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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

DH taking pics without asking

328 replies

sierrahotelindigotango · 04/05/2021 21:14

Long term lurker, first ever post. Been happily married for nearly ten years, together over 15 years. I've noticed recently that DH will sneakily take photos and or videos while we're having sex without asking or telling me. Is this normal / okay? No other issues in our relationship really. He's very respectful and loving generally. We have four kids and full on jobs running our own business so sex isn't as often as we'd both like... I don't know if I'm just being a prude or not.

OP posts:
JamieFrasersAuntie · 05/05/2021 12:08

Thinking back, there have been times where he's pushed boundaries sexually - but he's always so loving about it that I feel like I'm denying him something that will make him happy. Looking back I realise this sounds pathetic

Oh he's one of those then. A man who thinks if he's affectionate to you while he's abusing you it isn't abuse. It IS abuse. Some degree of manipulation must be happening for you to feel you'd be denying him something if you said No.

You've got a lot to think about before you confront him.

Does he sulk op, or get emotionally upset? The description of him as a sensitive gentle chap troubles me because he is clearly anything but sensitive. In my experience "sensitive" folk are only sensitive about their own feelings and wants and frequently trample on other people.

Do you avoid upsetting him because of his sensitivity? Does he play the victim if you confront him about things?

MrsCBY · 05/05/2021 12:13

Thinking back, there have been times where he's pushed boundaries sexually - but he's always so loving about it that I feel like I'm denying him something that will make him happy. Looking back I realise this sounds pathetic.

Just joining all the others in picking this up.

It doesn’t make you sound pathetic at all, sierra. It makes him sound like a manipulative abuser who’s fully aware of what he’s doing. And it makes me think that confronting him as your first step would not be a good idea at all.

IceLace’s advice is very good, good that you seem to agree.

I’m so sorry. What a dreadful betrayal and what a horrific shock to discover the he’s not the man you thought he was at all.

LomasLongstriderJnr · 05/05/2021 12:23

"On a non- legal (slightly more unhinged and less sensible) note, I would steal his phone and laptop, hack his passwords and reset them, and go through everything for evidence."

^and as he's tech savvy, you'd have to make sure you hid, (or changed the wifi password for) all devices in the house/did it when you know he has no way to access internet or e-mail. While he was asleep maybe? If he can't find his phone, and tries to check his e-mail on one of the kids phones, your phone, or the xbox, he could reset the password and lock you out again, or twig he's been hacked.

Xbox, ps4, Ipads, kindle fires, anything like that can access the Internet, and store files too. You'd need to work out the passcodes, to check these aswell.
It wouldn't be getting into the accounts that should be difficult, as much as him not catching you out on it, before you'd had a proper look.

Do you need any help with your own online security, in case he realises something is up, and he tries to hack you?

trunumber · 05/05/2021 12:26

The thing that stood out to me if that you felt you needed to check if you were overreacting before you said anything.

That shouldn't be an issue in a loving relationship. If I'm hurt, I'm hurt - it can't be an overreaction, it's my emotional response. You should feel safe enough to share that without having to check yourself first.

disconnected101 · 05/05/2021 12:42

[quote IceLace100]Firstly my sympathies OP. What a horrible situation. Remember this is not your fault.

There has been some back and forth about legalities here, so just wanted to give people the relevant legislation and case law on this, just in case it helps OP and/ or another reader:

Section 33 of the Criminal Justice and Courts Act 2015. Offence is disclosure of private sexual photos or films without the consent of the individual who appears in them with intent to cause distress. This would only apply if he has disclosed the images (ie sent or uploaded them), which we don't know.

Regarding non consensual filming without sharing the image (which we know for sure has happened) there is a case involving a woman called Emily Hunt. She was filmed when she was unconscious in bed. She (eventually) won her case and her rapist was charged with a voyeurism offence.

Article: www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-54027088

If anyone knows anything else about this, please chip in as I am not an expert.

The point is, legally, "D"h is likely to have committed an offence.

If I were you OP I would, in secret:
A. Seek help from the charities linked below and take their advice

B. Speak to a firm of solicitors who deal with both civil and criminal law; and

C. Call the police.

There is a charity dealing with this: revengepornhelpline.org.uk/

You could also contact women's aid: www.womensaid.org.uk/about-us/contact/[/quote]
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tees-56846307
Shock
'He did not, however, declare his conviction on any election forms or tell anyone who nominated him as a candidate about the offence.

"I decided not to mention it to them to make it simpler or easier for me," he said.'

Deathgrip · 05/05/2021 13:05

Thinking back, there have been times where he's pushed boundaries sexually - but he's always so loving about it that I feel like I'm denying him something that will make him happy. Looking back I realise this sounds pathetic.

It doesn’t sound pathetic. You love and trust him and believe he cares about you so you give him the benefit of the doubt - the person who exploits that trust is the pathetic one. You have done nothing wrong.

I have been exactly in this situation and it’s like being the frog in the boiling pot. It’s so gradual that you don’t realise - hell, I even managed to convince myself that these were my preferences too, since it was easier to believe that than to be believe the truth (that someone I loved was openly and obviously sexually abusing me on a daily basis while saying they loved me). Eventually things escalated to a terrifying point and I left after getting badly injured. I still felt responsible as I hadn’t told him to stop.

It’s only recently, now that I’m in a much better place, that I realise how much it traumatised me and that it’s actually made me frightened of sex. Even in a loving relationship, I’ve found that I don’t say stop if I want things to stop because I’m scared of being on the receiving end of anger and emotional abuse. I literally realised recently that I’m afraid every time I have sex because of what he did, even when I know I’m safe.

Sadly I expect the more you analyse the trajectory of your sex life, the more concerns you will find - it’s really a shock to find you’ve been abused all that time and didn’t see it.

Please be kind to yourself. You are not pathetic. He’s taken advantage of your love and trust. A good person does not treat someone they love this way.

And please, starting right now, rethink this belief. You are allowed to “deny him” sex acts that make you uncomfortable and that is not a hardship for him. That’s a relationship where both people have boundaries. If you wanted to do something very extreme sexually that he would find humiliating, degrading or painful, would you expect him to go along with it to make you happy? Could you enjoy yourself and have an orgasm knowing that he disliked what you were doing? I bet you could not, but he can get off knowing that he has pushed at your boundaries - that is not respect or love. It is abuse.

Coupled with knowing full well that you would not consent to these images, hence doing it behind your back, you are starting to realise that he is not demonstrating respect and love for you. And that’s heartbreaking when you thought you had a great relationship.

You need to make sure that you physically have hold of his devices and insist on full access, to anything you haven’t been able to check, before you bring this up. You need to be clear that he must tell you the full story because otherwise you’ll be going to the police so they can investigate, and if you ever discover anything he hasn’t told you, you’ll be saving the evidence so you can go to the police then. Insist that he tells you every single place they are posted online so you can try to get them removed, as if you ever find any he hasn’t told you about you’ll go to the police.

You may decide to go to the police anyway, but the threat of doing so at the slightest hint of a lie might be enough to get the full story.

Make sure you get evidence (screenshots, photos of your phone) before anything is deleted. Make sure that anything deleted is also deleted from the cloud - sadly very possible that he has back ups somewhere but again, threaten the police if anything that comes out later. Tell him you’ll report him to his employer, tell his family, whatever you need to say. Make him feel some of the shame and humiliation you’re feeling right now.

You don’t need to decide what you’re going to do about it now. You do need to address it as soon as possible though, to prevent this happening any further / any more sharing. Obviously do not have sex with him, or be naked around him. Make sure there are no cameras in your bathroom or bedroom (i would be getting changed in a different room for now to be honest - you’d be amazed at the tiny places hidden cameras can be).

Have you tried doing a reverse image search yet if you have any of the photos? I know that could be distressing but it might give you some info.

Please talk to a friend you trust. If you were my friend I would want to support you through this.

You’re welcome to send me a message if I can help at all. I’m so sorry this is happening.

Eddielzzard · 05/05/2021 13:06

So sorry you're having to deal with this sierrahotelindigotango. I personally would try and work out his pin by watching him when he unlocks his phone. I wouldn't trust him to be honest with you at this stage. All bets are off.

How does he react when you reinforce your boundaries? Is he still loving and respectful?

Moonwhite · 05/05/2021 13:17

"He takes pictures of us having sex when my back is turned. He's very respectful..." The social conditioning.

There are plenty of sites online where he could be uploading those pictures.

You need to speak to him. You need to tell him you know what he's doing, and you want to know what he's doing with those pics. And only do what you are comfortable with sexually, if you can even trust him in that way again.

SteveArnottsCodeine · 05/05/2021 13:17

This is not just awful (and illegal) and disrespectful, it’s weird as fuck!! How are you not asking him what the hell he’s doing when he sneaks out his phone?!

sierrahotelindigotango · 05/05/2021 13:45

@Deathgrip thank you for your very kind message. I'm so sorry you've experienced that kind of abuse. I won't be sleeping in our bedroom tonight - I'm going to say I'm feeling unwell and then I've made plans for the kids and I to stay with my brother and his family this weekend while I work out how to tackle him without the kids around. I might talk to my SiL while I'm there. I'm sorry to sound vague and uncertain. There's a lot to think about.

OP posts:
IsThePopeCatholic · 05/05/2021 13:53

Very sorry for you, op. This is monstrous behaviour.

CokeDrinker · 05/05/2021 14:05

[quote sierrahotelindigotango]@Deathgrip thank you for your very kind message. I'm so sorry you've experienced that kind of abuse. I won't be sleeping in our bedroom tonight - I'm going to say I'm feeling unwell and then I've made plans for the kids and I to stay with my brother and his family this weekend while I work out how to tackle him without the kids around. I might talk to my SiL while I'm there. I'm sorry to sound vague and uncertain. There's a lot to think about. [/quote]
OP, bad move! You need to act as if nothing is wrong. If you sleep in another room or couch, and then take the kids to stay with your family this weekend, he will KNOW something's. And, if he is posting the pics, he will suspect you found out, and remove them from the sites while you are away.

You can't let him smell blood in the water, you HAVE to act like everything is completely normal. Otherwise, you may as well just go ahead and tell him, since your sudden change in behaviour will have him suss.

CokeDrinker · 05/05/2021 14:06

OP, if you don't think you can hold it together and 'act normally' around him, I think it's really best that you confront him asap. The sooner the better.

TatianaBis · 05/05/2021 14:18

Have you looked on his devices to see what porn sites he’s been on?

I understand you’d be loathe to contact police in these circumstances but there’s no other way of recovering the photos and tracking where he’s posted them.

Namechangedforthistoday · 05/05/2021 14:20

Op, no matter how nice sil appears at the end of the day she will always have her brother’s back when it comes down to it. Don’t put yourself in a vulnerable position by discussing it with her

52andblue · 05/05/2021 14:21

@Mycatisthebest

It's wrong and he knows it. That's why he is not telling you and being sneaky about it. Angry
Agreed. If he thought you'd be okay about it (either to keep the pics for private mutual use or to upload / share publicly) then he'd not be doing it sneakily. It's illegal to do this without your consent. Do you want to inform the Police? Unless you want to try to 'save' your relationship (I wouldn't) then you have nothing 'to lose' by doing so. What if he has uploaded them and your children see them? that would be my fear in your situation (sorry, don't mean to worry you)
saraclara · 05/05/2021 14:21

@Namechangedforthistoday

Op, no matter how nice sil appears at the end of the day she will always have her brother’s back when it comes down to it. Don’t put yourself in a vulnerable position by discussing it with her
?

SIL is OP's brother's wife. Not her husband's sister.

SirVixofVixHall · 05/05/2021 14:22

I really would not confront him yet, If you do I think you will never know the extent of it.
I would sweep your bedroom and possible bathroom for hidden cameras. They can be absolutely tiny, hidden in something like a charger, a light, a plug socket, picture frame. There are films on youtube on how to find them. Think about looking at the film at someone else’s house though, as he may be able to see your browsing history if he thinks you could be on to him. Ask your Sil to use her phone if you can.

EverythingRuined · 05/05/2021 14:25

@sierrahotelindigotango

I heard him reach for something and I looked between my legs and saw the phone and a few weeks ago I saw a load of pictures of me on his camera roll that I didn't know he'd taken. I know I sound ridiculous.
OP, you say you don’t have access to his phone so how did you see the photos? Also you mention that it was a few weeks ago that you saw the photos. Does he know you saw them?
Deathgrip · 05/05/2021 14:25

I agree that you acting unusually is likely to tip him off something is wrong - is it unusual for you to go and stay with your brother without him? Do you normally sleep separately if you’re unwell?

Could you feign a plausible reason for needing to go to your brothers - them needing help with something, etc?

I would want to get out of there too, but do your best not to alert him if you’re not ready to confront him.

Would it be unusual for your kids to stay elsewhere without you? That might be a good idea if your brother and SIL could handle it? Maybe you could say your brother has offered to have the kids overnight so you can spend some time together - that way he’ll think you’re trying to get some alone time with him for a good reason?

I wonder if anyone technically minded knows if there’s anything you can install on devices to record the screen so that if he does rush to delete things you’ll have evidence? Or if he accesses any sharing sites you’ll know? I don’t usually agree with online monitoring like that but this would be an exception.

SunnySpills · 05/05/2021 14:30

Could you get his phone and take it to your oil's [turned off]
until you confront him? You could then ask him for the phone pin
and passwords to any relevant sites or files he has. Then check these
things on his phone when you pick the DC up.

SunnySpills · 05/05/2021 14:30

*SIL's not oil's

elfies · 05/05/2021 14:41

Please forgive me ,I don't mean to worry you , but are you the only one he's filming ? How old are your children ?
It sounds far fetched , but it sounds as if the man you think you know is a totally different person to the man he is .
I would be unsettled and worrying a wee bit !

sierrahotelindigotango · 05/05/2021 14:43

@EverythingRuined I looked over his shoulder one night when he was scrolling through photos and saw the ones of me I didn't know he had. He doesn't know I saw them. I felt too shocked / confused to say anything at the time.

OP posts:
sierrahotelindigotango · 05/05/2021 14:46

@elfies my children are all under 9. As far as I know he's only done this when we have been having sex in certain positions. I honestly don't believe he would ever do anything like this to our children. He's an amazing dad.

OP posts:
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