To flee to a friend's?

[AIBU124]

NC for this as I want to keep this as anonymous as possible.

Bit of a muddle, this one. I'll try to keep it as simple as poss. I'm in my early 20's and still live with my mum as I've had a rough go of it with mental health over the years and struggle with some of the independence that comes with being an adult. My mum has had chronic pain over the years as well, and also struggles with her mental health.

The family as a whole has an issue with letting the house turn into a tip, and I'm one of the worst offenders. I seem to almost be blind to mess and clutter, and can easily sit in a room for days letting mess accumulate around me. It's been this way since I was very little and all concentrated efforts only last for a few days before it all falls apart again.

This, understandably, has always upset my mum. It's one of our biggest causes of arguments, and while most of these are unpleasant at best, sometimes when she explodes, she, well- Explodes.

Today was one of those times. To cut an already long post short, there was an argument over not being up at an early enough time to help clean the house, and not tidying the kitchen the day before. I must admit that I'd frozen up and was non-responsive at this time, and didn't move when she told me to leave the room. In anger, she grabbed me by the throat and pushed me back into the wall, which was enough to make me hyperventilate from fear and panic while she shouted at me.

After cursing at me to move, and being too frozen to do so, she pulled me hard by the hair once, as if she was going to drag me to the kitchen, which was enough for me to stumble out. I stumbled my way through the tidying in tears, still breathing hard and dry-heaving a few times.

When I brought it up to her a few hours later, after talking with friends and having them point out that, as in the wrong as I was for not pulling my weight, it wasn't right for her to physically threaten me like that, I brought it up to her over dinner. I said it was scary to go through and made me not want to be around her, and that if a partner were to do the same to me I would be told to leave them. She apologised, but countered that it was also abusive and shitty of me to chronically fail to help her out when she asked.

I feel like us being around each other at this point is feeding into our respective mental health issues. I am frightened at not being able to read when she'll get overtly angry (she normally keeps it to raising her voice, slamming doors, and throwing objects), and she is understandably hurt and frustrated at my chronic failures at keeping the house clean. (Recently diagnosed with adhd but that's not a complete excuse, plenty of others with adhd can clean up after themselves).

When I told a friend this he said that I should consider contacting the housing office for help tomorrow, and graciously offered to let me stay with him to create some space and help me feel a little steadier. I know we're in the midst of lockdown, but I can barely look at my mum and the tension between us is thick enough to cut with a knife. I don't know if I can feel the same amount of trust for her again, as dramatic as that is.

So am I being unreasonable to go to my friend's? Am I not putting enough blame on myself?

OP.

First of all no this isn’t okay. It is Abuse and you would be wise to leave the situation.

I think you are correct in saying yourself and your mums issues are not helping the other and therefore you would be better living separately.

I would contact the housing office today, state that your mum was physically violent to you and it is not safe for you to stay there anymore either physically or mentally. Do not minimise what she did or your fear. If you are unable to live independently they will know of supported accommodation providers but they will in all probability need to do an assessment to determine how much support you would need

I would also recommend speaking with your GP in the new year to ask for support in regards to your diagnosis and getting some coping and support strategies in place.

we have no way of knowing how extreme that mess is. Lots of people are untidy. You didn’t deserve that treatment.

Exactly, they could be wading knee deep in shit for all you know.

The people here justifying the OP's mothers actions are disgusting by the way. Not only is physical abusing someone EVER justified (and putting your hands round someone elses throat is one of the worst sorts of physical abuse IMO and objectively dangerous), but they seem to be missing the fact that OPs whole family including the mother seem to struggle with tidyness and are possible borderline hoarders. I know how to keep a house tidy and clean because I was TAUGHT as a child. In turn I teach my son how to tidy up - I dont do this by letting the house get into a state and then screaming about what a mess it is. I know OP is an adult, and it is definately possible to learn how to keep things tidy and clean even if you had a chaotic upbringing, but she has not had the chance to do this yet living as she does in a chaotic home and suffering from MH issues.

What outcome do you think is best, OP? Ultimately, you will have to find the way forward. I have a lot of sympathy for anyone caught between a bad living situation on one hand and the risks of homeless on the other.

I think the first thing to do is to arm yourself with information about local homelessness support, from Shelter and your local council. When you have more information, you're better placed to make a decision. Don't try to think about too many actions or you'll get overwhelmed. Just start with that one thing - information about local options.

Im not sure any of your mates are going to be as understanding for long when they continually have to clean up the chaos you let accumulate around you, and nor are you going to find it easy to maintain a home without independent living skills.
You are in a tough position as your mum is clearly at the absolute end of her tether having to clean up after a grown adult. She should have kicked you out rather than assaulted you though. She fucked up.

As for your mental health issues, lack of being able to lift a finger to help round the house and lack of care about your mum living in chronic pain and noone doing a fucking thing to help her, I think you could possibly do with looking at this in shades of grey rather than black and white.

I honestly feel compassion for both sides here. I am aspie and have ADD and am naturally disorganised and messy. That said, Ive had to LEARN strategies to not let my house turn into a shit tip. I have also lost my temper at my entire household for treating our home like a fucking rubbish tip. Its hard for me. Its something people judge you on. Its an awful situation.
Forgive your mum in my opinion, and work out ways so that even if you arent doing as much tidying as you should, that youre at least not creating more chaos and shit for her to do. Pay your way. properly. Pull your weight more, because if you dont, this problem will follow you around your whole life in every relationship. Medication isnt going to be a wonder cure. YOU have to do the work here

@Spanielsarepainless

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Wow. Just wow. Victim blaming on another scale. How ducking dare you.

I’m fairly messy. My husband will make comments like “ah, someone has left their boots in the hall ready to be tripped over”, and “the cup goes in the dishwasher”. What he doesn’t do is grab me by the throat and pull my hair. If he did you would all be telling me to LTB

[quote Labobo]@MissLucyEyelesbarrow - yes and only on MN are all men potential abusers. Maybe her friend will let her stay for a while and give her some support until she works out what to do next. I wouldn't live with a parent who throttled me. Are you suggesting OP should stay where she is?[/quote]
I am female but let a friend and her child live with me for a bit. I am not abusive but it was still a bit of a strain when she was there and that was someone I am very close to. I do not regret it at all, and we are still friends, but I am very glad that there was an end date in mind. If the OP moves in without an end date/plan for leaving, then even if he is a completely honourable man they could still end up parting on poor terms leaving the OP with few other options. That could easily lead to a situation where she bounces around friend to friend sofa surfing - and the law of averages dictates that she could easily end up staying with someone who takes advantage. At the other end of the scale OPs friend could be a truly awful person who is specifiacally intending to take advantage of her vulnerable situation. Between those two extremes their is a whole mass of messy situations that living together could land them in. Without a very clear arangement between the two the balance of power and feelings of obligation could easily lead to a lot of mess, disagreements, and resentment. It is better if possible if the OP finds another place to live. But if she does stay it needs to be for a set amount of time before finding her feet. Otherwise best case scenario she loses a good friend. Worst case she gains an abusive partner.

To the victim blaming twatwaffles on here blaming op for being physically abused and blaming her for being “a slob” ... can you all read the part where she says THE WHOLE FAMILY let’s the house get into a state. Why is op being the only one held responsible for this?

Op you also stated youve had this problem has a child. So has your awful mother done anything to help you with this? Or does smacking you around count?

The relationship is toxic. You need to leave. Have you ever lived alone? I suspect once you find yourself in a safe and secure place your “issues” might slowing begin to unravel, they’re probably massively compounded living at home and being in such an awful environment.

I haven’t RTFT so I apologise....but phone the police!

I'm not sure why so many comments on here are getting deleted for basically saying: its not right for your mum to be aggressive but you are an adult and you need to move out and take responsibility for yourself.

@CrotchBurn erm because it is justifying someone being physically assaulted?

imagine it the other way round - I grabbed my mum by the throat and yanked her hair because her and my father are allowing the house to get messy. people would absolutely loose their fucking minds.

Today was one of those times. To cut an already long post short, there was an argument over not being up at an early enough time to help clean the house, and not tidying the kitchen the day before. I must admit that I'd frozen up and was non-responsive at this time, and didn't move when she told me to leave the room.

Why did you freeze up? Do you find it happens a lot during confrontation or just with your mother?

Shame on the posters blaming this poor girl. Violence is NEVER acceptable!

@AIBU124 you need out but you need a plan. Do you have a social worker? Call housing and ask for the crisis team. Pack away anything precious to you, ensure no financial details are left in your mothers home. If your digs are due delay it today, you need money for essentials.

its not about justifying it. Some things are absolutely wrong, such as assaulting someone or killing someone, but obviously the lead up to these things makes a huge difference to how you deal with it.
An abused wife who snapped and battered her abuser is objectively wrong, but the punishment would be different to someone that stabbed someone in the street because they looked at them funny.

Thanks for your reports about this thread. We've removed a number of posts which we considered to be disablist, or which minimised domestic abuse or were victim-blaming; others we deleted because we felt they were really not in the spirit of the site. The OP's clearly going through a stressful time and has come here for support.

We're going to move this thread over to our Relationships topic as we don't think AIBU is the right place for such a sensitive thread.

OP, please take a look at some of the organisations listed in our Mental Health webguide and our domestic violence support webguide to see what help may be available to you in real life.

Thanks again to everyone who's given the OP advice and support.
OP, we hope you're okay.

@BuggerationFlavouredCrisps

OP, I get you. I’m in my fifties and still very untidy and accumulate lots of clutter as I struggle to throw things away. I’m always doing/thinking of several things at once and can’t easily focus on one task at a time. I can be cooking the evening meal then I’ll break off mid-way through to do something entirely unrelated.

Luckily, when I was younger, my mum accepted who I was and didn’t get abusive. She definitely found the situation frustrating at times, but she understood that I didn’t operate in the same way that she and my sister did. My sister is almost OCD in her tidying by comparison and never accumulates clutter. She’s a difficult houseguest to host because you can drink a cup of tea and you’ve just swallowed the last mouthful and she grabs the cup and puts it in the dishwasher. I’d simply rinse the cup and use it all day so I find her behaviour quite annoying.

You are being physically abused and there is absolutely no excuse for this type of abuse. You must move out to preserve your own sanity. You might also find that CBT therapy can help you organise your thoughts a little better and help you learn strategies for coping.

CBT therapy will help with mild to moderate psychological problems and it’s very helpful for anxiety problems such as OCD. For ADHD it’s best delivered in a particular coaching way to help with executive functioning. It’s often done in conjunction with adhd medication. I am adhd diagnosed and a CBT therapist. To all the PP saying get organised/make a list/be consistent/don’t be like that when you live somewhere else, unless OP has some very specific ADHD psychological coaching and medication it is not likely that she’ll be able to change a neuro-diversity by simply being mindful of her behaviour. It doesn’t work like that. From my personal and professional experience I’d suggest OP’s mother gets an assessment because there is a strong family link and a modern adhd diagnosis also recognises the impulsive and explosive elements of adhd (it’s often misdiagnosed in women as BPD). A diagnosis of adhd is very much about the MH comorbidities but they need treating through the lens of the adhd, I’m not minimising or ignoring your mother’s behaviour OP but i think the adhd is an important factor in your situation and without treatment it will be very difficult to live happily alongside others. The same my well apply to your mother.

[quote Johan23]@whaa are you the mother?

OP I would suggest that you contact social services and try to get some supported accommodation[/quote]
I do not think whaa is the mother but I agree with her. I am not the mother either.

I agree with @Branleuse here - also being aspie/ADHD and having 2 kids the same.

Leaving home can set you on a very difficult pathway because if you dont have the executive function to be able to deal with whats being asked in the family home - where the mum no doubt is dealing with all the financila side of it - you are going to struggle even more having to do all the other stuff that comes with living alone. It took me 25 years to get myself out of the financial mess I ended up in as a result of leaving home at 19, and that was when rents were far far cheaper, you could get housing benefit, and when you still got a grant for university.

That said, the level of physical abuse metted out by your mother is unacceptable, and she needs to know that is the case, and that if she lays hands on you that she risks being reported to the police.

You cannot just bury your head in the sand and use ADHD as an excuse, not when you are living in someone elses place. And its your home, but its your mums house, and having to do shit for adults is bloody exhausting and frustrating after 20+ years. Its possible, due to the hereditary nature, that she may have ADHD herself, she may not be able to demonstrate how to do it herself because she most likely struggles herself with the same thing as you say that the house is generally in a certain level of chaos.

You both need to sit down and work out how this is going to work going forwards. No violence. No shouting (if shouting makes you freeze) Maybe she can leave your room to you, but you need to understand and make an effort with communal spaces. I understand absolutely wanting to cry when you come down in the morning and discover someone has been cooking and snacking late at night and the kitchen is like a bombsite with the sink full and you cant even fill the kettle, and know that the person responsible probably wont get out of bed before midday.

But no. that level of violence is unacceptable.

Exactly @NettleTea

I can also identify with not 'seeing' my own mess but being acutely awat=re of someone elses mess in 'my' areas. My mess is important and in piles and all has meaning and relevence and I know where it all is. My daughters mess is just her stuff she has left on the table because she cant be bothered to take it upstairs to her room.

Of course thats not true - but its how my brain works. The truth is that we are both messy but able to tolerate our own stuff, and its only her stuff or my son's stuff that I will get upset about