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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

DH has given me an ultimatum

259 replies

tempusername22 · 18/08/2020 05:47

He has decreed that I am obsessed by my phone and said that if I don't address it, our marriage is over as he doesn't want to be married to someone who would rather use her phone than spend time with him. We live in a small apartment a long way from our families, DC have left home. We both work full time. Apart from work, we spend over 95% of our time together (I sometimes meet friends for coffee or book club, he very rarely goes out unless it's a work thing, and those aren't happening right now anyway).

I don't use Facebook, but do use Twitter (I'm a teacher and have made a lot of useful connections through there, including being part of a software development trial which will benefit my school and becoming a tutor for an online course, which has paid me over £1000). I've recently started learning two relevant and useful languages on Duolingo. In the past, I have deleted apps that I felt were too 'compulsive'. I tend to use the phone to read the news or play a short game when we are in the car, but never have it on the dinner table at home or out, but might use it in a cafe if DH is on his or I'm updating the shopping list etc. I'll take it out if I'm hanging around in a clothes shop while he tries something on or he has gone to the toilet in the shopping centre. He says 'Every time I emerge from somewhere, you are on it.' The car and the shops are probably the easiest times to stop using it as I feel like he needs to really see the difference right now.

I don't get a screen time report but I just looked it up and it says the average is 2h 40 mins - bear in mind that this is during school holidays so it would be less if I was at work. I drive to work so don't use it when commuting, but I listen to audiobooks and podcasts when exercising, shopping on my own and when driving on my own. I also have work emails on there plus work and work-related WhatsApp groups.

I've done three online smartphone addiction quizzes, 2 said yes you have a problem, the third said no. I answered yes to do you keep it by the bed, because I charge it there, but we both do. I also answered yes to do you message people more than talking face to face, and that's also yes due to covid and geography and time zones and being at home alone a lot right now.

I'm absolutely prepared to address this, as I don't want my marriage to end. However, I am sometimes using it purely for entertainment to stave off boredom. I'm not a party animal but we very rarely go out in the evenings, so we eat about 7.30 and then we're in our pjs for the night. The tv is always on and we have some shared tastes, some not so much (rugby and police programmes, especially). DH is really into music and I'd rather read, so if we're home on a weekend he will often watch music videos on tv and I will read or use my phone.

I told him that I would like us to have one tv-free night a week and that I don't want to tell him not to watch the things he wants to watch but that if I'm not interested in it I will do something else like read or use my phone. In the row he said at one point 'I don't know what you use it for' and at another that it was due to social media use, which it isn't, and I challenged that because he can't say he doesn't know and then tell me what the problem is. In lockdown my friend lent me a 1000 piece puzzle, which he helped a little with, but also complained that he had 'lost' me to that. I really enjoyed doing it but didn't do it 24/7.

At one point I was almost playing argument bingo - these things always come up:
I earn XXXXXX and that's why I have to have my work phone and be available 24/7
Your salary isn't enough to pay the rent here
Has this been an issue in previous relationships
Has anyone said this to you before
I'm not having another relationship where I'm treated like xxx
I don't need your income/intellect
You're treating me like I'm an idiot
I can manage perfectly well by myself (e.g. cooking etc)
I moved here so that we could spend more time together but not for this

This has been an issue several times over the last few years (we've lived here 2 years now). He accepts that I have gone some way to addressing it but says it's not enough, and that I am not the sort of person who should need to be asked more than once so clearly I don't care. It was a very one-sided row that lasted about 3 hours and involved dinner going in the bin. He's been really short with me the last few days so I guess this was brewing. He left for work this morning and I had a terse 'I'm going' and that was it.

He insists he doesn't want me to feel like I can't use my phone and it doesn't need to be out of reach, but when at home I just need to manage how I use it better. Although I think he is over-reacting, and there are underlying issues from his previous relationship, I definitely do not want this to be the end of our marriage so I will sort it out. I need some sort of engagement from him so that I don't die of boredom on the sofa every night. He said if it's not your phone it's your tablet/laptop, but all of my reading takes place on a device e.g. Kindle or tablet. I feel like he doesn't 'do' anything - apart from the gym, which we used to do together but this is tricky now that every other treadmill is out of use so we stagger our visits at the moment - so once at home if he's not doing domestic stuff or work stuff, there's only the tv. He doesn't read, plays the guitar but very infrequently, and has no hobbies.

Don't say LTB, it's not happening and I wouldn't over this - although he has said I can move out and then I can use my phone as much as I want. He's angry but also said he's very unhappy, and I don't want to be the cause of that.

Sorry it's so long!

OP posts:
notalwaysalondoner · 18/08/2020 09:44

That really isn’t that much usage - I use mine that much and I work full time (although certain apps that keep the screen on permanently like google maps add a lot to the total). But that’s not really the point - he feels you use it too much. The question is, if you stop using it will he just find something else to pick on (you mentioned the puzzle)? I found my DH phone use annoying when it felt like the second we weren’t talking he’d pick it up, rather than think of something else to chat about. It was a default habit but made me feel uninteresting. It wasn’t about his total usage at all, but about how he used it. I suspect the fair response is somewhere in the middle - you don’t use it too much, but you could think about restricting your use at key moments that bother him. But there may be bigger issues to address if he’s just being controlling and expects you stood to attention whenever he wants you.

YgritteSnow · 18/08/2020 09:46

so he is sensitive about my perceived intellect

He sounds just awful tbh and I don't think there will be any way to please him but I fear you will twist yourself inside out trying to.

YgritteSnow · 18/08/2020 09:48

There is no issue with me reading at any time and especially when he's engaged with something else.

Phew! You're fine to do what you want as long as he's occupied but make sure you're on high alert ready for when his interest starts to wane and you need to step up and entertain.

He is a giant toddler.

Friendsoftheearth · 18/08/2020 09:48

It is a shame you can't benefit from Rishi's idea, as it has saved our midweek evenings, which to be honest now after so long in lockdown everything has become boring we love our nights out!

You can eat outside with candles, swim in the evenings if it is hot etc and make the most of the humid darkness! Not sure that is coming out well, but anyway you do sound like you are old before your time, but if suits you that is fine.

CurlyhairedAssassin · 18/08/2020 09:49

He accepts that I have gone some way to addressing it but says it's not enough, and that I am not the sort of person who should need to be asked more than once so clearly I don't care.

What does that even mean, you're not the sort of person who should need to be asked more than once? This sounds like a very manipulative thing to say. It does sound a bit like he's engineered this argument as he wants out.

It may be useful to call his bluff and agree to put your phone away after a certain time, and then say "Ok then what shall we do?" and see how much he's expecting you to just sit and do what HE wants to do.

Just thinking round the issue, though....Re screen times. Yours actually seems too low, considering all the things you say you look at. As you're a teacher, presumably you also use your laptop a lot too? Could this be why your phone screen time is low? Mine dropped so much when I bought my laptop during lockdown as I mostly use my laptop for the stuff that I used to use on my phone.

I'm fairly addicted to screens, I'd say, (I read the news, MN, whatsapp, FB for gardening groups) but I would never look at my phone in a cafe or restaurant as my attention is focused on who I'm with. I find it really annoying when you're out iwth a friend and all they're doing is looking at their phone - it's the height of bad manners.
I don't tend to look at it in the car either, and don't let the kids go on theirs. I also hate the fact that all workplaces seem to think it's essential to use social media. Personally I think it's become WAY overused, there is so much bloody dross on there that purports to be important. And because it's so fluid people feel like they constantly have to check for updates even when they're not at work. So bloody wrong, it's completely spoiled people's work/life balance and causes untold issues. Complete information overload.

It doesn't actually sound like there is much that you enjoy doing together. DH and I like some different TV stuff - he would never watch something like Downton and I would never watch 10 million cop shows. But I do watch a couple of those with him, and there are other genres of shows and films we'll watch together, and with the kids. We're both quite happy to sit watching telly of an evening though. I don't watch anythign much during the day and he works long hours so he likes to watch telly to relax. But it doesn't sound like this is the case for you - shared tv viewing doesn't seem to be your thing, so you need to find out what IS your thing, as a couple.

One final observation - you refer to the fact that he said "I moved here so that we could spend more time together but not for this", and you refer to being wherever you are for about 2 years now. Also something during an argument about "the rent here". What is this location situation that you both highlight? Has something changed in your relationship in terms of where you live, and if so, why? Could that have had any bearing on anything?

Good luck!

thinkingaboutLangCleg · 18/08/2020 09:51

This is a very boring time, OP. I wouldn’t make any big decisions or changes until life gets back to somewhere nearer normal. This pandemic is putting a serious strain on relationships.

Also, he needs a hobby. DH and I love each other’s company and have always worked at least partly from home. But we have a few separate interests too.

Friendsoftheearth · 18/08/2020 09:52

We need to factor in the lockdown effect too, it has been pretty hellish for most people apart from committed introverts and hermits. It has been a Very Trying Time, to say the least, so best to let things settle anyway.

InDeoEstMeaFiducia · 18/08/2020 09:53

I might also research some board games that require strategy rather than general knowledge (he's really smart but I have two Masters degrees and my brain is a general knowledge sponge, so he is sensitive about my perceived intellect).

we are a little bit past this, I will address the way in which he raises my salary (which is commensurate with my seniority and experience in my field, but my field doesn't compare with international commerce) in these situations.

He stressed very firmly this morning that he absolutely does not want me to stop using my phone, just to manage it better and engage with him more. There is no issue with me reading at any time and especially when he's engaged with something else.

Read this back. EVERYTHING is he, he, he; him, him, him. And you doing this and that. What is he doing to fix this? He researching games and Spanish classes and examining his bloody issues with your salary and his issues with TV use and how he can engage with you more?

It sounds very one-way, temp is the one with the problem and she needs to dance round him fixing the problems and fixing herself for HIM.

He sounds suffocating and insecure and needy. It sounds like you've outgrown him.

My folks have been married for 56 years and they're not even so much in others' pockets; both of them agreeing it's made for a healthy marriage.

CallmeAngelina · 18/08/2020 09:54

@FredaFrogspawn

It does sound a bit uneven. Ask him what he’s going to change if you agree to spend less time on the phone. Ask him what he thinks you should be doing less of on the phone - your languages? Your tutoring? Reading? What’s he going to do to entertain you in its place?

Then put the phone away and talk to him. Hour after hour. Ask him his opinion on anything and everything. Don’t really listen to his answers - just tel him yours. Demand he dances with you. Tell him you want the seven veils dance from him and it’d better be worth losing duolingo for. Talk all through his tv programmes. Demand his attention at 2am. Tel him he is too focused on his sleep and not on you. Tel him you need him to do yoga with you, play castinets, make your own sushi, play pin the tail on the donkey. He needs to get away from the tv and practice medicine ball eurythmics with you. Go on a big hunt and identify 8 arachnids. Penis puppetry show - you want one of those. Can he do all the moves in the Karma Surra? Stuff a bolster to be his partner and sit back for the show. Sixty animal impersonations in sixty seconds please.

He’ll be begging you to pick up your phone and get back to your duolingo.

Or just tell him to fuck off telling you what to do.

This! GrinGrin Frogspawn wins the thread!

And what the fuck did he mean by, "I don't need your intellect?" ShockAngry

Badassmama · 18/08/2020 09:58

Ok so... you’re out shopping... he goes to the loo... and expects you to just stand there waiting eagerly watching the door in anticipation of his exit?
That’s nuts.

Mischance · 18/08/2020 09:58

I agree about not making important judgements at this time as life is so grossly abnormal for many.

I worked as a photographer and one day, whilst we were out on a walk, my OH said to me" I am sick of going for a lovely walk with you and you spend all your time looking for a good photo, instead of enjoying the moment. Couldn't you just leave your camera at home?" I did listen to what he said and took on board that I needed to live in the moment a bit more and stop studying the light etc.

Is it worth listening to what he is saying and having a proper discussion (not a row!) about what he wants to do together with you? Ask to sit down with him and talk about it in a non-belligerent way on either side. If you think he has some valid points and sensible ideas then you might meet him half way. If it seems he is just being possessive, then a different outcome might be reasonable.

Tough times for all at the moment. Good luck.

Friendsoftheearth · 18/08/2020 10:00

I mean this kindly but you are coming across on here as though you actually believe you are intellectually superior to him, and it has come up in your posts more than once. So it is no wonder that he is commenting on it if you do actually think you are better than him?

Particularly as it seems you even have to adjust board games to suit his low intellect/general knowledge...and his 'sensitivity' might be well founded given your posts.

I might also research some board games that require strategy rather than general knowledge (he's really smart but I have two Masters degrees and my brain is a general knowledge sponge, so he is sensitive about my perceived intellect)

midsomermurderess · 18/08/2020 10:00

You have given a very lengthy justification for your phone use. It isn't cutting through with him. I'd advise you to get off this bit of social media and talk to him. You'll get the usual stuff here, he sounds abusive, controlling, how dare he, You know the drill, the usual tired old knee-jerk stuff that will no doubt give you validation. What use is that to you or him? Talk to him, think about what he is saying/feeling. Really, pages of LTB on here will probably end up with him following through on his ultimatum.

KetoPenguin · 18/08/2020 10:00

He's told you all the reasons he doesn't need you, maybe you can do the same for him. You are a teacher and could live comfortably without his financial support if you were single, maybe not as comfortably but you wouldn't have to put up with his whining so it might balance out.

rainbowstardrops · 18/08/2020 10:03

Tbh, he sounds a bit dull and boring. Just because he doesn't really have any interests or hobbies, he's resentful of yours.
If he doesn't like it then HE should be thinking of things that you could do together too.
I'm guessing whatever you suggest he'll find a reason to not want to do it.

peanutsandpinenuts · 18/08/2020 10:06

It can be annoying when it feels like you partner or friend is on their phone all the time. 2hr 40 mins isn't a lot over the whole day but it could feel like a lot if its all in the evening when you are supposed to be spending time together.

To be it sounds like you guys are stuck in a rut and need to develop some proper shared interests. Could you get a film subscription or something, learn to cook a different cuisine together, go hiking, dancing, something?

I'd sit him down for a calm conversion about what you both need within the relationship. Agree not to throw blame about and work to find a solution that satisfies you both.

Good luck.

Friendsoftheearth · 18/08/2020 10:08

In all honesty I think I would feel tempted to leave someone that thought they were intellectually superior to me - so much so they had to adjust board games to fit around my lack of general knowledge Confused,

Someone that spent hours every night on their phone despite years of me asking them not to. Could not relate to the fact that phones were killing all conversation and the likelihood of intimacy, not to mention our marriage. Instead of listening to me and considering my unhappiness and find resolutions together they simply describe it as as 'argument bingo'

I think I would be looking to leave, and sharpish.

Drivingdownthe101 · 18/08/2020 10:08

@Friendsoftheearth

In all honesty I think I would feel tempted to leave someone that thought they were intellectually superior to me - so much so they had to adjust board games to fit around my lack of general knowledge Confused,

Someone that spent hours every night on their phone despite years of me asking them not to. Could not relate to the fact that phones were killing all conversation and the likelihood of intimacy, not to mention our marriage. Instead of listening to me and considering my unhappiness and find resolutions together they simply describe it as as 'argument bingo'

I think I would be looking to leave, and sharpish.

Well he’s more than welcome to leave if that’s how he feels.
Catapultme · 18/08/2020 10:10

Why on earth are you researching board games that you won't be too good at?

Graciebobcat · 18/08/2020 10:10

You don't have a phone problem, you have a DH problem. Keep the phone, lose the DH.

WhatATimeToBeAlive · 18/08/2020 10:11

You both sound pretty boring to be honest. You have no common interests, so why don't you just both move on with your lives separately?

YgritteSnow · 18/08/2020 10:11

I mean this kindly but you are coming across on here as though you actually believe you are intellectually superior to him, and it has come up in your posts more than once.

Hmm, see I think it comes across that he is threatened by and resentful of her intelligence and has regular mantrums about it.

CallmeAngelina · 18/08/2020 10:17

The OP was asked several times to explain the "intellect" reference, which she has now done. That's not her being superior, but explaining the situation.

TitsOutForHarambe · 18/08/2020 10:21

Sounds like you two aren't right for each other

SusansSassySidePony · 18/08/2020 10:22

I remember DH criticising my phone usage once. I pointed out that I have emails on my phone, a scanner, spreadsheets, all my work documents, books, newspapers. So when I'm on my phone, I'm probably working. It's just not immediately obvious. We never had a conversation about it again.
Is your DH suspicious of what you're doing on your phone? Is he jealous of colleagues or a friendship that you have?

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