Should I Let Her Husband Go Too?

[Perriwinkles]

So, I am female. I have a male childhood friend. He met his now wife and she and I hit it off … in time. I made a huge effort with her & wanted to make sure she knew just how platonic her husband and I were. A true friendship then developed.

Roll on 8 years later and she and I had got very very close. Then one day, it all imploded. I thought it was a bad fight (& our only ever fight) but she cut me out entirely even though we had left each other on good terms that day. I was devastated & asked for an explanation. She wrote me a nasty text that I didn’t know she was capable of. I had never been so close to a friend & it affected me terribly. I spoke to a therapist about it and lost a lot of sleep.

Her husband, my long-standing friend, still makes an effort to maintain his friendship with me — we see each every once every few months and some texts. The problem is that every time I see him I am re-triggered. The friendship break-up cut me deep and seeing him opens up the wound every single time. It takes me weeks to recover. I have never once brought any of this up with him and I never discuss her with him. He brings her up though as he is consumed by her.

What do you think? Should I try to slowly phase him out too? The problem is … He’s universally adored! He’s one of those guys who doesn’t see people often but puts on his game face when he sees them and so ‘the gang’ all love him (when they see him at get-togethers, weddings etc.).

I want to move on (as I know she has) but what should I do?

He’s thinking about his feelings, you’re thinking about his feelings, who’s thinking about yours?
If it’s easier don’t answer for a day, then another day and then it’s too late, like when you get a text in the middle of something and quickly close it and forget it was ever there.

It Just feels like basic good manners y’know.

Well nobody was thinking about their manners when they were bad mouthing your ex husband.

This guy wasn't thinking about manners when he made horrible jibes to you.

Stop worrying about what other people think of you because that worry is being prioritised over your own wellbeing.

They are fine. They will be fine if you don't message. They have a new baby and he will find a new captive audience to be charming / a bit of a wanker to. She has decided not to speak to you again so she's moved on already.

You're living your life giving space in your mind rent free to people who aren't kind, genuine friends. They are people who have both made you feel shit in different ways.

Codependency and people pleasing tendencies need some serious work and I think looking at those things again would be really beneficial for you.

..."But this is what I mean. I feel bad not replying as I start putting myself in his shoes (as I would with anyone) and I start thinking ‘how would I feel if my text wasn’t answered?’ It Just feels like basic good manners y’know.

@Perriwinkles
Go easy on your conscience.
Was it drummed into you to have a conscience when you were young?

He doesn't have a conscience when he upsets you - does he.

Thank you to you both. Xx

All three of you …

Yes, I have a fairly ripe conscience & suffer with a lot of guilt at my misdemeanours so I try to do the right thing when I can!

Me too but once you take a step in the right direction it gets easier and feels better all round.

..."Yes, I have a fairly ripe conscience & suffer with a lot of guilt at my misdemeanours so I try to do the right thing when I can!"

I know, and it's a very hard-wired habit to break - it's almost like a pre-programmed knee jerk reaction.

Realistically you could be absolutely anywhere and doing anything - so stop yourself from replying.

Once you're brave enough (no insult there at all) you will be quite surprised that it is actually very easy to do after-all and that the sky won't fall down on you.

@Perriwinkles

OP, if you can't discuss this with him straight up, he's not your friend, & yes, you should let him go to protect yourself. If you can discuss it, why not do so, & see how you feel when you've opened the door & let the elephant out of the room?

You’re right - and I don’t want to put myself through the stress of meeting him and trying to discuss it so when he next contacts me , I’ll just reply with that text I wrote above … or a variation of it …???

I suspect you need the 'closure' of sending a text - if you do, make it as bland & non-committal as possible. I liked PP's above, of just saying 'sorry, lots on, can't come to see baby at present' ... & letting it drift until he contacts you again.

What i don't like is how he steps up the pace of contact when you do slow your own response down. I think you're better off preparing yourself for this, & having some stock boring-but-undisputable reasons not to meet up, than handing him the drama-ammo of a big explanation of your feelings. If he's not a narc, he's at least a drama queen (look how he needs to wow everyone in the room with his glamour & charisma ... ) & I feel you are best backing off slowly then ending anything with a bang.

This is why I say keep it boring - Grey Rock is your friend.
www.e-counseling.com/mental-health/what-is-the-grey-rock-method/

This man, however, is not your friend. He used to be, & that history means you have given him a lot of leeway to date. But look at the facts - he makes snarky remarks, keeps you dangling, expects instant comms responses but doesn;t reciprocate, & you feel drained & down after every time you see him.

It's far too much headspace, & far too much angst. Like your ex advised - more focus on you & your good pals. Less on him - also, less of this notion that he has some sort of social power over you. I'm betting that when you start responding to him less, & minimising any talk about him with others, that they are likely to follow suit.

@ChargingBuck
This is great advice.

No drama = nothing that he can have an issue with and hold against you.

Thanks to you all. I really appreciate the advice & I just read the Grey Rock link which is illuminating to say the least …

The thing is I know this guy very very well and if I try to fade him out without explanation, he’ll go to my friends and say things like ‘I’m worried about Perriwinkles. She doesn’t seem like herself these days. Is everything ok with her?’ I know him well enough & long enough to know that that is what he will do. I’d much rather be a little more upfront.

I’m not sure how my saying something along the lines of ‘it’s too upsetting and triggering to see you’ gives him ammo. How can he use that against me exactly? That’s a genuine question …

It depends if you can then resist the need to get into a conversation with him about it because he deserves a further explanation or if you can say that then shut the door so to speak and ignore him shouting through the letterbox. At the moment he’s knocking and you’re tempted to open it and start what will become a hurtful argument.

If you say it's upsetting and triggering for you to see him/the baby then you could be construed as creating drama and making it all about you at a time when all focus should be on new baby. Look - he hasn't liked you having feelings til now, has he. Do you honestly think he will welcome the introduction of your feelings (and him having to consider you as an actual human with same) at this stage?

With as much kindness as possible, he sounds like a using, selfish arsehole and you sound desperate to keep him in your life somehow. Please do yourself a long-term favour and reduce contact or stop it altogether.

@Immunetypegoblin

Ok … I didn’t think of it that way and I did think I should’ve brought all of this up before the baby was born … I’m going to do nothing. ‘When in doubt, do nowt.’

@Karwomannghia

Yes … no telling how he’d respond. Hard to predict. It’s unlikely it’d turn into an argument but you never know. Best to do nothing for now.

@Perriwinkles

Thanks to you all. I really appreciate the advice & I just read the Grey Rock link which is illuminating to say the least …

The thing is I know this guy very very well and if I try to fade him out without explanation, he’ll go to my friends and say things like ‘I’m worried about Perriwinkles. She doesn’t seem like herself these days. Is everything ok with her?’ I know him well enough & long enough to know that that is what he will do. I’d much rather be a little more upfront.

I’m not sure how my saying something along the lines of ‘it’s too upsetting and triggering to see you’ gives him ammo. How can he use that against me exactly? That’s a genuine question …

How about you just let him?

He can say whatever he likes to friends.
If they decide to relay that to you, bat it back with Grey Rock.
So if he hear about his "I'm worried" schtick, all you need say is something like "there's nothing for him to worry about, are you having tea or coffeee?"

If mutual friends do probe, & you feel they are good enough pals to hear a low key version of the truth, given them something like "well it's not the same since Friendwife dropped me, so I'm not actively seeking Friend's company these days, but it's fine if I see him around in our group."

No drama, no fuss ... & no handing him your narrative to do what he wants with. I really think the better friends of yours in the wider group will understand, & if they are good folk, they won't probe or persist beyond making sure you are ok.

You are allowed to other other people as much or as little of your attention as you wish, OP. You don't need this man's permission to back off, & you certainly don't owe him an explanation.
He's mean to you, but wants to keep you dangling at arms' length for his own amusement (& possibly to antagonise his wife about, who knows). Cut off his supply, gently, & start living your own life without this drain in it demanding you as his audience.

How can he use that against me exactly?

"God, I only asked perriwinkles if she'd like to meet the baby - if I'm honest I felt a bit sorry for her cos she seems a bit sad these days - and she sent me this whole shitty text about how she can't cope with seeing me at all, she says I just upset her and make her feel bad, which is honestly so crazy and really unfair because I've only ever been a good friend to her. When she fell out with my wife and was such a bitch to her, I tried to stand by her because I'm the kind of guy who gives people a chance, you know? I haven't even told you half the crazy shit she came out with at the time. But I thought maybe in time she'd chill out and stop being so weird and angry about everything. But after this latest outburst I'm wondering if that was just me being too generous and kind hearted. Maybe my wife was right all along and she's just been trying to make trouble for us and get involved in our relationship. I didn't want to think badly of her because I'm not that kind of person, but now I think it really does sound like she's jealous and actually I think she might be in love with me. She obviously hates my wife, she blames everything on her, and it sounds like she wants to split us up. I've been a really good friend to her and I've never led her on in any way, but she obviously has strong feelings about me and I guess maybe she's felt that way for a long time, guessing from how totally over the top emotional her message was. Really she just sounded unhinged. I think she might be having some kind of mental breakdown, or maybe my wife is right and she's just a crazy bitch. Should I cut her out of my life, or give her a chance to apologise and make things up to us?"

Some version of that, either said directly to you, to his wife, to your mutual friends...

I had a similar friendship with an older man whom I met through our mutual interest in antiques. It was entirely platonic and I learned a lot from him. He took me home to meet his wife and family several times with no issues. Later I went in for an operation and my friend briefly visited me. After I got out his wife phoned and in an angry conversation told me that she strongly objected to him coming to visit me. She would not believe it was simply a friendship.

After that I did continue to see my friend on a sporadic basis but it came to an end when I moved to another city.

I think for wives to behave like this it indicates some fault in their own marital relationship with the man. Your best plan is probably to distance yourself. If his wife finds out you have seen him she will accuse you both of sneaking around. She sounds a very insecure person who needs professional help.

Ok thank you for your responses. I completely get it now and I really see what you mean. Sending a message like that really would be eating into his bands.

She sounds a very insecure person who needs professional help
This is very very interesting … I won’t go inti more detail but you’re not entirely wrong. That said, plenty PPs have Said I need professional help so I’m not looking down on her!

I feel a lot better now as I really get why I shouldn’t send that kind of text & why Grey Rock is best. Thank you

*hands

This is so frustrating, every time you seem to turn a corner or agree with good, sound advice, you end up suggesting something that shows you're not taking it in.

OP, I mean this with kindness, but pages and pages in you're still not seeing it. Texting ANYTHING is a total mistake. The texts you've put on here that you plan to send are an absolute car crash if you're genuinely trying to end this friendship. I don't think you are, I think you're clinging to the detriment of your own self worth, I think your heart did a flutter when you saw he'd texted, and it's becoming painful to watch. Please just ignore him, or grey rock him like you've read about. Closed sentences that he doesn't need to answer, without any emotive language or - crucially - any feelings or explanations. He will read any kind of "I just have to explain..." or "I feel I need to..." texts as more and more drama, more evidence that you're totally in his enthral, and he's clearly lapping it up. Please put yourself first and don't wasting another second basking in the reflected light you think this man gives off. He doesn't. You are his confidence boost, please put your energy into boosting your own instead.

Thanks @ZeldaPrincessOfHyrule

I do plan to grey rock him and I haven’t replied to his text yet, which is very unlike me.

I’ve only read all the OP’s posts and it reads to me like you’re in thrall to this guy, and by association his wife.
It was very conflicted friendship with you, him and his wife involved, and the conflict is still rumbling on 2 years after the fall out, it seems unhealthy.
These people are not good for you and you need to break free.
His priority is his wife and new baby and I get the impression he’s chucking you the scraps and you’re gratefully gobbling them up. You need to cut ties with them. Completely.
I know someone who is ‘charming’, he’s extremely good looking, rich, successful and everyone loves him. He makes people feel good, when he turns his attention to you, it’s like the sun shines on you. However it’s all fake, it’s false, it feels and looks artificial when you start to realise it, you get the ‘ick’, and then you see right through him. This has started for you now and for your own sake you need to kill this relationship off.

@Perriwinkles

Thanks *@ZeldaPrincessOfHyrule*

I do plan to grey rock him and I haven’t replied to his text yet, which is very unlike me.

Really good news, OP - you're strong but this is unfamiliar ground, so it's bound to feel unlike yourself at first. That's ok! Prepare for him to keep texting, and for the inevitable "what's wrong?" message, I'll add another £1000 to a PP's bet that he'll chase you if you don't heel the instant he whistles. Keep telling yourself you're diffusing the drama, because you are, and that's a good thing for everyone involved. Don't forget that tinkly laugh, should you need it

Thanks @Angryfrommanchester1

His priority is his wife and new baby and I get the impression he’s chucking you the scraps and you’re gratefully gobbling them up. You need to cut ties with them. Completely

So true … all of his suggestions to meet up are just me slotting in to his existing plans,

Thanks @ZeldaPrincessOfHyrule

Keep telling yourself you're diffusing the drama, because you are, and that's a good thing for everyone involved
I already feel bad for not replying to his text but this fade out has to start somewhere. I’m already dreading his next text.

Don't forget that tinkly laugh, should you need it smile
I look forward to trialling it! Xx