I'm tired of stoners

[Annoyedbyit]

Have been seeing my dp for 7 months, I knew he was a 'smoker' (and other things) when I started seeing him, so I feel I don't have much of a reason to be peeved, however, I would very much appreciate a bit of advice.

I don't smoke or take any sort of illegal drugs, just my choice and I don't judge those that do as it's simply their choice. When he comes to my house, he smokes his weed outside as I don't even smoke cigarettes and it wold make my house smell. He doesn't object to this.

I stayed at his place on Saturday night as he had the house to himself (flatmate away), so I was really annoyed when on Sunday morning this happened...

We had a nice lie in and everything and he went to get the papers and was going to make us a nice breakfast, a lovely, lazy sunday morning. However, his friend from the flat upstairs pops in, as he always does (v annoying) with some weed, so dp instantly 'skins up' and they start smoking several joints. It is really strong and there is a smokey fog about the place, so I went and sat in another room.

I thought to myself: 'what the hell am I doing here!', so I decided to head home as a stoned dp is not what I wanted to be with. DP totally taken aback by me wanting to go home as he couldn't see he'd done anything wrong. I felt like he had put me on hold until he was ready to pick up the romantic sunday element again. I just didn't want to be treated like that, but he made me feel like I was being totally irrational and unreasonable and he couldn't see why I was peeved.

Anyway, I left and feel like something insurmountable has happened, don't think we can come to an agreement over this. Sorry if this is long and rambling, it's really on my mind and I don't know what I should do or if it's worth trying to move forward on this. Thank you all for listening and thank you in advance for any advice.

Hi Atilla

The up side: he's done so well this far though: no coke/speed/e/alcohol/cigarettes - I think he's done quite well! I just can't bring myself to end it now we've come this far. I know I can't save him, only he can do that, but I can offer him (non-professional) support, love and the reminder that there is a life without drugs. We've done loads of things together we wouldn't have done if we'd been inside and him smoking/using, we're spending Christmas together over an invitation from his friends who are getting together for a massive non stop, three day bender (as they did last year) - he decided not to join them, it was his idea. Plus, he's said he notices that he has much more money as it's not going on drugs, so he is saving up for things.

The down side: he still has moments of weakness when with his friends, even that he still sees the friends who pass him weed. He still has cravings and a need to smoke.

I think we've made a little progress, I want to see what else we can do to take a step forward into a drug free life. I know I've used this analagy before, but it's like being on a diet and you crave a piece of chocolate or some hot, buttered toast anda eventually you give in, sometimes it's a necessary evil as it makes you more resolute to stay on the straight and narrow. Sometimes it opens the floodgates and you do on a downward spiral, so I'll see what happens in this instance with him. Any coke and I'll finish with him outright, I've had enough of that full stop. Plus, he's coming down with a cold, so perhaps the smoking has given him this, it's how he always used to be - on the point of a cold all the time, nose running (columbian flu type) and eternally tired from the lack of sleep, so now he's under the weather after several weeks of exuberantly bouncy good health, after a session smokeing, he's now poorly again. Maybe he'll learn from this, maybe I'll point it out? A lot of it is up to him but I think I play a role too?
Thank you for still being out there Atilla, I do weigh up everyhting you say and I imagine what you must have been through was terrible.

Oh lst, that must have been hard to take in, why does cannabis have this effect on users? I can only think it's because they make their own little world where they can all exist with no questions asked. They don't have to face up to any real responsibilities. It's like propping up the bar but it's all done in someone's front room.

How are you at the moment?

How did you get to a point where you knew what was the right thing to do?

I'm going to see him tonight and I want to talk about it with him, mainly to say that he is doing well but I was sad that he slipped in the last week.

I really take on board when you and Atilla and all the lovely people who have contributed to this thread say that it's his decision and I really understand that and that it's not going to happen overnight. It's a really testing time and it's on my mind so much. I think though that he wants a drug free future as he has said how much better he feels being clean. Does this sound like a good signe to you?

And, thank you for your email adress, I'll keep it to one side and will be in touch when I've worked out how to get a hot mail account - I'm not very technical and am shy about using my real name! Bear with me! x

ABI

I would urge caution; it is still early days and he continues to slip back into his old ways. Of course he still has cravings; he has a long term drug addiction to more than one subtsance; its not going to go anytime soon and there are no guarantees.

Have you or he suggested a complete lifestyle change; this would involve moving away from this area and not associating with his druggie mates any longer?. I haven't seen this mentioned.

This is not like being on a diet (which also do not work but that's another subject entirely). He - with professional support - needs to look at why he started using at 14 (I believe that is when he first smoked weed). What triggered his using?. Would you agree with those comments?.

He needs professional support and you do as well. You're the adult and he's the child; I argue that he's still stuck at 14.

This is a heavy burden to carry on your own.

There is a fine line to tread between supporting and enabling; you cannot and must not enable him. Do not protect him from the consequences of his actions. Don't put up with him having weed on his breath and don't let him smoke in your house; you need to make it clear that he cannot see you if he is not clean.

I ask again - where is your own support network?. You need real life support. He is in no position to give support, he's too wrapped up in his own addictions to be of any real use to you in that regard.

There are many people who suffer from addictions, and in some cases their loved ones actually enable the addiction because they want to help. Sure, you want to help the one you love to overcome addiction, but you definitely to not want to enable the addiction any further.

Take a minute to think about an addict. They intend to continue what they are doing no matter what. Why not go ahead and get someone to help him with the addiction? You see, without someone to enable him, an addict would need to start dealing with all the consequences that his actions cause, which could actually bring the addiction to an end. Unfortunately many well intentioned enablers actually help to protect the addict from the problems that are a result of the addiction.

In some cases family members actually help the addict get the drug in a safe manner to try to protect them. They are afraid that they will get hurt or that they will go with withdrawal and so they go on to help their loved one keep using, which does not fix the problem at all. Some of the actions that may signal you are acting as an enabler include making excuses, lying, and helping your loved one to get what they need. This means you are no longer helping them, you are enabling them to continue in their addiction.

Usually this type of behavior starts out quite slowly over time and in the beginning is just behaviour that is used to help smooth things over. People want to keep their family problems a secret so they keep their mouth shut. Also, many times denial of the problem actually affects the enabler and they rationalize things away to try and avoid the problem that is occurring. Sadly, the problem will not just go away.

Once a person starts enabling an addict, it turns into a cycle. The person who is addicted never has to deal with consequences, and so they continue in their addictive behaviour. Since their addiction becomes even worse, then the enabler gets drawn deeper and deeper into the problem. Soon this turns into more chaos in the home, which an addict will use for an excuse to continue using.

So, how can you get this cycle to end? Well, while the person who is enabling the situation may be fearful and full of shame, at some point this will probably turn into anger. While they may try to bottle it all up, at some point it is going to come out in an explosion. They will be sick of excuses and they will need to decide to lovingly detach themselves from the situation.

This means that now there are no more excuses being made by the enabler, and suddenly the addict has to deal with the consequences of their addiction. In some cases this may lead them to try and find treatment for their addiction. Usually people who go for treatment either get tired of the addiction or they end up experiencing a dramatic crisis that leads them to seek out treatment for the problem. It is important that you never protect a loved one from this type of crisis because you may be keeping them from finding the treatment that they need for their addiction problem.

That describes the enablers role, not you per se.

I would urge you to take heed of the last sentence in this piece though.

ABI im sorry, i have heard all this before. Im cutting down,
I will only smoke after 6pm,
I wont do it infront of the children,
I'll only do it at weekends
Everybody does it
I have to have 'something'
I'm hardly smoking at al

Actually when you are an addict ( and Im sorry but your BF fits all the criteria of being an addict) you cant just 'cut down', amd actually no amount of any mind altering substance is ok.

for me to hear my h say that gave me some kind of hope actually. He has been in denial, lying and being abusive for so so long that the fact that he has recognised a very fundamental truth gives me a bit of hope for his future.

I agree with Attila that druggies stay stuck at the emotional age they started smoking at. In my H's case about 16 when he started using heavvily. They take drugs to avoid dealing with any 'emotional' pain. Dont allow yourself to take resposnibility for his problems

My H is now attending NA meetings most days. He is clean for the first time in 25 years. NOW he sees that it rots your brain, destroys ambition and has ruined his marriage. NOw he sees whats valuable. too late

I left because the constant craving for drugs and anxiety and lying and stress and desperation that he brought on himself turned him into a child hitter. I left to protect my children. But by then I had no respect left for him and I dont think i even like him anymore.

sorry to be so bleak. But its a bleak subject

lst x

ABI - I just wanted to say don't ever be ashamed to come and tell us if he's relapsed. We are here to support you and won't judge. God knows I've backtracked on here enough times, and as I said before Attilla says it like it is, not always what we want to hear, I know, but she has helped me loads in the past and she does know what she's on about.

how are you doing annoyedbyit ??

Hello LST - sorry for being so quiet, I've been off work for a bit (using up hols before end of year) and also, have had to stay off internet at work as they're having a clampdown!
Well, he's back smoking again, so, I'm currently having a mental review of everything and thinking very carefully about what I want and what might happen going forward.
In his defence (I know I'm inviting a harsh response by even defending him), he only does it when he's with his friends and he is doing it considerably less than previously.
Going against him is the fact he is still smoking. He was quite out of it on Saturday night (we saw separate friends but then caught up later on), so I left him to it and just went home. Then again, he was smoking on Sunday with same friends, but as far as I know, he hasn't smoked yesterday.
I really regret not having said anything to him over the weekend but I don't think it would have made any difference and I would have just come across as nagging.. what could I have said? 'Please don't smoke'? He'd have still got stoned.

I feel weak and stupid, but not totally surprised that he is looking to get stoned again.

Thank you LST for wondering how things are going, I'm sorry it's not such good news.

ABI

Wondered how you were doing so was interested to see a message from your good self.

You certainly do need to think about what you want because I think he is making his position all too clear to you.

Love your own self for a change, put your own self first for once. Where do you yourself want to be emotionally in say 3,6, 12 months time?. What do you want from life?. He has made a conscious choice to continue using (even if its only with friends, as if that somehow makes it more "acceptable" and or palatable to you - WELL HELL NO!) now its down to you to make yours.

You do not have to continue feeling both weak and stupid but you do need to take a long and hard look at your own self to determine exactly how and why you got to where you are now.

With best wishes

Attila

Hello Atilla! I hope you're well.

Strangely, I feel that whenever I remind myself I have a choice, it doesn't take on the big, scary proportions that it did a few weeks ago. I feel quite calm, still a bit annoyed by it all but if it all gets too much, I will leave.
I've spent a bit of time just doing my own thing and feel less dependant on him for entertainment. Plus, I've got a few Christmassy things lined up with people at work, so I'm getting ot there a bit more and meeting people, maybe might make some friends from it?
Just to blow my own trumpet a bit more, I have been taking a little exercise and have lost a few pounds (only a few, but I feel better!), so I'm in a mind where I'm taking a little more control.

I'm going to get back to you about what I want from life and where I see myself in a few months as I want to give it some proper thought.

You know what, in the past few days, I though to myself, 'oh god, those MN crowd are going to go mad at me for putting up with this!' but I also thought 'why should I put up with it!' and on Saturday, I felt great just going home and getting away from all the smokers.

ABI

Good for you my friend. Writing that message has shown me you are making much progress. You keep working at it or I'll be after you with my army of meerkats !!!. Small and steady steps over time mare far better than trying to make huge ones.

ABI

sorry to hear that. How are things between you otherwise? is the smoking and your frustration with it destroying the other aspects of your relationship yet ?

fwiw i dont thnik he will/can stop. I dont think he wants to. and until and unless HE wants to stop, not for you but for HIM, he will continue to use.

and only you can decide if you can live with that.

I do know how very hard that is to hear

lsct x

ABI

just to give you a bit of hope, i (and my DW for that matter) used to be heavy smokers, but when we decided to have children, a couple of years ago, we stopped, cigs and weed.

At some point you (i.e. your DP) have to make a decision about whats important in life (and grow up a bit...), and frankly (once i'd got over the insomnia from not smoking myself to sleep)i felt alot better, both health wise and in my head.

Very, very occasionally i might smoke with a friend (though tbh i can't really handle it anymore...and it gives me a headache ) but never when i'm near/got charge of my DD, i'd feel really guilty and probably 'a bad parent' if i did.

It can be done, but, as the old saying goes you have to want to stop.

Hello everyone, it's me, back from beyond! I am so sorry I haven't been around much, I got a new job and it doesn't have internet access, so I haven't been online for ages. I hope you are all doing well? I wanted to join in the support thread, but without internet, I fell behind.

Anyway, I've come to a major decision and I wanted to tell you all as you were so brilliantly helpful. I'm going to finish with him this week. I know it's taken ages for me to see sense, but I had to do this my own way and in my own time. I feel really stupid for not seeing sense earlier, but I guess this means I know I am now making the right decision.

He's just been negecting me so much and making me feel so useless about pretty much everything. Over the Easter weekend, he took a 4 day break to visit a group of old friends (all stoners) so it was like the final nail in the coffin for us. All the freinds he saw are, as far as I remember, all single, all heavy smokers and users of various substances.

I have thought about ending the relationship many times but always felt scared about being alone... about being unloved..fat, ugly and unloved... but I want to be free of the pain I am feeling and he is the one causing it. So, I am going to break up with him when I next see him, probably this week. I don't know whether to be brutally honest with him, or to just say that we are drifting apart and just leave it like that. I wish it was all over and done with now, I am dreading the conversation.

Anyway, I just wanted to fill you in and I wanted to say thank you again for all the help you gave me and the sense you spoke to me.

ABI - im so sorry it has come to this. sorry that your partner cannot see what e is losing by putting his need go take drugs above everything else. Unfortunately thats the addict.....Personally I would tell him straight, that you dont wish to be in a relationship with a drug addict - it may not change anything now, but one day he may think bout what his compulsive drug taking has cost him.

good luck

lst xx

Hi ABI

Was very interested to see a message from you as I haven't seen your name here for a long time.

I think you had to do this in your own time even though you were being advised to end this relationship with him long before now. I would just be straight with him and to the point.

You need to work on rebuilding your life and self esteem - you need to confront this fear you have of being alone. And I tell you something else as well; I bet you a crisp £5.00 note that you are not ugly at all (what is that anyway?) but you need to truly believe that for your own self. Beauty comes from within. Perhaps some counselling would be helpful for you; there are issues here (and I can recall your parents not being very nice either in childhood) that you now need to face.

Love yourself for a change. No more trying to rescue and or save men who are ultimately deadbeats by their choice. You will one day meet someone who is truly worthy of you.

With best wishes

Attila x

Hello you two! I hope you're both well?

You know, I think I will tell him why I am finishing with him, I do want him to know how his actions have affected me and that I have accommodated his every need, I never nagged him to stop, I just hoped he would want to. God, I feel stupid! All that time I've wasted! I swear I will never get involved with another stoner again. So, I suppose it wasn't wasted time, just a protracted lesson - like double maths!

LST - I don't think he will understand why I am finishing with him, but like you say, maybe one day in the future when/if he has sorted his act out he might.

Atilla - you can put your money away! I'd probably spend it on cakes! Weird as it may sound, even thoug I'm scared of being alone, I am going to face it and see what happens. I would rather be alone (by myself) than be feeling even more alone when I'm in the same room as him.

xxxx

Hello ABI,

Not been on this thread before but the title caught my eye. I lived with someone who smoked constantly and had friends who were coke dealers for four years (him not me).

Although he cut out the coke pretty quickly there was always the odd line on the go and way too much at Xmas etc.

Your opening post was very much like the kind of thing I would have to deal with on a regular basis. I absolutely hated it.

Good for you for deciding to leave. These days I am not even around people who smoke cigarettes, let alone any other drug, and I am so happy. Just wanted to add my support. X

Hello BearMama - thank you so much, your situation sounds like it was really hard to deal with... it's impossible to see sense when all around you are getting out of it.

I've thought so long and hard about it all that I'm not sure if I'm thinking straight!

I think that I forgot there is actually a life out there to be lived and sitting in someone's lounge watching him smoke (or in the early days, watch him do lines), is not my idea of fun. Being alone scares me but I am also looking forward (pensively!) to doing my own thing.

How did you handle your situation and how did you leave your partner? Did you say to him it was the drugs that made you unhappy?

Hello ABI,

I handled the situation really badly TBH - I met someone else and left that way. It was about as complicated and awful as it could be and to tell the whole story would involve pages!

I wasnt honest about the other man but I did try to tell him that his lifestyle was not for me. He said that was just an excuse and maybe it was. But it had become intolerable long before I met the man I left him for.

What you say about a life out there waiting to be lived - hold onto to that. Spring is here, summer is coming and I remember well walking in the sunshine thinking that my life was my OWN and how glorious it was.

The stoners life is unbelievably oppressive to those non-participants stuck in it. You deserve better. X

wow, I have just read all of this thread and am at how similar the comments are to what DP and myself have had to go through with a friend of ours. He (the friend) has been smoking for years but during last year he started doing it more and more, to the extent that we truly felt it was negatively affecting his personality and moods. Sadly he was working with my DH on developing his safari routes and his mood swings and memory loss were making it more and more difficult to work with. For example, when we had to change a plan at the last minute to go to his cabin in the mountains (which was his 'smoking place') last Januray he completely flipped his flop and told us yet again to stuff the tours, and many other really nasty unmentionable things. It's really really difficult and surprising that a drug like that (which I have never really had any opinion on before now) can change someone so much. He doesn't remember, or claims not to, any of the things he says or does. We have hit a brick wall with him now, no-one can help. The people who should really be able to help him the most -his family- don't know about it and it is not our place to mention it (smoking is not a very socially accepted 'activity' where we live).

Well done, Annoyedabit, for trying and for having the courage to end it. It is difficult enough with a friend. It must be a lot worse with a partner.

Hello Wellies, sorry to hear about the dificulties you've been having too, it's amazing how devoted to the smoking scene some people are. It seems to speak to them and have the same hold on them as alcohol, or any other addiction. I feel right there in the same position as you: no one can help.
I hoped deep down he would stop the weed-smoking and find new (clean!) ways to relax/socialise but he can't see beyond it. Plus his friends all do it, so it's his entire world. It still, even today, when I know I'm going to finish with him when I next see him, it still jolts me to think he wants to sit in a dingy, smelly room and smoke into the early hours rather than be with me and that I can't change him. Nothing about me can change him. I know I'll miss him as he could be so caring and lovely.

God, I'm dreading the conversation we're going to have!

I've got to go now, but I will try and check in, thank you everyone, you make me feel less alone. x

Oh god! I've had to make a detour and come back to you all!
He just texted me to ask if I want to meet up tomorrow night... Can i run my reply past you to see if it sounds ok, I don't know what I'm doing anymore, I'm so nervous.

My reply is this: 'ok, let's meet tomorrow, I do think we need to have a chat'

Should I add in the bit about needing a chat? I don't want him to think it'll be a cosy meeting, I want him to know something is going to happen as I don't want to take him entirely by surprise with the news I'm ending it.

Thank you in advance for your advice!

Hi ABI

Again texting you is a get out clause for him; this is not proper communication is it?.

I would phone him back (not text) and say, "okay re tomorrow but we need to talk" and leave it at that. That may be one option. On the other hand you could be really hardball, phone him back and say, "no more contact of any sort, its over as of this minute because I've had enough. I am fed up with being mucked around and coming a dim second to a drug addiction. You made a choice and its clearly not me. Goodbye". Then delete his number completely from your phone and life.

What will you do though tomorrow if you do meet up and he pleads with you to give him another or just one more chance promising that this time he will really change, he may turn on the tears or alternatively be really sharp and or be manipulative again towards you. He could potentially wrap you around his finger. You need to think about all that too.