Open marriage has gone wrong 😑

[PhillyQueen]

Name change for this as previous posts may be outing.

Sex life with DH dried up completely about 8 years ago. It was never stellar but that didn’t seem particularly important to either of us . Our relationship was otherwise perfect, he is a fine person and a great dad to our (now adult) kids and we used to have sex at most weekly, then over the years went to fortnightly and monthly until it tailed off altogether. Neither of us seemed bothered and it wasn’t a big deal and I just assumed that’s what happened in long-term relationships. Life was good even if any passion was long-gone. We have both always had our own friends as well as mutual ones, we both run businesses, we were busy but always looked forward to time together.

After the sex stopped altogether, we avoided the subject for a couple of years then we had the conversation where we both agreed that we wanted to stay together as we love each other but that DH didn’t want to give up that part of his life forever and that if it wasn’t possible with me, he would like to look elsewhere and would prefer to do it with my blessing. So, good idea or not, we had an open marriage policy for a few years and it seemed to work well. It was reciprocal but I wasn’t up for it with anyone , not just him, I’ve never been very sexual. Even though he had a couple of brief affairs, nothing changed with our family life and I was happy enough knowing we could carry on as we were. All good. Not a perfect love story but a practical way of keeping things going, which is what we both wanted.

Only now things have changed. He has met someone he really likes, by his own admission even loves, and I am worried he is going to leave me and our life for her. She is younger than us and very attractive. If I were standing next to her, I would look like her grandmother. He is absolutely smitten with her and for the first time, I feel our marriage is truly in danger.

I feel that DH has violated the terms of our agreement for an open marriage and should stop seeing this woman but he has said he won’t do that, that she makes him happy, and that we agreed that we could both see other people etc. so it’s me that’s being unreasonable. Falling in love with someone else was never part of the deal I agreed to, though.

So what can I do? Grit my teeth and bear it and hope they break up? Or ask him again to stop seeing her otherwise our marriage will have to end?

I honestly think OP it’s better for you to part and remain good friends if you both feel able to do so, otherwise this might all get rather nasty. I accept you don’t want sex, I feel the same way, but it’s clear he does , so unless you radically change your mind this is only going one way and even if this ends he has now had a taste again of both love/sex and I suspect he would seek the same. If we all put aside our current annoyances (those of us that have them) and think back to when we first met someone we really connected with in all ways— it’s a very intoxicating feeling and once it’s been reawakened I don’t think it will go back in the bottle.

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with putting the idea of sex therapy out there. Some, maybe even many, women in their 60s may not be aware such type of specific counselling exists. Many women of that generation may have grown up absorbing the attitude that enjoying sex is somehow shameful or “slutty” - for all the trumpeting about the sexual revolution, 40s and 50s sexual mores prevailed well into the second half of the 20th century where women’s sexuality was concerned. It’s not about saying the OP should just lie back and think of England, it offers the possibility that she might herself discover a new life of actively enjoying sex in a way she didn’t know was possible and which she could potentially find pleasurable, if she were so inclined to explore such therapy. She may not feel so inclined and that’s her prerogative, and she’s already aware of the consequence of that decision so far as her marriage is concerned. On the other hand, if she has any sadness at all about having lost that intimate part of her marriage, she may decide to at least look into what sex therapy could offer. It’s her choice to make, once she is aware that there is a choice there she could make.

It’s clear OP you are comfortable financially and could separate with little impact on lifestyle. You say you don’t want to start again but you already have. You already have built your own lives. He’s not with you physically or mentally. What do you actually do together? Lots of couples separate amicably just growing apart - you could still speak, have family meals etc.
How do you envision retirement? I can’t see him wanting to travel and leave her.
He may be saying no plans to leave but his actions are very different. It looks to me like he’s trying to engineer his affair being public knowledge to force the situation.
You are hurting yourself and your friends and family by carrying on this way.

You say the two of them have set ground rules about not leaving partners, but he also set ground rules with you that this was just sex no dating, and he's completely ignored that when it suits him. Your feelings clearly mean nowhere as near as much for him as his feelings for this other woman and if it suits him he'll leave in a second. How can you have any respect for him let alone want to still be married to him?

@Blossomtoes nobody has said that- they have suggested them separating because op wants to have her cake and eat it

If this does fizzle out, you're back where you started - in a relationship where you're happy and he is not. He won't want to go back to no sex and he shouldn't have to if sex is important to him in a relationship. Have you addressed your issues with sex and why you have decided you no longer want to be intimate with your husband? I think your husband probably feels backed into a corner to stay with you because he doesn't want to hurt you

It's very me me me. You want your comfort and home life, but he's never going to be happy with a sexless marriage even if it does fizzle out with this woman. He's already said he doesn't want casual sex with randomers, so your previous "agreement" won't work anyway. What do you think is going to happen? That's he's going to have another few miserable decades stuck in a marriage where he's missing something vital to him? It's doomed, let it go!

OW has met some of our mutual friends at a property DH is doing up to sell on. They were all there helping one day. Friends do not suspect anything, honestly he is the last person they would think was fooling around. They refer to each other as boyfriend and girlfriend

Fwiw friends know exactly what's going on but they're sparing your blushes.

I also agree with posters saying you are too trusting. He’s having an affair and you are taking what he says as absolutely true.
You are leaving yourself in a horribly vulnerable position. Do you have full knowledge of and access to finances? He’s obviously spending money on her already but it could well escalate - he could change his will leaving substantial gift to his mistress etc.
If Divorce isn’t palatable to you then a legal separation may be an option. Please get some specialist legal advice.
I can’t get over how you can deal with the humiliation. It will be like a black cloud over every family event. Do you go with him to all events or are you already left out in favour of her.
It’s horrible for you and those you love. Have you seen film Muriel’s wedding? Downtrodden wife at home. Businessman father. Every event and meal his mistress appears - what a coincidence it’s Deidre Chambers. Everyone cringes. It’s uncomfortable to see on film let alone in real life.

He's trying to do is make you end it so that he's not the bad guy.

Once your DH describes himself as the 'boyfriend' of someone else, the relationship is over.

If you meet your friend for coffee (the one that he introduced his girlfriend to) I bet it will help you move on. You need to confront and deal with this not bury head and say it’s going to fizzle out.
Nothing you have said has made anyone on here think it will fizzle out. And even if this lady isn’t it long term there will always be the threat of another ow hanging over you.

Tatiana Yes that’s my thought too. Make it so publicly humiliating for her that she simply can’t stay with him.

You think your friends don't know but they do. It's so obvious when people are in a relationship, little non verbal clues give it away.

Would you still be okay with it if everyone knew?

I think you are deluding yourself that this will fizzle out. It sounds like he is telling you what you want to hear whilst moving her into his life as a permanent fixture.

If you do believe him then there would be no harm in you talking to her directly. Why don't you ask him for her number and see what his reaction is.

This will be death by a thousand paperclips unless you start waking up to what is actually going on rather than being spoon fed by your husband.

paper cuts not clips

I'm so sorry OP. It gets worse with each update. I don't see how you're going to keep the life you have. Things are changing in front of you.

Wow. I think it is so disturbing that people are so disparaging of marital and sexual therapy. What message are they sending to a married couple who want to try ? That they are pathetic for needing sex therapy and should give up? This 1800s attitude is abhorrent and disgusting. Sex therapy is there to encourage marriages to try and find happiness and intimacy again in a marriage instead of just giving up. There is nothing shameful about being open to trying to be intimate with your partner. On the contrary. And shame on anyone who attempts to say so.

There's a world of difference between having therapy because you realise there are problems that you want to fix, and just not wanting to have sex. It's fine and good to have therapy with problems that have the potential to be fixed, and I include sexual therapy in that. But this isn't what is happening here. The OP just isn't interested. It's not that she thinks she might be if only she could get over a hurdle. She just doesn't want it. She's in her 60s (or thereabouts). That can mean huge changes in your body and a dramatic drop in hormone levels.

Nowhere have I said therapy is bad and unnecessary for everybody. I'm just assuming the OP knows her own mind and her own body and I wish to god people would stop pathologising a low or absent sex drive.

@Jaguarshoes

Is he aware of how much this is hurting you?

What is it that the two of you have together, that is worth hanging on to? I can understand that there is a shared house and grand children but what else is there, really? Watching TV, having dinners out, going on holiday…his body is there but it’s very likely his mind is elsewhere. He’s not truly with you, his mind is occupied with thoughts and dreams of her and he’s even openly messaging her in front of you. What’s in it for you?

You seem to think he’s infatuated with this OW, much like a teenager, but he’s 62. This is different. He may be kidding himself that they can both remain married and keep this going but really, it’s a half-life for everyone concerned, and it will eat you up inside. If it does fizzle out she won’t be the last. It’s likely his feelings for her will intensify and he will break this new ‘rule’, too.

I think the best thing you could do right now is to go back to couples therapy to iron this out between yourselves, as well as in your own mind.

As someone who has been married as long as the op I know you have much more than a shared house. You have memories and information, shared aims and family. You can communicate without speaking because you know what has gone before. Lots of people are painting the DH as a poor man just looking for love and intimacy. I say bollocks to that. He’s just a man wanting to stick his dick in a woman and show off to his mates how he’s still got it and can pull a young bird. He probably took her to his investment property to impress her with his wealth. My dad left my mum for the ow. I once asked him what he saw in her thinking it would be love and companionship but he said ‘it’s because she thinks the sun shines out of my arse’. Just because the ops DH is in his 60’s doesn’t mean he isn’t a dick, men don’t really grow out of it.

Oh Op, I'm so shocked that he's introduced her to mutual friends. And he may not have introduced her as his gf but how did he explain who she was? And anyway, he still took the opportunity to introduce her. He wanted those friends to meet her.

What happens when someone sees them out for a meal or a walk? It's only a matter of time.

He is treating you dispicably and I'm sorry that you're happy to live like that.

I think it’s clear now that our comments are irrelevant to the OP. Her responses show no willingness to reflect. Her mind is made-up!

He introduced her to friends to see how well they accepted her without knowing who she really is. He's preparing for the future. He might say that they don't want to leave their partners but it seems like he is thinking about it.

Have you both thought about what will happen when one of your DC or their friends see you ‘D’H our with his ‘girlfriend’? Is he not bothered that the waiters in the restaurant were probably sniggering behind his back that he came in one night with his mistress and the next with his family?

Sounds like you both want to have your cake and eat it. If he keeps her around you’ll be miserable, if he leaves her and goes back to a sexless relationship he’ll be miserable. Surely it’s best to just separate and continue as friends? Both partners have to be 100% ok with open relationships for them to work and this is not going to work for you. But it’s your life.

I’m here because I like our life and I love DH

But he’s seeing her because he doesn’t like your life…or at least, an important part of it. Marriage isn’t pick and mix. Think of it the other way - how awful would it be if a DH said to his wife, “Look - wee are fantastic co-parents and I think you’re really hot. But you bore me senseless and I can’t bear to talk to you any more. So we’ll carry along with the children and having regular sex, but we’ll each just spend the rest of the time talking to our own mates about interesting things.” This is the same - it’s just a different part of the marriage that you’ve “farmed out”. And it’s a hugely important bit to him (as to most men).

@PhillyQueen

Things that give me cause for hope:

He isn’t sure he loves her exactly and they haven’t said it up to now.
They discussed ground rules when it was evident it was becoming a relationship rather than a friendship and both agree that they are not leaving their partners no matter what, and whatever they have has to exist in the parameters of that.
DH admits we could have seperated years ago but he never wanted that

Things that give me cause for concern:

DH is completely smitten with OW
OW is objectively beautiful and apparently clever and funny
OW has met some of our mutual friends at a property DH is doing up to sell on. They were all there helping one day. Friends do not suspect anything, honestly he is the last person they would think was fooling around.
They refer to each other as boyfriend and girlfriend

They thing that broke me is that on Thursday he took her to a restaurant where we often go as a family. We were there on Friday (the day after) with his siblings and dad and it’s where my daughter-in-law had her baby shower. I don’t know why I find this more upsetting than him sleeping with her but I do

I haven't read your other comments because I couldn't get past this one.

He's smitten, they refer to each other as boyfriend and girlfriend, he's introduced her to mutual friends and he's taken her to one of your favourite family haunts.

You're losing him, OP, and fast. Either resign to that or put the brakes on them by issuing him with an ultimatum that it's you or her, but I fear he's too far gone now. I wish you tremendous luck going forward.

In many ways I think it’s the girlfriends attitude to her current relationship that will determine this. Id imagine her own partner is closer to her own age. I’m her age and currently dating. I’d think long and hard about taking on a 62 year old man (no matter how currently young looking and youthful in attitude). So even though she might be enjoying the current boyfriend / girlfriend scenario - it might be her staying put that causes things to fizzle out.
That said, even if they only stay together 6 months to a year - can you live with that mental torture of their emotional intimacy? You already sound tortured and I’m not surprised.
As for your friends not knowing - as others have pointed out you are daft to assume they don’t know that there is attraction at the very least with this random beautiful woman that your husband has suddenly materialised with at his house project. You need to be clear about that. Just because no one has mentioned it (they are probably mortified on your behalf) doesn’t mean they aren’t thinking it.