Married to someone with Aspergers: support thread 5

[Bluebellforest1]

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@AspergersWife have you googled/read about Cassandra phenomena/Cassandra syndrome? It struck a huge chord with me....

@AspergersWife thanks I find it helps to read your and other’s updates. It can feel confusing and lonely. I really felt for you with this His choice is never me. that must be really tough for you. It must feel like what is the point, when you are always the one ‘asking’. Do you think he has stopped appreciating you? How do you think he would be if you separated?

@RainyMayDay yes the fawning used to absolutely crush. I’m not so confident that I can brush it off. However now I’m just numb to it. It’s like DH seems to me to ‘collect’ these people, once he’s got them he places them on a shelf and has no interest. DH told me, kindly I think to try and explain his coldness to me, he said that with any girlfriend (he’s had absolutely loads) he’s been very into them and then has no interest at all after a short while. He’s told me he admires my ability to stick with projects, with people. However he ‘sticks’ with work.

@Daftasabroom is it just big family events? Is it just your family or your any gatherings? For me I have a lot of tolerance and capacity to compromise with DH, and would have been only too happy to give up a lot of things like family, outings, holidays with him - for me once I’d committed I wanted to do what it takes. However for DH I think half of the reason is that he’s just not that interested in me anymore..

DH is in hospital. I find this kind of time hard as he is much more open at the moment, and because of lockdowns and he’s fairly cautious around the pandemic, he hasn’t been going out and has seemed to need and want more time in my company. I find it bittersweet as I’ve had to mentally become tougher, in order to preserve myself, but times like this I just want to stay married to him and be a family of sorts, even if it’s not everything that I want.

@Blossominspring2021 mostly just big family events. There is a Tony Attwood lecture where he explains that some ASD women will sit back and observe a situation and then when they feel they have understood it and are confident enough will dive in, try to to take over and impose their expectations on the rest of the group. This is DW to a tee. I think in non family situations she generally doesn't get past the observation stage, there is also little or no expectation of her. But with Christmases and Birthdays she definitely has expectations she feels override everyone else's.

@AspergersWife whenever I suggest we do something together or as family it normally ends up in acrimony. DW will rarely have any suggestions but will reject all of mine. On the rare occasion we do she will sabotage, hijack and control to the point of utter misery. If one of her friendship group suggests something DW is out of the door at the drop of a hat.

She never chooses me

@Blossominspring2021 I can actually answer that very accurately, as he moved out over the summer. To sum it up, I was happy and he was in a very dark place.

Alert - long story warning!
At that point he was seriously anxious about Covid, and our children's year groups re-opened in June. They desperately needed to go back, but H said no he wanted us all at home. We live in an area that's had very few cases, but in the north west so have had stricter restrictions for over a year. He was convinced he'd catch it and die. Me and the children were together 24/7 for months on end and he did not lift a finger to help me. He continued going to his office and worked (alone) throughout, then gamed all night. I was so happy when the kids could go back, but he went mad and refused. I told him they absolutely were going back for their sanity and mine!

So at that point he decided to move out to protect himself from covid risk. I viewed it more as a trial separation, he viewed it that it was for his health. His dad has a flat so he went to stay there and decided not to have any contact at all with us. Very, very quickly his mental health declined, after 3 weeks he wanted to meet us for a walk, and about 3 weeks later he was asking to move home. So he was gone around 6/7 weeks.

The fact was, I was fine with that as money-wise he continued to pay into our joint account (as I could not run my business). It was a weight being lifted. No grumpy Daddy refusing to go on walks. No endless moaning about covid and gloomy predictions he'd catch it and die. Kids missed him a bit, at first, but he is such an absent father anyway that they didn't notice too much. I didn't miss him as much as miss having an extra pair of hands at certain times, but generally I'm on my own anyway whether he's in the house or not, so it was fine. The house was tidier and everything felt lighter.

However his mental health deteriorated so fast I was very worried. After the 6 weeks or so I did let him move back for fear something bad would happen. He was full of promises - we'd get the dog I'd always wanted, we'd have a trip away, he'd see a counsellor again, he'd get help and medication for anxiety and depression, we'd see a marriage counsellor. Back then he wasn't as into the game and the rest of the summer felt like he was trying to be more 'normal' and engaging with us.

When further lockdowns came in the autumn, it started spiralling again and he got further into the game. But at this point our son was seriously struggling with the return to lockdown, things were awful for him. So I pushed my marital concerns to one side as I wanted to be strong for my son. I was unable to get help for him anywhere. Eventually we ploughed our savings into getting him a private AsD assessment and recently had the info through that he too is high functioning. Basically he'd be Aspergers like H if they still gave that diagnosis.

A while ago I suggested to H that he move out again. My reason was he was sleeping through all of our weekends and the children missed him. We were in the lockdown again, so homeschooling and me on duty 24/7, him off to play his game during quiet spells at his office and then on the game again all night. He told me he was too stressed out by the kids (the 1 hour a day on weekdays he spent putting them to bed ), and when he's stressed he shuts down and sleeps. Lie in for him, more work for me. Too tired to do lunch, I'll do it. Doesn't want to go for a walk, ok I'll take the dog. Rinse and repeat. I had enough.

This time, I reasoned, if he moved out he's already on his antidepressants so in theory shouldn't decline as much, and that way instead of being an energy sucking ghost in the house, he'd do exactly as he pleases 6 days out of 7, then spend 1 day a weekend with the kids full of energy and able to give them his all.

He refused unless I was asking 'for personal reasons' I.e. because I wanted to split up. At that time I still thought we could make it work, and said I had no personal want to move him out, but that's how drastic I wanted an improvement for our children. He didn't want to move out and said he'd try harder with the kids. For a few weeks he did, and fair enough on the weekends lately he's been doing a bit more with the kids. But only because since things started opening in April I booked me and the dog into a weekend training class, so he's now forced to interact with the kids on his own for an hour each Sunday. So far that's been mostly 'movie day' but far better than him on his game ignoring them on their rooms as per previous weekends.

If I ask him to go again, it will be a personal reason, and not to do with the kids. It will be because I've tried everything and I'm fed up being the only one trying. At the moment I feel trapped because of my lack of financial independence and the children being so young, I think if I had money of my own and they were a little bit older it'd be completely done between us. The fact that he can't even manage a week of "balance" between me and the game tells me everything I need to know.

@Blossominspring2021 just saw your partner is in hospital, I hope you are ok. It often seems that when you harden yourself, they suddenly seem more open. Maybe he senses a sort of challenge?

@Daftasabroom that must hurt so much. My H is similar in that if a friend suggests something (recently it was one of those escape type rooms) he will be enthusiastic about it, and plan to do it. I suggested one pre-covid and he laughed me down. Or he'll agree but then end up cancelling for some excuse. It's like anything I am interested in is pathetic, but if it comes from an external source it's the greatest thing ever.

@Bachprelude thank you, I had not heard if it as Cassandra syndrome. I have come across the Attention disorder (can't remember the name, it likens living with an aspie partner as almost abusive due to the gaslighting similarities and the NT ends up with PTSD type symptoms). It is indeed eye opening. I don't know how I've kept my sanity all this time, but I feel it slipping away at the moment.

Last night I overheard H say to the woman he games with 'I'll give the wife a hug, back in 10 mins'. That's all I'm worth, 10 mins. I called him out on it, but he was unresponsive, stonewalled me totally. He barely said goodnight to me, then this morning because I didn't particularly want to hug him goodbye he said so nastily 'that's a shit hug' and walked out. No comprehension as to why I might not feel like going through the usual performance. Acting like nothing happened. Making me wonder if last night really did happen. Little things over and over that chip away at my confidence, my mental well-being, my own sense of self.

AspergersWife that sounds so hard 💐

I know the prospect of leaving and struggling financially is very daunting. But you do also need to consider the imoact on your mental health and the resulting ability to be The Parent for your children. It is often the case that if the mum's ok, the children are ok. It sounds to me like you have tried everything.

Wow interesting. My lived, devastating, experience of being married to an autistic man for 25 years, and parent of a dc16, also autistic, gets me deleted. Wow.

@AspergersWife I have an analogy that represents at the last fifteen years:

It's like we are standing four steps apart facing each other. Inevitably we agree to both take two steps forward and meet in the middle. I take two steps forward, she takes two steps backward. We end up four steps apart, still facing each other, except I have given up another little piece of myself and she has retreated further and further into her comfort zone.

@colouringindoors I didn't see your post but we do have to be very careful not to generalise. Syntax and semantics count.

@colouringindoors I’ve had posts reported in the past because perhaps I have spoken too generally.

Having my experience invalidated on here is similar to what I experience in everyday life. Just reinforces that my view doesn’t count.

Having my experience invalidated on here is similar to what I experience in everyday life. Just reinforces that my view doesn’t count.

@RainyMayDayy Yes. I said Some. Not all, not many. Some.

Will have to leave the thread.

@colouringindoors I didn't see the post that got removed which is a shame. I felt like I could finally, finally open up here but it seems not. Totally invalidating, just like the rest of the world. Nobody understands what it is like except the posters I've found here. I see why you might leave the thread, but your contributions to me have been insightful so I hope you stay. If you don't, I really hope you can find somewhere else to open up and gain support because this is a terribly lonely existence.

@Daftasabroom that's a perfect analogy. How much more is left to give when you've continually made those steps? How can you possibly keep on stepping towards their side when you're already over their with them?

I've been doing this for 10 years of marriage and the few years dating/engaged before that. I saw all the warning signs, but it's the boiling frog analogy for me. Now I feel it's possibly too late to save myself, but I can at least save the kids from growing up seeing their mother in this miserable life. It just comes down to making that crunch decision and I'm not sure I feel ready.

I’ve been here since thread 1, and I’ve had several posts reported and removed, usually for “generalising”. If you check out previous threads, we were “policed” by some posters who had an agenda, it seems to have calmed down a bit, but I’m sure they’re still there, checking us out. A bit like Line of Duty, 😂

@RainyMayDay, @colouringindoors
Having my experience invalidated on here is similar to what I experience in everyday life. Just reinforces that my view doesn’t count.

Yes, this is just how it is.

@Daftasabroom Brilliant analogy.

@AspergersWife
I've been doing this for 10 years of marriage and the few years dating/engaged before that. I saw all the warning signs,

15 years for me (second marriage) I feel I was duped.

@Daftasabroom yes that’s exactly how I feel

@AspergersWife I’m a lot further down the road than you, 23 years in and I agree with the boiling frog comparison. As I said before my DH isn’t a bad man at all and he’s hardworking. I’ve always felt that bits of me are slowly being chipped away and with my DM being ill and me also hitting menopause it’s just made it all the more clear that there isn’t really any emotional support for me when I really need it. But now I’m stuck in many ways and I wish I hadn’t put everyone else first at the expense of my career and my sanity. My life isn’t terrible by any means and on the outside looking in people would think I’m very lucky but I do feel lonely a lot of the time. Every so often when we get to breaking point we have “the chat” where we say we’re going to make more effort and listen to the other more etc, but it never lasts long or really changes anything.

@Bluebellforest1 duped is exactly the word. In one of his more honest moments, H did say himself he feels like he 'tricked' me into marriage. The person I fell in love with was him masking, mimicking, putting on his Mr Wonderful act. Traits that seemed positive have become jaded over the years. I gave up myself and my career which made his life easier, but now I don't know how to get back to myself. I'm lost and a slave to his life. My username reflects this - I'm married to the syndrome/disorder and not the man I thought I'd married.

@Turquoisesea are you able to find support elsewhere while your DM is unwell? The chat goes the same way for us every time, it's a depressing Groundhog Day.

@AspergersWife yes I’m very lucky I have lovely friends who are very supportive.

@colouringindoors I agree. I’ve done the same. Don’t leave the thread.

Thanks Bluebell RainyMayDay

Turquoise sorry to hear about your DM.

@AspergersWife it took me years to make The decision. Even with his Bipolar on top which was horrendously traumatic. His final crisis clarified things. But having reflected on this all a Lot, I actually think in many ways the Autism was more harmful to me than the Bipolar.

@colouringindoors The Autism was more harmful to me than the Bipolar
I can understand that. It’s my DH’s ability to compartmentalise that destroys me. The fact that my DH can suddenly decide he had found a new best friend or become set on a particular course of action regardless of my existence. Suddenly everything I stand for is unimportant. Everything we have done, or do, is insignificant. I may as well not exist. The life we have may as well not exist.

And he will lie to get himself out of any situation. That’s not to say the lying is associated with autism - I don’t know whether it is or isn’t - but whereas I feel guilt if I were to lie, he doesn’t at all. Not a jot.

@colouringindoors I hope you stay. I would be more than happy to have a kind of pinned agreement that everything I say and feel, or describe about DH is not necessarily ‘his autistic traits’, that difficulties and autism do not necessarily go hand in hand, and that a marriage where one has ASC is always difficult. Everyone is unique and different. I’ve no idea how much of my marriage difficulties are due to traits of autism - (of which I also have many!) - and personality, upbringing, culture, circumstances. I do hope that my posts are not in any way trying to say otherwise. What I do know is that when DS was diagnosed, many things about my marriage made more sense, some difficulties I saw in a new (and often more helpful) light. And reading other people’s experiences, which are often similar, on this thread has massively helped me.

Some people hopefully are also able to make more positive marriages as a result. Or to leave with a greater understanding.

I hope that makes sense!