that I felt confused a lot of the time. I could have dealt with his distance and alone time if he had also put effort in to make me feel this was going somewhere.

OP posts:
ChargingBuck · 13/10/2021 13:05

the thing is he was amazing in lots of ways

So what?
He was crap in so many others ...

abersterol · 13/10/2021 13:10

@ChargingBuck that’s what i keep struggling with I think. All the ways he was great. I know I shouldn’t focus on that though. It hurts so much that’s he’s not even been in touch. Clearly I was what was bringing him down.

OP posts:
CrumpetStrumpet · 13/10/2021 13:19

It was awful but I've survived and so will you.

He'd have spun it out until you very rightfully lost patience, which you have.

These men are terrifyingly good at detaching. My ex kept at Christmas and when I asked how he could leave us at that time of year he said it "didn't matter" I felt a total mug as well for a long long time. The truth is though that we have nothing to feel stupid for, the shame is all on them.

CrumpetStrumpet · 13/10/2021 13:23

And you weren't bringing him down. He's brought himself to this place by his own actions. Stop blaming yourself. You haven't done anything wrong.

These men are masters as making you feel its your fault. My ex used to make me feel guilty for my 'unreasonable' requests that he pull his weight at home and take a proper interest in his family. They don't see us as real people. We are there to service their needs and nothing more. They are selfish to the core. Its all about them and once we don't give them what they want they detach.

CrumpetStrumpet · 13/10/2021 13:24

It's good that he hasn't been in touch. Long may it continue. He's a toxic presence.

katmarie · 13/10/2021 14:01

Op, he's lied to you over and over and over about so many things. And when you started to say that you wanted more from the relationship, that you wanted what he had been telling you that you could have, he realised he was rumbled and resorted to cruelty instead.

If you give him the benefit of the doubt, then he strung you along because despite knowing he wasn't going to meet your relationship needs, he really wanted to be with you, but could only do so on his terms. In reality what that means is that he knew he wasn't going to meet your needs, but was selfish enough about his own that he didn't care about yours at all.

Low self esteem is crippling, and leads to terrible decisions, I know. And the fear of loneliness is awful too. Buy the misery you would experience if you committed your life to this man would be significantly worse, believe me. It is not selfish to put your own needs first, to be kind to yourself, to know your worth.

ChargingBuck · 13/10/2021 14:33

Clearly I was what was bringing him down.

You're still not getting it Aber.
It's not you that brought him down.
ANY woman with reasonable expectations for a normal relationship would bring him down.

Why are you so determined to cast yourself as the villain of the piece?

abersterol · 13/10/2021 14:38

@ChargingBuck I think it just makes me feel horrible that he will be relieved I am not in his life and see that as a blessing, when I’m so cut up that this happened. We could have been really happy, I don’t know what he was expecting. It’s just hard to accept someone cutting you out so brutally like that.

OP posts:
CrumpetStrumpet · 13/10/2021 14:50

He won't be relieved. He'll be annoyed that his woman appliance has finally cottoned onto his bullshit and he's now going to have to go through the inconvenience of finding another woman to lead up the garden path.

You could never have been happy together. You've only been together a year and he's already made you unhappy. How could you have been happy with no sex and basically no consideration from him? He was expecting you to put up and shut up. Why the fuck should you lead your life like that? Aren't you worth more?

ChargingBuck · 13/10/2021 15:27

We could have been really happy

No, you couldn't Aber.
He is not capable of making any woman who has 'normal' expectations from a relationship happy.
He simply does not have the werewithal to do that.

How is that your fault?

Also ... why are you grieving so hard for someone so inadequate?

anthurium · 13/10/2021 15:44

@ChargingBuck

I think Op is grieving so hard because she is 35, frightened to be missing out on marriage/family...the tedium of having to go back on the dating apps (is that where you met Op?)/everyone else having (supposedly) what she doesn't....In general having to start all over again....sunk cost fallacy

Scrollonthroughtherain · 13/10/2021 15:46

Shortly he's going to be coming back to you to give you one more chance, expecting that you're going to crumble into his arms. Stay strong. He's never going to give you what you want.

HaveringWavering · 13/10/2021 15:53

Hi OP. Sorry you’re feeling so rotten but you really are better off without him, even if that means being alone for a while. You will feel better once you realise how nice it is not to have the weight of his issues on your shoulders. You were compromising too much.

I’ve read all your responses and don’t think I can see an answer to a question I asked a while ago- do you think that his reluctance to let go of work for even a weekend could be because he is embroiled in some sort of fraud or misconduct and needs to keep covering his tracks? As I said in my earlier post, my husband’s bank mandates 2 full consecutive weeks of leave for every employee every year in order to combat fraud. It would also explain his generally odd behaviour, if he had something like that going on.

abersterol · 13/10/2021 16:30

@HaveringWavering no it definitely wasn’t that. Again would have been simpler if it was :(

Currently sat on the beach watching the sun start to set and don’t know why he wouldn’t have wanted to share these things with me.

It’s the idea of getting back out there that’s making me feel hopeless!

This thread has helped me so much thank you.

OP posts:
ChargingBuck · 13/10/2021 16:41

It’s the idea of getting back out there that’s making me feel hopeless!

One step at a time.

You would do really well to take dating off the agenda for up to a year. Really work on yourself with your smart therapist, & get to the nub of this self-esteem issue.

Until you invest time in that, you are likely to be vulnerable to men who are not going to be good for you.

When you do invest time in that - you will find that a lot of the anxiety & hollowness you experience about solitude will lessen anyway. You will then feel more confident in attracting a decent guy - & be giving off the positive vibes that will make this easier for you.

minmooch · 13/10/2021 17:44

In the kindest way possible you really, really need to pull your big girl pants up!

He was never this imaginary perfect man. He never put you first, always excuses.

Open your eyes. See him for what he is not what he says he'd like to be.

It's a hard lesson, but just another lesson in life's journey. You can and will go on to meet someone much better for you once you realise your own worth. Once you see him for what he really is you'll get more strength.

You sound lovely. Don't let anyone take advantage of your good nature.

HaveringWavering · 13/10/2021 17:50

Don’t think of it as having thrown something away. Think of it as having dodged a massive bullet. I was over 40 when I got married and it was worth hanging out for the right man, it really was. I shudder when I think of who I might have settled for.

Christinayangtwistedsister · 13/10/2021 18:05

Oh for gods sake end it with this man

abersterol · 13/10/2021 18:57

Thank you. Tonight feels really hard.

OP posts:
TheChip · 13/10/2021 19:03

I'm sure tomorrow will be easier. The nights are always the worst, when it gets quiet and your mind gets louder.
You've come a long way in a short time.
I'm a bit jealous that you got to sit on a beach watching the sunset tonight though. It sounds lovely!

Coffeepot72 · 13/10/2021 20:09

If getting back out there makes you feel rubbish, then put that on hold for a while? Can you occupy yourself with non-dating things and give yourself a break for a bit?

abersterol · 13/10/2021 20:21

I did message someone and they seem very nice and want to speak on the phone but I’m worried it will push me back to the other man as it will feel so unfamiliar

OP posts:
anthurium · 13/10/2021 22:12

@abersterol

I did message someone and they seem very nice and want to speak on the phone but I’m worried it will push me back to the other man as it will feel so unfamiliar
What do you think you'll get out of being back on to the dating scene so soon? To feel validated/wanted?