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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Is this early onset cocklodging or am I overthinking?

479 replies

dizzyupthegirl86 · 02/09/2021 10:58

I need to get my thoughts together and I know exactly what my best mate would say but a) he is male and b) doesn’t have the best relationship history.

So I’ve been single for about two years after a horrific break up that took me a while to get over. I’ve accomplished loads in that period and am happy with myself at the moment. I don’t need a relationship but I do miss having someone.
I started seeing someone a couple of months ago, initially I didn’t think there was much of a spark when we were texting but he was nice enough - but then after a few weeks something definitely turned a corner.
We’ve not spoken in great detail about finances but he works full time for his local council, I think from piecing bits together he earns maybe 20-23k? I earn 10k more. He was renting a room but his landlord sold the house so is now staying with his mom whilst saving up for a deposit. He’s 30, I’m 34, he lives around an hour away but typically comes to me as I live on my own.

The first time we went out, he suggested we split the bill. I didn’t have an issue with that. Second, third and fourth times, he came to mine, we ordered dinner and I paid. The second and third were cheap (maybe a tenner between us both times) but the third was about 40 quid and at that point I was a bit Hmm

After that, he suggested we go to a restaurant for dinner and the day before, he said he’d pay - which I thought was nice and a way of acknowledging he was aware I’d paid the last three times.
Next time, he came round, I paid - it was my ‘turn’, I thought. The time after that, we were ordering in and I told him it was his turn. He looked a bit surprised but said ok, though commented that at 45 quid, he hoped it was good. It was 45 coz he’d added a tenners worth of sides that HE wanted!

I then paid the last time. He knows I’ve got this week off work coz it’s my birthday and he suggested we go out for drinks and dinner yesterday which sounded lovely. He said he’d pick the restaurant, sent me a link and when I said how nice it looked, he said something like ‘yes but I’ve not looked at the prices yet’. He also said he’d come to mine beforehand (where we were going is roughly in the middle of where we both live). I told him that I usually get a taxi to the train station and then a train into town, but if there were two of us, a taxi straight into town would work out the same price - he said ‘that’s fine if we’re splitting it’…..

I thought it might be his way of saying he was on a budget (not something he’s ever bought up before) so I suggested we could do something cheaper if he wanted. He came over yesterday and I didn’t feel great so we decided to stay in. I suggested we could cook dinner with what I already had in, or go to the supermarket to get something - but he said he’d rather get a takeaway. He ordered it on the phone and asked if they took cards so I assumed he was paying - at this point, my (unspoken) logic was that it was his ‘turn’ and it was my birthday.

Food gets delivered and suddenly he can’t find his card. I give him mine to pay and he does so. If I’d been in that position, I’d have been mortified but would have offered to transfer it to the other person. No such offer.

So I’m at a bit of a loss really. I’m not typically that obsessed with money or who pays for what - I don’t mind at all taking it in turns and feel that it generally evens itself out. But I’m starting to get resentful about it now, and I’m noticing it more and more.

These comments about money really take the shine off things a bit! If I was in that position, I wouldn’t expect to be paid for but I’d definitely suggest cheaper things or offer to cook for someone.

A few weeks ago, he was over and he suggested staying the night - I was a bit thrown and said no. The next time he came over, he fell asleep but then basically wouldn’t get up, made out he was falling back to sleep. It was like he was expecting me to just cave? I told him three times he needed to get up and ended up turning the light on and leaving the room before he actually did it.
In a lot of ways, he’s great - he’s really nice, he’s engaging, he pays attention to what i say and is very generous with his attention. He’s close to his brother and the only day they both have off is Saturdays so he spends all day on Saturday with his brother, which does mean the things we can do are limited.

Sometimes I feel a bit Pearl-clutchy about things, so I don’t know whether I’m just overthinking these things. I would never dream of inviting myself to stay over, I’d wait to be invited.
I suppose what I’m asking is…. Is there another viewpoint I’m not seeing on the money side of things? It only became noticeable after the third time I ended up paying but it feels like he’s happy to let me pay. If he’d genuinely lost his card (and it did turn up once at my house after falling out of his pocket so it’s not outside the realms of possibility) and offered to transfer the cost of dinner, or even half, I wouldn’t feel quite so…. Used.

OP posts:
ThinkWittyThoughts · 04/09/2021 12:37

Happy birthday!

BudrosBudrosGalli · 04/09/2021 15:57

Happy birthday, OP. Have a blinder of a day!

The mere fact that this 'prince among men' did not immediately make an effort to repay you the £40 since you mentioned your disappointment, is really all you need to know...

Standrewsschool · 04/09/2021 20:01

Happy birthday to you,
Happy birthday to you,
Happy birthday dear Dizzy,
Happy birthday to you.

Hope you having lots of Gin and Cake

Rozziie · 04/09/2021 21:51

Good for you, OP! Hope you're having a great birthday with your friends!

dizzyupthegirl86 · 05/09/2021 09:48

Morning all! Thanks for the birthday wishes - I wasn’t in a drinking mood so our usual ‘ten bar crawl’ (which has been nine bars for the last few years because we’ve lost count) didn’t end up happening but we had a few drinks and a heart to heart.
I’m feeling quite ambivalent about it today - I know I gave this guy chances to fix the Saturday issue and I know that I gave him a heads up on the money thing. I’d be mortified if someone told me it was my turn to pay. If I was skint, I’d also jump on the chance to have a cheaper date if it was offered.

I’ve not heard from him since but I wasnt expecting to. We basically left it on ‘all the best, hope you find the right person’ etc so no room for him to come back (intentional)

Anyway - I’ve got very little to do today so I’m going to relax with some coffee and then crack on with some housework. I always feel a bit better with a tidy house so that’ll help.

My chat with my friend last night bought out that I’m feeling a bit off in other ways - so I think the way I’m feeling isn’t just related to that guy, but has been exacerbated by it a little bit. Definitely got a bit of stuff to work on anyway!

Thanks again for all the kind wishes and advice. I’ve got so much out of this thread and it really gave me the kick up the arse that I needed to make the right decision.

OP posts:
Cherrysoup · 05/09/2021 09:56

I’d so wear that if I had the figure! Fabulous!

FanFiction · 05/09/2021 10:55

Hello OP,
I’m in a sort of similar position. Left it so there is NC. There is a sort of melancholy that it didn’t work out, but also a sense of relief. I am finding it helpful to have a general “tidy up” of my life. Looking at the values and qualities I cherish in other human beings, also in myself. What was it that led me to this type of man? I believe this sort of reflection and dust-settling is hugely beneficial and a wonderful part of wellbeing.

You sound like a fun, lively, person with a strong moral compass. We deserve good partners who walk alongside that. Enjoy the peace! 😊❤️

dizzyupthegirl86 · 05/09/2021 11:35

@FanFiction

Hello OP, I’m in a sort of similar position. Left it so there is NC. There is a sort of melancholy that it didn’t work out, but also a sense of relief. I am finding it helpful to have a general “tidy up” of my life. Looking at the values and qualities I cherish in other human beings, also in myself. What was it that led me to this type of man? I believe this sort of reflection and dust-settling is hugely beneficial and a wonderful part of wellbeing.

You sound like a fun, lively, person with a strong moral compass. We deserve good partners who walk alongside that. Enjoy the peace! 😊❤️

Aw thank you! I don’t feel fun or lively, which is admittedly part of the problem! One of the things I like in a partner is someone who has their own hobbies and interests, and that guy didn’t really seem to have them.

I think you phrased it better than I did - it’s the melancholy that things didn’t work out more than anything. I don’t enjoy the dating game particularly but a lot of that is my own self confidence.

A lot of my sadness is just unfair and wrong. For instance I had a bit of a cry yesterday because a few years back, I was on holiday for my birthday with an ex, who took me to Barcelona for the day - somewhere that had been on my wish list for ages. It meant SO much to me.
But the reality of the situation was that he didn’t know it would mean that much to me, he was a raging alcoholic who fell off the wagon that day and didn’t think I’d spotted him ordering the alcoholic beer rather than the non alcoholic version, and after spending two years with him, I’d alienated myself from my friends and family to the point where I didn’t know how to be on my own in my own house anymore.

I’ve done my wallowing - there’s nothing wrong with being sad but for me it helps to address the reality of the situation rather than my perception of it, after I’ve got it out of my system a little bit!

It’s a beautiful day today and I’m not hungover ( we swerved the best old fashioneds in town, which are incredible but my god do they turn me into a misery the next day) and my house is finally starting to look like an actual adult lives in it!

OP posts:
ThumbWitchesAbroad · 05/09/2021 12:06

Sounds like you're having a "new start" day, @dizzyupthegirl86 - moving on up and moving forward. Excellent! [thankks]

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 05/09/2021 12:07

Thanks that was meant to be - fat fingers, sorry!

putthetubeinthebin · 05/09/2021 14:58

Well done OP. It's brilliant that you e thrown this one back.

I was just thinking about my ex and the first tome I went to stay with him he had no food in. We went to the supermarket, I picked up a couple of bits hit let him take the lead as assumed he'd be paying then when we got to the till he just stood with his hands in his pockets as I paid for the lot including expensive snacks and beers that I don't drink.

Anyway, 17 years later and I'm about to chase him up again for maintenance thats 4 days late. Happens every month.

dizzyupthegirl86 · 05/09/2021 15:27

Ah been there…. I was with a guy for a few years, we’d met at work. He was a driver and I worked in the office. My team got made redundant and so I was out of work for a few months. He’d come over to mine and let me pay for the shopping…. One time he put a box of chocolates in the trolley and said it was for our mutual work friend who was having a rough time of it. It was a few months later when I mentioned it to her and she knew nothing about these chocolates, but by that point I’d already found out he’d been cheating on me with his best friends wife….

OP posts:
HateJudgmentalPeople · 05/09/2021 18:05

@dizzyupthegirl86

Ah been there…. I was with a guy for a few years, we’d met at work. He was a driver and I worked in the office. My team got made redundant and so I was out of work for a few months. He’d come over to mine and let me pay for the shopping…. One time he put a box of chocolates in the trolley and said it was for our mutual work friend who was having a rough time of it. It was a few months later when I mentioned it to her and she knew nothing about these chocolates, but by that point I’d already found out he’d been cheating on me with his best friends wife….
OMG he basically bought those chocolates for another woman when he was with you! Total cunt, it’s almost like he hated you deep down!
bevm72yellow · 05/09/2021 18:45

He is looking for someone just like you to pick up the slack for his shortcomings. He is picking you because you provide food, money for fun things and accommodation when he feels like it. He has forgot his manners and does not respect the simple things you want ...like "to go home". Start as you mean to go on. He is not complying.

PicardyRose · 05/09/2021 20:15

OP’s twat radar is finely tuned!

MiaRoma · 07/09/2021 16:43

Well done OP. You come out of this with grace and integrity

littlebilliie · 07/09/2021 17:56

Bin

dizzyupthegirl86 · 07/09/2021 18:09

@MiaRoma

Well done OP. You come out of this with grace and integrity
That’s such a lovely thing to say, thank you! Feel like I’ve had a mumsnet hug!
OP posts:
Rozziie · 07/09/2021 18:31

Yes, OP, you sound lovely and I'm in awe of your confidence and poise. I'm sure you'll meet the right person because you're absolutely right to kick people to the kerb early on if they've shown they're not right for you! Too many women feel obliged to keep seeing someone if they're mostly decent and somewhat normal, even if their gut is saying no!

PornStarQuarantini · 07/09/2021 22:46

@Rozziie

Yes, OP, you sound lovely and I'm in awe of your confidence and poise. I'm sure you'll meet the right person because you're absolutely right to kick people to the kerb early on if they've shown they're not right for you! Too many women feel obliged to keep seeing someone if they're mostly decent and somewhat normal, even if their gut is saying no!
Hear, hear!
Crikeyalmighty · 08/09/2021 14:10

You know OP there’s some right old cheapskates out there (Male and female) who like a good time but would rather it was on other people’s cash. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with being careful in a relationship but it only works if you are both like this and the expectations match. I would have saved myself 4 years with someone in the 90s if mumsnet had been around and introduced me to the idea of a cocklodger (and one with high expectations too) . It doesn’t mean to say these guys are only with you to bleed you dry but I do think a certain type are attracted to women they think will be a soft touch and have a decent income coming in

Crikeyalmighty · 08/09/2021 14:10

Oh and the reverse is true too but tend to be known as goldiggers!!

dizzyupthegirl86 · 08/09/2021 17:44

You’re right - it doesn’t need to be 50/50, and the frustrating thing about it was that I’m not normally the type to quibble over it not being split evenly. If I’d paid for 2 to his 1, I’d have thought it was about right given the distance he was travelling and the time on his part, plus combined with the difference in earnings - I would have considered it roughly even.
Instead I had to be someone who worked out how many times I’d paid vs how many he’d paid. He paid twice and one of those times I don’t think he was expecting to!

It’s not about the money, it’s about the gesture and the intention behind it.

OP posts:
pollypocketlover · 09/09/2021 07:51

Best mate has regaled me of many times girls agreed to go on a date with him only to let him pay and then disappear in the sunset.

For anyone who needs to hear it: men are not entitled to your time just because they bought you a plate of pasta. This is a sexist, rapey mindset that is very common in the incel and manosphere communities.

If your friend is asking to take women out to dinner he should not get butthurt when they assume that he will be paying, considering he is the one who has asked to take them on a date. All of the women he went on dates with were perfectly within their right to "disappear in the sunset" aka. go on the date and decide that they weren't feeling it for whatever reason.

Honestly, with how common date rape, stalking, and harrasment from men is I find it laughable that people reall think that tons of women are purely going out with men for the sake of a £12 dish at Il Bacio. If your friend is regularly going on first dates and not getting second dates... perhaps consider that he, being the common denominator, may be the issue.

Rozziie · 09/09/2021 08:35

@pollypocketlover

Best mate has regaled me of many times girls agreed to go on a date with him only to let him pay and then disappear in the sunset.

For anyone who needs to hear it: men are not entitled to your time just because they bought you a plate of pasta. This is a sexist, rapey mindset that is very common in the incel and manosphere communities.

If your friend is asking to take women out to dinner he should not get butthurt when they assume that he will be paying, considering he is the one who has asked to take them on a date. All of the women he went on dates with were perfectly within their right to "disappear in the sunset" aka. go on the date and decide that they weren't feeling it for whatever reason.

Honestly, with how common date rape, stalking, and harrasment from men is I find it laughable that people reall think that tons of women are purely going out with men for the sake of a £12 dish at Il Bacio. If your friend is regularly going on first dates and not getting second dates... perhaps consider that he, being the common denominator, may be the issue.

Hear, hear!

If the man offers to pay, that's on him. There's no obligation to sleep with him, see him again or anything else.

The idea that a woman would take the risk of meeting someone who could be a creep to get a few drinks or a meal for free is totally insulting.

If a man offers to pay, I'll usually ask if they're sure and if they say yes, I will accept it, regardless of whether I want to see them again. They should be offering because they enjoyed my company and had a nice time, not because they think I owe them something.