DH had lunch with another woman

[pizzaandcats]

Today my DH had a day off work while I was at home working (he gets a day off in the week if he is scheduled to work a weekend). He told me a few days ago that he would going out for a meal with some old work friends today. He also mentioned a little while ago that they were planning a team secret santa but then hasn't mentioned this since to say who he chose or that he was buying the gift (stay with me this will all be relevant in the end).

When he got back from the meal today he had a wrapped up present from his secret santa and told me it was from "A" (a woman he works with). I asked who he'd picked and he'd also coincidentally chosen "A".

When I asked who was at the meal he said it just ended up being him and "A" but that he did see some other people from the team before hand (I don't understand how he saw them before hand at a restaurant but they didn't stay for the meal. I didn't ask though as I felt like I'd quizzed him enough at this point).

Basically I am feeling uncomfortable about the fact that he went out for a meal just him and another woman and exchanged christmas presents. I just feel like he's been pretty vague about how it ended up being just the two of them and its quite a coincidence that they both chose each other in a secret santa too. Is my mind running away with me too much or is the situation very weird?

I also had to ask today what he bought for her as his present and usually he would just tell me or ask my advice on what he should buy.

Yes we need to know what the pressie was. Also where did he buy it? If online where was it delivered? If he works from hone presumably your house? How did he wrap it?

You can get gifts pre wrapped when you order them

I'm a little bit meh about this and actually disagree that he's done anything wrong really.

My DH last year did a secret Santa which ended up being him and a mate from footie exchanging gifts. He said it was secret Santa as was under a tenner. I didn't clock he'd bought or wrapped anything and pointed out that it wasn't secret Santa as was just the two of them. He shrugged and thought it was because of price limit.

Your DH's explanation is absolutely plausible and has happened to me more times than I care to mention-you plan to meet with a group but one by one they tail off with various reasons (other two may not have felt comfortable eating considering COVID) and there's just two left. This has happened a number of times and I've ended up eating with just one (sometimes a man-gasp!).

He came home, didn't hide the present as was under his arm. Quite normal to wait to open on Xmas day. He immediately told you it had ended up being just the two of them and didn't lie about it.

As soon as you questioned secret Santa he explained it fully and openly and you pointed out his misunderstanding of SS.

You've said she had previously made an effort to come over and say hi.

I'm really struggling to find the deceit and betrayal unless there is something else that has meant you're unsure about his commitment to you?

So many posters saying you need to get your ducks in a row and this just seems like such a massive over reaction for absolutely nothing.

It's a bottle of beer and a glass engraved with "the world's okayest coworker" packaged up in a box with shredded paper and a few quality street chocs. Nothing too personal but quite thoughtful I feel. He says he feels bad that its playing on my mind, he really did intend to meet with 3 other people and his colleagues have a habit of dropping out if things. Questioned how they managed to go in somewhere and eat and he said it was a takeaway meal so they actually ate outside. Also asked him how the present idea came about and he "can't remember" whose idea it was but still doesn't think it's weird as they are friends and friendlier than the other two people who were supposed to eat with them. I'm still uneasy and he knows it but what else is there to say or do at this point? The way he is talking about it now it does sound more feasible that they planned to meet up and grab lunch somewhere but didn't actually book anything or make specific plans so it might not be that weird that two decided they didn't fancy anything to eat and left after a "hey, how are you?" And a short catch up. My main issue now is the specific planning of gifts (I just can't imagine messaging someone and suggesting we exchange gifts for one another when we are meeting with a group of friends - too weird) and the secret santa lie.

In the UK, in tier three everything is closed.

That is England, not the whole of the UK.

It all sounds perfectly reasonable to me. Unless you have other reasons not to trust him I'd say let it go.

I find it all a bit odd if I'm being honest. You wouldn't go for a meal with four people but exchange gifts with only one of them. I truly don't believe he ever intended to have dinner with his other two co workers.

@susanwouldntlikeit yes he always wraps his own presents for his family and friends. And he's ordered his presents for pretty much everyone on amazon this year, as have I. So we've had a fair amount of deliveries and u wouldn't ever open his in case its a present for me. He did say yesterday that he ordered the diary alongside some things for me so I'm 100% sure he'd refuse to show me the order if I asked. I'm still on the fence here about him actually having done anything wrong so I'm not going to go mad, get my ducks in a row or anything OTT like that. But he does know I'm not happy and that his explanations don't make sense to me.

We know in Mumsnetland men and women cannot be friends.

@pizzaandcats I really doubt there's more to it than he's said, but if I was still suspicious (if it was me), I'd drop it and remain watchful.

Does he often close his computer or his phone when you come near? Keep his notifications on silent? Go out shopping a lot or "just pop to the shops" for a minute more than usual? Has he been acting distant or weird lately? Those are possible indicators that ALONG WITH the recent scenario could indicate something, but if all he's done is the lunch thing, I'd say it sounds innocent.

WTF uses a diary nowadays ? That glass needs to get oops dropped at some point . Go with your gut and keep alert with this OP ! He will be on alert now but give it time .

I think you should trust him. I've gotten presents for work folks before - often because someone will mention they got you something so you know you have to get them something. Secret Santa might just have been an easy and sloppy way to explain it and he should have been clearer, but he's not into detail and didn't want to go through the whole explanation. You mention never doubting him before, so it is likely nothing to worry about and you might be stressing yourself out for nothing.

Lockdown and lack of socialising have made me focus much more intently on my DP. I depend on him for all my socialising, love, conversation etc - so it can be easy for small things to seem much bigger than they might have done previously. Is it possible that's also playing a role in your situation?

I would be concerned that DH had bought a gift for another woman and not told me about it until after the event, upon you seeing the wrapped present in his hand on coming home. Of course it very much depends upon your DH's personality and your relationship - is he the sort of man who usually does things like this without telling you first? Is he the sort of man who does nice things or buys other people things because he's a sociable person/likes to be liked/generous person? If he is, I would say put your fears to rest, don't talk to him further about it, but just monitor the situation in the background for a while.
Generally, I would think it respectful for the spouse to inform their partner beforehand about the fact that they and a colleague had decided to buy presents for one another, perhaps ask the spouse if they are okay with that, and ask you to help him out buying her a gift.
However, if he's a bit clueless regarding how these sorts of situations can appear to one's partner then it might be a case that he's just bought the gift while he's been online shopping for you and other friends/relatives and so the opportunity to mention it either never arose or never even occurred to him.
You know your DH better than anyone - what is your gut feeling when placed in the context of his general personality and previous behaviour concerning colleagues?

Let's be honest here OP, he met a female colleague for lunch to swap Xmas gifts they had bought for each other.
There was no coincidence that they randomly picked each other as there wasn't a secret santa.
He's come cleanish because you asked and people from the office have probably seen them, hense him saying he's seen people from the office. He's giving you a story 1st in case you find out as he's been seen.
I'd be very wary but I trust no one and nothing except myself and my instincts, hope I'm wrong in your case ❤️

Cross Post, just seen he told you there was no secret santa

Questioned how they managed to go in somewhere and eat and he said it was a takeaway meal so they actually ate outside

Why did he originally say they went for a meal then? Who describes a takeaway sitting outside away from
a restaurant, presumably in the freezing cold, as a meal?

His casual diary was also engraved or he wrote a personal message on it.

I was on the fence earlier but not now.

He is, at the very least, flirting and enjoying the attention of this woman and giving her enough back to keep it going. But...he may be enjoying the flirtation without any intention to do anything further. That still isn’t treating you respectfully.

Can’t people be colleagues or even friends without it being an affair? Men and women do work together and if anything this attitude is why women on a mostly-male team are always the outsiders. All this speculation makes marriage seem stifling. People can have professional lunches! Not everyone is having an affair. Has nobody ever eaten in the staff canteen with a workmate (pre-Covid)?

@epochtime you have explained this perfectly in terms of his personality. I am very much about sharing all the details and he just isn't. He has just set up for work and I'm still mulling about in bed. He came back in to see me, has given me a huge hug and another apology for how he made me feel along with the promise that if ever he was feeling that way and looking elsewhere I would be the first to know, but that he would be mad to want to leave me or cheat. I do feel a lot better but will keep my wits about me for a while just in case (but no snooping). As a side note I have been tempted a few times to say sorry to him for feeling insecure but I haven't said it, I'm quite proud of that as I know I shouldn't apologise for my own feelings.

It’s not about meeting someone for lunch. It’s about the degree of trust.
Either you don’t trust him because he’s actually doing more than having lunch or you’re being paranoid and mistrustful.
Neither is good basis for a relationship.

Of course a man and woman can have lunch without it being indicative of an affair. I often have lunch with a male work colleague of similar age. It’s fun. He’s been happily married to his husband for sixteen years. My husband occasionally took his PAs out for lunch so he wasn’t eating alone or to do work as they ate. Neither of the two PAs would look twice at him as anyone other than as someone it is a nightmare to manage but whose quite nice really.

[quote pizzaandcats]@epochtime you have explained this perfectly in terms of his personality. I am very much about sharing all the details and he just isn't. He has just set up for work and I'm still mulling about in bed. He came back in to see me, has given me a huge hug and another apology for how he made me feel along with the promise that if ever he was feeling that way and looking elsewhere I would be the first to know, but that he would be mad to want to leave me or cheat. I do feel a lot better but will keep my wits about me for a while just in case (but no snooping). As a side note I have been tempted a few times to say sorry to him for feeling insecure but I haven't said it, I'm quite proud of that as I know I shouldn't apologise for my own feelings.[/quote]
Absolutely you should feel proud of sticking to your guns on the old apology thing. Your DH sounds really lovely and I would be really happy if my DH had said those things to me in this sort of situation. So glad you're feeling better. I am sure that these sorts of situations like the one you've just been through are sent to try us now and again! Have a wonderful Christmas.

It's kind of convenient that he bought your presents at the same time he bought hers ?

I'd still ask to see the diary purchase on his account .

I'm not convinced ... he's pacified you for now as he know you're onto him.

She's a welcome distraction outside of things at home ie trying for a baby, referral for fertility treatment ... this is usually the time some men look for excitement elsewhere . Numerous stories on MN tell you that people never think their partner is 'the type'.

This is the pre cursor to a potential affair , he's putting in the groundwork .

You need to make it very clear what you see as overstepping the mark... for some it's flirting , for others having one on one meals like dates .

I’d actually give him the benefit of the doubt here. I thinks it’s good that he’s saying he feels bad that it’s playing on your mind - it would make me think twice if he was defensive about it instead.

Op so he met with his 3 colleagues carrying the gift around? That seems very odd. He must have been waiting to be alone with her to exchange gifts because he couldn't have done it with everyone else around. It must have been planned to be alone to exchange the gifts. OR they parted ways at the end of the meal and met up at their cars or somewhere alone to exchange.
This doesn't sit right somehow.
How does this even come up to buy gifts for each other?

I think you have nothing to worry about.

He and his coworker are friends and they planned on buying each other a gift. Your DH knows that you're a naturally suspicious person and made things worse for himself by trying to do it without alerting you to the fact he had lunch and bought a present for a female colleague.

Yes he should have been up front about it beforehand but I reckon he's done that stupid man thing of trying to keep it on the down low for a easy life.