Dating Thread 199 - Come on 2021....

[LongtimelurkerL]

The Rules:

1. The first rule about the dating thread is don't talk about it with people you're dating.
2. Develop a thick skin.
3. Do not invest emotionally too soon.
4. It's all BS until it actually happens.
5. Trust your gut instinct.
6. People vanishing, lying & being generally weird is not your fault.
7. Know your worth.
8. If it's not fun, stop.
9. Loo update is mandatory.

10. No dating the thread. 11. Treat others as you'd like to be treated 12. Any relationship you have that could get ruined by having a conversation about your feelings, standards and/or expectations wasn't really stable enough to begin with 13. The things you choose to ignore/ tolerate now are the reasons you will break up in the future 14. OLD can get very time consuming. Keep doing other activities you enjoy.

Optional: Please give your irons (potential dates you are talking to) nicknames like Mr Scottish. Initials are allowed (Mr S) when you are an item

Eesha - I'm rarely friends with exes too. I'm friends with my most recent ex but I think me/him have sort of been wondering if there's something left to salvage there (I dumped him) and of course with lockdown both of us have been lonely but we also got on well. You're not an idiot at all though and I just saw (not sure if I'd missed it before) re the autism diagnosis with Mr Yoga - that's a very tough thing for you to deal with so don't be hard on yourself at all.

Eesha - your questionable views on race, six pack and Covid denier sounds like someone I was in touch with over the weekend!

Clovertoast - it sounds like Mr C has been honest and in these Covid 19 times I think just do as you say and check in on it too, it sounds good so far re what he's said to work with though.

My final iron - is a nice enough man but seems to believe in God (and states it on his profile), let's wait and see how that pans out.

@Clovertoast I'm absolutely loving your plan, its definitely what you need to do whether you're with Mr P or not.

I know I've said it before but a man should enhance your life and not be your life.
You should have a fulfilling life because you matter as well.

Please be careful about the meeting all your friends, family and kids. Are you meeting all his?
I hope he didnt say this because he could sense you pulling away and wanted to offer hope.

I actually like the fact Mr P has been very clear on what he wants, yes he should have been like this from the beginning but right now you know where you stand and you can decide whether its right for you.
I know this has caused you a lot of angst, hopefully you can put the worries to bed now and go with the flow.

Obviously his hotheadedness is a huge red flag but you know my thoughts on that.

I also agree with the not doing anything at his, you are not his wife, cooking meals and doing his housework does not make him love you more, it just makes you a skivvy.
You should go to his to relax and be a girlfriend.

[quote Notcoolmum]@UtterSocks that sounds like a headfuck of a situation. Are you saying that during lockdown they live separately? Now this pattern has been established can't it continue post lockdown? Have you managed to get to the bottom of why he lets her behave like that? I'd hope lockdown has helped set some boundaries between them. How old are his kids?[/quote]
Hi @Notcoolmum - yes it is a headfuck but I'm so used to my head being fucked with ahaha. They are living separately because she had an operation and went to recover at her mum's and be waited on hand and foot. He looks after the kids in the week (14 and 17) and takes them to her mum's at weekends. He has told her not to come back as the atmosphere and the arguments are unbearable. She has recently started sending him very abusive texts threatening him and saying she has a 'right' to return. They aren't married but her name is on the mortgage even though she doesn't contribute to any household costs. I think she wants to live in the house and force him out, live in it with her new BF and the kids and then he will have to pay the mortgage, pay her for the kids and rent for a flat for himself. She has threatened all sorts.

I have no idea why he lets her behave like this but I expect it is an ingrained pattern, like I lived with an emotionally and financially abusive man for years feeling trapped by his threats. And he is not someone who enjoys conflict. She has moved out before for periods and moved back in presumably when it suited her or her mum or current BF got sick of her sponging off them.

He is pretty weak, I see that. Also, though, I don't want to listen to it because it makes me cross and it makes me start trying to solve him, suggesting lawyers, courses of action etc - and it's none of my business and if he acts on my say-so then it's on me isn't it - I'm his escape ladder. And it will accelerate things massively when I am very cautious and want to just take it day by day. He has already given me grief about not seeing him in the week but I'm not having him at my house when my daughter is there and he doesn't want me to meet his kids yet (nor do I have any interest in meeting them to be fair). I like having him as my weekend guy for fun and food and sex and boxsets. We have a lovely time away from the real world. I just keep having to head him off when he talks about the future. If I am not careful then when my DD leaves for university, he will end up staying at mine all the time and paying for his nasty ex to live in his house and I'll have to have his kids at weekends. I am not up for that. I just want a man who has his shit together!

@clovertoast I remember you from last time I was on here. Thanks for the update. I think you are being very measured. I like that Mr P has been upfront with you. That's so important. I think if you KNOW (like I knew with Mr Local) that the boundaries are XYZ then you can decide if you can cope with it. It's when you find out too late that they have been future faking or lying about who they are that it's horrible. It's a shame he wasn't like that from the start though as it's harder to trust once it's been broken. But I hope you are able to make it work for you as you clearly have something good together.

Regarding the 'friends with ex' thing. I always try to stay friends with everyone. I have decorators and ex-bosses who still send me stuff at Christmas, I am a tenacious socialiser 😂 I refer to everyone as 'friends' if they don't actually hate me (I'm an introvert's nightmare!) But with exes - well, when I can pull it off it is usually because I wasn't really into them that much in the first place. The FWB type exes or the ones I test drove hoping I'd get to like them more than I eventually did. I think if you have feelings for them it's like putting your hand in the fire and keeping it there. I still communicate with Mr Beard. If he told me he was seeing someone else (even though I am and have for a while) I would be brokenhearted. And no there is no logic to that at all!

@UtterSocks I know you don't want to, but aren't you practising a helplessness of your own, if you don't tactfully mention that there are mechanisms for dividing assets and avoiding all the abuse and confrontation ?

Also I know in my case, I pretty much decided I'd give a lot away just to make a clean break as quickly as possible and to ensure stability and a non-hostile environment for my son. This is possibly something that is driving Mr Ginger's actions more than weakness ? I know it's different for Mr Ginger with the prospect of a free loading ex- with boyfriend in tow but can see that this also hems him in, in terms of negotiating a quick solution.

No easy answers really ... but I don't think these things have to come to a head, or be necessarily confrontational between you and him - just explorative chats (thought sounds like you've done this) might ease your tension with him and give him food for thought.

I do like it when you dip in @HairyArsedMan you always give such good, measured, well rounded, grounded advice.
How, and I mean this in the nicest way, are you still single?

Thanks @HairyArsedMan - I mean that is food for thought, definitely. I am avoiding getting drawn in which is a sort of helplessness - but deliberate helplessness. I have my own battles to fight (similar situation, gnarly divorce finances with an entitled cocklodging ex) and can't take on his. I've not asked him to help me find a way out of my mess. I have suggested he see a lawyer though rather than getting in his own way all the time with his defeatism. It doesn't lead to arguments between us, he isn't argumentative at all, one of the things I like, but I just feel he has to sort this himself and then report back to me. I'm a rescuer by nature and I am really trying to stop it as it doesn't do me any good. I have said more than once that I don't see a future for us though, if she moves back in, and I don't really. So he knows where I stand.

He wants to sell the house and divide the assets in a way that will cause the least damage to himself, and of course he is happy to support the kids. But she is trying to block him from selling it - she basically just wants to live in it and him pay for her forever and ever while renting somewhere for himself. They aren't married so he isn't obliged to, although she plays the 'sickness' card a bit. Utter hypochondriac. She also has form for calling the police every time they have a disagreement and making things up about him. I just find it distasteful to be honest. I really don't want someone like that even on the periphery of my life. I don't even want to hear about her. It is what it is I guess!

@uttersocks his situation sounds horrible with the ex etc, but you have your own problems to sort. In your situation I think I would be stepping away from the drama completely. It would be too much (I'm not a fixer by nature, except re my DC).

Yeah @Uttersocks I get that your situation is very much in the forefront of your mind and you don't want to be sucked in too much. But seems like you've got things in common in that area and can share knowledge and support ...

Doing my own bit of solutioneering on his behalf, ultimately, he will have to make her a good offer on the equity, and swallow any idea of least damage to himself and see it as a legacy for his kids. And you might be able to see it that way too, despite her actions being totally the opposite of the way you would behave. It's hardball negotiating from her and despite the relationship being over she wants him to solve all her problems for her (been there). He might just have to do that, one last time, to get out cleanly, then put very strong boundaries in place.

@Clovertoast I've been very happily single recently but decided I'd try to spoil all that and rejoined the dating sites last week

@Uttersocks - having some experience of this kind of thing also, he might need signposting rather than actual rescuing. Hairy's angle is pretty sensible if he can swallow it; it might be best to take a hit for quick resolution and move on as quick as he can. I did and have no regrets. Can't be good for the kids if nothing else.

Hairy I too always look out for your posts. You are really good at looking at things from a different perspective. If it's not too nosey to ask, what happened to the lovely woman that you were speaking to in the summer/autumn (?) She had some health issues and you were proceeding as friends ?
Eesha I am joining in with the hopes and wishes for you to find someone extra special soon. You conducted yourself with Mr Y with great class and restraint. I don't doubt that there have been times of sadness and frustration for you but knowing very clearly that him and his situation was by and large beyond your control must help.
I had a lovely weekend with Mr V and slowly I am feeling that this has the potential to become long(er) term. I would like eventually to share my life with someone and live with them. I liked being married and haven't had the far reaching fall out of a divorce to deal with. I am a bit of a fixer though and Mr V's financial situation needs dealing with. He could buy the council property that he has lived in for years and says he wants to. But he is taking forever getting that underway. Financially I could help and it could be an investment for me ( we have discussed the legal side, making it more of a joint financial investment ) but it seems a huge commitment if things go pear shaped between us. I have my own mortgage free property. This would be merely helping him to buy his place with a view to renting it out or longer term selling it. The council give him a huge discount on the sale price so effectively if he doesn't buy it he will lose that money. I want to just enjoy being in a relationship with him and I don't want money to be a major part of that. But at 56 if he doesn't act soon he'll miss the chance. Just to add there is no pressure coming from Mr V for me to help him, it was my idea and not his. I guess my motivation is to get him to a better place financially and trust that when that time comes we are still moving forward together as a couple. But I can see based on a lot of your thoughts and experiences many of you would run from this as fast as your legs would carry you

As a fixer @UtterSocks I realised I quickly went into 'what he needs to do is x, y, z' mode! His ex will always be on the periphery. Is that something you can deal with?

I've had to learn to step back and not try to fix Mr B. He knows the things about his current situation i want to change but I've stopped trying to find a solution for him and now just see them as his problem. Sometimes they impinge on me, which is annoying. But mainly there are his issues to deal with.

@Eesha sorry to hear your updates. As others have said, there's nothing stupid about you. It does suck though, and I know the pain you're going through. You come across as very kind and caring though, and I'm sure there's a lovely guy who is available and has his shit together out there just waiting to meet you.

@Clovertoast nice to see your update, and your plan looks really good. Doing things for yourself and becoming a stronger person is never a bad idea. I think I need to take a leaf out of your book myself.

@UtterSocks just wanted to add some more words of support to you, although I've never been in a similar situation so don't have any helpful advice to add. I can see how hard it is for you though, and I hope things improve. Out of interest though, how do you handle seeing Mr Local as well? Does this complicate things for you, or is it useful to have someone to take your mind off things with Mr G?

As for the friends discussion - I've never kept in touch with any ex other than Miss H. I thought I could handle being friends, but clearly my feelings for her are still too strong for that given how hurt I felt when I saw her back on the app. I have become good friends with someone I met for a date just over a year ago though, and in fact saw her last night for a walk around town and chat about dating and life in general. I'm really glad we've become good friends.

I've also kept in touch with Miss Forest, but as we only saw each other a few times there just wasn't that emotional connection, so I don't think it would bother me to hear about her dating others.

@Onesmallstep67 thank you and everyone else for your lovely words of encouragement and support. This thread has definitely been a huge help for me and I'm aware I flooded the thread with my woes!!!

@Onesmallstep67 I'd personally avoid making any financial commitments at any point. This is huge. The biggest I did was lending my ex money to pay rent for several months after we split so I'm thousands out of pocket there. Try and keep things fun and avoid making it messy with money issues.

Anyone available for a profile review? I think I might need a refresh, @DudeFromThatLondon, @TheCatWithTheHat can't remember how old you are but would like a male perspective please. Hairy, you know me anyway so I'll be pestering you too.

Or if anyone is just willing to give me their thoughts, male or female too!

Have to say @Eesha, you've been exemplary in the handling of your situation. With my last iron I had a big conversation about it just being a case of bad timing. But of course I was doing all the talking and it was rather her just not being into me. That made me feel like a fool. Still, I suppose even handling things badly sometimes can a positive effect on personal growth.

Question for you all. With the remaining friends with exes, I always thought of it as a way of offsetting any residual bad feelings about the situation so prefer to if possible. It sounds like as a rule people prefer not to. Would an old iron contacting you for a few months usually be unwelcome?

@Onesmallstep67 I think I'd avoid making a financial commitment unless we were moving in together. How would you protect yourself and realise your investment if you split?

@Eesha always happy to give a male perspective - I'm mid 40's if that helps!

@Clovertoast

I do like it when you dip in *@HairyArsedMan* you always give such good, measured, well rounded, grounded advice. How, and I mean this in the nicest way, are you still single?

@Clovertoast I thought about answering this very honestly and self critically ! Much like those Honest Trailer takedowns of movies. Then thought wouldn't it be funny if we posted Honest Profiles on here - the stuff we don't actually out on the profiles but we're painfully self aware of ... But I do remember when the thread was full of positive affirmations and this might open a can of worms !

@Onesmallstep67 Thanks - I read your take on things pretty closely too - there are always some real nuggets of wisdom in there.

I can only remain friends if I genuinely don't want to be with them anymore and have absolutely no problem with them finding happiness with someone else. If even a tiny part of me would be hurt to see them with another woman, I couldn't.

@Onesmallstep67 You know, I think you can avoid taking a financial interest. I think with you seeing it as a dead cert investment, this might be counter productive and he might consider you're after that rather than him if he isn't terribly secure.

Still, if you can negotiate that potential problem, you should definitely encourage him to do it as an investment. It totally makes sense. At 56 he can draw a significant lump sum from his pension tax free to contribute to/minimise the mortgage. The paperwork will be minimal as the council won't be like the typical seller. Tell him he's sitting on a goldmine (in you)

Hello my first post here and would love an opinion from the men on this thread.

I matched with a guy online (we are both late 40s). I probably overshared the difficulties I am having with my ex partner and children.
I suspect he's too interested in sex.

Anyway after a sad convo on Sunday he texted me yesterday and I didn't reply. Do you think if he is interested he will write again? Honestly I don't want to put him off but I want someone who really goes the extra mile for me. It's not game playing but I need to see some effort on his part. Thanks!

@confused1974 Why didn't you reply ? Was it something he explicitly said that made you think he was just trying his luck for sex ?

As a guy I think you can't really expect him to be going an extra mile at this stage. I know everyone wants to feel special, but I feel it's got to be a mutual pull in that direction.

If it were me and it was early messaging and I'd sent something innocuous but conversational and didn't receive a response, I'd assume there was someone else more interesting to talk to, knowing what I do about online dating courtesy of this thread. If I was really really really keen, I'd make light of the non-response with a follow up message, but I would be quite loathe to do that as it would feel like an intrusion on a quiet rejection.

@Onesmallstep67 I would keep love life and investments about 100 million miles apart. He should definitely avail himself of the opportunity but why can he not do it on his own? If the answer is that he can't afford to, then this shows what would happen if you invested then you split up - he couldn't afford to buy you out, so there is no exit strategy for your investment.

@confused1974 welcome - but I'm sorry, setting this weird hurdle for your guy (which he doesn't know about) of requiring a chasing message sounds like game-playing to me. And how does it show chasing or effort? It's just a message.