Are (seemingly a lot of but not all) men really put off by intelligent women?

[bathsh3ba]

Is this a thing?

Generally speaking I think I probably would get on best dating someone of a similar level of education/intelligence. I'm just finishing a PhD; I don't think of myself as especially clever but I am intelligent and I am well-educated.

I don't want to limit my options when dating too far so I'm open to people who haven't gone to university or who don't value education in the same way, if I think we share other values that are important.

However, increasingly I am finding that as soon as a guy finds out I'm doing a PhD I get raised eyebrows, a 'wow, you must be clever', then some self-deprecating comment and they lose interest.

I always thought the idea of men being threatened by intelligence was just a myth. Obviously I need a man who isn't ... but is being threatened by intelligence actually a thing?

Intelligence and education are not the same thing. I also think there are other types of intelligence which are not measured by IQ. I apparently lack common sense, I struggle to cross the road safely and I'm not brilliant at doing 'life' DH thought this weirdness was cute. He is also very patient at listening, debating and asking questions about my pet subjects, and I am very clever at my pet subjects! never put him off. I agree with others who have said that plenty of averagely intelligent but determined people have completed a PhD. Some of the brightest most insightful and clever people Iv'e met have had no education beyond school.

I would just say you are student until you meet. Not much to be gained by explicitly stating you are doing a PhD.

Do remember that there are a lot of people who haven't had the opportunity to go into further education. I met people when I was working on a bar while I was at Uni who were so intelligent (a fuckload than me) but hadn't used their intelligence in academia due to lack of support. The right person won't be put off by academic achievements but similarly an intellectual snob would put anyone male or female off.

Not in my experience. It can be one facet of a general chip on the shoulder. I dated one guy, and unfortunately married another, with what seemed to be serious chips - and it's something I would avoid now. But their big bugbears were slightly different and much more about class than education. I'm done apologising for who I am, which isn't particularly impressive or terrible anyway.

I'm just back from a group walking holiday.

Now, these holidays do attract a certain sort they tend to be middle class and educated to a reasonable standard. Usually people with some interesting information to share and generally nice people to spend a few days with.

However, the majority of this particular group were very well educated and didn't we hear about it! Good degrees from top universities and PhDs too. Their children who weren't even there were all at top universities too

I'm not daft. I was brought up working class, got decent O and A levels at a "sink" comp and did my degree plus further professional qualifications later in life. But they wouldn't know that because no one asked, they were too busy making sure I knew how superior they were.

I'm at least as intelligent and well qualified as most of the people on that trip but you could see them dismissing me as having nothing worthwhile to say, just because I look and sound working class.

I wonder if the men you think are turned off because you're too clever actually think you're dismissive of them?

Not in my personal experience, Dh actually said that the fact I was clearly very intelligent and ambitious was one of the main things that initially attracted him to me. I went on to get a PhD after we started dating (he has an undergraduate degree but a big successful career) and he’s always said that he couldn’t ever have dated anyone who wasn’t as hardworking and smart as I I am. I did snag him in his early 20s though so maybe this type is a rare breed!

I don’t think it’s necessarily that they feel threatened or are put off by intelligence. I think people tend to go for those who they think they will get on with and have things in common with. You start your post by saying you would probably get on best dating someone with a similar level of intelligence, they probably just feel the same.

I don't think a raised eyebrow and a 'wow you must be clever' means people are put off though. It is quite a natural reaction when you find out someone you are chatting to is doing really well at something. I don't think it is just for a PhD, you would garner the same reaction (slightly different wording) if you said you ran marathons or play viola with a top orchestra, or you were a paralympic athlete, or an extreme sports enthusiast, or train dogs for Crufts or 1001 things that most of the population don't do. It is something noteable about you, not necessarily something offputting.
I mean, I don't know much about OLD, or what people put in their bio, but back in the old fashioned days of meeting people in person and getting to know them, people didn't generally flag up their qualifications in the first few sentences. If you had a higher qualification it tended to be brushed over, not shouted about.

I'd say to not be too "inverse snobbish" about yourself?

"Like those who like you"

If some guy is attracted to you because you have a high-level qualification and his background/culture means that's seen as a "virtue", then why not "use" that fact rather than trying to "explain yourself" to someone else "outside of your social group"? Why make it harder?

(Mark Zuckerberg married a very smart woman so they could geek out together).

I haven't really had time for a F/T relationship, but like you I've enjoyed dating guys who are the opposite of me - I'm quite cerebral and am attracted to guys who are smart but work with their hands.

But if I need to "switch to the geekier side" to get a solid relationship where we have stuff in common, then that's what I will do?

A man who wants a uncomplicated woman to mansplain to and impress is not your type. Consider it a lucky escape.

I think a lot of them are unfortunately.

It upsets the male superiority cart when they can't be centre of attention all the time. He doesn't really care what she has to say and it'd be especially annoying and an inconvenience to him if she had a big job or expected him to listen to what she had to say equally.

It might mean he'd have to treat her as an equal.

It's sensible that you don't want to limit your initial options but the reality is that your intelligence is going to become apparent at some point of every dating process you embark on, so discovering whether someone has a problem with it can't be avoided. You might as well mention it upfront as anyone who's going to be put off will be put off early and you won't waste time with them.

The ones you really need to look out for are the ones who declare that they love intelligent women, but actually only like their partner to be intelligent insofar as it benefits them (like, if your area of expertise can help them out), but not if it challenges them.

You'll be able to spot these guys because they love telling other people that you are 'so intelligent' because it reflects well on them (after all, if their girlfriend is brilliant, they must be smart too), but don't actually express much direct admiration for your intelligence to you. And you'll start to notice that when you know something they don't, or query something they've said, they get defensive instead of curious or reflective, and make remarks that suggest you're acting like a know-it-all, or change the subject very rapidly.

I am a doctor. I had no boyfriends through University. The very occasional disastrous date - including a man who ghosted me after 2 dates.
It was horrible.
In the meantime all the blokes I trained with - some of whom where complete arseholes ( the aresholes became orthopaedic surgeons 😉).
had women throwing themselves at them. It used to piss me off no end.
In the end I met and married my most gorgeous husband in my mid 30’s. He is nor University trained but works. He is intelligent, including very emotionally intelligent.
Lots women docs marry decent ordinary blokes - they marry builders, plumbers, landscape Gardner’s and they are great. Plus the tradesman earn much much more than most doctors( surgeons excepted)
My advice would be look outside your academic circle - and avoid orthopaedic surgeons 🤣. There will be someone for you.

Hold firm and don’t settle for someone less than you deserve.
Don’t loose heart if it takes some time.

Yes they definitely exist and you can never tell till you get to know them a bit.

On the other hand there are lots of men who go for intelligence as part of their "perfect" mate.

Win some lose some? The important thing is to not put up with any nasty behaviour directed at you because you're smart.

@Dizzywizz

My Dh said he would be (so I am now insulted!)

I have a PhD and my ex husband left school with A levels never did a degree and is probably the most intelligent and I interesting people I know. My new BF left school with I CSE (before GCSEs) and is amazingly insightful and intelligent -I learn from him all the time. He told me he initially assumed I would get bored with him (he didn’t know them about the PhD as so don’t parade it or use the title) but just that so was intelligent.
Ignore the qualifications and know the person.

I think some people find it intimidating, but if you don't talk about it, they can normally get over that.

I find there are more men who don't cope well if their partner earns more than them. And still more who don't cope if their wife/gf has a 'big job' with lots of responsibility.

No. Not in my experience. Normally, men admire a smart woman. Even my idiot ex-husband liked the fact that he had a "smart woman" (his words). Clearly not smart enough not to marry him

If you state on your OLD profile you are working on a PhD, you might delete it for awhile, don't mention it at all and see what happens - ya know, all in the name of Social Experiment.

Your phD should be the least interesting thing about you.

@Lampan

I don’t think it’s necessarily that they feel threatened or are put off by intelligence. I think people tend to go for those who they think they will get on with and have things in common with. You start your post by saying you would probably get on best dating someone with a similar level of intelligence, they probably just feel the same.

I agree with this. I've usually had more successful relationships with people who have been to university. That was one of the best times of my life, and I like discussing it with other people. My wife is very clever and did a similar subject to mine, albeit studied in another country.

I think so. Unfortunately.

@CampaignToo

I'm just back from a group walking holiday.

Now, these holidays do attract a certain sort they tend to be middle class and educated to a reasonable standard. Usually people with some interesting information to share and generally nice people to spend a few days with.

However, the majority of this particular group were very well educated and didn't we hear about it! Good degrees from top universities and PhDs too. Their children who weren't even there were all at top universities too

I'm not daft. I was brought up working class, got decent O and A levels at a "sink" comp and did my degree plus further professional qualifications later in life. But they wouldn't know that because no one asked, they were too busy making sure I knew how superior they were.

I'm at least as intelligent and well qualified as most of the people on that trip but you could see them dismissing me as having nothing worthwhile to say, just because I look and sound working class.

I wonder if the men you think are turned off because you're too clever actually think you're dismissive of them?

You poor thing - that would have been miserable!

Not RTFT

I read a thing about a study a while back.

It found that while men say they like clever women. In practice they don't at all.

(NAMALT obv!).

Ditto with women earning more.

Oh and this is good.

Apparently when men say they like a good sense of humour. They don't mean a woman who is funny. But one who laughs at his jokes..

Oh and also not sure how they measured intelligent.

Qualifications etc is not the same thing.

Loads of people without lots of education are v clever. And tbh I've met plenty of highly educated people who aren't that sharp iyswim.

So that's another thought.

Shouldn't the question be whether you have the right to ignore men who are insecure about your academic prowess. Answer, - yes you do!
Find someone who is secure in themselves and proud and supportive of you.