Marriage advice needed - do I stay or do I go?

[Gutwrenching]

Hi all, I'm here desperately seeking advice, apologies in advance for the essay!

My wife and I have been married 11 years, together for 15. We have built a beautiful home together and have many happy memories. She has always been there for me and is a wonderful person, and I've never never really considered anything other than us growing old together, until now.

After some lengthy introspection, I have admitted to myself that our marriage isn't working. We don't have children (we are 39 and 40), but I really do want them, and I have done for a long time. When people ask why we don't have children I have told them that its not the right time, or that we've been trying but its just not happened, but the reality is that we just don't have enough sex and our communication so has been so poor that we just haven't ever properly discussed it.

The lack of sex is mostly my fault, and I have been aware of the problem for a couple of years. I tried to fix this myself, but for whatever reason I haven't been able to (I'm just not sexually attracted to her anymore. I find myself staying up late to avoid sex, only making the effort to have sex at the right time of the month, and when we do have sex I feel uncomfortable initiating it. In all honesty, I find myself preferring to masturbate and fantasize about other women. Whilst I haven't cheated on my wife, I have looked around a bit over the last couple of years and started to think about what life could be like). I also find that I don't make any effort to be affectionate to her (buying flowers, sending nice texts) and I think that these things should come naturally, if I'm in the right relationship. I finally opened up to her about all of this, and she said she was aware of the problem but she thought I was happy enough with our marriage, so she didn't say anything. We've since tried to make an effort together, but for me nothing is changing, despite the fact I can see she is making a real effort.

I'm starting to think that if I am going to be able to have the life I crave, the right thing to do is move on. I also feel as though me moving on is the right thing to do for her - because she deserves someone who truly adores her for who she is, and who makes her happy (whilst she says she is happy in the marriage, I know this isn't truly the case - even though she won't admit it. She feels as though I prefer spending time with my friends and not with her and often asks why I ever got married, she has complained that her life is rubbish when she's been upset, she misses the affectionate small touches, she gets anxious and jealous when I go away with work etc).

But there's a few things holding me back. Selfishly, I worry whether I'll ever find anyone who loves me unreservedly like she does, and whether I'll ever again find the companionship that we enjoy. I'm also put off by the thought of leaving my home, which I love and which we renovated together and I always considered would be my 'forever home'. But most importantly, I'm worried about her. When I left and told her I wanted a break she was absolutely devastated and I can't bear to see the pain I'm causing. She mentioned that if I'd have said this a few years ago she'd have still had time to meet someone else and have a family with them, but at 40 she is now at a point where it is too late for her to do that. I worry that if I stay with her it may be just delaying the inevitable and we'll end up resenting each other, but I feel though as if I leave I'm completely ruining her whole life. I don't know what to do

@Marshmallowmom

Gut wrenching , like I said it doesn’t matter what anyone’s opinion is at the end of the day but if you want the advice I would give my partner if he felt like this and I was your wife .... I would want you to be telling me not a load of random people on the internet AND this is the important part . I’d want you to be absolutely unequivocally honest in how you feel the whole lot . The absolute dealbreaker that children are for Yoh , the way in which you have turned away emotionally and sexually and the wanting to be with other women ! The lot She has a right to decided whether this is worth saving too . This is not about you being some knight sacrificing for some FALSe sense of happiness she may not be feeling herself As they say The truth will set you free but first it will hurt like a bitch....

I say down with her a few months ago and told her exactly how I was feeling. Completely open and honest. I stayed in the house and we tried to do things differently. When nothing changed, I sat down with her again a couple of weeks ago and told her nothing had changed and that I was moving out and we needed to separate for a bit, but that I’m willing to try therapy, go on dates to try and rekindle the passion etc. She made it clear she wants to save the marriage. I’ve been completely honest with her, I just wish I’d done it earlier

I wonder whether you need to take having children out of the argument / debate for the time being? It's clouding the issues regarding the lack of intimacy perhaps. Has she ever asked you whether you wank and why you prefer to wank than have sex. Likewise have you ever asked her?

I do think that some of the posts are quite tough - but then given the predominantly female audience then maybe its expected.

I commend you. You've told her how you are feeling. Its not as she is initiating sex and you are refusing, so she also has to be open and honest to you about how she feels.

What did you try to change, and why didnt it work. She says she wants to save the marriage but did you feel that this translated into actions from her when you talked about needing to change?

"I do think that some of the posts are quite tough - but then given the predominantly female audience then maybe its expected."

Why is this the stock response to so called harsh responses on here? It's just so insulting. No one has been that harsh. The man wants to end his marriage. Most people here are encouraging introspection on his part. That's not harsh, that's being grown up.

One person said it was the most selfish OP they had ever read on MN......

And I was very clear on my words. I said some and not all.

Well you sat her down and told her that having children is a dealbreaker and that you would rather masterbate than have sex with her and you are dreaming of being with other women and she doesn’t care or think any action needs to be taken
So there’s your answer ! The relationship seems unsalvagable and if I were you I would to tell her that because told her those three important facts and she is content to continue and doesn’t care you’re leaving

Knowing that you’ve given her ALL the information makes it really much easier

@welliesarefuntowear

"I do think that some of the posts are quite tough - but then given the predominantly female audience then maybe its expected."

Why is this the stock response to so called harsh responses on here? It's just so insulting. No one has been that harsh. The man wants to end his marriage. Most people here are encouraging introspection on his part. That's not harsh, that's being grown up.

I don’t know what thread you’ve been reading, but I don’t want to end my marriage. I’m absolute devastated at the thought that my marriage could be ending. I never thought this could be us, and feel like a complete failure. I feel like I’ve let her down, let myself down and let our families down. The reality is I know we’ve drifted apart and in the long run we could have better lives apart, and perhaps I owe it to her, as much as to myself to take the leap. But the thought of being on my own and starting again fills me with dread, I’m terrified of making the wrong decision, I’m distraught at the thought of devastating the woman who has been the most important person in my life for 15 years. My heart tells me I owe it to her to stay with her and try to work things out, my head tells me that’s just delaying the inevitable.

Given the predominantly female audience. Your words

Any chance this is a reverse, OP? Sorry to ask

@GrantI

I commend you. You've told her how you are feeling. Its not as she is initiating sex and you are refusing, so she also has to be open and honest to you about how she feels.

What did you try to change, and why didnt it work. She says she wants to save the marriage but did you feel that this translated into actions from her when you talked about needing to change?

Yeah she did change. After we talked she did start to initiate sex, she did track her cycle and tell me when was the right time. I guess the problem for me is that I felt like I was going through the motions. You can‘t force attraction. I found us slipping back into the old habits of going to bed at different times etc

@FindingNeverland1

Any chance this is a reverse, OP? Sorry to ask

Not sure what this means, sorry

@Gutwrenching I've been reading your thread. I get your upset. But you've talked about ending your marriage. If you don't want to end it don't. There are no winners here and I've been in a marriage just like yours. It's painful, I get it. You can see my post wasn't aimed at you, more of a general comment about the stock response to a predominantly female response. So there's no need to twist what I've said.

Reverse threads are written from the other perspective to lure posters into writing a response that may help understand another's point of view. So for example your wife writing this thread as you. In my opinion they are deceptive and unhelpful and I really don't think that's the case here

Yes gut wrenching I see yoh are finding this very hard but many people are spending lots of time and thought in giving you solid advice
Please tell me yoh can understand why a woman would not want to have a child to a man who prefers masterbating and is dreaming of being with other women . Isn’t it unrealistic for you to even expect this of her . I mean that’s quite narcissistic to be honest to thi k she should be content to give herself over to pregnancy childbirth and motherhood while you are fantasising about sex with other women
I mean you say it’s because of the baby issue but I’m guess when you masterbate your not imaging some woman holding a baby with ragged hair who has t slept with for days ( the reality ) your SEXUALLY fantasising about and wanting other women
Some might even say it’s narcissistic to even expect her to want to have your child tbh and to think your doing her a favour by staying
You sound heartbroken for sure but I don’t think many women would put their hands up to be i a relationship with a man who feels that way about them

"You sound heartbroken for sure but I don’t think many women would put their hands up to be i a relationship with a man who feels that way about them"

Maybe I'm wrong but it sounds like his wife does. He's laid his cards on the table, and she hasn't told him to leave. She hasn't raised the issue before - so she is happy with the status quo. I think that is what makes all this harder

Yes I agreed and I can’t imagine someone who’s self esteem is so low that they would settle for someone who would rather wank and imagine other women
Is it possible she’s depressed ?
Either way I again say he’s doing we zero favours being there

@welliesarefuntowear

Reverse threads are written from the other perspective to lure posters into writing a response that may help understand another's point of view. So for example your wife writing this thread as you. In my opinion they are deceptive and unhelpful and I really don't think that's the case here

Ah ok, yeah that’s definitely not the case! But I guess one motivation is that I want to know what other women, who have been in the same position as her, would rather their husbands did/would do. I know right now she’s rather I stay. I wonder whether in a few years she’d by relieved that I left. Either way, to some extent I probably am looking to relieve myself of the guilt I’m feeling a bit.

Can I suggest she's not happy with the status quo but terrified of rocking the boat. There's a lot of cliches there but I think my point stands. Of course she wants change. But he's suggested separating. When I was in that situation it left me feeling powerless and terrified he'd leave me. Which of course he did.

I'm going to say that having children, sex, wanking, imaging other women etc are more like symptoms than the cause. People suggest counselling, which I think would be good. I wonder if there is something else underlying emotionally that is at the root here.

I agree she’s probably deep down miserable but scared

He's a good man by the way. He's just a bit of a mess. And unhappy with how his life has turned out in many ways. I still think there's a chance for you and your wife. I really do. But you have to recognise the damage caused by yourself. It will help her enormously.

I disagree grabtl , they may be one compulsive as a symptom but then they also become part of the problem . It’s a circle
He cannot reasonably expect her to want a child when he behaves like this . It’s a huge massive undertaking for a woman to bring a child into the world ... a man who is so easily tempted to other women is a huge risk and biologically this is something most females innately avoid

@Marshmallowmom

Yes gut wrenching I see yoh are finding this very hard but many people are spending lots of time and thought in giving you solid advice Please tell me yoh can understand why a woman would not want to have a child to a man who prefers masterbating and is dreaming of being with other women . Isn’t it unrealistic for you to even expect this of her . I mean that’s quite narcissistic to be honest to thi k she should be content to give herself over to pregnancy childbirth and motherhood while you are fantasising about sex with other women I mean you say it’s because of the baby issue but I’m guess when you masterbate your not imaging some woman holding a baby with ragged hair who has t slept with for days ( the reality ) your SEXUALLY fantasising about and wanting other women Some might even say it’s narcissistic to even expect her to want to have your child tbh and to think your doing her a favour by staying You sound heartbroken for sure but I don’t think many women would put their hands up to be i a relationship with a man who feels that way about them

Yes I can see all that, and I have pointed out to her that I can see that she deserves better, and that she could end up having a better life without me. Yes, I do worry sometimes that she is only staying with me because she is so resistant to change. And yes, I feel she does have awfully low self esteem. But I do know that she is devastated, because I’m speaking with her and I can see the pain I’m causing. To be honest, if she’d told me she felt the same or unsatisfied when I said all this, I suspect it would have made this whole decision a lot easier

And yes he may be a good man but he’s expecting something very unfair of her considering what he’s giving to the relationship

I’ll just add, marshmallow, that I’ve never so much as kissed another woman in the 15 years I’ve been with my wife, and I never would. But if you think women should never have children with a man who might, at certain points in their marriage, fantasise about another woman, then the problems associated with population growth would be quickly fixed!!!