He isn't in love with me yet

[movele]

I've been dating a lovely guy for the last 4 months. Both 30s. Things have been going well - we've been on holiday together, are on the same wavelength about everything, can stay talking nonsense for hours, sex is great, and we both really enjoy our time together. We had the bf/gf conversation 2 months in. I've met his parents and friends too.

We did have a few weeks of minor arguments because we had very different schedules at the time, and spending time together, and dealing with restrictions/lockdown was a challenge. But resolved these quickly and have gotten closer and more connected since.

A few weeks ago, I told him I loved him. And he said he liked and cared for me deeply, but didn't have those feelings yet. But saw the possibility of it turning to love in the future. Obviously I was upset, but he explained that to him love is an absolute - if he fell in love, that was him committing to always love me. And he never understood people who fell in love, then fell out of love. He also said, that he can't remember the last time he told his parents he loved them, though he is very close to them.

As background - he has never had a serious relationship before, (I'm his first), or been in love (though he has had a few crushes, if i can call it that). This is mainly because he did a lot of travelling and had a major career change so not a lot of time for dating. He is also not from an affectionate or emotionally expressive family, though he is close to them, and very affectionate with me. I, however, have had a few long term/live in type relationships, and come from a VERY affectionate and emotional family.

I asked him why he was with me then - and he said he could see a future, and loved spending time with me, fancied me, and am one of the only people he is comfortable opening up to.

To not drip feed: one of the only issues we have, related to our intial arguments. When we are not together (Which is 4-5 days a week), he isn't very communicative by text, and would never call. Will always reply though. He has gotten better after I've told him I need to not feel like he's forgotten me when I'm not around. So he will now ocassionally call (I told him specifically I wanted this) and does text more. But not sure if this is related to him not being in love with me?

Since then, I haven't brought it up again, or said it. He has been making more effort to be more attentive since then. I do love him, and understand that people move at different paces, and 4 months is not long. However, every relationship I've had my bf has said it first, about 2 months in. And I've heard that men know pretty quickly if they love you or not.

So I don't know how long I should wait till he says it? Or whether it's a bad sign that he doesn't reciprocate my feelings? I do feel quite insecure about this, as the more time we spend, the more deeply I fall but am always conscious he may never reciprocate.

Can anyone advice me on what to do, or if they've had a situation where their feelings weren't reciprocated till much later?

Perhaps this is your problem. You don’t appear to see that love and commitment are a long term prospect, perhaps just a short sighted means to an ends. Perhaps he has picked up on this and doesn’t see himself as a sperm donor first and a life partner second. A man in his thirties is probably more likely to want to settle down, choosing a life partner with which to raise a family takes a little longer than 4mnths.
20yrs ago before mobile phones, texting and the internet communication took far more effort. I think it was easier for my generation to judge whether a man was seriously into you.

@YoureNotOnTheList Cost mainly. I did research it loads. But because I'm already 37, I figured i may as well just start with the sperm donor as it's all so expensive - and I'm already a bit in the headspace to have a child. Not sure I could afford both within a few years of each other.

I wasn't actually looking for a relationship at the time - was pretty sure I just needed to start the cycle. But he pursued me actively and I liked him, now here we are.. He does know all this - and did say he is aware of my timeline for kids, and thinks he would be ok with that (certainly didn't scare him off), but until he actually has those feelings for me, it's all just talk atm.

Not sure if this has been mentioned but I would be hurt too. I couldn't wait for soemone if they weren't sure. That's probably my issue though but it would worry me that you don't approach relationships the same.
How long are you willing to wait? Idk it would make me feel a bit insecure.
I have to be with someone who is on the same page.

@movele hahaha most likely as he is a one of a kind and most likely the only one left 😂 I did that too, waited, gave him time but nothing changed and I found myself deeper and deeper into him and it was very difficult when we split. I lost weight, lost hair and lost my confidence as I thought I was not good enough for him. If I could take back time, I would have not bothered with him after 2 months as he was not all that looking back and because the longer you leave it the deeper you find yourself attached to him and it will be harder when it eventually happens- the split. I felt like Carrie with Big from Sex and the City. I turned into someone unrecognisable, needy, anxious and less confident. Please be wary, the last thing you need is a broken heart 💔 xxx

I've seen it happen with my friends. And it's happened to me.
Tbh men are simple and when they fall for someone they fall hard and fast.
I just wouldn't wait.

Hi op,

I met my DP at your age and we have a child together. He told me he loved me first and I didn't say it back. There was no major reason, I didn't stress about it, I just wasn't there yet. I did think I would be there. He actually continued telling me and I never felt there was any pressure to reciprocate, it was actually lovely to hear. Then one day it just came out so naturally, I hadn't planned to say it, I just felt overcome with love.

In terms of how long should you wait to hear it - I'd say when it becomes a problem for you.

Also please consider that the word means different things to you both. He has been clear that its expressing an intention of lifelong commitment. So really he probably does reciprocate your feelings, he just describes them differently.

I wholeheartedly agree by the way in your approach of being clear in what you want from a man - he either meets your standards or he doesn't. It is the furthest thing from needy or desperate.

I'm genuinely surprised that the OP is apparently 37. She sounds much younger 😳

Perhaps the OP is getting tetchy because she's worried that this latest guy won't actually be ready to have kids with her since he's 'delaying' saying he loves her, and because she doesn't want to relay her concerns directly to him, she's taking out her frustrations on us. Fair enough if she doesn't agree with some posters but very immature and rude the way she's responded to some of them when she was the one who came here to canvas opnions in the first place! I think a lot of posters have made some really pertinent points here, including red flags that have already appeared early on in the relationship. At 37 you have no time to waste if you want kids and just sticking fingers in your ear to ignore what you don't want to hear will only be to your detriment.

I don't know. Ok, yes, people take time etc. I wouldn't give it ages though. I just noticed when I came to think of it that every brilliant relationship I have had started with BOTH of us falling for each other around the same time. Sure, sometimes I took a bit longer to say those words, but it wasn't ages. Also, every relationship that made feel really anxious and odd was because he was somehow not really into it in some way.

I'm not saying he doesn't care for you, I don't know him! But take care of yourself. Be ready to walk away if you're insecure,unhappy, whatever.

OP, I recommend the book "Mr Good Enough" by Lori Gottlieb. She actually ended up having a child via sperm donor but regretted not focusing on dating the right type of men instead, and she gives practical advice on how to go about finding and assessing guys to find one who is truly compatible with you. There's still time to meet a guy but you have to be ruthless about it and know the right things to look for.

[quote movele]@youvegottenminuteslynn because there's a whole bunch of posters on here who take great pleasure in being denigrating and seem to delight in making women feel bad for having needs and wishes different to their own. Words like 'needy', 'desperate', 'full on', nasty little digs, insults - not necessary or helpful. None of which answer my actual question!

Absolutely no chance you'd talk to people like this in person, so why do it online.

It's my thread, and I can choose to respond to whoever I want to. And if anyone reads this in the future I want them to know they are not needy for setting boundaries and having standards.[/quote]
For the same reason you’ve posted on an anonymous Internet forum— so that frankness isn’t tempered by a desire not to hurt the feelings of someone they know and love?

OP, you have a schedule. He doesn’t. He’s also managed to remain remarkably relationship-free for a man of his age. That’s absolutely a choice — being a medic, even in a particularly stressful specialism, makes no one a monk. I have a lot of doctor friends of my age — late 40s — and they’re all without exception married or in longterm partnerships, several with other medics, and have children.

The only male friend of mine who’d only had a single relationship by his 40s ended up being ‘encouraged’ into a commitment by his longterm girlfriend whom he had seen at weekends for eight years with no progression — it ended up the predictable clusterfuck.

I both understand why you’re in a hurry and why he’s not ready for any declarations. Don’t invest too much or for too long.

OP, first of all well done on great self esteem and boundaries. Its to be commended. Never ever lose it!!

Second of all, do you genuinely love him? What is love for you? You don't have to answer it on here but think about it.

For me personally, love is being there for someone through the darkest hour. If my partner was to tell me he had a degenerative life limiting disease meaning he would need to be nursed around the clock, I would do it. No questions asked.
I would wipe his backside and take a break from work and give him my all.
If he needed expensive treatment on another continent then I would sell my house in order to get it.
That to me is what love is.

Can you honesty say (hand on heart), that after 4 months, if he turned up on your door and said he had 5 years to live, you would forget about having biological babies, give up your job and become his carer full time until he passes?
After 4 months, would you?

If you have any assets, would you sell them all to give him treatments, after 4 months?

If he needed a kidney would you hand on heart give him yours after 4 months?

To me this is what true love is. You must truly know someone in order to honestly be able to give that kind of love.

Dont get me wrong, that kind of love is not unconditional if my partner became abusive or cheated then I would split and seperate myself from him. I'd still love him as it is deep. But I still have my boundaries.

That to me is true healthy love with healthy boundaries.

If you would honesty do all this for him after 4 months then wow, you truly are in love and I hope it works out for you.

If he is like me and views that as his version of 'real love' then it won't happen after 4 months. It can't possibly. But it can come, in time.

I'm aware you don't have time due to fertility. But maybe you could both compromise with that. Maybe he'd still be happy to have a child with you whilst still falling into that deep kind of love? If you both really want kids then its a win/win for both you regardless of if your relationship works out and you'd be great co parents?

I hope you don't find my post condescending as its not meant to be. I wish you well

My DH was like that, he struggled initially because he finds attachment hard, after a few months it was fine. You're kinda overthinking it, although you will have to learn to accept the lack of comms. In an emergency my DH is the last person I'd call because he wouldn't pick up, and sometimes that can be quite tough. When my father died it took me two hours to get hold of him. I had to book flights quickly so I went alone, which I was pretty annoyed about. Well, maybe the bit where he hadn't heard what I said and said "oh, so do you want me to come home? I've just got a drink"...

Ignore the harsh replies on here, they love to pile on. I hope things work out, i'm sure he will say it in time, just try to relax and keep doing as you are, he does sound serious and committed.

I think you’re moving too fast

Hang on....harsh replies? It's people opinions from life experiences and it's not simply being mean for the sake of it.
Personally if you're posting on a forum then things aren't right or deep down you're not happy with the situation
I think it's red flag galore and I wouldn't be giving reassurance because that's what OP ultimately wants.
I wouldn't want my time with this guy.

Not all replies but some like 'well I can see why he's not already in love with you ' are just vile.

So ive not rtft, but read as far to the point where you say you want advice on one person having stronger feelings than the other. And wanted to point out that this isnt neccessarily the case

Youve admitted yourself that you dont put as much meaning in the words as you perhaps should, have said it before, caught up in a nice day etc etc. Your dp takes a lot of time to be sure of his feelings, that it isnt infatuation, and that when he says it itll mean forever.

So the use of the words doesnt mean unequal feelings. You might feel exactly the same about each other, just that you class that as love, but he doesnt. Doesnt mean his feelings for you are less than yours for him, just that he doesnt want to assign the L word to them yet.

Same way that people have different threshold for other emotive words, one persons 'horrific' might be 'annoying' to another etc etc.

Actions can speak louder than words on times, from everything you've said about describing him , especially from your 11 day bike tour , I would definitly say he loves you , even if he hasn't said it yet!

It's been four months of course he isnt in love yet!

I told my partner early on that I loved him he didn't say it back at the time I said it he just said 'thank you' hurt like hell hahaha

However I hung in there as everything was great and he said it two months later and he said he just wanted to be sure. We've now been together 7 years two kids and a dog.

Maybe just give it time if everything's going well he may just need a bit more time to feel sure and that's not a bad thing.

OP, everyone has a different experience. There are many stories on here of men not changing and committing and there's a reason they're single. I used to be very much of that view until I met DH.

He was 36 when I met him and 37 when we got together. I was 27/28. He had never had a relationship before me and had never had a girlfriend. He was very career motivated and very much a workaholic. All things that raise flags for other PPs here, and would have raised flags for me too.

However, he never had a serious relationship because he was genuinely unlucky in love. He never met a girl at university or at work when he was younger, and as he got older, that knocked his confidence. It then meant he wasn't actively looking for a relationship because he thought he would end up alone. And because of that, he dedicated his life to work, because he had nothing else. All his family and friends lived far away and he was alone in London. He genuinely thought he may get lucky when he's older and meet a divorcee but he accepted that he may never get to have a family. It breaks my heart when I think about what he went through.

After we first hung out together a couple of times, he tried pushing me away because he reached the point of being scared of a relationship. I only stuck around because my gut instinct said so (a feeling I had never had before - if someone rejects me, they never see me again!), and now we're married and have a baby on the way.

In today's day and age, it is so much harder to meet someone and date, and there are men and women who hit their mid and late 30s and just haven't settled down. Doesn't mean there is anything wrong with them.

He may just be so used to being alone, that it takes him a while to appreciate he now has someone in his life who cares for him. Follow your gut. Give it time. He may just be insecure and not used to having someone care about him this way.

@movele my BF told me after 3 months but he went round the houses saying it and could tell it was not something he said lightly. But to be honest the lack of communication when you don’t see each other would bother me more than if he hadn’t said I love you by 4 months. I agree you need that communication when you aren’t together and I find it odd people are saying it’s needy. I wouldn’t want to be with someone who took “days off” and didn’t contact me at all. Shows lack of investment.

He reminds me of someone I dated. IME when a man is really in to you, you don’t doubt it for a second, it’s shown in their behaviour. They don’t need to be promoted to text/ call, they’re chomping at the bit to speak to you.

The guy I dated I think had avoidance issues. After I got away, with a knock to my self confidence, he persued me relentlessly. By this point I had met someone else who left me in no doubt about their feelings. I shudder at the state my self esteem could have been in if I’d stayed with the avoidant man.

In your shoes, I’d make moves on the donor route. There is decades ahead of you to meet a man, but your fertility is precious.

Prompted not promoted.

what's the rush?

If you really love him, you'll wait .