Feeling a bit caught between DP and my DMum- new baby on the way

[LittleRa]

I’m 37 weeks pregnant with my second baby, however it is my DP’s first (my nearly 7yo DD is from a previous relationship).
Obviously we’re all very excited

Last night DP and I got talking about birth choices and preferences etc, and the conversation also led on to preferences for after the birth, with a newborn baby.

Now, my DMum can be a little bit.... overbearing. We have had some tense moments over the years, but nothing major, no big fall outs, more just frustrations. I think she is kind of a snob and sometimes says things without thinking, she also has ridiculously high standards that she holds me and my sister to. However, I know that this is because she wants the best for us. I think she sometimes forgets we’re grown ups now She also does absolutely loads for me and for DD- she picks my DD up from school two days a week and while she’s at my house she does laundry, cleans the bathroom etc. She’s bought loads of things for the new baby (probably unnecessarily so...) and has washed all the new baby clothes. She sends my DD little presents in the post (during lockdown). She’s very generous and kind.

However, I completely understand this feeling that she gives my DP, that he voiced last night, that she is judgemental or that things one does aren’t good enough for her. Obviously she makes me feel like that- she’s my Mum!! But I’m sad to hear she makes him feel like that too. I’ve told him she doesn’t mean it and it’s just her way, she probably goes home and kicks herself about things she’s said.

An example is that when she was at my house looking after DD, a slightly batty neighbour caught her in the street and said “You have to tell your son in law not to park his car there, as it makes it tricky for me to get my bins through on bin day”. When my DP got home from work, DM passed this “message” on from neighbour, saying things like “it’s important to get along with your neighbours” and suggesting alternative places to park along the street. This got his back up a bit as he didn’t want to be dictated to about where to park, by either the neighbour or DM. Later that night DM texted saying she was sorry she’d got involved, she shouldn’t have said anything etc.

Now, DP is very laid back, and is extremely supportive of me. He’s happy to support my choices in birth, parenting, with the baby etc. However, what was coming out of the conversation last night was that his preference would be to not have DM round on the first few days, maybe first week after the baby is born. I had assumed we would form an under 1s bubble (we already have a childcare bubble for DD but this allows her to look after DD, not to be in the house with me socialising). She’s my DM and I feel like after the birth she will be able to be such a big help- like I said, she does several loads of laundry each time she’s here, changes my DD’s bed sheets, does dishes, she’ll cook if we’re going to be late home from work. Also because she’s my Mum, I’ll feel she can support with more intimate care like if I’m getting breastfeeding established, if I’ve got stitches and am bleeding etc.

DP says he really does appreciate all the things she does for us, but as a first time parent to a newborn (DD was 3 when we met) he wants time to be able to establish confidence without feeling like he’s being judged for “doing it wrong” or that any unthinking comments will be made that make him feel inadequate or awkward. He feels that after the first little bit once we’re a bit more established in our roles as new parents to a newborn would be the time to introduce other people to the situation.

We’ve been doing NCT and some of the other couples have spoken about how Covid restrictions and lockdown have meant that they’ve decided to say no visitors at all (eg if they both have sets of divorced parents to choose from, easier to just say no one). I definitely feel that having the restrictions as an excuse to not have streams of visitors coming in and out (which I do remember having when DD was newborn) is a good thing! But I feel just DM is different. But I do understand what DP is saying and would like to be in our own little world for a while too!

I have said to him that if DM doesn’t come to help, then I will need him to step up with the household jobs that she does. Which he’s said he of course would.

Just some other info-
-DM was also her same overbearing self when DD was born but she was still working full time then whereas she has since retired so has a lot more time to dedicate to family. She lives about 45 mins away, so not on the doorstep.
-DP will have 2 weeks paternity leave, and then be back to work, so I suppose that will be the time I really need DM to come during the day and help.

I’m not sure whether I should say to DP- suck it up, I need my DM to help too and if she makes any comments just let them go over your head, she means well and I trust you and know you will be an amazing dad. Or say to DM- when we come out of hospital we want a few days/week where you don’t come round while we find our feet. I know she would be sad about that. Also, she will be looking after DD when we’re in hospital.
Am I overthinking, shall I play it by ear and see how it goes a bit more, or do I need to manage expectations beforehand. I was wondering about saying something to DM like DP is feeling nervous about becoming a new Dad and so to be mindful of being positive and supportive etc and that we’ll need time. I have actually joked to DP to give it a few days and he’ll be ringing her up begging her to come and help out

Glad you are going to talk to her. If she is a speak first, repent later sort, she may well take in on board just fine with reflection and that will be great for you all.
Have a lovely time!

you could maybe suggest that she contribute her routine of 2 visitors a week ago that DD gets some grandma time and she could see new baby and maybe bring you a main meal those 2 days. That is a compromise as you know when she will be there and that it will help, she could also do laundry and clean bathroom if she wishes, but it also gives clear boundaries of when she is expected.

But does she mean well? Really?

@LittleRa

In your OP you said
she’ll cook if we’re going to be late home from work

I thought that meant for you not your daughter.

I would appreciate the help

I honestly think you might need to sit down and have a proper conversation with your partner about how much your mum does because if my mum came and did half the shit your mum does it would drive us both crazy. Maybe your partner is more like you and and doesn't mind it, but if he does and it is starting to cause resentment that way you can create boundries he is happy with as well, especially if he has kept quiet because your mum is over to help with your daughter and he might not feel he has as much of a say as he would with his own child

Its not really help though because you have not directly asked for it. She has chosen to come into your house and do various chores within it off her own bat and to her exacting standards. She may also feel on some level you are both incapable of doing this to anywhere near her self imposed standards.

A healthy mother daughter relationship is one that demonstrates love, even in the face of conflict. It is one that establishes healthy boundaries and one in which neither party is self-seeking. This is NOT what you are describing here at all between your mother and you. She depends on you for entertainment, validation and companionship.
nmeshed mothers tend to become over-involved in their daughter’s lives. The enmeshed mother will want to become friends with her daughter’s friends. She will not want to allow her daughter time to explore her own identity.

This type of mother is basically living her life through her daughter. She wants to be so involved, because she wants to absorb aspects of her daughter’s identity. Daughters in such relationships may not mature as they should, because the relationship boundaries have been so blurry, and they have essentially been bound to their mothers’ sides.
You are indeed bound to your mother's side here.

@Nanny0gg

My view as a GM:

If she's looking after DD she can bring her home, have a quick cuddle and a cup of tea.

Just forwarn her that after that you just need a couple of weeks on your own to settle in as a family. If she wants to drop off a couple of casseroles however, that would be appreciated!

What @Nanny0gg said. Perfect.

My dm is very like you described. When my dd2 was born (I also have a dd from previous relationship) she helped by taking dd1 for a couple of nights when I was just home from hospital, and then out the park or mcds etc for a couple of hours a few times a week. It worked well because she was able to give practical help but at the same time gave my and dp time alone to get settled as parents (dp was also a first time parent when my dd2 was born and had the same concerns as your dp). Could something like that work for you? Obviously mum got to see new baby when picking dd1 up and leaving her home, but she wasn't constantly there like when dd1 was born - plus it did dd1 the world of good getting a bit spoilt by nana while she was adjusting to having a new baby sibling.

@wibblewombat

But does she mean well? Really?

I don’t know, I thought she did, but maybe she doesn’t, I suppose I’m starting to see now. This thread is making me feel sad really. I don’t know what her motivation would be to do housework and look after her granddaughter if not a positive one? She can be critical and overbearing but I thought lots of mothers were like that, I see lots of threads about it on here. And it’s not like she’s sniping and horrid every single time she’s here, it’s more passing throwaway comments that niggle. She’s so excited about the new baby and has helping with buying the pram and washing newborn baby clothes ready for the hospital bag etc, buying my daughter “I’m going to be a big sister” T-shirt. Like I said she’s originally American so doesn’t have her extended family here so maybe more of a focus on me and my sister. I don’t know. I feel all out of sorts about it now. Just to reiterate, I am going to speak to her about those first few week, and further time, after the baby is born. I love my DP so much and I don’t want anything negative to impact on our relationship at what should be a really happy time.

You rely on her too much and she obviously relishes being needed and it's through this that she doesn't have any boundaries where your family are concerned.
I do think she'll cause a wedge in your family. It's already starting.
It's not nice for your OH having her around all the time 'helping'. He's told you as much. I'm betting he'll also be sad and resentful that his family are second best by default to this woman who makes him feel like a spare part in his own family home.

It's all very well you correcting your mother once she has made a comment, however by that point the damage is already done to your DP's confidence. You need to be firm with her now and tell her that it is not OK to belittle someone in thier own home. Not seeing her at all in two weeks is a bit much but it does sound like she needs to take a step back a bit. Make sure DP knows that he will have to take over the housework that DM would otherwise have.

Does his DM ever get a look in at all?

Don't feel bad about not seeing it happen. The drip, drip of slowly entwining herself in your life can happen without you realising.

Also, with it being his first and your second, he's probably worried that you will know what your doing and your DM will also know and he won't get a look in to learn how to take care of his child himself and bond with them. Sounds like he very much feels like a third wheel in this.

"She can be critical and overbearing but I thought lots of mothers were like that"

They are not but she has led you to believe that. In my view your mother is both critical and overbearing.

Where is your dad here; is he still in your life now?.

Would you be willing to sit down with someone like a BACP registered therapist re your relationship with your mother?. You need to find someone who will fit in with your approach and is also someone who has no familial bias about keeping families together. Therefore the first person you see may not be the right one. Would also suggest you interview these people carefully and at length before going ahead too.

@AttilaTheMeerkat

"She can be critical and overbearing but I thought lots of mothers were like that"

They are not but she has led you to believe that. In my view your mother is both critical and overbearing.

Where is your dad here; is he still in your life now?.

Would you be willing to sit down with someone like a BACP registered therapist re your relationship with your mother?. You need to find someone who will fit in with your approach and is also someone who has no familial bias about keeping families together. Therefore the first person you see may not be the right one. Would also suggest you interview these people carefully and at length before going ahead too.

My mum and dad are together, and my dad often comes too to look after my DD but not every time. He is more laid back. He helps too- he cuts the grass in the garden in the spring/summer.

He won't get these two weeks back OP.

This isn't her turn.

Do you actually know what her expectations are?

You've spoken about her getting material things but not what she expects her day to day role to be in the first few weeks after birth. Has she said anything?

I think it's about boundaries - to say flat out 'You can't come over for 14 full days after baby is born' is extreme and anywhere outside of MN would be seen as offensive and ridiculous (unless you also didn't want your mum there, but that's clearly not the case). But to say 'You can come over for an hour on day 3 once we're recovered and settled in, then we'd prefer not more than 2 hours every 3 days after that until DH goes back to work as we want quiet time as a family' is quite reasonable.

Your DH's reasons are completely valid - he shouldn't be made to feel incapable or that he's doing things wrong - but there is a middle ground between banning a helpful MIL from the house and having her practically move in for 2 weeks straight after the birth.

Even if my DM was tricky and DH didn't much like having her around, I don't think banning her is a solution - it will cause so much upset and anger and there's a risk you could lose your childcare too. It's not just about your DH when someone does this much to help you.

he cuts the grass in the garden in the spring/summer

I'm not being funny, but what age are you two? Are you both very young?

I have a question. When was the last week she hasn't been to your house at all since you've been married?

@ElspethFlashman

he cuts the grass in the garden in the spring/summer

I'm not being funny, but what age are you two? Are you both very young?

I’m 35 and DP is 28.

@RantyAnty

I have a question. When was the last week she hasn't been to your house at all since you've been married?

We aren’t married. During school lockdown periods she has not been at all, as my DD has been off school and me working from home so I haven’t needed the childcare- so from March to the summer holidays and then from January to now. She came as normal Sept-Dec as DD was at school so she collected her etc. In this school closure period Jan-now she has been twice, not on her regular day, but because I had midwife appointments during the day so she looked after DD at my house while I went to those.

I can see your DParents have stepped up when you were on your own with your DD, before your DP came on the scene. But you seem to have reverted in age and responsibility by allowing this to continue. You can be grateful for the help, but not at the expense of your current relationship.

My mum is lovely, but I'd feel very suffocated if she was that involved in my life.

@Justmuddlingalong

I can see your DParents have stepped up when you were on your own with your DD, before your DP came on the scene. But you seem to have reverted in age and responsibility by allowing this to continue. You can be grateful for the help, but not at the expense of your current relationship.

When I had my DD, my dad had to drive me to the hospital in labour as my exh was on a 13 month drink driving ban He was pretty useless.

I think you're getting a bit of a hard time here @LittleRa. My DMiL was very helpful to us (my own DM not so much) and would even do the ironing if she was babysitting when we had a night out. No wonder I loved her so much I didn't see it as interfering or being over involved, she did it out of love for us. What your DM does on those 2 days is great and is just what I would do for my DD and her family if it was needed. Take no notice of those saying they had loads of kids, worked 100 hours and still did the housework! Your DM helps you out and I've noticed she doesn't hang around when you and your DP get home so she's not all bad is she?
Obviously respect your DP's view but don't let this spoil your relationship with your DM. You don't have to have a showdown or any kind of conflict. I agree with your approach entirely. Enjoy your new baby!