Relationship and finances

[crossroads1]

Hi all.. bit of a long post here so bear with me. There are 2 things that have been running through my mind lately.

Me and my fiancée got engaged last year - wedding will be postponed due to corona - but a little while ago he opened up to me about his finances. Now don’t get me wrong he is very stable, has a few properties and is very smart with money however he told me he made a lot of mistakes when he was younger which has resulted in him taking Loans and being in debt. His finances are something that is affecting him badly as he knows with a wedding to plan money is crucial. He used to be frivolous but def isn’t anymore.. which leads me to my next point.

Him and I have an amazing relationship his personality is exactly what I’ve always wanted in a man but this thing with his finances has turned me off a bit as he asked me to take a 15k loan for him which he will pay back due to me having a good credit rating and a low interest low. I don’t question him paying me back but I’m turned off and a bit resentful that he even asked me. I mean he made those mistakes when he was younger not me but now I’m feeling I have to suffer because of his out of control spending.

Also I’ve been comparing him to my ex who was awful!! But the one thing ex never did was ask for money help.. in fact he had to declare bankruptcy as he didn’t tell me the extent of his debt.

I really love my other half but am annoyed I’ll have to take a loan for him on my name. Of course I want to help him he cries and his hair even falls out because of the stress. He thought I would leave him and says I deserve someone better who can give me a better life. I know money isn’t everything and he’s by no means poor but I can’t help feeling a little hard done by!! All those fancy holidays nights in casinos etc and now I’m here with the bill it seems!! We don’t go anywhere fancy in fact he really limits his spending because of the mess he’s in. To also be clear he will pay me the money so he says .. it’s just to clear some other things down on a lower interest rate. I haven’t gone through with anything yet but wanted advice. I do trust him but can’t help this feeling of disappointment. Thanks all

Would a bank increase interest on an existing loan? I've had a few loans in my lifetime and none have changed during the term of borrowing.
This smells fishy.
Please can you calculate how much interest your loan would charge over the term and also his higher interest rate loan too. If it's a matter of a few £100 I'd expect my future husband to foot the increase just to not burden me with the admin.

No, loans tend to be fixed rate, don't they.

Someone who, for example, missed payments on his 0% on transfers creditcard could lose the right to the lower rate, quite easily.

I have a mortgage myself to which he did help me and i swiftly paid him back.

Can you tell us a bit more about this?

Did you lend you money at some point then so that you could buy a house?

Is he employed? What does he do for a living? Sorry if I missed that.

Before I did anything I'd ask to look at his credit report - equifax etc and see what's on there

Yes what is the saving each month from what he's currently paying and what he will pay you with the lower interest rate?
I wouldn't have thought it would be that different.

Just walk away, OP. He is a conman and a liar and he will drag you to financial ruin, if you let him.

Why would you want to be with someone who his willing to fleece you like that?

How long will you/he be repaying the loan for?

It is a situation you know you want to say no to. But feel you can't. When I met my ex we were young and he was foolish. Living a single mans life. Out all the time etc. Over drafts. Bank loans and credit cards.

He moved into my house and we started a family. And absorbed his debts into the house. This pattern continued over the next 15 years. He too was a very hard working man. Always successful at what he did. But also complacent about spending. Always the expensive clothes and shoes. And flashing the cash when out. He could never say no. Or compromise.

We aren't together anymore. He earnt well. But spent it too. He wouldn't compromise for the sake of the family. His wants and needs came first. And that has continued in the last 3 years he has paid about 6 months child support.

I am still in the house. But I have the same outstanding mortgage I had 15 years ago. I should of been mortgage free by now. But I have a secure home for the children and I can provide for them. and that's is what is important to me now. Our security.

None of this makes any sense. Just how big was his debt from many years ago that he still needs £15k now to sort it.

That scenario is not someone who is good with money. It clearly shows someone who is fine with debt and doesn’t make it a priority to pay off. So why on earth do you think he will use the £15k debt in your name to finally pay off his debt? Nothing in his past shows you this is likely.

You would be insane to do this. Also don’t marry him. You are not on the same page financially, it would be a huge mistake.

I think you need to ask for complete transparency before marrying him @crossroads1

I know he has got himself into a mess but tbh it isnt my problem

It will become your problem if you take out this loan.

I’ve been thinking about this OP.

Ten years ago when he was 24 he was given / inherited some money from his parents when they sold their family business. He and his sibling used this cash as a deposit to buy some BTL ? residential properties. ( I’m a bit confused why the OP would have been in them if they tenanted ).

My guess is that the fiancé then spent ( his share of ) the rental income rather than using it to pay the costs - mortgage, insurance , letting agent, tax.

I’m also guessing that rather than him regarding this as extra money each month on top if his wages, that he quit his job or Never got one and though he could live off the income . You need A LOT of capital and properties to be able to do this. And be smart ( which I strongly suspect he’s not ).

So maybe that why he had to borrow money to pay these basic costs. And that his “ investments “ are these debts or gambling debts. Or he might have invested in risky schemes which have come to nothing.

Either way, he’s not been very smart with money. Though clearly his sibling IS a lot smarter, if they have refused to allow him to borrow against the property .

Which is why he’s asking the OP to take out an unsecured loan in her name.

Either that or he’s maxed out his credit cards already.

Like PP I don’t think it’s anything to do with an interest rate increase on an existing loan. I think it’s that he CANT borrow anymore on his existing
Properties.

Another possibility is that his recent “ crisis “ might be related to the tax changes for landlords that come in this week with the new tax year.

If he bought his properties 10 years ago, he would have been able to deduct all of this interest on his mortgage from his rental income before tax was paid. But now there’s no tax relief cor capital repayments of mortgages, he will just gets a 20% tax credit instead. This change has been phased in over 5 years, it’s not like it’s a surprise.

I might be wrong and this is nothing to do with it. It might just be that he’s no longer able to service his debt from his rental ( or other ) income.

If they are not repairing and renovating the properties, their rental income might have dropped or perhaps there’s been vacancies or their costs have gone up in another way.

One way this guy IS smart is that he’s moved in with a woman who is good with money and is getting her to subsidise his living costs.

Op have you thought of checking your own credit history to see if he’s taken out any loans in your name already ?

Does he have an actual salaried job or regular SE income? Does he rely only on investment income without actually paying off the business loans?

Has he been totally transparant showing you credit reports, bank statements etc?

Don’t marry someone who is terrible with money it will become a massive issue in your relationship when you want a family. I’ve spent 20 years missing out on extras and holidays with friends and my kids missing school trips because we never had any spare cash and when we separated it was a huge relief to finally have financial control back and not always having to compensate for someone else being useless. Its like being someone’s free cashpoint machine I’m not a big earner just careful. He’s picked you because you are sensible with money and so he will always have someone to bail him out. Are his tenants in good jobs? Are they all going to be able to pay their rent in the current crisis? If not your £15k will be a drop in ocean. Mortgage rates have just gone down and he can get mortgage payment holidays or extend the mortgage term. He could sell you his share in a property rather than take a loan. He needs to get a proper job. My ex was same wouldn’t get his hands dirty and played at being self employed for years. I have been better off since he left and that’s without any child maintenance as he isn’t financially solvent enough to pay any. Be lucky you saw this side of him now I went into it thinking he’d sorted himself out and started a new career only for him to walk away and go freelance within months of the wedding and he’s never been financially stable since. Every time things looked better he’d get bored or quit and we’d be back to square one. If he is that worried he would be willing to work 2/3 jobs evenings and weekends to dig himself out of this hole. I did not appreciate how important having similar attitudes to work, money and responsibility are. My STBXH is a lovely guy great company and we still get on well but he is selfish and spoilt and I will never ever live with anyone or share my finances again. Basically when our house is split he will make a massive profit for being lazy and stupid and I will take a massive financial hit for being sensible and always making sure the bills got paid. The resentment will cancel out whatever else you have together. Don’t have children unless you can finance that solo.

Great advice above......

Remember OP.......you are not getting the truth from him....

Crying and stressed that his hair is falling out.....

He's in deep financial shit...

15,000 from you will probably be only a plaster on his mess...

Its been spelt out very clearly to you here.

Not read the whole thread but it sounds fishy. If he has properties he should be able to raise £15k no problem. There is probably more to this and he is not being honest with you. I'd be wary.

How are you feeling OP? Do you feel any closer to making a decision as to what to do?

There's a logical disconnect here - why is he insisting that he needs the OP to take out a loan, rather than using her savings? You would have thought that a man who valued cash so highly would jump at the chance to avoid paperwork, and get his hands on her money straight away, with minimal paper trails.

The only reasons I can think of (and none of them are very convincing) are :

1. he wants to get her to agree to £15k, then at the last minute, find a "better deal" on a higher amount and pressure her to take that out instead

2. he has no intention of paying it back, but somehow misguidedly thinks she be able to get the loan forgiven/reduced when he stops paying - possibly he has had IVA in the past where debts have been written off. So he thinks its "no big deal" to default on a loan, and that the OP will be fine in the long run, since this way her savings will be safe.

3. he actively wants to get her into debt to make it harder for her to leave the relationship, since she will stay with him to safeguard the repayments. That doesn't make much sense, because he could achieve the same effect by borrowing her savings, then becoming unreliable about paying it back.

4. he's an idiot who doesn't understand how loans work and doesn't realise that paying off £15k over, say, 5 years will cost him over a thousand pounds in interest. This one is probably on balance the most likely - regardless of how much he likes to play the savvy businessmam, he clearly doesn't have a clue what he's doing.

5. He intends to scam her into actually borrowing a larger amount by saying he'll "sort out all the paperwork", not giving her a chance to look over it properly and hoping she'll just trust him and sign up.

Hmm. Any one else have any suggestions why this extremely untrustworthy man might prefer a loan over cold hard cash?

Please don't lend him any money...and please don't take out any credit for him.
The resentment will eat you up alone..which you already admit..
Do not doubt your gut...it is telling you all is not well for a reason..
You are seeing the red flags waving...but are trying not to look because you love him and want to see the best in him..
He is a grown up...he needs to get himself out of his own mess.
It is not your job to bail him out...It doesn't make you a bad person.

You need to secure your assets for yourself...you have a lot to loose by getting involved with the finances of a partner who can't manage money.

You won't want to hear any of this..but I would also forget any idea of getting married to him..

In summary my advice would be to say no to the financial help...put the wedding on hold until he is solvent...if he is genuinely wanting to do this and proves himself the relationship will survive...If not..you will have had a lucky escape...(and will still have your assets in tact to start afresh)...
People don't change their financial personality..and it sounds like you and he are very different in this respect..
Please look out for yourself..
Wishing you all the best x

Because taking £15k cash off your GF and not paying it back is stealing. Only a terrible person would do that.

Whereas he’s “ only “ asking her to sign a bit of paper, it’s just a technicality that it’s in her name and he fully intends to pay it all back. Until he can’t, of course. Or he has some extra expenses that month, like his mates stag do or her birthday. Or until he needs the money for another investment. Remember he has defaulted on loans before, it’s no big deal to him.

I’m sure that to him, taking money you probably can’t pay back from a company is somehow morally ok whereas taking from your GF isn’t.

And once they are married she can share all his other debts too. What a shame the wedding is postponed because of the virus.

Finewordsforaporcupine, my theory would be that he sees her savings as "real" money and would therefore (possibly) feel guilty about taking it, whereas he sees a bank/loan company's money in abstract, and thinks he'll teach her to move debts around like he does or indeed that she can get it written off.

Do not! I repeat DO NOT take a loan out for this man. If he loves you he won't be offended if you say no

The guy's a tin pot man. You talk as if you believe his hype, even in the face of hundreds of people telling you that he's talking shit.

Smart with money.
Crying and losing his hair over debt.

Why can't you see that these two comments do not compute?

You need a 25% deposit for a buy to let property. Add 10 years of equity on to this. Multiply the properties. He can remortgage and easily take 15k. Except he's a liar.

Well.. your wedding's been postponed, indefinitely. So the plan is you take out the loan, and he keeps all his assets..? And then..? Why doesn't he sell some of his properties for money? He could transfer them to you? For £15k. You give him cash, he gives you the property? Then if you still end up getting married (big if..) it'd all be shared again anyway? And if not, well you'd have a property with rental income to cover your debt.