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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Boyfriend asked me to leave early for refusing sex

564 replies

Aurelia278 · 27/09/2020 00:22

I took my boyfriend out for his birthday. We spent a day in London all paid for by me (shopping, drinks, fancy steak restaurant) After a few drinks the conversation arose about our sex life and how he wants to spice things up and would like me to initiate sex more, dress up etc. I told him I was open to suggestions. He suggested we start that night and feeling a little tipsy ended up in the late night pharmacy buying condoms.
The whole journey home he was being super affectionate, complimentary which is very out of the ordinary for him. Hes usually a very hands off guy.
By the time i got home I was shattered and uncomfortably full after a 3 course meal and told him that I was simply just not feeling up to it right now.
He went into a giant huff saying that I had ruined the evening and his birthday, it could have been so nice, what was the point of buying condoms etc etc and he even went as far as to suggesting that maybe i should leave his place early in the morning as there was no point me hanging around.
I appreciate he may have been disappointed but after having spent the best part of £300 on a day out for him to be spoken to like that has left me feeling really hurt.
Was I in the wrong for changing my mind? Should I have just got over it and made an effort for his sake?

OP posts:
mbosnz · 27/09/2020 21:55

Well, Gods knows, I know now from this that my daughters weren't making shit up about how fucking ignorant people of both sexes are about issues of consent, and rape, in this country are.

Sickofbroccoli · 27/09/2020 21:55

Coercion is insidious Haribo. It starts so small with sulking if you don't want to but it escalates. First it's agreeing to "special occasion" sex you don't want, then agreeing because it's easier. For me it ended up with me desperately "consenting" to his every demand because I knew full well if I didn't then he would "really" rape me and I was clinging to the only bit of control I felt like I had.

OP, you should run a mile. Don't listen to the apologists, I did and I really wish I hadn't.

KooKooKachu · 27/09/2020 21:57

Broccoli I am so sorry this happened to you.

BlueThistles · 27/09/2020 22:02

I'm stunned at the 'you lead him up the garden path' comments. I'm actually saddened by them.

Hariboqueen1 · 27/09/2020 22:04

Newname I get what you’re saying from reading my sentence back if a man said that it would seem Atrocious so it’s equally bad when I say it. I apologise. For me when I can’t be bothered to have sex and feel lazy I know as soon as I start kissing my partner I will start enjoying it no pressure from him no him asking me just me kissing him back and ill be in the mood. That’s all I meant.

Mittens030869 · 27/09/2020 22:07

@KooKooKachu

I agree with you, I've been genuinely saddened by the attitude towards sexual intimacy expressed by multiple posters on this thread. I think it explains why there are far fewer convictions for rape now than previously. Because it demonstrates what the attitude too many jurors have.

As a mum of 2 DDs of 11 and 8, it adds to the sadness I feel. They're the ones who will be entering the dating scene in a few years. Sad

KooKooKachu · 27/09/2020 22:09

@Hariboqueen1

Newname I get what you’re saying from reading my sentence back if a man said that it would seem Atrocious so it’s equally bad when I say it. I apologise. For me when I can’t be bothered to have sex and feel lazy I know as soon as I start kissing my partner I will start enjoying it no pressure from him no him asking me just me kissing him back and ill be in the mood. That’s all I meant.
But in this case, it feels you are very much a willing, consenting partner. If, for example you were definitely not in the mood, for any reason and he punished you or made you feel bad for not doing what he wants, you'd be in your rights to tell him to jog on. I'm making an assumption you have a healthy relationship though, were he wouldnt dream of doing that. That's the key difference.
CandyLeBonBon · 27/09/2020 22:09

Can enjoyable sex be rape? Genuinely curious?

I was raped. By a man who I'd flirted with at a club with my friend. He was a friend of my friend. She invited him back to her flat, having seen that we'd got on. I was staying at hers that night. She went to bed with a wink. He and I sat together on the sofa. We kissed a bit. That was it. I said I didn't want to go any further and was very firm about that. I was staying in her spare room. I said goodnight. I shut the door and got ready for bed. I was just falling asleep when the door opened. He got into bed and climbed on top of me. He fucked me, without a condom, came, rolled off and started snoring within about 30 seconds. During all of this, I said nothing. I was COMPLETELY SILENT.
Throughout, My mind was trying to process how he had deciphered 'no, I'm going to bed' as 'yes, please come and have sex with me'?
He didn't once complain that I was too dry. He clearly entered me without any problems. In a court of law at the time, that would have been seen as a sign that I 'wanted it'. As was the fact that we'd flirted in the club and kissed on the sofa.

I was 18. I didn't want it. I told him no,

I felt like my body betrayed me. Yes. My vagina had a response to being penetrated, it produced a lubricant to avoid friction burns.

I felt like I'd betrayed myself because I didn't fight him off. I felt ashamed that my body appeared to respond physiologically.

I felt ashamed.

I never spoke to my friend again,

I left in the middle of the night, whilst he snored, leaving my purse, bank cards, driving licence, because I didn't want to run the risk of waking him up and confronting him,

Was I raped?
Yes.
Was I pinned down?
No
Did I fight back?
No
Was it easy for him to have sex with me?
Yes?
Did I say no?
Yes
Did he listen!
No
Did I feel that I could report this up the police?
No.

Ask yourself why
and don't ever come on here telling other women what 'real' rape is.

CandyLeBonBon · 27/09/2020 22:11

Again, I'm so sorry for derailing. I just get so sick of other people defining what us or isn't rape. If it's inappropriate I'll ask for it to be deleted. I just think so many women put up with shot like this and never feel they can say out loud that it's not ok

myrtleWilson · 27/09/2020 22:11

Am so so sorry Flowers @CandyLeBonBon

ComeOnBabyPopMyBubble · 27/09/2020 22:16

@Hariboqueen1

Newname I get what you’re saying from reading my sentence back if a man said that it would seem Atrocious so it’s equally bad when I say it. I apologise. For me when I can’t be bothered to have sex and feel lazy I know as soon as I start kissing my partner I will start enjoying it no pressure from him no him asking me just me kissing him back and ill be in the mood. That’s all I meant.
Yes you are comparing apples and oranges.

To go with the weird food theme, it's like OP saying she has a food allergy(spinach) and you telling her to try anyways because despite the fact you don't like spinach, when you've had it in other foods you enjoyed it.

Being pressured and coerced into sex,or sexual things(like dressing up) isn't the same as initiating,,getting yourself in the mood etc

newtb · 27/09/2020 22:17

Pity you didn't just give him the cheapest blow up doll you could find. Or a mattress with a hole in it.

My (stbx)'d' h bollocked me for not wearing nail varnish to try and attract him
He's an alcoholic
I'm, apparently, a fucking bitch just like my mother - wtf?
His body is like that of a woman at 8+ months of pregnancy ie no longer really masculine
He shaved off his pubes to use a pump to help his erectile dysfunction - like having your vulva thwacked with a wire brush

Even on the day he said it, I thought wtf, apparently I had no right to expect him to do things to attract me.

When he found out that I knew he'd bought a blow-up doll, he cut it up and took it to the tip. Cost 300€ and more the week he bollocked me for £20 for a bra.

Finally, I'm stupid, I left, the month after my 40th, yes 40th wedding anniversary. For someone intelligent sometimes I'm really fucking stupid.

Please please OP, I really do beg you, don't be me.

mbosnz · 27/09/2020 22:17

I think the heart aching'ist hardist questions I've ever had to answer on the end of a Rape Crisis line, was 'this wasn't rape, dear, was it? But it just didn't feel right, I didn't want it, I was crying'. . .

KooKooKachu · 27/09/2020 22:18

Candy Flowers

Rape isn't the kind depicted on tv. It's not always strangers in dark alley ways and a struggle. Freezing is natural response to rape, the mind zones out whilst the body can go along with it as if it isn't yours. I'm so sorry.

CandyLeBonBon · 27/09/2020 22:19

@myrtleWilson I'm 51 now. But I hear people define 'rape' in such narrow parameters and still it hurts. Not just me, but any woman who has felt coerced, forced, manipulated and shamed into having sexual that they didn't want. Not all rape is violent, and it makes me so angry that other women can't see that. It's bad enough that men think it, but that other women can't comprehend that rape isn't always just about violent force, well that really saddens me.

ComeOnBabyPopMyBubble · 27/09/2020 22:21

There's a massive misconception about when women physically react "positively " let's say.
Raped women can and do get wet , other bodily reactions or even orgasm. It doesn't mean they wanted it, or that they consented, or that they enjoyed it or that it wasn't rape.

CandyLeBonBon · 27/09/2020 22:21

@mbosnz

I think the heart aching'ist hardist questions I've ever had to answer on the end of a Rape Crisis line, was 'this wasn't rape, dear, was it? But it just didn't feel right, I didn't want it, I was crying'. . .
Was that what someone at rape crisis said to you??
ComeOnBabyPopMyBubble · 27/09/2020 22:22

@mbosnz

I think the heart aching'ist hardist questions I've ever had to answer on the end of a Rape Crisis line, was 'this wasn't rape, dear, was it? But it just didn't feel right, I didn't want it, I was crying'. . .
The worst comment I've heard that wasn't aimed at me was from a judge in a marital rape case "It can't be sex on Tuesday,rape on Thursday and sex again on Sunday. It's either all rape or all sex".
newnameforthis123 · 27/09/2020 22:22

The hardest thing I've ever had to hear was after the late stage termination following my rape.

A female nurse came round to talk to me about contraception while I was still bleeding.

I said I didn't need to talk about that as I was raped.

Her answer?

"Everybody says that."

I'm crying now thinking about it again and it was 15 years ago.

Some of the attitudes on this thread, from women, in response to other women's experience and trauma have been so disappointing and so depressing.

I'm so sorry to anyone else who has been through anything even remotely similar. I feel almost lucky mine was violent and by a stranger. That's what comments like those on this thread do. How fucked up is that.

Again, I'm so sorry for anyone who has been through it. I stand with you and I hear you Thanks

mbosnz · 27/09/2020 22:23

No, that was someone who rang up, and she was trying to rationalise what happened to her. Poor lady.

CandyLeBonBon · 27/09/2020 22:24

@newnameforthis123
I stand with you too. Thanks

CandyLeBonBon · 27/09/2020 22:25

@mbosnz

No, that was someone who rang up, and she was trying to rationalise what happened to her. Poor lady.
It's so sad. Women even now are being told tjat our bodies are not our own. It makes me sad and angry all at once.
KooKooKachu · 27/09/2020 22:26

I feel almost lucky mine was violent and by a stranger.

Bloody hell Sad. I hope you're ok Flowers

ComeOnBabyPopMyBubble · 27/09/2020 22:29

@mbosnz

No, that was someone who rang up, and she was trying to rationalise what happened to her. Poor lady.
Ah that makes my comment sound awful now. Apologies.
Aminuts23 · 27/09/2020 22:29

@CandyLeBonBon I totally agree with you. I also have been coerced and manipulated into sex I definitely did not want. Rape is not always a violent attack by a stranger. It’s bullying and control by the one person who is supposed to care for you. It leaves you feeling totally violated and it happens to men and women. People who feel their body has to be intimately used to avoid an argument. It’s sickening. Some of the responses on this thread are so disheartening they make me feel like crying. Those of you who are justifying this make me sick in my heart