Building up courage to leave - support thread

[myotherface]

Hi everyone,

Just seeing if anyone wants to get together to support each other in difficult relationships thinking about divorce but not quite having the courage for it yet.

I've been married for 10ish years. 3 primary aged DC. First three years together before children were amazing. The past 10 have been rocky to say the least. DH was emotionally abusive throughout a big chunk of that although I still feel he hasn't done it on purpose. I've gone through cycles of saying I'll leave, him being tearful and begging me not to and then eventually turning it all so that everything is my fault. Lots of arguing all throughout the years (can't even think what all this has done to the kids). Episodes of my depression with one of them ending me in hospital.

I've had loads of therapy, worked on myself and what I want from life. I've realised I only have one life and decided I don't need to stay married to a person I don't like. I expect it's going to be unbelievable difficult as he will oppose the divorce with all he's got. I'm going to need support and people who will remind me why I want this in the first place.

Whether you're nowhere near thinking about divorce and have only just started opening your eyes to abuse or even just your own unhappiness in the relationship. Or whether you've already ordered the divorce papers. Please join me and we'll support each other through this. There's got to be a happier life on the other side of this.

@Diabetes123 It all came to a head in the spring last year. I moved out in the summer after a very tense few months. It was really difficult as I didn't have the required earnings for rent or actually any money at all!
Ex is still refusing to discuss divorce, even though he now has a secret (but we all know!) girlfriend. He likes to play games and I can never be entirely sure what he is up to.

@xkayleeyx Sometimes when you really don't know what to do, the best thing to do is nothing. The last few months have been so weird that it is hard to know whether this will mimic normal life or not. If he is genuinely lovely and you are not feeling good about it, then you need to be sure. Nothing needs to happen straight away. Take a bit of breathing space (in a flat, in lockdown, with 2 children!!!) xx

Can I join? I’ve read the whole thread and some of your stories resonate with me so strongly.

DH of nine years, 1 DC aged 6. He’s controlling and will turn everything round to be my fault. I’ve found something out that is a marriage ender (he doesn’t know I know) but it will all end up being my fault and I drove him to it.
I’ve got a phone appointment with a solicitor tomorrow. He’ll want 50/50 custody and I don’t think I can cope with that. He will also refuse to leave and I’ll be stuck in the house with him through a divorce.

@Maybeonedaysoon Same here, happened upon this thread last night and was amazed to find so many of us in similar positions.

I had to stay in the same house for a few months. It was very tense, very weird, very horrible and I really feel for anyone going through that. I got through it though.

Have a really good think about what you want to ask your solicitor and make sure you have all your documents (passports, driving licence, birth certificates, marriage certificate, Vehicle registration document etc) together. Consider stuff like access to bank accounts. I'm sure someone will be along with some good questions for the free legal advice!

If you can, tell a friend what is going on. You can do this. It isn't easy, but that is no reason to stop you. (Everything was always twisted to being my fault to, it becomes almost a default position).

weetabixandcrumpets He sounds nice!!!!!

How do you get over the enormous guilt because right now I am literally drowning in it :( The pain of leaving my DH so heartbroken and my DD's is tearing me apart :(

Sometimes I just miss being a family and just want to run back to my old life (even though I know that would not be the right thing to do). Its so difficult trying to deal with all of the emotions :(

@Diabetes123 I can't give you advice about whether or not to go back, I can only speak from my experience. So, for what it's worth...

My ex is an emotionally abusive git, but like many, can be incredibly charming and we have had some great times and have two gorgeous children. If I went back, there would be no second chance for me, I honestly believe he would seriously harm me if he started to feel I could leave again. But, even with that knowledge, I considered it just to be with my DS and to make everyone feel better, like I always do. And that would be awful. I know how you are feeling.

To cope, I phone my mates and cry at them (I am very lucky to have 2 very close friends who support me to the ends of the earth), I google stuff about how to cope and positive stories of kids and people doing better after divorce. I make tea. I put on Friends on Netflix, I get out the flat for some fresh air and I make good plans for the future. I do not contact my ex. I send the kids funny memes and say 'I love you'.

Time is helping and it is definitely getting better. My DS is coming round and our relationship is becoming a lot closer. I send him cards and letters sometimes so I know he knows I'm thinking of him, but always funny..he is a 13 year old boy and doesn't want angst...but always with a 'loads and loads of love, mum' in them. I have told him many times that it is not him I have left, that he always has a home with me and that I love him more than anything. I also act completely normally with him. He doesn't want the drama. He wants help with his History homework, copious amounts of food, an occasional hug and a laugh.

I am studying for a degree with the OU and have a new job. I am keeping busy!

Good days and bad days. Like I mentioned, my ex is very manipulative and knows the buttons to push. I have huge and exhausting battles ahead. I have done my best to get the message over to him that the kids need both of us and they should not be emotional sounding boards or pawns. He completely ignored me

I know I have many more hard times ahead and some bloody ugly, sobbing, snotty tears and anguish, but each day is another step in the right direction

@Weetabixandcrumpets I know, it’s amazing how similar some of our stories are. It’s comforting to be able to see that there maybe is a way out of this.

I don’t think DC will cope very well at all with a divorce and the thought of it is breaking my heart

My father told me to try and always be kind (not a pushover, just kind), and it is good advice.
I have been assertive (not sure where the strength came from) but I have always tried to be kind. That way it is one less thing to beat myself up about when I am lying in bed going over and over things.

Evening everyone
Kindness I think is key
I'm in a slightly different position to some if you as there is no abuse or bad behaviour in our relationship just a long slow burn out!
I am trying to remain kind and compassionate throughout our difficulties and looking to plan for our future
My DH deserves that and I think and hope that by using this approach I will be able to squash the guilt I feel
I'm feeling tired tonight have spent the whole week going back and fro in my head and have a weekend at home which I am sure will be a challenge x

hi
I went through a divorce 4 years ago when my kids were 4 and 5. It was hard but my kids were fine so I got through it.
Unfortunately the next man I got involved with is a nacassist and I am trying to get the courage to get out of the relationship. I thought he was the one but he has been wearing me down.
I now have no confidence and I am scared of being on my own xx

@Diabetes123, yes, I think it's possible to build the relationship back if there were examples in the past where you enjoyed each other's company, no reason why you couldn't again, but it requires work! And this relationship coach(Jack Ito) is kind of against couples counselling, he says most of the time it leads to each in the couple just sitting there blaming each other...he promotes individual coaching but even just his free resources can point you in the right direction.

I found his book about needy people quite a revelation (got a free download via Audible trial on Amazon), I wouldn't even have considered reading it because I'm the last person I'd ever identify as needy, but thankfully read a few reviews and in one of them there was a mini-summary of the book, and I realised I had to get it. ( and I want to get his What to do if he won't change? book too)

A lot of it was too late for me, there was a few chapters on the importance of choosing your future life partner very carefully and how to go about it, but that's beneficial to teach my kids at least! but there was still many interesting points to consider about my reactions to my DH, and how they came across as totally needy (even though not driven by my personal desires but by my desire to keep the family together, keep the peace, be patient etc).
His website is actually very helpful but very badly laid out in terms of finding information, I'm going to copy and paste some extracts which I found useful.

coachjackito.com/blog/needy-people-marriage-relationships/

Have a read, Diabetes123, judging by the glimpses of your story it's your husband which has a problem with neediness and he might need to do most of the work for you to be able to be together( though it's apparently common for needy people to get in relationships with other needy people) but also if you had a problem establishing boundaries that's a sign of insecure(needy) behaviour, so you could benefit from trying to grow more secure in yourself.

this is from the page following that link, does it sound a bit like your situation, with your leaving being a blow from the blue for your DH?

Development of resentment
In other cases, rather than compromise, one partner gives in to the desires of the other. The more needy partner “temporarily” (they think) sacrifice their need for a close relationship in order just to maintain the relationship. Or, the less needy partner “temporarily” sacrifices time with friends or individual time. These sacrifices only postpone inevitable conflict.
The giving in will help one spouse to enjoy the relationship while the other one becomes resentful. Resentment is an enemy of maintaining feelings of love. If it was the needy person who gave in, the relationship is likely to continue, but to be very unhappy. If the secure spouse gave in, he or she may divorce or have an affair as a solution to being happier.
Surprise rejection
In situations like this, the needy partner will experience the rejection as sudden and as “coming out of nowhere.” Needy people often see danger when it is not there, resulting in mistrust. Needy people also often do not see breakup or divorce warning signs for what they are. Even in this situation however, there are six steps you can follow for how to save your marriage.

More from his blog:

Every teen girl or boy should learn this basic example for building respect. If you are on a date and your date says or does something disrespectful (calls you a bad name, flirts with someone else during your date, complains if you stop his or her sexual advances, etc.), end the date immediately and go home by yourself. What that would accomplish is nipping the behavior in the bud, gaining respect, and becoming more valuable (rather than cheaper and more easily used/abused). What typically happens for teens and adults, single and married, is that they may say they don’t like the behavior or what was said, but then just continue the date. Do you suppose their date, or their spouse, stops the bad behavior? They don’t. They actually feel a little more powerful by continuing to do it. When women tell me that their husbands flirt with others when they go out, what do I know about the women who are complaining? That’s right–they complain about their husband’s behavior, but they put up with it every single time. Do you think their husband’s love them more for it? Or respect them less? Who is more likely to flirt online behind his wife’s back? When you lose respect in one area, you lose it in all areas.

it's from coachjackito.com/blog/get-respect-love-from-spouse/
anyone who has a disrespectful spouse should have a read!

I've found this one really interesting too:

coachjackito.com/blog/blamed-for-everything-by-spouse/

Kind of a lot of work, but if you are already have a family with the 'blamer' worth doing potentially...probably wouldn't bother if it was just a boyfriend or if there were no kids unless such a blamer had loads of other irresistible qualities...

Cassandrainthenight

You are absolutely spot on. I know that behaviours I learned in my very early childhood and perhaps into adulthood have lead me to maintain an unhealthy relationship. I know that I am not aware of my boundaries and have allowed my DH to "satisfy my needs" regardless of how damaging that was to me just to keep my family together. In other words I learned to placate and keep the peace but in the long term my mental health suffered to the point where I just could not take anymore :(

Living on my own is definitely giving me clarity in terms of who I need to be in order to move forward. My concern is that my DH is having individual counselling to address his issues and I will be too however I feel his expectations of getting back together are far higher than mine :(

I will definitely have a good look at that link.

Thank you so much :)

God what a goddamn all morning I have had :(

After a conversation this morning regarding finances etc this is then the message he send me which has just broke my heart in two.

I've got broad shoulders and I'm still processing the shock of whats happened in the last 4/5 weeks without any notice, signs or communication from you - I'm devastated to say the least......and hurting badly. However with family and my friends support along with counselling I will arrive at the right conclusion for me whilst ensuring our daughters suffering/hurt is as minimal as possible. To help I would like communication to an absolute minimum whilst I go through this process. :(:(:(

Made me feel like absolute shite :(

@Diabetes123 hugs, that's hard to hear. You were honest about what you needed, he's being honest about what he needs right now. It's so not easy. He sounds like he accepts it's over.

I'm still here, still haven't done anything. I havered over giving it another few months, but now I'm not sure why. I'm not lowering myself to beg for him to talk to me only to be rejected again. His take appears to be that I should stop trying to dissect our relationship during a global pandemic. I'm not trying to dissect it, I'm trying to start an honest conversation in the hope we can salvage this, but he doesn't know I'm seriously considering splitting up, so I guess he can't make that judgement. So I need to tell him. I'm such a wuss

@Seaside1234 you are most certainly not a wuss it is the hardest chat to have especially if there is some love and care for the person still there
Believe me though when I say once you start it's easier than you think
@Diabetes123 sorry you have had a hard morning
That is a tough message to receive but a bit of distance might help you too giving you space and time to get your head in the right place
I'm heading into the weekend unsure if what it holds my DH wants to keep talking all the time and whilst I know that's good I'm exhausted and still don't have the answer he wants to hear

Everyone posting on here helps thank you
Sending lots of love and a few wines your way this weekend x

@Diabetes123 Are we married to the same man?!!!

I have very similar messages. Always the same format. Basically :-
'You are terrible. I have someone had to get through it despite being blameless. Luckily, people sympathise with me and realise you are a witch. My priority is my son (and usually some blurb about devoting his life to him after I have devastated him). Despite all this I am somehow finding a way through it and do not want you to contact us and upset the apple cart (i.e please disappear whilst I re-write history and paint myself as a martyr) '

I don't contact him much as he gets ranty, pompous and dramatic. I usually keep it very simple and stress that the children need both of us, I have no intention of putting them in the middle and regardless of our problems I would appreciate it if he didn't either, as we both love them very much. (Like I say, makes little difference!).

Will your 16yo DD talk to you. Can you ask her to meet so you can at least have a chat?

'somehow' not 'someone', though there is some irony there!

@Seaside1234 You are definitely not a wuss. It is bloody hard.

Seaside1234 I just so fed up of feeling so guilty all of the bloody time for all of the hurt that I have caused to both my DH and my DD's :( but I am hurting too after all I'm the one who has left my beautiful home, my DH, my DD's and my Dog :( to live on my own which I have never done before and I am seriously struggling :(

I knew it was never gonna be easy but fuck me I'm so sick of feeling like shite :(

You are not a wuss like I have just explained its never gonna be easy and you're gonna hurt others and yourself in the process but I promise saying the words is much easier than the thought of it :)

Takethegirloutofscotland I here you its very exhausting that's how I feel today :( I have the worst stress headache ever :( Do you think maybe you and he need some time apart to work out what you both want?

weetabixandcrumpets Lol :) Its just like in one sentence he says hes devastated and hurting in the next breath its like I'm sure I'll come to the right conclusion for me with no emotion :(

I have been seeing my eldest daughter and she is amazing so supportive and understanding but the youngest one will not speak to me at all :(

Hi thanks for starting this thread. Yep in the same boat, really need to leave ASAP. Stuck in toxic relationship with very angry dh. Married 13 years with 2 dc.
Can’t take much more, everything is always my fault. No sex or affection for years. Soul destroying! For me the hardest thing is going to be the prospect of not waking up to my kids everyday. He will fight for 50% joint custody of kids. For me that’s going to be heartbreaking. Life is so hard, I’m sure none of us on here planned to marry into what would become an unhappy relationship. You get one life right!

It's all such a mess, isn't it.

Everyone should have a chance of happiness and sacrificing yourself to keep the peace might be noble, but heck, what happened to your life?

My parents split up when I was 11 and my brother was 13. They both behaved appallingly and it showed me what not to do! Interestingly my mother made my father out to be Satan personified, eventually we made up our own minds. (He isn't perfect but not quite Lucifer!)

My ex managed to turn my mother against me, even had her spying on me for him. I found emails he sent to business contacts saying I had 'swanned off to try and be young again and have a midlife crisis, abandoning our son and leaving him to pick up the pieces'. He hounded me off social media and has somehow, nearly a year on, managed to confect an image where everything is my fault...and despite the years of emotional abuse and some bloody awful other stuff (oh, it gets much worse), I still feel guilty!

I am aware I need to relearn how I think of myself. I am definitely getting sassy. I am showing DS that I can do things...career change, degree...I am looking good (a stone lighter and it needed to come off)...and our time together is precious. That said, we've talked, he knows he can ask anything but I do not spend my time apologising to him and trying to be Disney mum (can't afford to be, but he is learning money management too!) . I am me, and he is getting a positive impression of how women should be.

@Diabetes123 You are doing so damn well. My thoughts are, keep trying with DD, don't get emotional or dramatic, just be available and let her know you would love to see her when she is ready. It is early days (although I bet its feels like a lifetime). I can't think of anything that I have experienced that is harder than this. It sounds as if your DH is being a bit of a git and he has found a really good way of hurting you.

thank you weetabixandcrumpets although it really really doesn't feel like I'm doing well. No me either its the worst thing I ever been through in my entire life :(

My eldest has just messaged asking how I am and I told her I'm okay (even though I'm not) she doesn't need to know how bad I feel shes just a child herself. Anyway I asked her if she would rather see me tomorrow instead of sunday as she said she was going to see her grandad and at first she said yes after telling me today that she had nothing on for the weekend. The she messages saying oh I forgot I'm seeing my friend tomorrow for some social distances drinks! Feel like she doesn't want to see me and just making something up :( probably just reading too much into it which is what I tend to do but feel very vulnerable at the minute so struggling to be rational :(

Your ex sounds like a right card to be honest :( good on you though for picking yourself up and doing you :) you should be very proud of yourself :)

@Diabetes123 My DS frequently changed arrangements. I called him on it in a moment of insecurity and he was like 'I do want to see you, I just had a game set up'

In my opinion it doesn't hurt to let them know you're unhappy, so don't be too brave. You are quite right though, it isn't their problem. My DD is 21, I told her that it was bloody hard and I missed DS hugely, but that my friends were there for me, so she didn't feel it was her responsibility. Likewise I told DS that being apart from him was the hardest thing in my life. He told me to go back to ex and I calmly explained that I couldn't. He asked for examples of why, I gave them (without the spicy detail) but reiterated that we both loved him more than anything and my ex was a brilliant dad blah blah blah.

When things get really bad, distract yourself. Bad tv is brilliant. Keep it upbeat.

You've got this x