Dating Thread 196 - Winter Wonderland Walks

[Dancerinthemoonlight]

The Rules:

1. The first rule about the dating thread is don't talk about it with people you're dating.
2. Develop a thick skin.
3. Do not invest emotionally too soon.
4. It's all BS until it actually happens.
5. Trust your gut instinct.
6. People vanishing, lying & being generally weird is not your fault.
7. Know your worth.
8. If it's not fun, stop.
9. Loo update is mandatory.

10. No dating the thread. 11. Treat others as you'd like to be treated 12. Any relationship you have that could get ruined by having a conversation about your feelings, standards and/or expectations wasn't really stable enough to begin with 13. The things you choose to ignore/ tolerate now are the reasons you will break up in the future 14. OLD can get very time consuming. Keep doing other activities you enjoy.

Optional: Please give your irons (potential dates you are talking to) nicknames like Mr Scottish. Initials are allowed (Mr S) when you are an item

Whoknows11 Going on and on about sex after date #2, especially if it's not reciprocated, is tedious and disrespectful. I don't think it bodes well

@Whoknows11 actions always speak louder than words. If he's not just after sex, then he wouldn't need to say it - you'd know.

@LongtimelurkerL Here's my take on it. A year ago I wouldn't even have considered swiping a woman who had kids - I saw them as baggage. Then a few comments on here changed my mind, and I decided to open my mind to the possibility. I ended up dating someone for 9 months (until recently) who had children, and she was lovely. OK it didn't work out, but I would have missed out on meeting an amazing woman if I had stuck to my selection criteria.

In my experience (so this is a massive generalisation based on the small number of women I've dated) there is often a reason a women who wants kids hasn't had them or been married by the time they are mid-late 30's or early 40's. Whether that is because they have focused on their career or haven't been able to form a long-term relationship, these reasons are usually not easily changed, so are likely to cause issues going forward. Obviously this doesn't apply to everyone (and equally applies to guys in the same situation including myself), but it does seem to be a common perception with a few of my friends who are single too.

Women who have had children more often have their shit together, and don't have impossible requirements for their perfect guy. It also takes a lot of amazing qualities to bring up a child.

The only thing that would put me off is if they were unable to spend any time with me, however I quite like my own space too so it's not an issue if I can't see someone every day.

And I've realised kids aren't baggage. They're part of someone's life. If I like that person enough, then that's just something I need to accept. We all have something that could be referred to as baggage. But it's just part of us, and who we are.

Had video chat with Mr Festival. I was hoping he'd float my boat but he really didn't. And I've had three glasses of wine so beer goggles. Wine goggles. Nice bloke and everything. Good for a laugh down the pub. Can't see myself ever fancying him though. A nice mouth is a big thing for me and his is a bit Wallace/Gromit (never sure who's who). I feel like I should meet up for the walk just to make sure. You don't get the benefit of a tall man on a screen. Maybe he smells nice. Maybe a bear hug will change my mind. I really want to like him. He's a lovely man. I don't know. I'll sleep on it.

Loving all the ginger love speaking as a ginger (though I prefer redhead 👩🏻‍🦰) and mother to 2 further gingers 😊
@WeWantTheFinestWines I’m a bit the same about the latest guy I’m speaking to. He’s lovely, really my type of humour, consistent, taller than me, intelligent but I don’t know if I fancy him. I met him that once standing outside for coffee and we got on great but don’t know about a spark.
Then I think about the major spark I felt with Mr Blue eyes over the summer and how that ended up
Also we didn’t as much as brush hands so I want to kiss him to see what it’s like. Wanting to kiss him is a good sign I think?
I think he deserves a name as the chats are continuing so I’ll call him Mr Tourguide based on our funny conversation this evening.

@LongtimelurkerL

I’m really struggling to know why any man would choose me over a non single mother - and it sucks. I’m hot and successful but never as good as no ‘baggage’

Heh. I have the opposite problem - never married, no kids....men can't work out why, think I'm too independent etc etc. By my age (52) kids should be easier to work around so that's not so much of an issue, but it's pretty unusual never to have been married.

But when people ask how come I'm single, I say "just lucky I guess". Or, why didn't I ever get married - well, the truth is I can't see the point of it unless you have kids and I never met anyone I wanted to have kids with.

Re talking about exes - I'd hate to say we drifted apart, because we didn't and if I later need to go into more detail it would seem like I had lied. Hard to think of a quick easy phrase and then move onto another topic though!

MrC should be back on Sunday or Monday - he’s on dry land and seems quite tired but messaged to say “yes he would take photos of random stuff in X country to show me” on his way to Covid test as requested by me.

So I’m letting him Sleep and hopefully we’ll message more in the morning (my overactive imagination is wondering if he’s on a lads night out but I guess it would be hard with COVID)

Feels weird right now tbh - couple of other issues are clouding looking forward to reunion.

Temp work has been good but also turned into a bit of a nightmare getting out clear - the big boss is the work equivalent of one of those ex boyfriends who treats you like shit then sends sixteen crazy phone calls to you claiming he loves you when you make your leaving decision.

Tbh it’s not strictly on my career path so I wouldn’t have stayed anyway, but after stratospheric performance the boss is obsessed with keeping me on permanently (not an ego boost I really don’t want it and overall it’s a badly run company and the job isn’t long term desirable for me)

so it will be like Jenga trying to avoid him.

He even rang my “in case of emergency” phone number trying to track me down to claim I wasn’t allowed to leave (total nonsense contractually).

Also weather conditions are now poor and my accident this year was winter weather related so I’m feeling really paranoid and anxious about going out.

Plus the usual teenagerish worrying about getting a spot or breaking a tooth or something the day MrC is back locally.

Tomorrow morning I’m turning up late to work (clocked up those hours before for sure) and lying in bed doing coding and eating curry and having some time to settle my MH

It is so nice communicating with MrC - he’s always positive and even tempered and makes me feel confident in myself and messaging him more.

Women who have had children more often have their shit together, and don't have impossible requirements for their perfect guy.

And there you have it.

Childless women are looking for impossible perfection.
Women with children are easier to bag because they're more desperate.

@Bunkbedpeople Accident?

I also had a pretty horrific accident in the ice/snow in February and I was very nervous driving yesterday (haven't been the rest of the year)

And Mr C. He's probably just chilling ... so chill 😁

Exciting times for you @Bunkbedpeople hope you have great times with Mr C when he finally arrives.

@WeWantTheFinestWines I think I'd go for the in person meet with Mr Festival for certainty about lack of attraction but of course this will make it harder to send that thanks but no thanks message if he's then into you but you're still not.

I've got a top tip to share with everyone - hope it doesn't make me sound too mad.

A few irons ago I started keeping a log of thoughts/feelings after each interaction from first phone call. It allowed me to spot teeny red flags which may have been forgotten if I hadn't written them down.

Eg. Funny but didn't ask me any Qs

or (as noted with the new guy I had an unanticipated two hour chat with earlier this week & am due to meet tomorrow)
'Sent nice enthusiastic voice memo to me but then didn't answer my early evening texts - music sent as requested until midnight despite being online'

I find the log really useful when I part ways with an iron as easy to spot looking back at the cumulative evidence that in hindsight he either wasn't treating me as the prize, we weren't a great match or he was a total dickhead but I chose to ignore the obvious red flags.

It helps to move on and not pine.

That makes so much sense @Ruralbliss

I had a notebook when house hunting so I could write down feelings and things I noticed in home reports and on viewings

Why wouldn't I do the same when dating...
Thus I shall, might turn me into a best selling author one day 😁😁

@LongtimelurkerL - n terms of the kids issue. Got a couple myself and have them 50% so tend to gravitate towards people who will understand / put up with time issues. I’d be less concerned now they’re getting older and more independent. Also have 3 sisters, 2 have kids 1 doesn’t. Not sure who is the most sane but the one without is happy to be without and won’t date guys with kids as wants someone who is available and puts her first. Fair enough I guess.

For what to say about previous relationships I say “well obviously we had our differences but mostly water under the bridge now”. Thought that summed up inevitable mess without glossing over or sounding like I was not ok with it. Also might point out get on fine with ex but won’t be going around for dinner anytime soon as got divorced for a reason.

Love that @Ruralbliss - I wish I’d kept a log of Mr Beard as his bait and switch antics made me feel so insecure all the time but then I misremembered it and thought only about the nice times when we were together. And even they weren’t all nice, he would ignore me for ages while taking yet another endless and meaningless call from his mum/brother/daughters and hissing at me to turn my mobile off and keep quiet in case they knew I was there 🙄

@TheCatWithTheHat I think you are generalising about childless women. Of course many women don’t want children or have other priorities but I have many childless friends in their early 40s who are childless after miscarriages, through fertility problems or because despite desperately wanting to have a family they have had awful relationships. Some are quite broken about it. You never know why someone’s life has turned out like it has. And likewise not every mum is a good person. They might love their kids but be a complete arse to their husband, friends and colleagues, or be narcissistic mothers. It’s too complex to generalise about. (Although I have in bad weeks been guilty of generalising along the lines of “all men are bastards” haha! But I know it isn’t true really - despite evidence where I’m concerned!)

@Bunkbedpeople I hear you on the crazy boss scenario! But very excited for you about your reunion with Mr C!!!

Have a good Friday all x

Thanks everyone - had a bit of a wobble last night but back to being 'sane' (ish) today.

That's a great idea @Ruralbliss and I like that line @DudefromThatLondon

I just keep a new little note for each new iron on my phone with dates added as the comms roll forward

It shows Mr VW was proper rubbish from the off & stupid me for being blind to this and instead choosing to focus on his hotness.

When I think about friends without kids, almost all have just not met anyone lovely to have kids with. Initially we were all young and innocent but as time went by, I'd say yes many did have very high standards and expected Prince Charming to rock up to their door without them lifting a finger. Those who did have kids went out looking to meet people and almost made it happen. This is just my experience with my social group.

How's everyone doing for weekend dates? I'm still not seeing Mr Yoga because of his parental situation but also trying to give him space so not texting etc. We are hopefully seeing each other next weekend. It's his birthday so I have presents plus I thought I'd take the Christmas presents too in case we don't see each other. Wondering if this is overkill?

@ruralbliss I had started doing that in a notebook. Writing down name, age, location, job, what site/app we met on and the date matched. Then any observations from conversations before a first meet. Where are when the first date was and how it went.
It helped me get stronger in saying no if they wanted a second date and had red flags. Also as a reminder if they popped back up again so I could refer back to why we didn't meet again

Great minds working in a similar way there then @Dancerinthemoonlight

Glad no one thought I was a loon for being so methodical about my dating log keeping 😂😂😂

Ffs the guy I'm meeting tomorrow after great phone chat is irritating me with his dire texting style. I send text - he goes online to read then online at further times (yes I'm doing spot checks on him when I'm on WhatsApp anyway with girlfriends and there he is online) & no response.

For context he's furloughed/redundant & I'm at work chairing conf calls.

Not sure whether this is enough to bin off tomorrow's meet. It's definitely giving me the opposite of a spring in my step - a pit of dread and a yucky feel.

It's reminiscent of Mr VW dire texting style but at least he was always instantly responsive if minimal wording. And initially when trying to woo me there was textual interplay throughout the day.

On this basis I'm going to state it here that I'd be surprised if we're a good match if I do go ahead for the date tomoz.

I guess the wise thing to do might be to call it out 'I don't think our texting styles are a good match' He does not need to know it's anxiety inducing - I do not identify as an anxious person!

Don't feel brave enough to sack off the date tomorrow on this lack of prize chasing behaviour but maybe I should as practice and strengthen that weak muscle of not binning off bad boys when the v early red flags are waved.

I used to joke about having a spreadsheet with notes on all my men but now I’m thinking I’m going to do it!

I’m staying at Mr Ginger’s tomorrow night. I think he must have had to buy his kids a PS5 to make them leave the house for a weekend, or put a rocket under them 😂. I do waver about him - he is relationship material definitely apart from his home situation, and he is really nice and I do fancy him, but I think I am utterly fixated on Mr Local’s extreme sexiness. I keep thinking it will burn itself out but so far it hasn’t.

Sorry you still can’t see Mr Yoga, @Eesha. Are you going to FaceTime him or anything? Roll on this bloody vaccine!!!

Weather is hideous here, heading back from the gym and will have to properly steel myself to get my shopping and stuff done, just want to curl up in front of the fire 🔥

Have a lovely weekend all xxx

@VanGoghsDog that isn't what I said or meant. I"m in the same position as you - never married, and childless so I've had the same questions. In fact earlier this year on here I mentioned that I was surprised I wasn't being snapped up, and more than one person said they see it as a warning sign if a guy has never been married or had kids by mid-40's. I don't think there's anything wrong with me, and wouldn't like it suggested that there was so I'm sorry if you took offence at my comments.

@UtterSocks I agree I'm wildly generalising, and I said so in my post - it was just based on my own experiences. In fact, my last LTR (of 8 years) was with someone who couldn't have children for medical reasons, so I know first hand the effect that has on someone.

My point (maybe clumsily made) was that I wouldn't exclude dating a single mother, and that in my own experience, just because someone doesn't have kids doesn't mean they are a better option.

And I'm child-free and never married, so I'm talking about myself too really...

Anyway, back to the dating - I met with someone last night, and it was such a relief to be able to have a drink in a pub, with heat and toilets, and not have to walk around yet another freezing cold park! She was nice - I thought we got on well, lots of chatting and smiles and definitely fancied her. However I've not had a reply to my message last night asking if she got home OK, and saying I'd like to see her again if she wanted to. So looks like that's another one to add to the "liked but got ghosted" column

That's a good point about the spreadsheet/notes too - I've been trying to keep a diary this year, initially to record my feelings at the start of the year when I was going through the final stages of a train wreck of a relationship with Miss C. But since then I've been making notes about dates I've been on, which is quite interesting to look back on in hindsight.

@TheCatWithTheHat you're allowed in a pub? With someone you don't live with? What is this madness that I'm missing out on...?!

I have to laugh at everyone having to keep spreadsheets. I am finding it surprisingly easy to keep track of Mr Dogs, who I had two dates with and didn't fancy; Mr Driver, who just wants sex and I have decided that's not for me at this point; and Mr Festival who I am so gutted to not fancy in the tiniest after seeing him on screen and who I really don't want to kiss because I don't like his mouth. And that's the sum total of my irons that went beyond a few messages.

Yeah, still no pubs allowed here other than with your own household or support bubble. I'm going to my mum's next week and she's booked dinner out for us, paella night. She's very excited. I used to go out to eat a couple of times a week, she would go with dad probably four nights a week. Since March I've had about six meals out I think.

Once we can go to the pub I'm throwing caution to the wind and inviting the guy from my walking group to meet me at my local for lunch!

I've been chatting to someone on POF, he seems nice and pleasant and we had a phone call which was nice and he wants to go for a coffee tomorrow. He hasn't done anything wrong, he only has one picture and I'm not sure if I fancy him but that's not so much of an issue as I find I often prefer people in person over their pictures.... but.... I want to name him MrBoring! There's no excitement about him, so I'm not sure if I should go?
On the other hand, I usually go for exciting and they turn out to be unsuitable and not what I'm looking for in the long run...

@TheCatWithTheHat I'm saddened to hear your date of last night hasn't got the good grace to reply to your texts - that's rude (but she may be finding it hard to send a thanks but no thanks msg & it's because she's nice that she's not been in touch)
It does look like she's not desperate to snap you, the glorious prize that you are, up and that's a pity when you liked her.