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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

SIL and money issues

1000 replies

ChopinandChampagne · 24/01/2021 13:01

I recently lost my DH and I thought that it would be nice to give some money to my DGDs, both toddlers, to set aside for their future as a gift from him. Realistically, they will not remember him, but I thought that if they have some money to spend on travel or driving lessons or to help with their university costs or whatever, they would think of him and know how much he loved them, even though he didn't live to see them grow up.

I did some internet research and the suggestions were for a Junior Isa, which a parent would need to set up, and I would then pay into, and the child could access at 18. Alternatively, a savings account, which I would be able to set up as a grandparent, as long as I produce a copy of the birth certificate, which the child can access and take over at 16.

So far, so good and, I thought, relatively uncontroversial, so I suggested it to my DD and said that I wanted to give each of the DGDs £10k from DH and the options. I said that I wanted it to be a separate account and that suggested that she open a Junior Isa or that I should open a savings account. Her response was that she would have to discuss it with SIL and I said fine, thought no more it. Then, I sense that there is a bit of tension and DD says she wants to set up a telephone call with both her and SIL one evening, to discuss the matter after the DGDs are in bed. This was a text, so I reply saying fine, is now a good time, but DD said not, but we could schedule a couple of days later, but only if she has completed her coursework for her studies.

Then, a couple of days ago, I receive an email from SIL, from whom I never hear anything direct, advising me that if I really want to put money in an account, he will open one, but that he thinks that it is a bad idea, as inflation will erode the money. He thinks I should invest it in gold bullion or some other specific account (he says he has recently opened one for DD), and he provided links to various websites.

The tone of the email comes across, not as friendly advice, but telling me what to do. I have said that I will have a rethink, but I am worried about offending him if I don't follow his advice. I feel that he is trying to control how I invest the money. He refers to it as my wanting to invest for the DGD's future, which it is partly, but it is also about wanting the DGDs to remember or be reminded of DH. I don't really want to invest in bullion, as I think it's a bit volatile, and the idea of a bank account is that the DGDs would get the bank statements and maybe learn how to save.

Does anyone have any advice on how best to handle this diplomatically? There is quite a bit of history with SIL (Lobster Boy for those who remember my previous threads), but things are on a reasonably even keel at present and I currently have a good relationship with DD, which I don't want to upset. She says that there is no rush to decide how best to invest the money, it is important to get it right.

OP posts:
Sssloou · 03/05/2021 00:26

Oh my dear @ChopinandChampagne - you poor love.

More and more hurt and manipulation.

On it goes - another turn of the merry-go-round.

You were punished by him because you dared to suggest you would visit for the DGD1 birthday. He slapped you hard there - v vicious letting you know that YOU were not part of the family. That must sting.

He is a grifter - that’s exactly what the private dermatology stuff was about. V nasty not to ask about her sister or you after surgery.

Tell them nothing about anything - don’t tell them about your surgery, your DD3, any holidays, lunches out, spa days etc - because Mr Grifter is toting it all up in his head and then demanding his entitlement.

These two have exploited the benefits system and grant system - neither have worked a day in their lives - and have no intention of - they own a couple of houses and it was always the plan to retreat further from society and the small holding and home schooling is a standard step. Keeping your DD1 pregnant and out of society is another tactic. Let her get tired - don’t offer advice - because this is actually enabling - let her get to the end of her tether with him not you. Don’t release the steam of their RS. Keep the pressure where it needs to be.

Keep you dignity but keep detached - vanilla and grey rock - give them no info on your life.

Please keep building and cherishing your DD2 and DD3 - invest in these daughters because they have been good to you and your late DH - they deserve your focus - your DD1 doesn’t need or want you right now - she has the love of her 2 babies and the hare-brained schemes of LB to fuel her delusions and distract her from reality. You’re 100% correct that she has wiped from her mind / minimised / justified her appalling behaviours around her marriage, giving birth, moving house and excluding you and your DH - she has to do that to cope.

But your other DDs have been deeply hurt by her.

This isnt goung to change for years and years - so try to detach with love so that you make the best of these very very difficult months you have ahead of you.

Justilou1 · 03/05/2021 01:27

I’m popping back in to remind you of the Prodigal Son Mythology. While parents wait around and offer gifts, etc.. hoping for the return of the beloved child who has behaved so badly, it causes so much resentment and bitterness for the children who did the right thing by their parents. I can honestly say this as I was the one who did the right thing. At some stage it might be better for your mental health and for that of your other daughters to admit that your DD1 is actually selfish and manipulative. You can accept that these are her problems and she has made her decisions. You have already been overly generous, and probably need to focus on what you have right now in your life, not what is missing. If DD1 is ringing you hinting that she wants you to pay for private doctors etc, you need to be blunt and say “You’re an adult and capable of researching this yourself.” You are also allowed to have human feelings about the betrayal and continued selfishness. It is not all SIL - she allows it.

ThewaterlilliesofGiverny · 03/05/2021 08:07

I agree with ssslou that these 2 have managed to squeeze a lot of money out of the system and people. £60,000 thanks to lockdown puppies!! - sold via Gumtree and not via KC breeder scheme with vet puppy checks and inoculations and profits declared for tax purposes.

I can see she’s hinting for more cash to pay towards a cleaner and private schooling, as well as the dermatology consultations. I think she’s been told by LB to squeeze as much cash out of you that she can, while you are bereaved and grieving.

It must have been rank in that house with no functioning bathroom and a load of piddling puppies, but that is the life LB has chosen and she goes along with.

Hotankles · 03/05/2021 08:56

Hi OP I’ve just read the thread. I’m so sorry did you loss and what’s happened between you and your dd1.

I think your making a mistake going up to visit them. Your going to be alone and very vulnerable. Every single would you say will be analysed and they may ask you for financial assistance. And I do think he will take offence at you taking her her to a spa.

How they behave is not on you. Your dd behaviour is not in you. And at some point as a grown women she does have to start taking responsibility of her actions. I lived with with some one very similar and cut my family off and ultimately I knew what I was doing.

Don’t pot yourself in a position where this man can have a sitting audience with you by yourself. People like this have very long spiteful memories and it wouldn’t surprise me that if he actually asked you to leave his house just like you did to him.

Just stick to FaceTime and phone calls and keeping them both at arms length Flowers

Hotankles · 03/05/2021 09:00

My gosh lots of typos in that post!

Hotankles · 03/05/2021 09:03

@Sssloou

Oh my dear *@ChopinandChampagne* - you poor love.

More and more hurt and manipulation.

On it goes - another turn of the merry-go-round.

You were punished by him because you dared to suggest you would visit for the DGD1 birthday. He slapped you hard there - v vicious letting you know that YOU were not part of the family. That must sting.

He is a grifter - that’s exactly what the private dermatology stuff was about. V nasty not to ask about her sister or you after surgery.

Tell them nothing about anything - don’t tell them about your surgery, your DD3, any holidays, lunches out, spa days etc - because Mr Grifter is toting it all up in his head and then demanding his entitlement.

These two have exploited the benefits system and grant system - neither have worked a day in their lives - and have no intention of - they own a couple of houses and it was always the plan to retreat further from society and the small holding and home schooling is a standard step. Keeping your DD1 pregnant and out of society is another tactic. Let her get tired - don’t offer advice - because this is actually enabling - let her get to the end of her tether with him not you. Don’t release the steam of their RS. Keep the pressure where it needs to be.

Keep you dignity but keep detached - vanilla and grey rock - give them no info on your life.

Please keep building and cherishing your DD2 and DD3 - invest in these daughters because they have been good to you and your late DH - they deserve your focus - your DD1 doesn’t need or want you right now - she has the love of her 2 babies and the hare-brained schemes of LB to fuel her delusions and distract her from reality. You’re 100% correct that she has wiped from her mind / minimised / justified her appalling behaviours around her marriage, giving birth, moving house and excluding you and your DH - she has to do that to cope.

But your other DDs have been deeply hurt by her.

This isnt goung to change for years and years - so try to detach with love so that you make the best of these very very difficult months you have ahead of you.

I agree with all of this.
RandomMess · 03/05/2021 09:21

If I remember we predicted home schooling would be the plan to keep DD1 isolated and stuck at home.

ChopinandChampagne · 04/05/2021 08:20

Thank you all, especially Sssloou, who has given brilliant advice, as ever. I hope that you are ok, too. You were also prescient as, all being well, there is to be a DGC3 early next year. At least she told me this time.

OP posts:
ChopinandChampagne · 04/05/2021 08:30

DD1 has also expressly told me that I can pass on the news, even though it is so early. So I assume that she wants me to tell DD2 and DD3, so she will be put out if they don't send their congratulations. She didn't ask after DD3...

But I am very happy about DGC3, and the positive test came on the six month anniversary of DH's death, which seems significant somehow.

OP posts:
Beefcurtains79 · 04/05/2021 10:55

Another child? No wonder the in laws aren’t keen to get involved with their childcare now, make no mistake- they’ll already have been told this news.
That’s 3 sets of school fees they’ll be expecting you to pick up for them then, they know you won’t want the children to be isolated and miss out on an education, and that’s exactly how they are framing it to get what they want.
Unbelievable how she wants you to pass on her ‘good news’ to her sisters, you know the ones she never even bothered telling they were aunties the first 2 times.
They are actually chilling in their manipulative plans.

faithfulbird20 · 04/05/2021 11:00

Why does it concern him anyway?

I'd do it secretly..leave it in the will or whatever...sounds like he'd nick it...I don't see why dd had to discuss it with him...

Justilou1 · 04/05/2021 11:45

Good grief! I am sorry to say that I remain unconvinced that this is entirely his influence. I am beginning to suspect that they are made for each other.

Diamondnights · 04/05/2021 12:21

@Justilou1

Good grief! I am sorry to say that I remain unconvinced that this is entirely his influence. I am beginning to suspect that they are made for each other.
Sadly I agree with you!
Mix56 · 04/05/2021 12:33

You cant possibly afford school fees fior 3, or more ?, GC, So dont even start
Your Dd1 will now have to home school 3 DC. (My own worst nightmare)
I would definitely draw back now.
Thats enough, take care of your other loving Dds.
She has made these choices.

EuroTrashed · 04/05/2021 13:19

I too am the sibling who stayed and looked after bereaved parent and did all birthdays and mother’s days and christmases etc. My sibling did nothing but every single day the first words out of her mouth when I phoned were “have you heard from your brother?”. He was plied with cash, flights, trips to meet in exotic locations, had private medical bills paid and was generally indulged to try and overcome his distance. As pp have said, that caused great resentment and upset that I wasn’t good enough despite being the attendant one. Huddle with your other two chicks - they are damaged by this too, DD1 is no pure innocent in all these schemes.

Wherearemymarbles · 04/05/2021 14:34

Sorry to say Chopin but DD1 is manipulating your emotional weakness regarding her and your GC’s and gives you nought but crumbs to keep you on side.

And as others have said, please dont run the risk DD 2 and 3 see DD1 as the golden child.

DD1 is culpable in all this and all this woe is me crap is just to suck you in.

Sssloou · 04/05/2021 15:23

These are such very tough days for you Chopin with many painful milestones and firsts to endure in this year without your DH. I really hope that you are able to prioritise your grief and reach out for lots of comfort and support. Good to see that you have a “safe and neutral” place with a good therapist. This will help you not to get drawn in, entrenched and then stuck in the toxic dynamics of your SIL / DD1.

No surprise that she is pregnant again - I suspect with the timing they will wrangle a paid maternity leave out of the system.

Always grifting.

Nothing has changed.

SIL has from day one been focused on two things - extorting money from you and isolating your DD1.

He manipulates your DD1 and punishes you in order to achieve both goals.

He truly believes in his head that he is entitled to you cash. It’s obsessive and compulsive with him. That’s his imprinted mindset.

He uses your DD1 to get it. Deep down she is likely hurting, overwhelmed, afraid and lonely even if she isn’t at all conscious of it. He is exploiting this vulnerability by provoking and then distorting these feelings so she instead feels jealous, excluded and resentful of her sisters relationship with you and he pushes her to seek financial recompense.

Follow the money.

Know his game. Don’t give her any info about her sisters. Play down any RS you have with them. Be v vague and non committal.

Don’t walk into any more traps. He is way more manipulative than you can even imagine and any word, sentiment, emoji or punctuation mark will be scrutinised and twisted to paint you as unfair to DD1.

Don’t give him anything.

Any approach / manoeuvre by you is a threat to him and so is crushed and punished.

On reflection the inheritance discussion and suggestion to visit were not good moves. Although I agree that you tap danced out of the inheritance conversation very diplomatically. Perhaps do the same with the visit.

Might be good to take a step back again. Stick to basic communication of just responding to her texts about recipes and Facetime.

Your DD1 is already tiring of him as he is exhausting her - don’t get in the his way - step well away so she is fully exposed to him.

Don’t give her any advice to make her life easier.

Because somehow he will distort everything and it’s your fault (it’s your fault not paying for childcare, cleaner etc that’s why she’s tired - not that he doesn’t help or God forbid they fund their own adult lives with the pots of cash they have accrued through exploiting every system and situation they can.

She knows deep down - even if she is repressing it her body is screaming out and keeping score with her skin issues and I expect that the DGD1 eczema is exacerbated by stress.

But enough about them.

This has many many years to play out - if it ever even does in your lifetime.

The choice now is how you choose to spend your finite energy, headspace, precious time and fragile emotions.

Getting repeatedly abused by SIL and embroiled in their dysfunctional marriage or taking care of your own inner world to honour your own grief so that you and your other DDs bond deeper and cherish each other without the shadow of DD1.

By doing the latter YOU will be in a much more robust place emotionally to support her if and when she eventually comes to you.

You can’t be in two emotional spaces at once.

Know that your detached approach is the best for you, your DD1, 2 and 3 and your DGCs ..... and when you feel the urge to get involved or respond with anything more than “that’s nice dear” .... that you should resist this urge to get drawn in because you will all ultimately be punished for it.

Don’t send the text, don’t pick up the phone, don’t commit or comment when in a triggered state. Take time out. Come back to it when you are emotionally settled and slap back in the with the vanilla and grey rock.

Your other two daughters have been very deeply emotionally injured by their sister - directly, experiencing their family pulled apart and watching both of their parents suffer. This situation with have had and with continue to have a profound negative impact on their own emotional state. They will be hurt, angry, confused and very sad with the years and years to date of relational trauma that this situation has inflicted on them.

They are now grieving their father and also grieving the fact that their family never healed this trauma and most likely never will.

Pour your energy, thoughts, time, focus and love into these two. That’s what you can do to heal your family. It’s you three now.

You can spend your time and money to support DD2 and DD3 in anyway you like.

You have no need to justify, defend, explain or reveal it to DD1. Tell her nothing about her sisters. If you want to keep final inheritance fair then that’s your choice - but your DD1 doesn’t get to pick over your bank account and spending habits and the lifestyle you choose to lead.

I suspect that DD2 and DD3 do not want to spend a holiday with DD1.

Prioritise their wants and needs.

Put DD1/SIL away up high on some dusty shelf that you don’t look at, turn your back and concentrate on your other loving, radiant daughters.

Bask in them.

billybagpuss · 04/05/2021 15:39

Hi @ChopinandChampagne it’s good to hear from you again, I’m sorry I lost the thread for a while.

It sounds like you’ve had a really tough couple of months. I pleased you’ve been talking it through with a therapist.

I’m not surprised at the hurtful way they’ve treated you over the potential visit, if it’s anywhere near me I’d happily share some champagne and listen to some Chopin with you for the day, the worse bit is if you now choose not to, you will be the bad one even though they’ve made it harder for you to visit, you had the opportunity and didn’t. I do think they were fishing for more money too despite them having already had more than their fair shares worth, and why am not surprised they’re running a puppy farm.

It’s difficult as I’m sure you don’t feel you have a big bond with the dgds yet are expected to act like that they are your world despite being kept at a distance.

Sending hugs 💐

Sssloou · 04/05/2021 19:04

I also wouldn’t hold back or deny DD2 and DD3 any financial support, rewards or treats because SIL/DD1 manipulates, threatens and blackmails to take the “pay per view DGCs” away - drop the rope on that gross game.

Don’t let them use them as bait / a weapon. Just don’t tell them anything about your activities and don’t stop yourselves having wonderful experiences and holidays.

Also try not to get too attached to the DGC because the minute they have rinsed you of your cash you aren’t seeing the DGC anyway because you by then will have no purpose.

I think that you will be especially vulnerable now in this deep grief phase. In your loss and yearning you will see these new lives as joy and continuity of your DH - but you could get very seriously emotionally injured which you already have been to date for many years - but this year and the next few years will be at another level due to your vulnerability and sensitivity in your deep loss. Protect yourself.

If you want to make a note and “save” money for DD1 down the line when / if she ever leaves him - and might need an escape fund - then your conscience is clear about equality. The worst thing you can do is give her large chunks of money whilst she is married to him. Also if she ever does leave him - don’t put any property or money in her name as she will be right back to him. Ensure she is well out of his grasp.

Lemon27 · 04/05/2021 19:53

This thread resonates with me as I am one of 4 children who have seen a family ruined all because of the parents actions favouring the golden child.

Following a dispute caused by my brother between us (the siblings), and despite having nothing to do with them, my mother and father chose to involve themselves and side with my eldest brother who literally can do no wrong in their eyes.

In doing so they cut off and destroyed their relationship with their other kids all because of their insistence to pander to him. I'm still in disbelief at it all and deeply deeply hurt, especially as like your other 2 daughters, we always were the ones to make such an effort with and support my mother in particular in everything. It was quite literally a slap in the face.

Please see your DD1 for what she is and what she has done and pour your energies into your daughters who actually care about you.

RandomMess · 04/05/2021 20:06

You know they are puppy farming, what does that say about DD1 ethics Sad

What sort of person has 2 soon to be 3 young DC and a house full of dogs all to make money out of puppies 😢

DD1 is happy to not work or have a career because LB has shown her the easy entitled way.

Justilou1 · 04/05/2021 22:03

Fabulous advice from @Sssloou! I just couldn’t go there because it would be a giant character assassination of both SIL and DD1. In my family, my DB was the golden child. He was also to special to work for a living and had rent and expenses paid and cars bought, etc while I worked and got married and had kids. When my parents wanted to see my kids, he’d inevitably have some “crisis” and my kids would get dropped like hot coals because “Poor DB” needed them. Reality - he was jealous and splitting attention. He drained them physically and financially and they let him. Of course when they died he inherited a majority. Do I have a relationship with him now? No. He assumed I would step in to become his new Mummy once our mother was gone, and tolerate his abuse, infringement on my time and space, etc. His aggressiveness when he didn’t get his way. There is now an AVO (Apprehended Violence Order) out so if he contacts anyone from my family he will get arrested. Well done parents!

ChopinandChampagne · 05/05/2021 09:37

Thank you everyone for your replies.

Beef - I have no intention of paying for school fees, not unless I want to live out my final days on a park bench Grin. I haven't expressed any view on home schooling and I don't intend to, as everything I say is regarded very critically by SIL/LB and is a hostage to fortune. I think he actively looks at ways to criticise me and punish me, as Sssloou so rightly says in her brilliant posts. My therapist also advises me not to make myself vulnerable to put downs and hurt, at a time when I am already vulnerable and hurting so much. Some days everything seems so unreal, as though life is happening to somebody else, and I am just watching. DGC3 doesn't seem real somehow and is a long way in the future, in any event. I tend to live from day to day, as the thought of endless days and months and years without DH is just too painful to bear, otherwise.

I told DD3 about DGC3, who just rolled her eyes and said words to the effect of 'another one' and was also sceptical that it wasn't planned. My feeling is that DD1 doesn't want a career or job - she has said as much - so this removes the threat of one. The question is whether or not LB/SIL will step up and get a job himself, but I am not holding my breath. DD3 is not proposing to send any message to DD1, as she says that she has not respected her boundaries, although she didn't elaborate. DD3 told DD2 the news whilst I was there, and DD2 also sort of rolled her eyes, but said she would send a brief text message, as she doesn't want to afford the situation any drama. I must say that DD2 has been brilliant in dealing with things recently and has done just what posters on here advise me to do, in that she is polite, will send the odd message, or sign a birthday card, but has effectively detached to protect herself.

Justilou and Diamond - you are right that DD1 is participating in LB's plots, which is what hurts the most. It is also what hurt DH, when he was alive, and her sisters. DD1 used to be so proud her family, at least she said so and seemed to be, and to love us very much. I don't know how she can therefore sit by and listen to LB/SIL criticising her family and how she can have acted so cruelly in the past. One of the most hurtful things she said was that 'LB talks a lot of sense. I see you all differently now'. I would like to think that she wouldn't act that way again, and there is no doubt that DH's death has hit her hard but, if push comes to shove, I am afraid that I have no doubt that we would be bottom of the heap, somewhere after the quail Grin. She is so influenced by LB that he can do no wrong in her eyes and she has adopted all of his rather unpleasant political views, which are of the misogynistic, racist, white supremacy, conspiracy theory variety. DD3 said, rightly I think, that DD1 is wholly influenced by the man in her life. So when she was with her previous BF, who was lovely, she was also lovely, but with LB not so much. For example, she was a committed vegan for a couple of years, but now speaks of butchering the quail for the pot, and even does it herself. It is the lack of loyalty which I just can't get my head round.

Even when I try to do something nice for them, it is a recipe for problems, as DD2 has astutely observed. For example, when DH was so ill and they were travelling a long way to visit him, I offered to get the DGDs something to amuse them on the journey. They wanted an iPad for DGD1 to use, so I thought it would be nice for them to have a child's one each, so DGD2 didn't feel left out. I bought two the same, which also included the Disney channel for a year, but this was no good as the DGDs are not allowed to watch Disney. So they sent them back, with my agreement, and they ordered one proper iPad for DGD1 in its place. I am also still paying DD1's mobile 'phone bill, which is their only source of internet, so LB has her 'phone when she is at work. I mentioned a couple of years ago that DD1 should pay for her own 'phone, but she hasn't done anything about it and I doubt she will.

Hello billy and thank you for your lovely offer of Chopin and champagne! You are absolutely right about the trip. DD1 actually asked me if I was still planning to visit when we spoke at the weekend, as I had deliberately not mentioned it. I asked her if she would like me to visit, to which she made some sort of vague reply, so I asked her again and she said that she did and looked rather shame faced (on FaceTime) and said that she only didn't want me to visit on DGD1's birthday, because they always spent it together (which I suspect isn't true, but there it is). I said I would be happy to visit and was reasonably flexible on dates or we could just stick to the planned dates. I also suggested going to a spa for half a day, just the two of us, and she actually seemed receptive to the idea, but I somehow doubt it will happen. LB likes to throw his weight around by messing me about and changing plans. Even when we visited a year ago, when DH had his terminal diagnosis, they still messed us around, so I had to change trains/hotels etc, thereby losing deposits. This was apparently because DD1 had an emergency C section, and wasn't well enough to see us, so was justifiable in a way, but we only wanted to visit and be helpful and see the baby, not to be entertained or catered for. In the event, we weren't allowed to visit until DGD2 was over two months old. DD1 commented a couple of days ago how sad it was that LB's sister hadn't been able to see DGD2, because of lockdown, since the day after she was born, which again shows where we come in the list of priorities. I suppose I was foolish to think that I would be welcome this time. DD1 was mentioning yesterday how she hoped she wouldn't get morning sickness until she finished teaching but, cynically, it wouldn't surprise me if she takes sick leave, even though she only has another three weeks to go. I can also see my visit being cancelled or postponed at the last minute for similar reasons.......

Euro Lemon, and lou - I am sorry to hear of your own awful experiences. I can assure you that I do not regard DD1 as the golden child and I am deeply hurt by her treatment of us all, which has been beyond cruel. She is not consciously cruel but carelessly cruel, but I do intend to try to protect myself as much as possible. I don't really have any bond with the DGDs, as I have never spent any time with them, which is a sort of blessing really. The pain experienced by DD1's treatment of us is such that I don't want to put myself at risk of it happening again. billy is spot on in saying that I am expected to act like the DGDs are my world, whilst being kept at a distance. In some ways, I feel that I have dodged a bullet by living so far away.

OP posts:
Mix56 · 05/05/2021 09:52

I fear you are setting yourself up to be hurt, both by proposing a half day spa, & visiting.
Your DD1 is going to change plans repeatedly, you will lose money/time & ultimately be shunned.
as it stands now, let her pick dates, & then say, If I book this are you going to play silly buggers & change everything like on out former visit ?
because if so, I will cancel & refrain completely.
Don't let her walk all over you.
Really you should stop now, she knows where you are, in 3 weeks, if she works to the end, she could come & stay with the GC if she wanted a relationship... Why doesn't she ?

LadyEloise · 05/05/2021 10:12

Mix52 writes "I fear you are setting yourself up to be hurt, both by proposing a half day spa & visiting....."
I agree 100%

I was shocked you were still paying DD1's phone bill.
To be used to be abused by that w*nker of a sil and your uncaring daughter.

You are just too nice.

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