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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Child conference and pre proceedings

348 replies

Mumtobe2021x · 25/08/2021 21:43

So my unborn baby who is due any day now I’ve been told is being placed on a child protection plan as the social believe she is at risk of harm due to me being involved in “domestic violence with the father” anyway I’ve moved back in with my dad and the social worker me and her dad have so far signed a contact arrangement plan or the father to have supervised contact with the baby at my address without me being in the room. I’ve also been told we’re having an initial child protection conference meeting and a pre proceedings meeting where both me and babies dad will have a solicitor with us provided by social services. I’m just wondering if anyone’s got any experience with this. They haven’t really explained much about these meetings and what could happen I’ve asked her but she doesn’t really explain a lot so can’t someone explain what I can expect ? Does it mean they’re considering taking the baby away or is it a plan to keep her in with me but in a safe way? I just want to know the possible outcomes as I feel like I’m getting a lot of mixed messages

OP posts:
Farahilda · 26/08/2021 13:18

I too am very very surprised that SS have agreed to this

Well quite.

One area I think you need to explore explicitly is whether the SW was trying to make something out of a bad situation or if they actually believe this plan is a good one. I suspect that it's the former.

If SW have doubts about the plan, you need to know this now. Do not rely on it being something they will continue to endorse, especially as you continue to minimise and excuse his conduct.

It is not up to you to sort out his issues - he needs to do that.

You need to keep your baby safe for as long as it takes him to do that. That may well mean no contact until there is more evidence that he has any insight in to his actions and is serious in dealing with them.

Please wake up now

BrownJenkins · 26/08/2021 13:19

OP. Say goodbye to your baby.

Tempusfudgeit · 26/08/2021 13:20

These threads make me weep. Thank God there are people/systems that will protect babies when their parents won't or can't. OP, in the future you'll look back at this time and realise this was the time that you could have safeguarded her and kept her with you. Instead you'll be wondering where she is and whether she's happy. So sad.

Mantlemoose · 26/08/2021 13:27

I think we can all see where this is going..............

LIZS · 26/08/2021 13:33

Fact is dv increases with the arrival of a baby. Your discussion with the fire service was just one incident in a whole catalogue. They and ss can see this pattern escalating even if you don't/won't. Priority is the baby, you can make choices on your own account, a baby or young child is vulnerable and can't. Whatever reason he drinks for, he becomes argumentative and violent. You cannot stop this. Did he drink while caring for his nephew? Can you not see that that relationship dynamic may differ from that with his own child and partner?

BasicDad · 26/08/2021 13:36

This is really sad. OP, I'm sorry to say, but you're about to lose your baby.

SS and the courts look at how they perceive the risk to your baby, and not your opinion. In fact your opinion just makes it 10x worse, as you seem oblivious to the risk.

You need to drop the "he would never", and the "if he steps out of line, then we'll stop". They want to see you taking reasonable actions to ensure it never happens. You're currently on another planet, and will in all likelihood lose your baby.

At least the baby will be 100% safe.

ChilliHeeler82 · 26/08/2021 13:43

OP, I don't think you realise how serious this is. A PLO is the final step before care proceedings are issued and if you present how you are here you WILL lose your baby. No dressing her in cute clothes or personalised gifts. She will be taken away at birth.

MsJinks · 26/08/2021 13:46

You have to be more than averagely protective now and show that to social. I imagine they’re short of resource and agreed that contact arrangement just to cover it for now, but don’t doubt they will also have records showing all your suggestions and questions about if you can be in the house, depending how all this goes.
You get your own solicitor and preferably one who does not also work for social care as well at times - some refuse to stand on both sides of the court proceedings but not many.
You really need one who can lay it out for you and be clear on what’s required - then it’s upto you - they can support you in a court case, but they can’t make you understand the problems and follow their advice. You need to be all over this and truly ‘get’ what is being said and then truly go over and above to demonstrate your protection of your child, as they are all that matters to you.

Wishingwell75 · 26/08/2021 13:48

I haven't had time to read the whole thread but I would like to comment.
Ok, so CS have to go through a set of steps by law, obviously they cannot just take your baby, even in an emergency situation they have to get a temporary protection order or the police can. I know that's not what's happening here but make no mistake a PLO meeting/process is incredibly serious and in some cases (not all and obviously we don't know in this one) but CS's may well already have a desired outcome in mind. Because of the age of your daughter full adoption as opposed to foster care will be considered.
So, as blunt as it sounds you now have to choose between him and her. There isn't a choice, it has to be your child.
I suspect you still have feelings maybe even love this man but it's not enough. It won't ever be enough.
Seriously, get yourself a solicitor and the one you choose is important. So, ask questions at the first interview and if you have to, see a different one. The problem is, frequently the time scale between needing to instruct a solicitor and the meeting is usually short but it's so important to find a solicitor that will fight your corner, I cannot stress that enough.
I'm sorry you're having to deal with all this, especially at such a time when stress is the last thing you need - but this is the fight of your life.
The brilliant thing is that you have family support, honestly you are really lucky in that respect. If and despite what I have already said it is still an IF, your daughter is removed from your care (even temporarily) CS's will look to place her with family before foster carers.
But you need to sever all ties with her Dad, OP. Let him sort out contact for himself.
If possible breastfeed your baby because, well many reasons but it's another plus for her staying with you.
In terms of how that will influence contact with your ex, if needs be, you can go to the contact centre with the baby and sit in the office while he sees her but ultimately that's not for you to worry about.
Put her needs above all else, that is what CS wants to know you can do.
I really hope it works out for you.

OpheliaOpholia · 26/08/2021 13:54

You certainly don't want a solicitor appointed to you by SS.

I would urge you to find your own, somebody who specialises in family law, ideally outside the local authority.

You're entitled to legal aid and that can be applied to a different solicitor.

Garriet · 26/08/2021 14:23

@OpheliaOpholia

You certainly don't want a solicitor appointed to you by SS.

I would urge you to find your own, somebody who specialises in family law, ideally outside the local authority.

You're entitled to legal aid and that can be applied to a different solicitor.

Social workers don’t appoint solicitors for parents. OP will have a “Public Law Outline” letter setting out concerns and expectations, and in this letter is the information she will need to access legal aid and appoint her own solicitor.

I advise her to prioritise this as she clearly desperately needs robust legal advice.

Pericombobulations · 26/08/2021 14:28

Can I add too all the previous posters warnings. I was 100% certain my abusive ex was only abusive when drunk. Until the day I refused to ague with him, and he, whilst sober, dragged me by the hair to the top of the stairs and threatened to throw me down them.

If he is abusive whilst drunk, he will be abusive whilst sober.

You have the chance and choice now, protect your unborn child or risk loosing them.

Mamamamasaurus · 26/08/2021 14:31

I don't say this lightly - I hope SS see through this charade, your denial, your bending of the truth, and remove your baby.

You may consider that harsh but you're not safeguarding your child, you don't seem to intend to, you see that your 'ex' has done nothing wrong or nothing was his fault. You've made excuses for his inexcusable behaviour and are still helping him have access to your innocent baby.

Your baby is the innocent party in this - your baby deserves better. You could do it but it doesn't sound like you will.

OurChristmasMiracle · 26/08/2021 15:32

Honestly you are excusing his violence and therefore minimising his actions and the abuse. The fact that you clearly already believe that it is you who causes him to be violent shows exactly how much mental abuse you are likely to have already suffered and therefore how much your child is at potential harm of the same abuse.

Allowing contact in your home when you are present is a recipe for disaster. Honestly you shouldn’t have even informed him of where you are living.

You are failing to protect your baby and SS will see that. The meeting will outline all the concerns and the plus points and what needs to change. If there is any concern you are not complying fully and are not fully aware of the gravity of the concerns then they may well apply for a placement order before the baby is born and the child could be removed from you before you leave hospital following the birth.

nocoolnamesleft · 26/08/2021 15:56

You say you would bet your life he wouldn't harm your baby. But you will actually be betting your baby's life.

Pebbledashery · 26/08/2021 16:07

Op what do you hope to gain by posting these multiple posts where everyone gives you the same advice over and over again, that you just ignore?

SpaceBethSmith · 26/08/2021 16:13

@Pebbledashery

Op what do you hope to gain by posting these multiple posts where everyone gives you the same advice over and over again, that you just ignore?
I’ve been wondering that.

Most likely she thinks that eventually she will have a thread full of people agreeing with her

Original poster
Mumtobe2021x · 26/08/2021 16:15

@OurChristmasMiracle

Honestly you are excusing his violence and therefore minimising his actions and the abuse. The fact that you clearly already believe that it is you who causes him to be violent shows exactly how much mental abuse you are likely to have already suffered and therefore how much your child is at potential harm of the same abuse.

Allowing contact in your home when you are present is a recipe for disaster. Honestly you shouldn’t have even informed him of where you are living.

You are failing to protect your baby and SS will see that. The meeting will outline all the concerns and the plus points and what needs to change. If there is any concern you are not complying fully and are not fully aware of the gravity of the concerns then they may well apply for a placement order before the baby is born and the child could be removed from you before you leave hospital following the birth.

I’m going to listen to there concerns an what needs to change and I am engaging with them no matter what they are. They can’t just take the baby away the whole point of this meeting I’ve heard is to see what can be done to prevent her being taken away so as far as I’m aware as long as I’m doing what’s asked of me and my baby is safe and she is not put in any danger then I am complying with them
OP posts:
Pebbledashery · 26/08/2021 16:15

It's pointless. You don't listen.

Pebbledashery · 26/08/2021 16:16

Actually, they can just take a baby away, they can apply for an emergency protection order faster than your feet will hit the ground, don't get complacent.

Original poster
Mumtobe2021x · 26/08/2021 16:17

I also have a family conference meeting tommorow also with the social worker me , my dad , the babies dad and his mum

OP posts:
Original poster
Mumtobe2021x · 26/08/2021 16:18

@Pebbledashery

Actually, they can just take a baby away, they can apply for an emergency protection order faster than your feet will hit the ground, don't get complacent.
I’ve spoken to the sw about this and she has assured be that no matter what happens at these meetings this contact arrangement is still in place she said the baby will be going home with me after birth. So surely if the plan at these meetings was to get her taken away from me she would not of said this to me
OP posts:
Original poster
Mumtobe2021x · 26/08/2021 16:22

Like I said , I know he is not going to be any danger to the baby. Yes I can see why ss think he could be and if he did act like the way he is in front of a baby then yes obviously that’s putting the baby at risk. However I know that’s not going to be the case and if it was I wouldn’t be allowing contact.

OP posts:
Original poster
Mumtobe2021x · 26/08/2021 16:23

If he did anything even the slightest thing around the baby even raise his voice in the slightest I would be informing ss and cutting of the contact. But he’s not going to and there are people there supervising him to whiteness this also

OP posts:
Bluntness100 · 26/08/2021 16:24

This sounds very familiar op to thr lady who posted at the beginning of the week promising never to see her boyfriend again as ss was going to take the baby away but kept going to his house and he had videos of her outside snd refusing to leave.

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