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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

He says it's not cheating...

175 replies

tiredofthisshit · 23/11/2020 14:18

Warning - long.
Big back story to this. I've name changed too because I'm embarrassed and disappointed, mostly in myself but I'll get to that.

Been married for 2 and a bit years, together for five. Two children, DD2 yrs and DS8 months and our eldest son would have been 3, he was stillborn in 2017, he was our first child.

We've been through hell and back together, losing our first baby was the worst thing to ever have to experience and it did bring us closer together which is probably why I have forgiven things in the past.

There have been indiscretions on his part before, apparently nothing physical - I found images in his phone, photos of himself exposed, which he had sent to a supposed random woman he had found through a dating chat website sort of thing. At the time of me finding them, the messages were historical and there was no clear evidence that it was a long term thing. More of a photo exchange for kicks and to wank off to.

He claimed that this was something he had always done and viewed this as porn essentially. There was no intention of ever meeting said woman and she wasn't the first one he had done this with. He viewed it as just the same as going on a website and watching a porn video. I told him I didn't think it was the same at all and I wasn't comfortable with it.
This was in 2017 when I was pregnant with our first son who passed away.

After he was born, the relationship felt as if it had evolved and become something else. I was as dependent on him as he was me, for support more than anything. It felt as if no one else in the world knew our pain and so we stuck together. He proposed to me a month or so after our son was born and I said yes. We were married the following September. Nothing has happened since then to arouse any suspicions, however I've always had it at the back of my mind and I haven't been able to trust him 100%. I think I thought he would probably be doing something similar but I just didn't really think about it. Having two young children it was perhaps too painful and inconvenient if I was to discover anything more. I don't know.

Fast forward to last night.
We decided to set up a family app sharing thing on our phones. He was due to go on a work trip and I had an app that would be of use so we set it up so he could download it for free off my account. In doing this it gave him access to see all the apps I have ever downloaded on my phone. It gave me the same for his phone.

I was having an idle look through his to see if he had anything useful. We were sat next to each other at the time, it wasn't a sneaky thing, he was looking at mine too. Anyway, I see a dating and hook up app, downloaded 2019. Then another, downloaded in 2018 (just before I had our daughter). Then a secret file app for hiding photos etc, downloaded 2 weeks after our wedding.

I asked him to explain. He got mad, said he was "sick of this" and that he was "done". More claims of it "just being porn" and that I was somehow irrational. All the things you'd expect a found out guilty party to say. He didn't really explain very well and it didn't make me feel as though it was an ok thing to be doing. I didn't feel irrational, I felt pissed off. With myself for being stupid enough to think he'd stop and with him of course for being a nasty, disrespectful piece of work.

He's gone on his work trip. We haven't spoken since. He's away for three days and I'm taking the opportunity to get a feel of what being a single mum is like because I think that's where it's headed. I'm not worried about caring for the children by myself. I do that anyway pretty much as he works practically every hour that god sends. He doesn't do any night feeds, nothing during work hours. He's present for one hour between 6-7pm and that's it. Weekends vary, he sometimes works them too.

I am a SAHM, I have been since I had my daughter 2 years ago. She doesn't go to nursery yet and I have no job. My main concerns are financial as he holds all the money. I would like to hope he wouldn't be a bastard about paying for the kids but I don't want to rely on that either. I understand there are certain benefits etc but I don't really know what I would need to apply for. I have no family. My parents are abusive bastards and we don't speak. So he is literally the only other adult I have. I do have friends but none close by.

Don't really know what the question is here. Time to pack his bags? If I forgive him he's just going to carry on doing it and making me feel worthless. He didn't care last night he was just stomping his feet and trying to make himself out to be the victim, whilst crowing "I haven't cheated".

Im at the "I don't feel anything about this" stage.

OP posts:
tiredofthisshit · 26/11/2020 12:38

I've got an appointment later today with a solicitor. I'm feeling pretty low and emotional today. I think it's all becoming real. Might feel better when I've got more information from the appointment.

OP posts:
tiredofthisshit · 26/11/2020 12:40

I just wanted to say thank you to all of you for all the support and advice. I do appreciate it really I do. I haven't spoken about this to anyone in RL yet so this is helping

OP posts:
QuentinWinters · 26/11/2020 12:42

Good luck tired. His attitude yesterday just shows how little he respects you, you deserve better.
I often wonder whether my exH still enjoys his cam habit as much now he's single and doesn't have my income to spend on it. These men are so entitled.

tiredofthisshit · 26/11/2020 15:29

Spoke to the solicitors. I feel a bit clearer about what's what now. I completely broke down on the phone to her but she was really lovely and helpful. I suppose all that's left to do now is have the talk of doom. That will probably come tonight when the kids are in bed.

OP posts:
Newwayofthinking · 26/11/2020 16:05

Good luck for later, hand hold x

QuentinWinters · 26/11/2020 16:28

No rush, if you don't feel ready to do it yet don't and bide your time til you are ready. There's no particular reason it has to be tonight. Well done for speaking to solicitors Flowers

tiredofthisshit · 26/11/2020 16:56

I don't think I want to drag it out any longer than it has to be. When he came home from work today I felt so shitty i cried (again!)
I think part of it is not knowing what's happening for definite. I'm a bit of a planner, I like to know what's going on and what to expect.

OP posts:
tiredofthisshit · 26/11/2020 23:43

So we had a talk, I decided I was going to say nothing and let him explain.

He reckons he never used the apps. He thinks he probably downloaded one to see if there was anyone real actually on it. He said he's certain he never used them for any sort of sexual behaviour. He tried to make it out as a jokey type thing. I could perhaps believe that if it was one app. But two? And one was downloaded in 2018 and the other in 2019. It just doesn't ring true to me.

I then asked him about the secret folder app. He reckons he downloaded that because he thought it was the same one he had a long time ago and wanted to make sure that there was no old photos or data on there.
I smell bullshit.
If he didn't have the app on his phone anyway as he had deleted it, then why would he be concerned about there am being anything on it? Because it wouldn't be there. And he reckoned it was the wrong one anyway, but he'd know which one he had previously downloaded because it would have the cloud symbol next to it rather than the "get" or "buy" button.

The youngest woke up anyway and that was as far as we got. I didn't want to discuss it any further with baby around. They pick up on stuff don't they and I didn't want to make him upset.

I'm going to bed now. I feel like there is more to be said on it all. He's off all day tomorrow and will be around the house. I think I might go out.

OP posts:
Mrsmummy90 · 26/11/2020 23:46

All the usual bullshit lies that I heard a million times from my ex who was on loads of meet-for-sex sites.
He said it was all just porn to him but no, he was messaging girls and sleeping with them.

Best thing I did was leave him

Ariesbaby89 · 27/11/2020 01:08

Most men watch porn, as you know anyone can access this on the internet. I’ve watched porn, but I would never send nude pictures of myself to other men- that’s cheating. Having any dating apps on his phone from the moment you were official is cheating. Having apps that hide things IS (you guessed it) cheating. Don’t listen to the bullshit, he knows damn well it’s cheating.

If you decide to stay with this POS, please download some dating apps (you don’t have to use them!) and make a nice quirky profile with a lovely pic. Then take some sexy pics hide them on your phone and purposely let him see, and then come back to us with whether he thinks this is cheating.

Lamppostcat · 27/11/2020 02:32

Yes it may be true that most women have seen porn . SOME may even watch it regularly as I’m sure we will hear but MANY if not MOSt men are watching it a hell of a LOT and the type of porn that is clearly finding a market is very questionable ... incest porn , barely legal and heaps of stuff where women are being blantabtly used and disrespected .
I highly doubt that many women who even watch porn are enjoying this TYPE of porn and herein I think lies the issue where men are crossing lines and think anything goes nowadays .
Everything including chats webcams and to becomes part of this sick world where women’s sole purpose is to be a series of holes to serve men’s sexual appetites . They lose touch with reality

Suzi888 · 27/11/2020 02:45

Sorry for what you are going through, seeing a solicitor is the best way forward. If he’s self employed then it is likely that he can fudge his accounts and be treated as low income.
You’d be entitled to claim Universal Credit, tax credits would be paid within it and also housing costs if you rented. You could also claim council tax support/benefit. I’d give universal credit a call and see what the rates are in your area. Your council can provide you with advice on housing, if need assistance.

cosmicbabe · 27/11/2020 11:13

They problem is he will lie until the end. That just what happens. Damage limitations. Big hug xx

GabsAlot · 27/11/2020 13:30

he downloaded it again to make sure there was nothing there

yeah ok then

TheTeaCosyofDoom · 27/11/2020 16:26

The smell of bullshit is overpowering, darling. And the more bullshit he adds to the heap, the more it will stink - and hurt. So I wouldn't spend too long talking and expecting the truth. If my experience is anything to go by, it will be a long-winded waste of time.

It's very easy for him to say that he would be unaffected if you did the same as he has done. The difference between you and him is that he hasn't had to face the reality of it. Words are cheap.

You must put yourself and the kids first now. Make sure the solicitor is the one for you - I 'trialed' two before I found one that seemed on the same wavelength.

Good luck Flowers

PartoftheProbl3m · 27/11/2020 17:54

How on earth did you get to a state where you don’t share money?!

canthide · 27/11/2020 18:11

Sorry that you are going through this op. His lies and defensiveness are bad enough but there may be more that you will never know. As many have said here cheaters never tell everything and the more denials only make you more suspicious. If it was only porn then the dating apps wouldn't be there, twice a year apart.

tiredofthisshit · 27/11/2020 23:49

Thanks for everyone's input. I'm taking my time to work out how best to play it for my childrens sake as well as my own sanity. I don't know what to do right now with Christmas looming, I don't want to ruin that for the children and I am almost tempted to play along until that is done with and I get the roof fixed with his money.
In the mean time I will try to squirrel away any extra money I can in a separate pot so I have a little cushion if needs be. I'm quite prepared to pawn my engagement and wedding rings too and they're worth a few Bob.

I am worried the longer I leave it the harder it will become. I don't want to just let it settle and be swept under the carpet - he doesn't deserve to be let off that lightly.

I looked back at the app list this evening and all the offending apps have disappeared. It would appear that there is a "hide" function, which he can control for his list and I am unable to see what is hidden. (I can do the same on mine). This obviously hadn't been used prior to my discoveries or else we wouldn't be here.

I don't know if that is significant or if it even really matters at this stage. Does it make him more or less guilty? I don't know. Do I even care? Not really.

I feel flat and weird.

OP posts:
QuentinWinters · 28/11/2020 10:02

The flatness is your brain protecting you because this is a very hard situation.
I think staying for Christmas and getting the roof sorted is entirely reasonable. You can spend that time observing and seeing how he behaves. Is he showing any concern at all that you are upset?
You are doing so well, trust yourself to do whats best at the right time. This stuff is hard

yetmorecrap · 28/11/2020 10:47

Just to give you an idea my H (at a point I knew he was watching quite hardcore porn virtually every day when I was out but didn’t know I still had the child blocks on- but blocking nothing ) as part of a very casual conversation I asked him if he watched it much— his responsexwithout blinking an eye ‘ maybe very very occasionally’ . This from a bloke who is usually very honest about stuff. To be honest that annoyed me way more than being upfront about it. Your H is feeding you a load of bull and I think you know it. What a twat- the lying when caught out ideas vad as what he is up to.

tiredofthisshit · 28/11/2020 14:40

He's not really showing concern, he's just burying his head and carrying on like nothing has happened, which is standard for him. Any time we have a disagreement about anything that's his usual reaction.

OP posts:
QuentinWinters · 01/12/2020 09:34

How are things tired?

tiredofthisshit · 01/12/2020 12:01

I'm treading water @QuentinWinters - but I'm doing ok thank you.
We did have a more serious chat a few nights ago. I told him I didn't believe what he had told me but I felt that I would never really know the truth. He apologised for hurting me and upsetting me, it was never his intention blah blah. I didn't really give much away with regards splitting up, I want to get Christmas sorted and out of the way and the roof too. I did tell him that I am incredibly unhappy though and that the relationship as it is, is not what I want long term. He's making an effort to be better. I'll let him keep doing that. I'm managing to put a bit of money aside too. He's taken a chunk out of the business and given it to me for xmas shopping.

OP posts:
TheTeaCosyofDoom · 01/12/2020 13:47

Well done you.

Make hay while the sun shines: keep feathering your nest while you have him on the back foot.

Look after yourself and the little ones.

Mrsmummy90 · 01/12/2020 18:49

Well done for staying so calm and getting your ducks in a row xx

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