He says it's not cheating...

[tiredofthisshit]

Warning - long.
Big back story to this. I've name changed too because I'm embarrassed and disappointed, mostly in myself but I'll get to that.

Been married for 2 and a bit years, together for five. Two children, DD2 yrs and DS8 months and our eldest son would have been 3, he was stillborn in 2017, he was our first child.

We've been through hell and back together, losing our first baby was the worst thing to ever have to experience and it did bring us closer together which is probably why I have forgiven things in the past.

There have been indiscretions on his part before, apparently nothing physical - I found images in his phone, photos of himself exposed, which he had sent to a supposed random woman he had found through a dating chat website sort of thing. At the time of me finding them, the messages were historical and there was no clear evidence that it was a long term thing. More of a photo exchange for kicks and to wank off to.

He claimed that this was something he had always done and viewed this as porn essentially. There was no intention of ever meeting said woman and she wasn't the first one he had done this with. He viewed it as just the same as going on a website and watching a porn video. I told him I didn't think it was the same at all and I wasn't comfortable with it.
This was in 2017 when I was pregnant with our first son who passed away.

After he was born, the relationship felt as if it had evolved and become something else. I was as dependent on him as he was me, for support more than anything. It felt as if no one else in the world knew our pain and so we stuck together. He proposed to me a month or so after our son was born and I said yes. We were married the following September. Nothing has happened since then to arouse any suspicions, however I've always had it at the back of my mind and I haven't been able to trust him 100%. I think I thought he would probably be doing something similar but I just didn't really think about it. Having two young children it was perhaps too painful and inconvenient if I was to discover anything more. I don't know.

Fast forward to last night.
We decided to set up a family app sharing thing on our phones. He was due to go on a work trip and I had an app that would be of use so we set it up so he could download it for free off my account. In doing this it gave him access to see all the apps I have ever downloaded on my phone. It gave me the same for his phone.

I was having an idle look through his to see if he had anything useful. We were sat next to each other at the time, it wasn't a sneaky thing, he was looking at mine too. Anyway, I see a dating and hook up app, downloaded 2019. Then another, downloaded in 2018 (just before I had our daughter). Then a secret file app for hiding photos etc, downloaded 2 weeks after our wedding.

I asked him to explain. He got mad, said he was "sick of this" and that he was "done". More claims of it "just being porn" and that I was somehow irrational. All the things you'd expect a found out guilty party to say. He didn't really explain very well and it didn't make me feel as though it was an ok thing to be doing. I didn't feel irrational, I felt pissed off. With myself for being stupid enough to think he'd stop and with him of course for being a nasty, disrespectful piece of work.

He's gone on his work trip. We haven't spoken since. He's away for three days and I'm taking the opportunity to get a feel of what being a single mum is like because I think that's where it's headed. I'm not worried about caring for the children by myself. I do that anyway pretty much as he works practically every hour that god sends. He doesn't do any night feeds, nothing during work hours. He's present for one hour between 6-7pm and that's it. Weekends vary, he sometimes works them too.

I am a SAHM, I have been since I had my daughter 2 years ago. She doesn't go to nursery yet and I have no job. My main concerns are financial as he holds all the money. I would like to hope he wouldn't be a bastard about paying for the kids but I don't want to rely on that either. I understand there are certain benefits etc but I don't really know what I would need to apply for. I have no family. My parents are abusive bastards and we don't speak. So he is literally the only other adult I have. I do have friends but none close by.

Don't really know what the question is here. Time to pack his bags? If I forgive him he's just going to carry on doing it and making me feel worthless. He didn't care last night he was just stomping his feet and trying to make himself out to be the victim, whilst crowing "I haven't cheated".

Im at the "I don't feel anything about this" stage.

I would get some proper good legal advice when he is away regarding the house and the business and what would be up for splitting and take it from there

And to find a lawyer? Google?

Maybe I am old fashioned but I don't like porn. I've never watched it and I wouldn't put up with a man who does. Porn has a victim, usually a trafficked or exploited woman and/or one who has been abused her self. Porn watchers enable this.

He went ape because he was rumbled. It is a classic reaction to being caught doing something. He is gaslighting you.

It is easier said than down ending it with him. I'd ask him to go to counselling first and see a sex therapist and then form there, split if no improvement.

firstly you need a family law solicitor . And many of them give a free hour. Gather as much financial info and questions as you can before you go in .
Check out reviews on local ones.
Then citizens advice about benefits because he seems the type that is going to wriggle out of all responsibility .

@WokesFromHome

I agree with you to a certain extent - but he did this while she was pregnant and just after marriage and has no empathy for her feelings or opinion at all . I would be doubting his sincerity about going to counselling .

I don't think you will find many people who would call this porn because it's not. If it's obtained through a dating site, then there is a real woman on the other side of this who he could presumably see in real life. A woman who may not be aware that he is married and that he is just using them. Shows a nasty streak at the very least. Also think most women would consider this cheating. I would.

We've already been to counselling - we went years ago and it did seem to help a little bit.

His problems stem from childhood. Without trying to psychoanalyse him, he was pushed from pillar to post, his mum abandoned him and told him she no longer wanted him aged 5/6. I have a feeling he was sexually abused, a weird thing to assume, however some details have recently come to light which I won't go into further, but it would make a lot of sense if he was abused in this way. As a consequence of this he has no respect for women, he's shown this time and time again.

I'm sure many people would say "why the fuck would you marry someone like that" and the truth is, because I loved him. Because we had been on this rollercoaster together through some of the darkest times and I could see the good in him.

Sadly it seems to have got to a stage where I can't see past the shit anymore. It's here, staring me in the face. No matter how shit you've had things, you can't make excuses for inexcusable behaviour.

It gets me the most as I've invested so much time and emotional stress from helping this person and yet they still treat me like a piece of shit on their shoe. It feels so unfair.

@tiredofthisshit

No access to any money at all. He runs his own business and he's the company director. He doesn't take a wage either and has no taxable income, so if he doesn't willingly pay for the children, going to the CMS will be pointless because he will be judged as a zero earner

Photocopy all the accounts then 50% of the company is yours.

I’m so sorry you lost your little boy.

He’s kidding himself if he thinks this isn’t cheating, not to mention trying to gaslight you into thinking that it’s something and nothing.

My best advice would be seek legal advice, as this will be the. OST accurate and useful.

Be strong, you’ll get through this 💐

You need to go through all the paperwork you can while he is away... bank statements that show money coming in.. he must be paying himself a basic wage as director and then topped up with dividends.. what sort of lifestyle do you lead? Could he be hiding money?

I paid £150 to see a solicitor when my marriage broke down. I took all the paperwork I had.. should you go for divorce all bank accounts and assets have to be declared, bank statements have to be provided for the last 12 months from both of you. The courts main priority in terms of finance will be to ensure the children are provided for. The fact you are married gives you much more protection.

I was like you, a SAHM and when I found out about my husbands infidelity, I was in complete panic about money. He had everything.. Get your ducks in a row and see if you can get some legal advice and then you can plan what you’re going to do. Knowledge is power!

I managed to keep the house and I started my own cleaning business. This was 4 years ago, it’s not been easy but my mental health has improved so much. Not having to wonder where he is, who he’s messaging, why he doesn’t want to sleep with me, the lies, the deceit. It made me feel like shit and for all the pain and heartache I am in better place but it’s not easy xxx

I'm sorry to hear what you're dealing with. You definitely deserve much much better than this.

It seems like you want to leave him and it looks like the right decision to me. And everyone else.

I get some universal credits. Entitled to is pretty accurate.

You would get:
single person element £409.89
first child £281.25
second child £235.83

total: £926.97

Which isn't great when you have a mortgage. If you rent, you do get help with this but i have a mortgage too and they dont provide any housing support if you do.

I work part time and this helps. Basically you can earn up to around £512 before they deduct any of your allowance. After this figure, for every pound you earn, they take 63p off your allowance.

Then, if you work over 16 hours they will add 85% of your childcare costs into your allowance. Up to £1108 for 2 children.

So the best option is finding a part time job. Say 24 hours per week. You then get most of your nursery fees back through universal credits.

Hope that helps.
I know its too much to think about but i know that once i knew i could keep afloat on my own, i had the strength to actually leave.

Good Luck with everything!!!

Whether he believed it’s cheating or not (I’m with you on this) it’s something that he knew wasn’t acceptable in the relationship.

Call CAB. They were great when I was in a similar situation.

Your one problem that I can see - besides a useless asshole of a husband is that because you own your home you won’t get any help with your mortgage for around 9months and then after that only the Interest is paid .
Maybe work out what the mortgage will cost you for a year see if you can get that amount together to cover the mortgage payments somehow then switch to interest only when that period kicks in on UC

I'm sorry you're going through this @tiredofthisshit what an awful position you must feel you are in.
I think firstly you need to decide if you want this relationship to end - or if you think it's worth working on. Only you can decide this. The advice on this thread is almost overwhelmingly telling you to end it - but don't end things just because a load of randoms on the internet are telling you too. Hope that makes sense.
Like others have said - it is up to you to decide if your husbands behaviour constitutes cheating - he doesn't get to decide for you. His reaction is definitely gas lighting and he is deflecting his guilt at being caught out onto you. From what you have said you have no idea if this habit was still going on recently - or ended some time ago. Would that make a difference to you in deciding whether the relationship should end?
I think the other issue here is the amount of control he has with your finances. You say you owned the house before your marriage and you had a good job in the past so you clearly have a decent head on your shoulders. Don't let his control make you oblivious to these things - get informed!
It may be an idea to use these few days he is away and find out what you can about his business and the household finances. See what you can find around the house. These days I guess its likely all the banking is on-line so you're unlikely to be able to find bank statements lying around but see if you can find anything else and take a photo of them. Be careful though - do you have a family "cloud" storage? If you do any photos you take may well get uploaded to that and he may see what you're taking photos of. Do you have access to your household current account, passwords etc?
Take things one step at a time, decide what you want to do, think what your future might look like if you separate, find out what you can about the finances, then and only after you've done the above find a solicitor. Again - beware of cookies - what you search for on Google will follow you everywhere!!

@Babdoc

The only good thing this bloke has done is marry you. Because that means you are financially safeguarded, and entitled to half the marital assets. Plus he will have to pay maintenance for the children. So you may be better off, post divorce, than you think. See a solicitor and get some advice on your position. Then you will have the facts you need to make your decision. He really doesn’t sound like much of a partner - you rarely see him, he’s either working, or sending dick pics to other women. Are there any reasons to stay with him?

This.

He's a shit partner and a shit father. You don't want your DC growing up with this as their model of what a marriage can be.

You deserve better.

Repost in legal and get a RL solicitor ASAP. As far as I know, 50-50 division of assets is NOT automatic where the marriage has only been of short duration.

Agree with pp - spend this work trip going through the house with a fine tooth comb and photographing every single financial paper you can find before he gets back.

I also agree with pp that the financial set-up you're describing sounds (as) dodgy as fuck and (b) potentially financially abusive.

@tiredofthisshit have a look at www.entitledto.co.uk it's really accurate and straightforward. Also, as a single parent you're entitled to 15/18 free childcare hours once your child turns 2 rather than 3.
Also, we had to sell our house when my ex and I broke up, because I couldn't afford to buy him out. But when I spoke to the council after we'd sold they asked why I hadn't contacted them sooner so they could help me stay in the house! So wondering if they provide some sort of benefit to help pay your mortgage!?

You sound incredibly brave!

The business will be valued by an independent accountant firm. The court will award you a proportion of the assets. It makes no difference whose names they are in. However as you have only been married a relatively short time they will take into account what he had of his own before you were married. That said he will be made to pay child maintenance for his kids.

He had nothing before we got together. He started the company around three years ago, at which point we were living together. Don't know if that makes a difference or not. He had a house etc but sold that when he moved in with me

The short version of the accounts are available from Companies House - they don't give you any detail but will give you some information about what figures he is putting through the books. If you are getting more than £2k in dividends each year out of the company you should be doing a self assessment.

@notapizzaeater

I'd be packing his bags tbh. He's not bringing anything other than money to the relationship.,

Yep agree. He knows he is in wrong that's why he's mad at you. Get rid. Just think how peaceful your life would be without the worry of him. He sounds gross. Let him know women don't like dick pics they aren't in the least attractive 🤢

Don't let him bamboozle you into being swayed in any way and questioning whether his cheating behaviour crosses a line or not. He doesn't even believe his own hype. Can you imagine him telling his friends and colleagues 'oh she got annoyed just because I signed up to online dating sites, talked to women on there and exchanged nude pictures which I wanked to. How unreasonable is she?! - no, he wouldn't say this, because he knows how bad this behaviour is.

The reason I am anti saying to any guy that ‘ I am ok with porn’ is that if it’s used a lot is many guys, if they think you are ‘ok with porn’ , then fail to mentally grasp that you ‘really aren’t Ok’ with ‘personalised porn’ , be it webcamming or hook up sites Or sexting — to some of them - the hard of thinking variety ‘ it’s ‘all porn’ — and the only way it’s cheating is if they are meeting up and shagging - OP he won’t change