Just told DH we don't have to have sex anymore. For his sake.

[Xmasdaymam]

We just had a big weepy chat by the kitchen sink whilst the kids were playing with their new toys.

We'd been a bit quiet for the past couple of days since I lightly asked if we could have sex sometime this week (it's been 2 months) and he went "Welllllll...." and I was like "wow, shot down!" and he tried to explain but I said "no need, let's just enjoy our night". And we did have a nice night but he was very quiet and preoccupied. There was no need to explain because I knew it was just that he didn't want to.

Because it has been 16 years of me raising the subject every couple of months. And yes we do usually have sex every couple of months. And we both enjoy it SOOO much. And say "we must do that more often". But then it disappears in him for another couple of months and tbh if I had no sex drive we would be completely sexless and he would be fine.

So this morning he asked if I was cross with him and I said I was more cross with myself because I should have said nothing. Because I KNEW. The definition of insanity is trying the same thing over and over and expecting a different answer. And I was sorry for raising it at all, and I needed to accept him the way he was.

And then he got very upset and was like what kind of man am I? I'm supposed to do this. He said "it's never been in me. Not even when I was 19. The other lads would be mad for it and I couldn't understand it because I never needed it at all". And there were tears and us both apologising to each other, him for being the way he is and me for being the way I am.

I told him we could just be pals. Because we are such great pals. He said he didn't want that, that we could find a compromise but I pointed out that the past 16 years have been a compromise and I don't want pity shags every 6 months to keep me happy. I have a vibrator, I will keep my mouth shut and manage. He hates the thought of me unhappy. But I told him I have to learn to be happy with a different kind of relationship and I will keep my needs behind closed doors with my vibrator.

So then I went to have a shower but I am just in the bedroom crying. I wish I was different. I should be different. There are so many women on here who are happy if they never have sex again. I know I can't chop off my groin. But sometimes I wish I could and we would be content, we would be pals forever.

He has never masterbated, he has zero interest in porn. He's definitely not gay. He's just possibly asexual, or at least on that spectrum. I remember when we first moved in together getting a shock that we weren't all over each other now that we had our own place.

We only had sex twice on honeymoon and tbh I initiated both times and the second time was only because he sensed I was getting upset.

I am devastated. I am only 45. I am such a sexual person. I always have been. I want to be wanted so bad. I want to be fancied. But I have realised that if I was a man coming on here and he was the woman, I would get my arse handed to me for not accepting her the way she is.

Please guide me in how to have a sexless relationship that is still close and sweet. Because we love each other so much and I don't want to feel myself pulling away from all affection. But I fear I will do it unconsciously and it will actually affect our marriage going forward.

@Xmasdaymam since you are upset/unhappy, I'd strongly advice counseling to get an external perspective and help you reflect. That could make the world of difference (speaking from personal experience!).

I'd also recommend to take some of the feedback here with a grain of salt. You know your situation, no one else here does really. Also, the advice would be a lot more sympathetic if it was you no longer wanting sex (as opposed to your DH).

My DB came out as gay after being married for 17 years. Funny thing is that it was a total surprise to me. SIL always said had no idea. They actually still live in the same house, do a lot of things/most together (no kids involved), so don't discount that possibility. I know Miriam O C has a big following in the gay community in Ireland. Her interview with Varadkar was very sympathetic and supportive.

Why do you frame it as a 'pity fuck'? He loves you and wants to do what makes you happy - how is it any different to, say, going with you to an exhibition of Victorian plumbing and showing interest (which is what my utterly uninterested DH did with me because he knows I love domestic history)? Dh facilitates things that give me pleasure, even if he cannot comprehend the attraction. So your dh gives you sexual pleasure, even if your need for it is incomprehensible to him

This is a complete misunderstanding of what sex is about for most people. The arousal comes from knowing your partner is aroused by you. It is that mutual arousal and desire that makes sense good. I would hate to have sex with someone who was 'doing me' when they weren't into it. That's a horrible and quite humiliating thought.

IN other words, the experience of sex is nothing like visiting an exhibition. It is an act of mutual joy and pleasure, with your desire for each other fuelling you both on to greater joy.

Uodate:

Another big teary talk. He has been thinking about it all day and is going to make an appointment with the GP to get his testosterone checked. I hadn't mentioned a thing. I asked him if he'd ever had them checked before but he said no. Clearly my vague vague memory was wrong, dunno what or who I was thinking of there tbh.

He also said he thinks this is beyond us and we need to see a counsellor. That it's too big for us to handle.

So many tears. I asked him very gently if he was gay. He didn't mind me asking, he said no, he'd never had a gay experience and never had any interest in one. That he doesn't know why he's this way but it's not because of that.

I asked him if he was having sex with me because he wanted it or because I wanted it. He said I'm honestly not sure. He said if he thought about it, if I never wanted sex, he would probably only ever actually physically want it twice a year.

He said he's successfully avoided thinking about it for years. Just ignored our differences because he was so terrified of losing me that it was too enormous to even contemplate. Brushed it under the carpet. Loved me to bits.

He asked me if I still wanted to stay with him, I said I did and was willing to go to counselling but he had to take the lead now in organising it.

We talked a bit about counselling. He doesn't understand why he's got a low libido. He says he doesn't feel any shame or wierdness. He wonders if when he was a teenager and didn't have a girlfriend if he developed some subconscious "well I don't need that anyway" defense mechanism but he was just wondering, he doesn't really have any idea.

We did explore why he's doing anything at all. I said, if I gave you a hormone patch to make you like me, would you even like the change? He says he's not sure, but we are too important as a couple not to try.

So much talking. All with Hugh Jackman singing in the background. Oh my god. Kids coming in every 10 minutes and rampaging off again, probably wrecking the place.

He sounds like a lovely, decent man who wants to make you happy and will be proactive in trying to solve your problems.
I hope it works our for you op. I think you have a good one there.

Oh Christ. I'm in the same boat, only I've stopped trying to fix it and have moved into the spare room with my vibrator.

I got to the point where, after threatening to leave, we were doing it once a week, but it was killing me inside knowing he was doing it out of duty and so I stopped.

I'd love to have an affair. Just so I could feel desirable again. But it would destroy the family if I got caught and I don't want that for my children.

Two decent people who have a lot to offer each other communicating and navigating their way through a problem neither have created or asked for. I really hope a balanced outcome can be found, what you have sounds too good to be discarded or subverted by introducing substitute sticking plaster solutions. A soul connection is a rare find.
I think if you've never had a sex drive how could you possibly imagine what it might be like to be married to someone you love and fancy and want to to rip their clothes off. I used to have a great sex drive, now it's barely there, yet I still have trouble imagining that level of desire - how much harder that would be if you'd never been there. That doesn't mean the fright therapy can't unlock that door for him. I hope comes what may you both continue to care for each others feelings and stay true to your souls.

Fright therapy. 😆😆😆

Who knows where your situation will end but the fact he's willing to look into it and isn't just expecting you to accept things without checking out the options is good.

I bet on some level he wants to have sex after our talk. Not because of any desire though. To make me feel better, because he is upset that I'm upset. I bet if I initiated tonight, he'd gladly do it. He may even initiate it himself. Or verbally suggest it. He would insist it wasn't a pity shag, and actually it would be out of love. Love for me, and also maybe to make himself feel normal

I know exactly how your DH feels. This has been my situation for a few years now. I wish I felt desire but I just don’t 😢

I'm in a basically sexless relationship op. Like your dh my dp is amazing. I look at all the other men I meet and none of them compare. We did split up for a while then got back together. We had more sex when we were separate but now back to close to nothing, maybe once every 3 months. The honest truth is some days I think I'm doing the right thing by staying with him, and other days I feel like I'm doing the wrong thing. I wish things were different

@Xmasdaymam

Sorry, I didnt expect people to go immediately to

LEAVE OR GET A FUCK BUDDY.

I know this is MN, maybe this was silly. Thanks anyway. Xxx

But it's not silly or outrageous for people to suggest it as if you are not having sex you are by definition just friends. Why not separate, remain best friends, coparent well and find someone to enjoy sex with.

Sorry missed the update. Hope things work out for you both but don't settle for a celibacy at 45- you'll regret it in years to come

We have acknowledged tonight that there may be nothing hormonally wrong with him. In fact he doubts it, as not only can he get an erection when I touch him, he described it tonight as a "hair trigger".

He also says he does masterbate. Not frequently but not as little as I had thought.

So he thinks it's more likely to be psychological hence the counselling if the medical tests come to nothing.

We have acknowledged also the counselling might not change anything other than we find a new normal way to be a couple.

But he said "this is my marriage and I'm prepared to fight for it". I really hope he follows through. No reason to doubt him as he does tend to be very good with completing tasks but this isn't exactly like organising getting the bathroom done!

But I feel better, like it is not all on me any more. We both feel better now we have a plan of action. We are going to light a fire and drink a bottle of wine and watch that Star Wars movie thats on today.

Thank you all for listening to me today. What a shitshow of a day. Kids had a brilliant day however, we just let them do whatever they wanted!

You both sound lovely - really hope you work it out. No advice -- but if you are both as emotionally literate as you seem, and if you both are being (and keep being) honest I think you will find a way out. Why not go to bed on a platonic hug and a promise to try to find the answers as soon as you can. I don't give a shit about being Mumsnetty so I'm sending you a hug too.

I really don't think it's true that without sex you're just friends. You can have intimacy a plenty without sex and take on partner roles that is special to romantic relationships, without sex.

I do wonder if there is something biological going on with him. Just because my libido drastically reappeared when I stopped the pill (after 15 years being on it!) and I remember being so shocked that it clearly had been suppressing it so much. You don't mention if he is on any medications but it's worth looking into, even if this has been going on longer.

You can have intimacy a plenty without sex and take on partner roles that is special to romantic relationships, without sex

That’s not remotely true is it, not for a couple who have never really had a proper sex life

Look at his linguistics op. If my husband asked me if I was gay, I’d say no, I really justdon’t fancy women.

Your husband didn’t say that did he? He dodged it, he said he’d never had sex with a man and didn’t wish to have sex with a man, which is basically the same as saying “im in the closet and I’m not willing to come out”. He didn’t actually say he didn’t fancy men did he?.

It’s irrelevant though, if you’re married to a gay man or an asexual one, the end result is the same. He does not fancy you or wish to have sex with you. No amount of therapy will change that. No amount of therapy ever did with men that didn’t wish to have sex with women, right?

So it’s up to you, are you ok with a marriage which is just mates?

Thank you CallMeNessa.

No, zero meds. And no alcohol abuse, no dope, no obesity, no fags for several years now, no diabetes.

He has an inhaler for asthma, thats it.

But then who the hell knows since he's never investigated this. Thank god he likes his GP.

Thanks all.

Do you know what age he lost his virginity? I reckon the longer you leave it, the more you get completely used to life without sex and so you are likely not to crave it as much as others. Alternatively has he had a traumatic experience in the past?

Reading your OP, I thought you were going to say you told him it’s over. Logically, it’s the only way to go after 16 years of mismatched sex drives. You’re simply not compatible. Give counselling a go, but be prepared for nothing to change as you’re just different people

I don’t think he’s necessarily gay per se. Gay men highly enjoy sex too, and there’s other things you can do in the bedroom that he would like. It just seems like he’s disinterested in sex in general. It doesn’t se like he’s ever sought sex elsewhere, he just avoids it as a whole

Your DH and mine sound very similar and I understand your point where you are done trying to solve something that’s not yours to solve. Living both sides of an emotional relationship is very draining. I’m glad that your DH has decided to see a counsellor. Mine has said similar but then Covid struck and it’s just gone from his agenda again. And like you I’m done with trying to do everything to get the horse over the line. It takes two and I’ve done more than my fair share. For me now though I freeze at his touch. I know or feel that it’s not naturally him, like it’s put on, and I just can’t respond. Mentally I think that it’s gone so far now that I can’t imagine ever being intimate again coz it just feels wrong and contrived.
Counselling is the only way forward for us but he has to do something about sorting it out. Strangely my exh was the same but never went to counselling. I’ve had some glorious moments in between husbands (erm not literally) so I know what a good healthy shag is but I can’t believe I’m so unlucky that I’ve had two lousy in bed husbands that I’m thinking it must be me but tbh I think it is more common than you think. It’s just that we’re brought up on a diet of Hollywood sex via media.

Also, I have two gay friends who are married and don’t have sex. Fortunately they are both happy with that so it works for them. So just because someone isn’t interested in sex it doesn’t mean they are with the wrong sex. They are just human and we are all different. I’ve slept with a variety of men and id say about a third of them had issues being ‘that virile macho man’ that they expect a partner to expect. Some of them I never saw again but others went on to be phenomenal lovers with me, they just, I assume, got stage fright when confronted with a red blooded woman on our first shag. So the image of a man always being up for it just hasn’t been true in my experience and I guess a lot of men feel they have to live up to that image.

@Bluntness100

You can have intimacy a plenty without sex and take on partner roles that is special to romantic relationships, without sex

That’s not remotely true is it, not for a couple who have never really had a proper sex life

Look at his linguistics op. If my husband asked me if I was gay, I’d say no, I really justdon’t fancy women.

Your husband didn’t say that did he? He dodged it, he said he’d never had sex with a man and didn’t wish to have sex with a man, which is basically the same as saying “im in the closet and I’m not willing to come out”. He didn’t actually say he didn’t fancy men did he?.

It’s irrelevant though, if you’re married to a gay man or an asexual one, the end result is the same. He does not fancy you or wish to have sex with you. No amount of therapy will change that. No amount of therapy ever did with men that didn’t wish to have sex with women, right?

So it’s up to you, are you ok with a marriage which is just mates?

Well I guess I'm going by my own experience so it was true for me at least. It might not be true for everyone of course but likely I'm not the only one. Not that this is about me but I was like the DH here. Liked sex when we did it, but never initiated. For 10 years. We had plenty of intimacy without much sex and we played (and continue to play) roles in each others lives that we would only do in an exclusive relationship. Everything changed and we have sex more now. Everything else is the same. So, no. Sex isn't the major game changer for everyone

But it wasn’t alway like that idontmind? The op has said he has never felt sexual desire to a woman.

I had a very high sex drive and then the menopause happened.

The menopause might end up doing you a favour, every cloud and all that!!

That's true. I was just saying that sex isn't the only thing differentiating between exclusive and 'just friends' relationships.

He sounds lovely and you do too. I hope things work out for you x