should i stay or go 20 year marriage

[MadgeMidgerson]

i have been married to my husband for 20 years. we have not been intimate for the last ten. he is not interested, and after he stoping taking care of his hygiene neither was i.

we have moved to my country a year ago. he has struggled to find work and i am the breadwinner. he earns a decent salary now but will only contribute money for groceries. this means 3/4 of his monthly salary goes on ??????

he does minimal stuff around the house, and only when asked.

pros: he is not a terrible person, does not abuse me and the children love him and would be devastated. they are 11 and 13.

he knows i am unhappy and i have talked about my feelings but he says everything is fine and we are great together. this makes me feel like i am crazy.

if i had no children i would go, in a heartbeat but i keep thinking it is a small sacrifice for me to stay and let them continue to have him in their lives.

besides if i kicked him out i am sure if only end up financing his life, and doing everything here at home, only completely alone.

every day i think i can’t bear this any longer and then i think so many others have it worse, and i should just get on with it.

thank you for reading, any advice is helpful and very much appreciated.

@MadgeMidgerson I wonder if you need a better therapist tbh.
You are so unhappy with your husband that you wish you didn't exist and wouldn't harm yourself only because your children need you.
Menopause has fuck all to do with this.
You can't stand your husband's behaviour. That's a perfectly reasonable response to what you've described.
I read what you said about driving through a wall to rescue your daughter if she lived like this. I think that's key.
You know full well this is miserable and deeply unfair. You wouldn't accept it for your daughter, yet you're trying to convince yourself that you should put up with it.
Probably, the best thing you can do to make sure your daughter never ends up like this is to show her how a woman doesn't have to accept a crappy, third rate marriage and can bloody well do something about it. If you are so hard on yourself that you can't put yourself first, maybe do it for her.
Honestly, I wish I could give you a hug. You sound so defeated. You don't have to be though.

Someone who does not take care of personal hygiene is not someone to remain with, unless perhaps it is the consequence of an illness and is short-term.

You’re finding excuses so that you don’t have to face the reality of doing what you need to do and end this marriage. Find your courage. It’s the hardest path to take but it’s the only path forward.

I’m in a very similar situation - length of marriage, number of kids tho he is the main earner. On paper my marriage is probably even “better” but I am planning on ending it in 27 days.
Life is very short. At 45 you are not too old to find someone else in time. I know that this is not the person I want to spend my days with. That’s enough.

Morning madgemidgerson,
I relate to many of the things you say in your post so you are not alone in being in this situation.

What I would like to say is this post is not about me, it is about you.

The therapist should help you explore why you feel how you feel, what the core issues are (you may not even know yet) they will help you consider your own values (for example what makes you think staying with him is ok)

I wonder whether this is what the psychotherapist meant about exploring staying and your thoughts etc

Psychotherapy is a journey and it sounds as if you have only just started. Perhaps sit with the process , rather than asking for advice on a public forum, although I understand that you wanting to move on (literally and/or emotionally!)

Good luck, you have started the change by going to therapy. As you change in therapy your view/ experience of the issue will change too

I think we all need more then simply 'not being abused'

I can relate a little to your situation and am seeing a therapist too, for over a year now
The focus on finding things to make you happy in situ, is not really about suggesting you should stay. It is about finding small chinks of joy in your life, through maybe a walk or coffee with a friend, an exercise class etc..generally things that help spark your enjoyment of life again. With that you build your self confidence and get stronger.
It doesn't mean you shouldn't or won't leave, but by building your self worth up, you feel more able to do it, there is a method to their madness!

madge

re your comment:-

"I started seeing a psychotherapist last week to help me sort through this but she said if i want she can help me come to terms with things and learn to find joy elsewhere while staying".

You need to see a different pyschotherapist frankly if this is also what is being suggested. What are women's rights within the home like in the country you are now living?.

What do you get out of this relationship now?. You for your own self must still be getting something out of this so what is it.
There is no joy in this marriage and this freeloader H of yours now cannot even be bothered to keep himself tidy. He does not have to hit you to hurt you and you've already given 10 years at this; your marriage is the very definition of the sunken costs fallacy. That basically causes people to keep on making poor relationship decisions.

Menopause also has nothing to do with the state of your marriage at all; its been on its knees for years and you've stayed with him for what are really your own reasons. Staying for the children is never a good idea and in your case a particularly bad one; what are you also teaching them about relationships here?. That a happy marriage and or relationship is not their birthright?. Your children need to learn life affirming and better lessons on relationships, not learn further from this shit role model they could go onto repeat themselves. Children love parents anyway and I would also think they do not so much "adore" this man but fear him in equal measure to you. I would also think they are hypervigilent, subserviant and quiet when he is around them as are you. You are now 45 so not old and it is better to be on your own with your children rather than to remain so badly accompanied.

What did you learn about relationships when you were growing up?. What sort of example did your parents show you?.

OP, put yourself first. It's not selfish. If more people took charge of situations in which they were miserable we would all be much happier.

My mum taught me that you have no agency over your life as an adult. You just have to suffer. I find it incredibly difficult to get my own needs met but there's really no choice. If you live your life for others, you will never have the opportunity to feel satisfied. Part of being an adult is the ability to say, no, I'm not settling for this. I will improve my situation. I have control over my environment and my head space.

You shouldn't have to "cope" with your husband. You shouldn't be feeling like you don't want to be here when you look forward in time. You shouldn't not enjoy time with him.

Your children will be fine. They will probably think you are a different person when they see you happy and carefree. You are never too old to start again and especially in your 40s! You're still young!

Sending a virtual hug.

He doesn't want to talk about it. Can't you say 'We do something now to get help or it's over.' Force his hand and get some professional guidance for both of you.

Women are not rehab centres for badly raised men.

Its not the OPs job to get him help; he is an adult with agency and besides which he seems quite happy as he is with his wife doing all the donkey work here.

No but op doesn't seem happy to end it as is and has tried to talk to him. Him refusing to talk is just not on. So either he talks and they can maybe salvage something or they are done.

From OPs initial post:-

"he knows i am unhappy and i have talked about my feelings but he says everything is fine and we are great together. this makes me feel like i am crazy"

He knows and does not care. He is gaslighting the OP by saying everything is fine and we are great together. It would give anyone on the receiving end of that spaghetti head.

First..why isn't he paying his way properly?

Frankly I would want out of this marriage, he is a freeloader.

See a SHL and gets some advice

I'm just giving my tuppence worth attila, op might want to give it a go at counselling so she can make peace with closure. My H was the same, we're fine, are you still worrying your head about that etc so I told him we get outside help or I'm done. Changed his tune pretty sharpish and the professional help is proving positive. At the end of the day, I want to say I have it every chance and if it ends, we'll have learned to be better communicators, which can only be a positive as we are Co-parents for life.

OP has very recently started counselling. Your H thankfully changed his tune but OPs H seems to be nothing like yours at all. I do wonder what lessons on relationships were imparted to her when she was growing up.

To be fair this is what the majority of marriages around the world and throughout the ages turn into. People sharing a household, money, responsibilities, kids, etc. but no real passion or romance. While there are plenty of people especially on MN who are still swinging from the chandlers and in lust with each other it's just not real life

Of course it's not selfish to consider your own wants and needs. That doesn't mean you won't consider your children's too. They will still have a father, albeit the pattern of their lives will need to change.

From what you say, although you have put up with the situation for a long time, your eyes have now been fully opened. You can't put the genie back in the bottle, so you won't be able to go back to suffering it the way you were before.

As for being too old for a new relationship- that's crazy! You are still in your prime and have plenty of active years left in which you can live a much happier life.

Seriously @adventurealice you think this is what the majority of marriages turn into???!! No intimacy, he doesn’t pay his share of the household costs, he doesn’t take care of his hygiene, no sex??!! Bloody hell - that’s a low bar. I totally disagree with your view, and op should definitely expect much more from her husband than she’s getting. She’s asked him, told him, been thoroughly gaslighted, he won’t pay a fair share etc etc, she’s now seeing a therapist. Despite the fact that your children may love their dad, they also love you. They will not thank you when you leave your husband when ‘they’re old enough’ , by then you’ll be a weary, unhappy, miserable shell of a woman, and they’ll feel their childhood was based on a lie. If you wouldn’t accept marriage like this for your daughter, PLEASE don’t accept it for yourself. You are a woman of worth, value and importance. Please don’t sacrifice your life for this man and this empty relationship.

"To be fair this is what the majority of marriages around the world and throughout the ages turn into. People sharing a household, money, responsibilities, kids, etc. but no real passion or romance".

Really?.

You really think this adventurealice?. What is your above comment actually based on?. Your own experience mainly or what you've seen in your wider social circle?. Yes let's all sell our own selves that bloody short.

Unfortunately, many people are slow to change and stay on autopilot. It was one of those epiphanies for me, and I simply couldn't stay in same situation. Final decision yet to be made but even communicating that and doing something proactive has helped. Wishing you the best for you, OP.

You wouldn't be "destroying" your children's home, you would be altering it.

If they "adore" their father, there is no reason for that to stop because of divorce.

There would be nothing for them to "forgive" you for, let alone to "never" forgive you.

Couching everything in such extreme, all or nothing, hyperbolic terms won't help you work through the situation in your mind effectively. Those are your own fears and emotions talking.

If you separated, everyone in the family would experience a range of uncomfortable and sometimes tough emotions as you all adjusted to the change. And then you'd adapt and life would find a new rhythmn.

You would support your children and provide clear information. They would still have a relationship with their father and they would still have a relationship with you.

Nobody would be destroyed or devastated or never forgiven.

I wouldn't waste another day. Being in a boring, unhappy relationship with him.

And you're 45 not 105. You could very well meet someone new, if you wanted to. Of course it's not guaranteed but there's a much better chance of it than continuing as you are.

No need for you to finance him either. Don't start doing that or it'll never stop.

thank you again, you have all been so compassionate and i was afraid i was going to be yelled at for my stupidity and selfishness. i had a little cry reading the responses. i see me therapist tomorrow and i will talk over all of this with her then.i am just conscious of not having any perspective on things and looking on the dark side and seeing only the negatives; my husband says i am prone to this and he’s not wrong.

i’m also conscious of how choosing to do nothing at all is also a choice, and that the years of my life are running down.