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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Just need to share - no solution

999 replies

Witchesandwizards · 11/04/2020 16:32

I met my kiwi husband 13 years ago in London, I am 48, he is 42 and we have two children, 10 and 7. We moved to NZ October 2019 against my wishes, but my husband always wanted to come back.

It was always an understanding that at some point we would move to NZ but this was decided before children, before my parents became frail and it kept getting put off as we built a successful and comfortable life in London with a close network of friends. I hoped that this would mean we didn’t have to move. By the time he decided we should move, I didn’t want to, but my husband held me to a ‘promise’ I had made 12 years earlier, and despite a lot of arguments, we set the wheels in motion and moved 6 months ago.

Immediately I felt homesick and suddenly realised that I had taken my life for granted, but emotionally I still felt in control and we threw ourselves into finding a house. And when we moved into that house, I looked forward to our container arriving and then it was Christmas. I spent 4 months either expecting things to improve or busy with the holidays. I still cried, we still had arguments, but nothing could prepare me for how I felt when the kids went back to school.

At the start of February it hit me like a ton of bricks that I have left most of my family and all my friends, my career, the home we renovated together, the city I love and my country of birth. It dawned that the rest of my life could be unhappy, living in a place I hate and don’t belong. At almost 50, I don’t really have much chance of building a life that is as fulfilling as my old one - I feel bereft and trapped. The best way I can describe it is that it feels like I’m in a coma and someone is trying to turn off my life support and however hard I try to yell, I can’t make them understand that I’m alive. I feel trapped in a nightmare - I have lost all control over my life. It’s a horror movie. I can’t even look back at last year and all the planning and believe I actually came. It’s a blur. I don’t know how I got on the plane.
Everything I do reminds me of an occasion, place or person from home. Hundreds of times a day. Music makes me sad, photos make me sad, social media makes me sad. I’ve always been the sort of person who can compartmentalise my problems, and still get up every day and find something to enjoy, putting a face on through hard times and still functioning well at work and socially. But now I only function for the children and nothing brings me joy. I have deserted my parents when they need me most, I argue and fight with my husband in front of the children, I don’t earn a living and I am horrible to live with.

Consequently, we are having terrible marriage problems - I’m not playing ball and embracing life as he wants me to, and he says I am negative. He is the classic extrovert and I am a natural introvert but with extrovert ‘cover’ when needed - he thinks I should socialise more to get out of my rut, find a job (after a 24 year career in advertising, I can’t get work for logistical/childcare reasons, age and now probably recession), and is pissed off that I don’t want to hang out with his family all the time (I don’t particularly get on with them). In return I have been absolutely vile to live with, lashing out (not physically) because I blame and resent him for my situation. He is now talking about separation but has said I can’t take the children home so I would have to stay here with 50% access, spending half my time alone in a country I never wanted to live in. I don’t know if I love him, I can’t see the wood for the trees.
I know I am depressed, but what good are anti-depressants, I need a time machine.

If you got this far thank you! There is nothing anyone can do to help but writing it down maybe helped. Or maybe not. 3.30am and I'm done x

OP posts:
Thehouseofmarvels · 28/07/2020 10:46

@Witchesandwizards

I have been reading Toxic Parents by Susan forward. I highly recommend it !

It explains the concept of enmeshment with controlling parents very well.

Thehouseofmarvels · 28/07/2020 10:54

I think some people will live in a state of denial until they are forced out of it against their will. Some will cling to a lie like a drowning man will cling to a rock because the consequences of letting go of their constructed reality is the most terrifying thing possible.

I think your husband knows exactly what he has done but is so terrified of admitting and admitting his family has problems that he will not until he has lost everything.

I strongly suspect that day will come in the next few years and I wonder if the mediator will think so too :)

Sssloou · 28/07/2020 11:40

Your DH is a classic man child in the clutches of his domineering narc controlling mother and toxic family system.

You can see this.

He knows this but he will not hear you - and the more YOU point that out the deeper he will deny it. His resistance of your opinion/needs is his existence - because he is emotionally unable to resist his controlling DM - he transfers and projects that frustration and contempt on to you.

But he will hear it from the mediator. Your task now is to say NOTHING that the mediator has said to you - because that will just blow apart the trust she is building and he will walk. That’s going to be v v hard for you - so work v v hard to resist the urges - meditate, bite your tongue, get your feelings out elsewhere. Give him nothing - except glazed, shallow, cut-short, vague customer services type interactions.

Every word you say is twisted and weaponised. Even facts about your DCs. He would prefer to attack you with your own words than listen to the emotional collapse of his DD.

Stop giving him this ammunition. He will not collaborate with you to support your DD - because his covert rage to hurt you trumps everything.

It will implode. In time. But don’t be near any of it - keep away from SIL.

Happynow001 · 28/07/2020 11:41

Hi @Witchesandwizards

I'm glad this later mediation session went more positively for you and I hope it continues to do so. Well done on putting your points through so well.

If anything, I hope the Trust situation implodes earlier rather than later.

You sound so much calmer and stronger - which is very good for you (particularly in the mediation and other professional situations) but for your children also, who need, amongst other things, for you to continue to be strong.

BTW you are fast approaching your 1K post limit on this thread so you will need to create a new one soon, and paste in a link to this current one.

Keep going OP. I think you are remarkable. 🌹

Scratchyback · 28/07/2020 12:00

Ive been lurking on this thread but have little to add to the great advice and support you’re getting. But I just wanted to say, I’m so glad you’re making progress, witches and delighted the mediator ‘gets it’. Keep going, keep strong. God, the MIL sounds awful. At the end of it all will she be thrilled when she has broken up her sons families/lives and interfered to the point that they can’t function without her? What a legacy she is set to leave.

I hope your DD is ok. Can DH not see what he’s done? What a fool he is.

Thehouseofmarvels · 28/07/2020 12:25

Your kids may be going through a tough time.. but they have you !

My fiancé did not have a sane normal parent like you and I can not even begin to explain the destruction that causes. He is building up his life from absolutely nothing at the moment.

Your kids may be related to dysfunctional people people but are fantastically lucky to have someone like you fighting for them. This makes ALL the difference. I wish my partner had had one relative like you. He says all he ever wanted was to be rescued.

You sound like an absolutely amazing mum and never underestimate just how important you are in ensuring that the dysfunction does not reach the next generation.

PicsInRed · 28/07/2020 12:44

She feels I could help SIL at some point. Turns out she grew up with SIl's mum and dad though which was a bit awkward.

Aaaaaand there it is. Of the Kiwis here, who else just knew she'd know them or be connected in some way?

Thehouseofmarvels · 28/07/2020 12:50

I believe that one day when your husband has lost everything and they have fallen out over the trust he is so ashamed he begs for forgiveness and you will go home. Maybe he will finally be free of the enmeshment.

You could look at this horrific nightmare as a thing you have to get though, and that it is something that your husband has to go through in order to hit rock bottom because it is the only way he will grow as a person and free himself from the toxic bonds. If he can come out the other side he may be a better father.

Never stop believing that it is possible to go home and keep being the strong woman you are :)

PicsInRed · 28/07/2020 12:52

she suspects if we sit round a table with DH, her and 'Superman', I will get what I want without going to court. And if anyone can bust open a family trust he can. He's already hinted I may be able to get income from it.

I think, and I say this with kindness, you are being breathtakingly naive here.

I would drop her immediately. Keep the lawyer, but keep an eye out to ensure he continues to work in your best interests. It will likely be fine as long as you exclude her from the negotiations absolutely.

She knows your SIL's family. Do you really believe she is going to assist you in reducing the capital and income to your SIL's family? She will not.

Besides, as a Kiwi, she will know very well how futile it is to attempt to extract income from such a trust. Your husband will almost certainly be a "discretionary beneficiary". If so, he has no right to income, any more so than any adult child has right to their parent's money. So shes stringing you a bit of a line there.

Her original comments around alcohol were her honest feelings, she is now simply mirroring your beliefs back to you in order to build trust.

You need a totally unrelated individual advocate. Not this woman who is connected to your husbands family - as I'm sure many of us suspected would turn out to be the case.

Sssloou · 28/07/2020 12:59

You have doggedly built up a strong support network who are on your side in the last 6 months:
GP
Lawyer
Friends from home
New friends in NZ
Family at home
Mediator

Keep tapping into the strength they are giving you to pull yourself out of this pit.

Just look at his family as a classic narc, alcoholic, dysfunctional, toxic pantomime with all of the roles assigned.....they are all circling the drain. It will implode. But be well gone because somehow they will implicate you - even started to with the SIL situation.

Expect your DH to start dating v soon (if he isn’t already) - no doubt the MIL has someone appropriate in mind - unless she wants to keep him for herself. His types can’t be alone - he will be spinning some big shot story out there.

That bit will really hurt. But be ready for that body blow and keep your dignity and your focus on keeping a calm, peaceful, attuned, positive home for your DCs.

RandomMess · 28/07/2020 13:26

Everything that @Sssloou says is spot on. Keep your mouth firmly shut.

Let him believe the mediator is on his side, let him be lulled into thinking his charm has worked and he's right etc etc.

It would be good to see where the lay of the land is in the future and if once the finances are agreed for divorce he will let you and the DC to return to the UK.

Thanks
Thehouseofmarvels · 28/07/2020 13:34

And you can't help SIL as other posters have said.

She needs to help herself. If she started going to Alcoholics Anonymous and the scales had fallen from her eyes about that family yes she might need someone kind to turn to if she thought she was going to fall of the wagon. You can't help people you can only support people, who are ready to help themselves get better :)

Catmaiden · 28/07/2020 14:16

De lurking again to ask, why do you not think the Mediator is doing the same tactic to you, of lulling you into a false sense of security?

I wouldn't trust her an inch, I'm afraid Sad

Happynow001 · 28/07/2020 15:30

If he can come out the other side he may be a better father.
But, given all he's done so far, from even before leaving the UK not a good husband at all, and not one I'd want to stay legally tied to once it's possible to be in a safer place to divorce him. Be clever OP.

And yes be careful re SIL. She is not your friend as she has her own interests to think of. I'm sure MIL would have no qualms in using you both against each other to protect her matriarchy.

Witchesandwizards · 28/07/2020 18:14

She knows your SIL's family. Do you really believe she is going to assist you in reducing the capital and income to your SIL's family? She will not.

Mediator doesn't know them any more or what happened to them post marriage some 50 years ago.

De lurking again to ask, why do you not think the Mediator is doing the same tactic to you, of lulling you into a false sense of security?

Unlike DH, I have been honest, admitted my faults (basically shouting, swearing back in Feb/March/April) have nothing to hide and not much to lose now I am convinced that he won't request the kids 50:50. Even with MIL's help he could not cope.

Even now, he is still defending LA twin brother's decision to lie to immigration and meet DH in a bar, leaving me on my own in lockdown with the kids. It's me who is in the wrong for losing my shit when he kept hanging up the phone and threatening to call the police.

@Sssloou I do now feel in a position to completely pull the rug from under his feet and yes, I need to let the infrastructure that I have set up do the work now and keep my big mouth shut! The mediator is going to try and see him this week so not long.
He's a dick - I do still recognise the love I had for him and it catches me off guard. He's thrown away what was a slightly faulty but very manageable and generally happy family life.

And to now be doing what he did to me to the kids, albeit via me, is a very dangerous game. Telling them how they feel.

@Thehouseofmarvels I honestly don't think they will fall out over the trust. They are all so tight knit they will never fall out with each other. I suspect that what will happen is that they lend/give/advance DH money for a house if and when I get the majority share of the family house. DM will keep this going until she dies.

If I helped SIL it wouldn't be until way after, literally no capacity now! But yes, I am wary. Even through her drunkenness she did spout the 'but you were so negative', 'you have a lovely house and lovely children' nonsense. She did reveal that BIL always said he would do anything to get DH back as well. She meant in a positive way as in 'of course he will share the business 50:50', but it also means any trick in the book.

DD had a much better day at school yesterday and was happier last night.

I'll start a new thread and post if I get any news on DH and his visit to the mediator.

OP posts:
Witchesandwizards · 28/07/2020 18:21

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3980634-Getting-my-life-back?watched=1

OP posts:
Witchesandwizards · 28/07/2020 18:28

This is how he winds me up.

Originally the mediator wanted me to see a counsellor before our next session, but I wanted to see her on my own before he was available.

I told DH I was seeing her and he asked if I had seen the counsellor yet.

Me: Not yet, he's not free.
DH: I know $180. It's all good. You need it.
Me: Haha. Stop gaslighting. I meant available.

OP posts:
PicsInRed · 28/07/2020 18:40

Mediator doesn't know them any more or what happened to them post marriage some 50 years ago.

Connections and family ties are known and strong going back 150 (and even 850) years. It can be like the most lineage conscious sections of the UK population. Her connection to them isn't "50 years ago". It's a connection.

"Where did you grow up" and "where did you go to school" will still be asked when you're 70. That's just how it works.

You are you and she is them.

Witchesandwizards · 28/07/2020 18:42

Expect your DH to start dating v soon (if he isn’t already) - no doubt the MIL has someone appropriate in mind - unless she wants to keep him for herself. His types can’t be alone - he will be spinning some big shot story out there.

You know what, I'm honestly not sure I care. It would be confirmation for any mutual friends left in any doubt, that he has behaved badly.
I mean, there will be initial shock, but not sure I can feel worse than I have.

Besides, as a Kiwi, she will know very well how futile it is to attempt to extract income from such a trust. Your husband will almost certainly be a "discretionary beneficiary". If so, he has no right to income, any more so than any adult child has right to their parent's money. So shes stringing you a bit of a line there.

It was the lawyer himself who mentioned it getting easier to break them. But, to be honest, I'm not really bothered about the actual money. The trust is an issue for me because of the lies around it and how it has been used to protect something that was offered to us as a carrot. It would be more of an issue if DH was on side and also pissed off by the deceit.
Morally I don't really feel I am owed anything from it as he doesn't own it yet and we are separated (this would make me like my narc SIL dictating how my parents

I am aiming for the house, child maintenance and spousal maintenance and he can work out where this comes from.

OP posts:
Witchesandwizards · 28/07/2020 18:43

Whoops
(this would make me like my narc SIL dictating how my parents distribute their money).

OP posts:
Thehouseofmarvels · 28/07/2020 18:55

@Witchesandwizards

If he ends up with little money I guess you are right that his parents could purchase a house. If they bought it within the trust his mum might have control over who else lived there, and maybe could veto a new woman moving in if she disliked her. Just what every grown man wants.. mummy approved girlfriends lol !

So good you are getting out!

Witchesandwizards · 28/07/2020 21:33

Even though I don't want to be here and don't appreciate it, there is a tiny bit of me revelling in my 5 bed house with a pool (and disco garage!) while he is in his childhood room in a house that smells of old dogs.
Even if the woman he worships does also live there.

OP posts:
Vodkacranberryplease · 28/07/2020 22:35

Extraordinary. So let's see if I've got this. His mum lied to him to get him back to NZ by offering him 50% of a company she then gave him 20% of, said company being worth far less than she told him. Doing a sales job selling medical equipment. He is now a travelling salesman.

Your h denies any of this and is having a great time drinking with his brothers (2 of them so basic maths would dictate 3 brothers plus parents are not 50% each). He is now living at his parents house. With a sales job, rarely seeing his children. Staying in his childhood bedroom. Where he has been for some time.

While his other brother who has never worked has a large luxury home away from them all.

And you are living in a nice house he pays for, with the children who he only sees one night every other weekend. Because he's at his mums so that's all he can do.

However he's asked for expensive mediation because he wants... something, we don't know what. Because he's not terribly interested in seeing his own children if it means sacrificing drinking time or work.

You couldn't make it up. How stupid is this man exactly? Unbelievable.

Meanwhile the so called evil genius mother has not managed to put together any kind of strategy - she effectively only cares that he lives with her and that they spend a lot of time drinking. 😮

This is going to be too easy. They will implode. You will easily be able to get grounds to take them back and he may even agree as currently he's having to support you.

I'm truly gobsmacked by his stupidity. He sounds to me like a 12 year old. A nasty one who thinks he's clever mind you. Good lord. I'm going to get a supply of popcorn in and will be cheering you on from London.

You and Superman need to take him apart. This is going to be good.

Thehouseofmarvels · 28/07/2020 22:45

I think the limit has been reached on posts but do tag us if you ever do another thread to let us know everything went ok for you :)

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