Help! Can things be repaired or am I destined to be in a loveless marriage??

[Eric7]

Hi all,

First time posting on one of these forums. Would really welcome some help. Been with my wife for over 20 years (Married for 11). She was my best friend. Things got tougher initially when we had 2 kids. However they are 5 and 7 now and we operate well as a family. Issue is my wife 12 months ago asked me to sleep in the spare room. Prior to that we argued from time to time about various things (work life balance, where we live, libidos (mine higher)). She says all the arguments caused her anxiety.

Since I moved into the spare room there has been no intimacy. My wife is also more detached from me. We still speak and sort of get on. We give each other a kiss in the morning and before bed time, but it is not the same. We have been going to counselling for the past 6 months. She provided a list of things she wanted me to change about things I do, which I think I have made great efforts to address (she agrees to). However there is little change in her stance. She says is affected by what happened previously and also she has lost the emotional connection to me / us and wants to try and find it again. But she doesn’t make much effort in trying to re establish it. It is always me offering her a hug, holding her hand, trying to make conversation. She spends most of her time looking at her phone when we are together.
The last 12 months have been awful. I work in a pretty stressful albeit well paid job and am the sole breadwinner in the house. Our kids are great and I could see us being a happy family and giving them a good life.
The issue however is my wife’s stance with me has taken a massive toll. I feel anxious now when I am around her. I feel constantly low and almost on the brink of tears sometimes. I have to maintain a façade when anyone asks about us, how we are.
With the lack of change I think I have a decision to make. I no longer have hope that we can work things out. I have done all I can to be a better person, but she has just remained withdrawn.
I can leave, but then I will have to move away back to my home town (200 miles away). All the close friends here are our neighbours, so I will lose them if I move out. I still have friends back in my home town, and whilst I doubt they are going to be as good as a rock as say family would be (PS Both my parents passed away so no longer have that support network), they will help. But I suspect I will have to deal with the pain on my own. And the pain of not seeing my kids grow up is horrible.
The other option is to stay, but accept that this is my life for the next 20 years in that I live in a pretty much loveless marriage. I at least get to be a dad to my children, but I fear I will change and become a more bitter person the longer this goes on.
Any thoughts advice appreciated. I would also like to know if anyone has stuck at such a situation and whether they are glad they did. Am in wrong and can things actually be repaired with my wife??? Or whether it was a mistake with hindsight?

Just to be clear I still care massively about my wife, and I think I still love her. I am still very attracted to her and just wish she would be the person I married (or as close to), as I really believe we could be a great family. But maybe my wishes are a bit delusional???

I am in my early forties, so perhaps there is a slim chance I could rebuild my life now. But I am scarred that I could be in the same position after a few more years.
I just want to be with someone who makes me happy, and who I can make happy as well. I don’t think that is unreasonable!!!
Thanks

I would suggest that you have a serious talk with her and ask her how she feels the counselling is going. I would then tell her what you have said here and say that you don't see much hope for this . Why would you have to move back 200 miles away if you separate ? Surely you will want to be near your children ? You shouldn't have to live like this so you are going to have to put your big boy pants on .

Hi MrsMaizel. You are right on the big boy pants!

She knows potentially what may happen already. And things havent changed. I get your point on the kids and living close to them. But I have zero support network where I live. And I dont think I could get through this living here. I am guessing irrespective of where I live, it will end up me seeing the kids every couple of weeks. And I can am okay with driving 400 miles every 2 weekends if I get to spend time with them.

Oh come on, moving away from your kids is ridiculous! Create a life where you are. Your kids are still very young so it is a priority to be close to them surely? Haven't you got friends and colleagues?

"She says is affected by what happened previously.."

Can you expand on this? What exactly do you understand by this?

Maybe an open marriage? Live together as friends and find another relationship outside the marriage? You never know, she might be pleased at this idea?

On the friends side, they are the dad neighbours. Yes have work colleagues, but they live all over London / south coast. And they have their own lives to lead outside work.

I have thought about staying down here. But I just struggle to see how I can go it alone. The least worst option is the move back up north and work hard to see the kids as much as possible.

Open marriage is not really an option (albeit I didnt think of it)

What happened previously is we argued a fair bit. And I have to admit that when the kids were born, I could have been better and more supportive. I was consumed by my job and thought (foolishly with hindsight) that me focussing on giving us financial stability was my role, when I should have been more supportive in the early years with the kids.

What happened previously?

I think you need to explain to your wife that you are not happy to continue in an empty marriage and that as she is also clearly unhappy that a sensible conversation will have to be had.

Can she return to work?
You will both have to look at your finances and paying for childcare.

It sounds as if the marriage is over for her.

Did she do the bulk of childcare when the children were young?

Were you unavailable to her because of work, hobbies etc?

These things kill marriages foŕ women.

Be honest with your answers for yourself to get the best advice.

She will have a lot of built up anger and resentment for you not being therefore her at the most difficult point on her life. She is hurting. Her trust in you will be broken.

I think she really needs to decide whether it's something she will ever be able to forgive or not. She needs to tell you this one way or the other because you are both just wasting your time carrying on like this. It also makes the chance of one of you getting your head turned by someone else and running off with them much higher. That would be the worst way to end things, better to deal with it now.

Do you spend regular child free time together? Do you take on more of the childcare and house work and the mental planning of day to day life for her to have the energy to give to your relationship?

I appreciate it is hard to keep putting yourself out there and not getting much back. Unfortunately, recovering from emotional pain can be a long and difficult process. Sometimes you really need to hit rock bottom and be about to leave for it to go one way or the other.

Sounds like you've done the same as many dads, unfortunately. My ex was similar - didn't know what else to do apart from being the breadwinner, but morphed into a workaholic who was hardly even with us at the weekend, if he came back then.

I live abroad so had no network of family or very long-term friends when my marriage broke down. It's been better than I thought. I got counselling etc. and put more effort into being sociable, so actually have more friends and things to do than when I was with my exh. After a suitable break I did some dating and have had a good time and been very busy. Don't imagine your life as sad and lonely if you stay nearby: you have agency and can be as sociable as you fancy.

When my mother and father separated, my mum took me about 3h away, so I could only see my dad when someone took me there, which was very difficult for me. You don't have to put your children in that situation. Why would you only have them every couple of weekends?

Id say she is using you for money. She clearly is unhappy but its easier for her.
Does she work?
I think you'd both be happier apart.
Has the counselling brought up anything else?
Do you love each other?
We all make mistakes in our relationships and it sounds like you've tried to address them but without success.
I'm a bit older than you and decided life was too short to be in an unhappy relationship.
My ex has met someone else, and I generally think it's easier for men to meet someone else.
Oh and moving 200 miles away from your children??? Seriously, get a grip. You stay local and see them as much as possible rather than forget about them.

I'd be looking to move out but to somewhere close to your children.
A trial separation. See how things go and see if it's what you both want.
Moving 200miles away is extreme.
You can carry on with your life as it is with your friends, work and dc - just living in a different house?

Thanks for all the responses. In an attempt to try and answer in a single thread.

She hasnt worked for a while. She is mega clever but the job she was in was really stressful. So she doesnt want to go back to that. She has recently started doing the odd part time hour or 2 at a local school. It is not permanent. She says she does not want a stressful job anymore is unsure what she would like to do. Think she wants to pursue something she is interested in. Financially it is down to me. And I do feel a little resentment that I have to have to deal with all the financial stress.

I try and help out around the house a little where possible (so sporadic tidying, emptying dishwashers, hanging washing etc). But she does most of the cleaning for sure, together with all the child admin.

The only time I get to do hobbies is at the weekend (so a couple of trips to the gym and maybe a trip to the golf driving range first thing). She manages to go to the gym / for a run each day.

Financially I cannot afford to buy a house where we live. At best I'd be able to get a 1 bed flat. Moving back home I could get a 3 bed house, so the kids (if they came to visit) would have a garden and a bedroom each. Most of our savings / wealth is in the equity of the family home.

In my mind I am thinking I give it one last summer. And really make the best effort I can between now and September. But then have a definitive date by which if things are still the same, then I absolutely have to leave. And I try harder to take the home admin off her.

The daft thing is I kind of did this in December last year, with June in mind and....erm here we are...

Maybe a trial separation is an idea. But I am guessing most of these end up in proper separation???

Sorry. In terms of forgiveness she says she doesnt know if she ever will be able to?

@Eric7

You have already answered your own question.

You ARE detached. You don’t even sound like friends.....

At best, it sounds like you are co - parents in the same house, that rub along. It’s usually a thing. For whatever reason, one partner checks out but the other partner doesn’t see it till the shit hits the fan.

She’s checked out. She’s not checking back in, no matter what promises you make, how you try to intrinsically change your personality, no matter how much you beg, etc, etc.

You know your choices.

Stay and accept things and raise your children.

Leave and be a fantastic parent and amicable ex - partner.

Have an open marriage or an affair.

I hate cheaters and would urge honesty before you embark on a possible extra marital relationship. ( But’s it’s your choice ).

She finished the relationship / marriage the day she asked you to move into the spare room.

Been there, done that, got the tee shirt.

It sounds if you stay, your frustration will turn into bitterness.

It sounds as though your wife’s frustration with you has long turned into bitterness. Albeit very subtle.

Your choice.

Financially I cannot afford to buy a house where we live. At best I'd be able to get a 1 bed flat. Moving back home I could get a 3 bed house, so the kids (if they came to visit) would have a garden and a bedroom each. Most of our savings / wealth is in the equity of the family home.

Don't forget that you do not have to come up with a solution now that lasts for the next 50 years. You could, for instance, rent a small place for a few years and see what happens - if either of you finds a new partner/job, for instance. Or is the family home perhaps big enough that you could downsize and have some cash left over?

Has your wife been doing all the childcare alone, and thus been practically unable to work for some time? If she has been spending a lot of time in the house and not getting out much, it will have been a blow to her confidence that will make it harder for her to go back to work. Being out of the loop for years is something you should not under-estimate. Sure, she shouldn't be entirely reliant on you (it does her no good either), but remember that this is an arrangement you encouraged when you are feeling resentful about her not working.

(My dad had a bedroom and a garden for me when I visited. I would rather have had him around more.)

My wife has been doing all the childcare. And you are right that whilst I may feel some resent, the reality is I fully do not appreciate how tough it can be doing what she does.

Family home is a 4 bed house, so downsizing is an option. But no idea how the kids will take to that, as they really like the home. And I am worried that if we have to sell the home, they will blame me for forcing it upon them.

OP,
You haven't answered the question as to what is the root of her unhappiness with what occurred before.

Selling the house is the obvious thing to do and buy two smaller properties.

The children are young, you have a long way to go.

Obviously you wife will have to return to work and hopefully you would want to support that and help pay for childcare.

The drifting you are doing isn't helping either of you.

You need to sit down and lay the cards on the table.

When marriages break up change occurs.

The most important thing is to remain amicable and respectful of each other.

That will go a long way to help the children adjust to a new reality.

Mediation would be a good idea.

When I was 6 I liked the (retrospectively probably awful) maisonette we had in Basildon as it had a slitty window and was on two floors despite being a flat. Cool! I doubt your children have an expert opinion on your house.

The main issue is keeping things consistent for them, but as long as you and your wife deal with it like adults and e.g. make sure they don't lose all their friends and routine along with their parents breaking up, then a change of home should be manageable.

It's not just that childcare is hard work; it's that it is really hard to go back to work when you have not done it for years. You remember the stress and simply can't imagine going back to it - you can't imagine yourself being competent any more as all you have had in your head for years is nappies and phonetics. Plus you know that you are still going to be coming home to the lion's share of the family work and mental load. I went back to work after just 4 years and for the first few weeks I could hardly keep my eyes open as it was so physically and mentally exhausting.

billy1966

Sorry. It was not providing enough support after the kids were born. And then ongoing arguments we have had regarding the same things of where we live (I historically pushed for a move back up north where we both lived originally as better schools, more affordable housing etc - she didnt want to move back. this was before the children started school, so far too late now. And I have told her I would be happy living down here if we were in a good place).

Also arguments around work life balance, parenting styles. Different libido's also caused a strain (she less, me more).

To be fair she is constantly exhausted. I used to give her some time at the weekends to herself and catch up on sleep, but it didnt really help much. And she didnt like being away from the family unit.

It sounds as though you've made your mind up about moving a rediculous amount of miles away, your children are still very young, and you say you have not been fully present in their lives whilst living with them, leaving your wife to do the lions share of bringing them up.

This will be another kick in the teeth for them, moving away being unavailable.

Have you posted before it sounds familiar?

Anyways, lookiing from your wife's perspective, she 40 still young enough to meet someone who she will feel won't neglect her and hopefully her new partner may be more hands on with family life so the children may not feel quite so abandonned.

She sounds like she's been fully available for your children and a responsible parent who won't neglect her responsibilities, you are a lucky man to have a woman like that bringing your children up, so much so that you feel confident in leaving her with the sole care and you can pop in their lives every 2 weeks, this won't happen of course weeks will be missed and you will lose your connection with them.

Never mind, hopefully she will choose better next time if she decides to have a relationship and your children may get a fantastic father fugure.

This is the reality.
Are your dad's neighbours (friends) really worth moving away from your children, is that really the excuse.?

My bf lives around the corner from his ex and they share their dd 50:50. He had to fight for that, but it is really nice to see him taking responsibility for her, and her getting both of her parents. If you do break up I'd encourage you to get as much time as you can with the kids: they will appreciate it too. And even their mum will come round to the idea that she gets some evenings off to go out, laze about or have her sexy young lovers round. Ideally, you'd be selling that to her as an advantage she will enjoy.

@Eric7

My wife has been doing all the childcare. And you are right that whilst I may feel some resent, the reality is I fully do not appreciate how tough it can be doing what she does.

Family home is a 4 bed house, so downsizing is an option. But no idea how the kids will take to that, as they really like the home. And I am worried that if we have to sell the home, they will blame me for forcing it upon them.

When it gets to that point, I'd tell them the house needs to be sold so you can both have a place for them. They need their father nearby and a regular part of their life a lot more then they need a a bigger backyard and bigger house.

@Onthedunes I understood OP to be saying that the only friends he has nearby down south are other dads living in the neighbourhood. Hence him wanting to move away.

This post is all too familiar. I am in a very similar position to your wife. I feel for you both actually. There's no easy answer.