Should I Let Her Husband Go Too?

[Perriwinkles]

So, I am female. I have a male childhood friend. He met his now wife and she and I hit it off … in time. I made a huge effort with her & wanted to make sure she knew just how platonic her husband and I were. A true friendship then developed.

Roll on 8 years later and she and I had got very very close. Then one day, it all imploded. I thought it was a bad fight (& our only ever fight) but she cut me out entirely even though we had left each other on good terms that day. I was devastated & asked for an explanation. She wrote me a nasty text that I didn’t know she was capable of. I had never been so close to a friend & it affected me terribly. I spoke to a therapist about it and lost a lot of sleep.

Her husband, my long-standing friend, still makes an effort to maintain his friendship with me — we see each every once every few months and some texts. The problem is that every time I see him I am re-triggered. The friendship break-up cut me deep and seeing him opens up the wound every single time. It takes me weeks to recover. I have never once brought any of this up with him and I never discuss her with him. He brings her up though as he is consumed by her.

What do you think? Should I try to slowly phase him out too? The problem is … He’s universally adored! He’s one of those guys who doesn’t see people often but puts on his game face when he sees them and so ‘the gang’ all love him (when they see him at get-togethers, weddings etc.).

I want to move on (as I know she has) but what should I do?

@beastlyslumber

I agree with pp that you're still somewhat in the FOG stage (fear - obligation - guilt). The fact you think he hasn't actually done anything that wrong - and then in the same breath tell of how he abused you on your wedding day - shows that you are still minimising and justifying. Get angry! He treats you like shit and you're supposed to run around after him and feel bad when you don't give him attention? Crazy

I know but the problem is that he hasn’t done anything recently . I took him out for lunch a month after my wedding - my instigation! So, he has no idea about that and it’s on me that I haven’t had more immediacy with all of this.

@beastlyslumber

Re. your mutual friends all loving him. It's always the way with bullies, that they have to have a team of loyal supporters. If your mutuals really can't see through his shit then you will have to refuse to discuss him with them and be very careful about them getting involved in this dispute. When I broke things off with my narcissistic intense friend situation (lots of similarities to your situation) I lost the whole group of friends, too. Be prepared for him going on the attack

I’m really sorry that happened to you. I am much closer to them than he is but his distance bolsters him as they only see short snippets where he maintains his lovely, friendly facade. I don’t think I’ll lose them but I’ll have to be careful not to badmouth him too much or I’ll look like the bad guy.

@beastlyslumber

If he texts again, I probably will reply but I’ll grey rock him and if he suggests meeting the baby again, I think I’ll simply reply, ‘tbh I think meeting him might be a bit too sad/strange without [your wife]’ … at least that’s what I think I’ll do

No, don't do that - that's giving him your feelings. Either don't respond or grey rock instead. "Not got time at the moment, lots on, you know how it is." But best to just not reply

Yeah you’re right: ‘giving him my feelings.’ He hasn’t shown much regard for my feelings. His wife cut me off and left me in a heap of upset and he never once asked how I was. He did make an effort to see me though but those meetings always had a sting in the tale.

tail

I know but the problem is that he hasn’t done anything recently

I don't get why that's a problem? So what? It doesn't make anything he's done in the past any less wrong. I'm not suggesting that you confront him about any of this - I think that would be the worst possible thing you could do. I'm suggesting that you yourself confront the fact that he has done wrong to you many times, and in some really damaging ways, and that you have accepted it and made excuses for him. And that has to change. You are the only person who has the power to change that situation. Don't give him any more of your power. Don't give him a chance to do any more harm to you.

@Perriwinkles

Thanks *@ZeldaPrincessOfHyrule*

I read that thread! I recall running in the rain featuring strongly. I was amazed at her resolve. My situation is different in that he hasn’t done anything as overtly ‘wrong.’ I wish I didn’t have such delayed reactions to things.

At my own wedding, for example, he bit the head off me. Meanwhile, a friend who had never met him before was texting me saying how kind he was to her and how he ‘must be the nicest person I’ve ever met.’ That’s a direct quote!

OP! This "At my own wedding, for example, he bit the head off me." IS objectively, overtly, undeniably wrong. Your friend said that about him because he didn't bite HER head off at HER wedding. Her experience of him has sod all to do with yours so you must stop placing so much value on what other people think of him. It's irrelevant to how you have experienced him.

Think how many disgustingly abusive men abuse their wives behind closed doors and then are said to have been 'upstanding members of the community', wouldn't hurt a fly, friends and neighbours are shocked etc etc when they are unmasked.

I'm not saying he's an abuser, I'm just illustrating the point that people are different with different people.

He's been a prick to you repeatedly, even at your wedding!

He's objectively a shit.

HE thinks she's doing 'better than ever'.

In reality, she's married to an arsehole.

Hardly a prize!

@beastlyslumber

I agree about this:

I'm not suggesting that you confront him about any of this - I think that would be the worst possible thing you could do

I just wish I had reacted appropriately at the time. I didn’t though & I need to move on. I’m starting to feel angrier than ever. It’s as though I didn’t trust my own feelings and their validity and his mixed messages fed into that. I really hope he doesn’t contact me for a long time.

Thanks @youvegottenminuteslynn

The thing is she told me lots of things he said and did - and I witnessed them too. She had the same flip-flop way of looking at him that I do. She knew about his multiple faces. Hardly a prize is right.

I regret not acting on this sooner as he’s probably going to be blindsided by me blanking him seemingly ‘all of a sudden’ but at least I’m processing it all now.

good for you and therapy is definitely not to be seen as a failing while they are triumphant. you’re working on yourself in a way that will transcend this mess. in some way they have done you a favour in recognising how the codependency and people pleasing leaves you feeling so much worse about yourself where these two are concerned. you’ve realised something is not quite right, and now you’re doing the work to make it right for you, not them. and i know all too well the effect of childhood experiences can have, so i’m wishing you lots of luck in this journey.

He had a go at you on your wedding day!
What an awful man and good luck to his wife - they're a match made in heaven and both deserve each other.

I think the issue all along (or for a very long time) is that you valued and treated your very long friendship by your own loyal and lovely standards, and not by his.

I think he saw you as being inferior to him and silly silly him for losing such a loyal and good friend in you.

Your eyes are very much open now and it is a very sad realisation to get over, but you WILL be alright☺️☺️☺️

There's also the option of trying the "phase out" first, but if (when) he starts texting you relentlessly and you feel you're about to give in, then resorting to the "last text and block".
By that point he will have probably figured out it's over and you mean business!

...also bear in mind it is perfectly normal to mourn the loss of a friendship 💐

Thanks @Und3rl1ng
A blended approach might work best all right!

Thanks @Notmoresugar
It’s nice to feel that even some of this is normal. I’ve always been someone who feels things deeply and who finds it hard to let go but the flip side is my unflinching loyalty to friends; so it’s not all bad. But yeah, my therapist told me to grieve the friendship with the wife, which I was never sure how to do. Now it looks like I need to grieve the relationship with the Husband too. Again, not sure how … but I’ll try.

Thanks @Notmoresugar

Kind words…

I think he saw you as being inferior to him and silly silly him for losing such a loyal and good friend in you
Thank you & yes, I do think he saw me (& most others) as inferior to him. He’s highly accomplished.

Your eyes are very much open now and it is a very sad realisation to get over, but you WILL be alright☺️☺️☺️
It is a sad realisation. That tipping point where the bad has outweighed the good for me.

Beware of him wendying you. When your friends next say how charming he is, I'd say 'yes, he can come across that way...' and let it hang in the air that all isn't what it seems. If pressed you could say he isn't always very nice to you. You don't want him to come off looking squeaky clean mr nice guy blah blah when you know he's a self-serving narc.

I think that you just need at accept that he isn’t a good a friend to you, as you have always imagined.
It really doesn’t matter that In your group everyone thinks he’s amazing and hilarious and has everyone falling at his feet. It really doesn’t matter whether they think the sun shines out his bum and he regularly walks on water. You know the truth , he’s not really the person he portrays himself to be.
Take that knowledge, put some distance between you and him, and work hard to make a new circle of friends, once that share your loyalty. Once you are feeling happy in yourself and you have new friends to enjoy yourself with, you will wonder why you lost so much sleep over someone, when all is said and done, doesn’t t deserve it.

Hi @Perriwinkles

Your situation is very very similar to something I’ve been going through this year. The friendship was great, we were like sisters and said it regularly. Her husband was like a brother to me, too. The last time I saw her was Easter this year. She bought eggs for my children. 2 days later, she dumped me. Totally unexpected and I was devastated. It took 3 months to find out what I had done as neither she nor him would tell me. I have found out now but she’s basically twisted a situation to suit herself as I think (and realise now) that she wanted to end the friendship but didn’t know how. But her way was brutal as hell.

We have now ended it completely, well, she has. She said it’s over, finished, all gone. It’s been hard to come to terms with it but I realised that arguing my side (which was truthful and honest) was pointless as she’s made her mind up. Her husband now won’t speak to me either.

I hope that you can move forward without these people in your life as I know it hurts a lot to have this happen. The only advice I can give you is that time is a good healer and although you’re 2 years down the line, you need more time to heal and move on. I know that I do too. I think it’s also key to remember that the woman in your situation (as in mine) doesn’t care what’s happened and never will. You just have to look after yourself and remember you will be ok.

OP,

So much great advice from so many, especially these three.
@beastlyslumber
@youvegottenminuteslynn
@ZeldaPrincessOfHyrule

I just want to completely reiterate how self sabotaging it will be to get into any discussion with him.

He is an unmitigated shit.

That you continued to be in contact with him after the wedding/remark about your husband absolutely means he knows your boundaries were shit and he is free to use you.

He is an ugly person.

Grey rock is the way to go.
Lots of emojii👍👍👍👍 are a great way of not being rude but not engaging.

You are going through a transitional stage in your life, you ARE fxxking busy.

Keep saying it to him and you will get back. Leave the texts longer and longer on unread before eventually reading.

Do NOT answer the phone, but respond by text that you are busy, on a loop.

You do not owe him even the slightest bit of information on your mindset and @beastly gave you a lovely taster how easy it is to twist ANYTHING you write or say.

Just be upbeat but so busy.

As for friends asking about him? Blow them off with "no idea, he's got a new baby" "no idea I have been so busy" on a loop.

Eventually "there really is only so much time" and like Judas Iscariot deny the the depth of the relationship in an offhand way.

Practice in the mirror being blasé and super brief about him.

Also remember he can try and say what he likes about "perri has blocked/dumped me" but if you refuse to engage and just do 🙄🤷‍♀️ and move on, it will deprive him of the oxygen he wants.

Keep reading back on the above poster's posts, as there is months of solid therapy for free in them.

Do not give him your power.
Do not give him information that he can use to hurt you.

But do be prepared for him to ramp up and try and bully you to meet.
Bullying narcs like him do not like being dismissed, so be prepared.

@Eddielzzard

Beware of him wendying you. When your friends next say how charming he is, I'd say 'yes, he can come across that way...' and let it hang in the air that all isn't what it seems. If pressed you could say he isn't always very nice to you. You don't want him to come off looking squeaky clean mr nice guy blah blah when you know he's a self-serving narc.

This is also very handy, damning with false praise.

@Hopingforabagofbuttons

It really doesn’t matter that In your group everyone thinks he’s amazing and hilarious and has everyone falling at his feet. It really doesn’t matter whether they think the sun shines out his bum and he regularly walks on water. You know the truth , he’s not really the person he portrays himself to be

Thank you. I need to say that in my head. ‘It doesn’t matter what other people think of him.’ I think I just didn’t trust my own judgment for so long and one time when I told a mutual friend (who describes me as his best friend) that the Husband screamed at me one day, the friend said ‘oh are ye not getting on because I can’t imagine him behaving like that?.’ I felt so hurt that he felt it must have been my fault & I think I’ve kept that feeling in my heart for years.

The Husband bought me chocolates and apologised in a card after the screaming. When I spoke in person he said, ‘we must be spending too much time together. I shouldn’t feel like I can scream at you like that.’

@GoodbyeOldFriend

Thank you.

Aw that situation was brutal for you. You were really left in the dark by both of them! The only saving grace is that maybe the bandaid was ripped off as both of them stood together? So hurtful though. It can be terrible to see how a friendship is just not valued by people you thought you were close to.

It’s almost two years since the fallout with the Wife but I think the continued contact with the Husband has been like scratching a wound. I think I’ll heal much quicker once he’s out of my life.

@billy1966

Thank you. I appreciate the practical advice for how to do it. I’m nervous about replying to the text he sent yesterday at all as I’m afraid it’ll lead to further ‘how are you doing? Want to meet [my son]/go for coffee soon?’ etc. I really really don’t want to see him on his own again.

I feel ashamed by this:

That you continued to be in contact with him after the wedding/remark about your husband absolutely means he knows your boundaries were shit and he is free to use you
I held him & his wife in far too high regard. I think I had a sort of non-sexual crush on them both in that I admired & looked up to them. I used to bend over backwards for them and shower them with gifts. Gawd I feel pathetic but I also hope I can be that close to people again without it going south!

@Eddielzzard

Thank you. A fair point.

Another thing that hit me today is that this is the first time that I can remember feeling in control in this friendship in a long time. Not replying to a little text is no big deal in the greater scheme of things but I feel a sense of relief I have never felt before. It is usually me waiting for replies from him and I’m amazed at how much calmer I feel today.