Open marriage has gone wrong 😑

[PhillyQueen]

Name change for this as previous posts may be outing.

Sex life with DH dried up completely about 8 years ago. It was never stellar but that didn’t seem particularly important to either of us . Our relationship was otherwise perfect, he is a fine person and a great dad to our (now adult) kids and we used to have sex at most weekly, then over the years went to fortnightly and monthly until it tailed off altogether. Neither of us seemed bothered and it wasn’t a big deal and I just assumed that’s what happened in long-term relationships. Life was good even if any passion was long-gone. We have both always had our own friends as well as mutual ones, we both run businesses, we were busy but always looked forward to time together.

After the sex stopped altogether, we avoided the subject for a couple of years then we had the conversation where we both agreed that we wanted to stay together as we love each other but that DH didn’t want to give up that part of his life forever and that if it wasn’t possible with me, he would like to look elsewhere and would prefer to do it with my blessing. So, good idea or not, we had an open marriage policy for a few years and it seemed to work well. It was reciprocal but I wasn’t up for it with anyone , not just him, I’ve never been very sexual. Even though he had a couple of brief affairs, nothing changed with our family life and I was happy enough knowing we could carry on as we were. All good. Not a perfect love story but a practical way of keeping things going, which is what we both wanted.

Only now things have changed. He has met someone he really likes, by his own admission even loves, and I am worried he is going to leave me and our life for her. She is younger than us and very attractive. If I were standing next to her, I would look like her grandmother. He is absolutely smitten with her and for the first time, I feel our marriage is truly in danger.

I feel that DH has violated the terms of our agreement for an open marriage and should stop seeing this woman but he has said he won’t do that, that she makes him happy, and that we agreed that we could both see other people etc. so it’s me that’s being unreasonable. Falling in love with someone else was never part of the deal I agreed to, though.

So what can I do? Grit my teeth and bear it and hope they break up? Or ask him again to stop seeing her otherwise our marriage will have to end?

@TheGirlCat

I've had to think very carefully how I word this. I really really don't understand women like you. There is no such thing as an 'open marriage' unless both partners are emotionless as well as sexless. It never works. Someone always, always gets hurt. There is no such thing unless you are flatmates. Sex is an extremely important, and vital, if not extremely vital - part of a marriage. Why did you marry him if sex wasn't important? It is not normal to be in a sexless marriage unless you are flatmates. Even women I know in their 70s still enjoy regular sex. Sex is an extremely vital part of a marriage. I have a healthy sex drive and even in my late 40s I wanted it at least once a week. Sex in the 60s is even better. And you don't even have young children as an excuse. You should be in your prime! As rare as you do? I'd rather not be alive. I understand people have varying sex drives, but if you don't give it to him at the very least once a month he will look elsewhere, and he WILL fall for another woman. You sound like you've stopped caring, stopped loving him, stopped wanting to make an effort. The question to you is, are you really happy not giving a damn? Do you want to let him go and find a woman that will love him and care about his needs? Or will you fight for him and your marriage, even if that means you yourself find a sex therapist/experiment with sex toys etc? The question is how much do you love him? Do you love him at all? Because there are almost no men that want to be in a sexless marriage. And not many women want to be in a sexless marriage either. If he is important to you, and your marriage (which should be about give and take, no a flatmate relationship) is important to you, you will do anything, Anything to get that magic back. You should be in your prime, not acting like a woman in a nursing home. A sexless marriage is absolute misery. You either are willing to give up your man to another woman and be alone or you will fight to rekindle your marriage and your passion even with a therapists' help. It may be too late as your husband has apparently found what he needs elsewhere. But you can try. IF you want to.

Not everyone is the same, ie like you. A woman in her sixties is absolutely not in her prime in any respect but particularly sexually. I’m not far off 70 and my friendship group is a similar age, those marriages that still include sex are a rarity.

I don’t know what the answer is for OP but I do know it’s not attempting to revive an interest in sex when the impetus has gone.

[quote LoislovesStewie]@deadleaves, I think that the OP has never been that keen on sex. We understand that after the menopause a lot of women go off sex but weekly as the maximum early in a relationship doesn't seem like enough to me. I did ask up thread if they were still physically affectionate but had no answer. If there is no sex and no physical affection then the situation is bleak.[/quote]
Yes, that seems clear too and that is fine. We are all different with different sex drives.

But there are lots of really horrible ' you need to put out' 'I can't understand women like you who stop having sex' type comments. It's bloody horrible; really horrible.

Yes @TheGirlCat You are lucky that your vulva and hormonal health has kept up. Not all women have that. And they don't need you telling them this means they don't love their husbands.

We spoke last night, in quite some depth, and he made it clear that whilst committed to staying in our marriage, DH is not going to stop seeing this woman. He said he never really enjoyed meeting women just for sex and had pretty much decided that, after a long break due to Covid, he was going to stop doing that and let his sex life go and be contented with what we had, which we both admit is good and enough in pretty much all areas.

Then of course he met this woman and everything changed and although he says “love” is too strong a word for so early on in their thing, they definitely have strong feelings for each other. He reiterated that it’s not jusy sex for him, that they have only slept together twice and that had only happened recently. But he’s not leaving and has no plans to do so, apparently not now or ever, and that he still loves me, which is what I have to work with right now.

As they have only been intimate twice, I’m going to assume he is currently infatuated with her but that this will fade and he will see what we have together is too good to throw away for sex. I am aware this might not be the case and this is merely a coping mechanism for me right now, but so be it.

But expecting your spouse to live without sex or intimacy isn’t reasonable.

Yes, it’s sad, and each to their own on how much they like sex, but you can’t impose that on someone else and expect them not to be happy to find it elsewhere.

Yes, I should have said 'have sex' instead of 'put out'. My point though is that I cannot understand women who withhold sex/intimacy/affection then are so surprised their husband wants it elsewhere. I mean, did they really not see that coming?

Hmmm, he now has a mistress.

I suggest that you do consult a family law specialist to take advice about if there are legitimate grounds for divorce with this new situation, & what the property & assets rights are for each of you. Purely for advice as I think this may offer you a reality check & give you some grist to grind.

What is is that you need for yourself? Do you consider what you need both inside & outside of your marriage? You many not be a highly sexed person but do you need physical intimacy as much & do you have this need met in your marriage?

If you are not used to this exploration of your feelings & needs, I suggest that consider a few sessions on your own with Relate or relationship counsellor.

I have no direct advice about what you can or should do, but it seems healthy to me to prioritise meeting your own needs to make sure that they are met, & this is important also for each person in a couple.

At the moment, both of you are about getting what you want, rather than what you need.

You may find that each of with reflection & a clearer sense of what you each need that can renegotiate your marriage or close that book.

Foremost, get yourself in the front foot by knowing yourself & the legal aspects of continuing or ending this marriage.

BTW any couple can have a rip-roaring sex life, & one of them may fall in love with someone else. It happens.

@deadleaves

Yes *@TheGirlCat* You are lucky that your vulva and hormonal health has kept up. Not all women have that. And they don't need you telling them this means they don't love their husbands.

The OP has made it clear she hasn't even tried, can't be bothered and never has been bothered. That's the difference. Most women would at least try.

@grapewine

It never ceases to amaze me the amount of women that won't 'put out' (for want of a better term that I can't think of at the moment) and then are - shock horror - surprised that their husband seeks that bond elsewhere. It sounds like to me that the OP is asexual and never should have married her husband. Sexual loneliness, even starved of affection in a marriage is a terrible, horrible and devastating feeling.

Exactly this.

But women who are asexual can also want a loving caring relationship and children. Yes people can harp on about adoption but the reality of that is it extremely difficult as a single person and most children put up for adoption have extremely serious mental or physical problems that most people couldn’t cope with.

I honestly don’t understand why yuh would want to continue with a marriage to someone who is ‘infatuated’ with another woman and leading another life with her. Are you not jealous!
? At all? Bizarre.

Good grief , so your husband is now having an affair and you are still just going to sit back and say that that is acceptable . Seriously @PhillyQueen , take a look at yourself and find some self esteem , what would you say to an adult daughter if she said her husband was having an affair which he had no intention of stopping .

I'm a single woman only a few years older than the OW and I have a career that earns me a six figure salary; I'd find your husband's solvency a plus point not for the money he has but for the fact that it would make us more equal. I don't need to use a man for my lifestyle/retirement but also I don't want to be used myself.

Yes I am very jealous. I pressed him into telling me lots of details, even though he didn’t want to give me them, and I wish I hadn’t as now I can’t stop thinking about them.

But he is still married to me and doesn’t want that to change. That is something and I am holding onto that.

@PhillyQueen our posts have crossed in t’ether.

Having read your comment: ‘ As they have only been intimate twice, I’m going to assume he is currently infatuated with her but that this will fade and he will see what we have together is too good to throw away for sex. I am aware this might not be the case and this is merely a coping mechanism for me right now, but so be it.’

All the ore reason for you to get in the front foot. Go see family law specialist.

I think that your assumptions about infatuation, fading feelings & you both having something bigger & better is you sticking your head in the sand. Yes, this is a coping mechanism because HE IS TELLING YOU that this time it really is different. It may blow over or it may the beginning of his next significant relationship.

The OP has made it clear she hasn't even tried, can't be bothered and never has been bothered. That's the difference. Most women would at least try.

I can't see what you're basing most of these assertions on. Such characterisations have little to do with OP 's description of the marriage.

Similarly, I don't know where the discussion about asexual has come from or why anyone has thinks that they have decent data rather than anecdotes about relationships at any age, never mind older demographics.

Op please get some self esteem. Imagine if one of your children came to you and they were in this situation. What would you tell them? Stand up for yourself and be independent or always be an option?

You husband was happy getting sex from other women, which you allowed him to do, so it's unlikely he will stop, whatever he said. He isn't giving up this woman for you op.

@TheGirlCat

Yes, I should have said 'have sex' instead of 'put out'. My point though is that I cannot understand women who withhold sex/intimacy/affection then are so surprised their husband wants it elsewhere. I mean, did they really not see that coming?

See there you go again with the sexist and insulting language 'withholding sex'.

She is not 'withholding sex'. She does not want sex. She has no inclination to have sex. Are you seriously saying her husband should have sex with someone who does not want to have sex with him?

Its surely not that difficult to understand that if someone has a low sex-drive that it disappears entirely at menopause/ mid-age?

Besides, we all have no idea if OP has never really enjoyed sex because her H is just not that good in bed. For all we know its not so much OP who should have tried harder, but her husband.

@PhillyQueen

Yes I am very jealous. I pressed him into telling me lots of details, even though he didn’t want to give me them, and I wish I hadn’t as now I can’t stop thinking about them.

But he is still married to me and doesn’t want that to change. That is something and I am holding onto that.

So you want to hang on to a marriage that is in name only, and prevent him finding someone that will care about his happiness and make him happy? It sounds like you care about the image and don't care about him or his needs at all.

@PhillyQueen

Yes I am very jealous. I pressed him into telling me lots of details, even though he didn’t want to give me them, and I wish I hadn’t as now I can’t stop thinking about them.

But he is still married to me and doesn’t want that to change. That is something and I am holding onto that.

Have you thought about having sex therapy yourself? The answer is to rebuild your sexual relationship with him .

Sorry op while I think you are very graciously allowing this scenario, the words cake and eat it come to mind with regards to your husband.
I'd very graciously be allowing her to wash his socks and cook his meals while I followed my own path if I were you !

@deadleaves There you go with inventing things to go with your narrative that the husband is bad. The OP has said nothing about her husband "just not that good in bed", you seem rather desperate inventing that narrative. The OP has said she's never been sexual. That she's never really wanted it. A marriage is about give and take and she hasn't wanted sex. So what happens if one person wants sex in a marriage and the other doesn't? It's not rocket science.

"She does not want sex. She has no inclination to have sex."

Then she should let her husband be free to find someone who does and will.

So he has now moved the goal posts, and is taking a mistress with your blessing. This does sound like a disaster waiting to happen and I think you need to make some preparations in case he does decide to change his mind again. Is he expecting you to be ok with this?

Is she married, too?

As some people have mentioned above, he is out in the open shopping for lingerie and having romantic dinners with her. He’s not being discreet. What if somebody you know sees them? What if they decide to tell one of your children?

I would also like to know what deep down makes you believe that you don’t deserve more than this?

@Washeduponthebeach Yes I suggested the sex therapy too, and no answer.

We had couples therapy when the kids were teenagers. I don’t know how that fits in with sex therapy.