Seriously, is this a thing??

[Querying]

Hi. I've been dating someone for a few weeks. Seems okay, but clearly still in the early stages of getting to know. He seems alright. We share a lot of the same values.

A couple of weeks ago, he invited me over to his apartment (not for sex). I was quite excited and looking forward to seeing where he lived, etc.

As soon as he let me in, my heart sank. His place was an absolute tip; curtains not properly open, pictures not hung up on the wall (left at side of chair), rug in the hallway was all skuwif (sp). I was quite surprised, and disappointed.

There was no milk in fridge so couldn't even make me a cuppa (he doesn't drink hot drinks, but knows I do).

Now this is where I think I'm judging. He's got quite a 'high-flying' job and I guess I expected his apartment to reflect that.

I've spoken to two friends. One has said that it's unacceptable and the other has said that perhaps he doesn't place tidiness as a top priority. I must say, his place didn't smell great, either.

But, here's the thing; surely if you know someone is coming over, you make the effort? Is there any genuine reason why this would not be the case (apart from the fact that he maybe doesn't care too much about me? )

Ps, I've seen him a couple of times, since...not at his place.

Maybe he spends a lot of time at work and does not take untidy house into his priorities.
A unstraightend mat and unhung pictures are not a major only minor.
Any filthy loads of dishes or laundry perhaps so.
If you continue to see him he might realise he needs a tidy - straighten up.
If you visit again for a second try, offer to get milk on the way.

Your list of messy stuff doesn't suggest it's a tip.

But the smell? That's more concerning.

Inspect kitchen and bathroom next time. Those represent the crux of the matter.

I really don’t get how what you’ve described is an absolute tip. I am lucky that family and friends love me despite my disorder, cobwebs and worse! Sounds like you are not compatible, let him go.

So his house is basically like a student house. Yanbu.

Long term, you'll end up living together. Could you handle living with the mess?
If not, would you be willing to keep it all tidy?

I can cope with untidyness and a bit of clutter. Smells?

Did it smell in the kitchen?

Smell = dirty

That's a definite, big fat NO. I don't care how much £££ he is earning.

Clean but cluttered is fine. If the place smells off then it’s not clean. So just no, it would completely put me off. I don’t need someone else making more work for me as they don’t have basic adult behaviours covered (and I wonder if I’d end up doing all of the adult work for us so the man could to earn his money - no thanks). If he’s earning enough he could get a cleaner but he hasn’t. One visit however isn’t enough to judge... and only you know if it’s a dealbreaker for you.

It would be a massive turn off for me! Everyone I’ve ever met has made the effort of tidying and preparing for visits. For example generally tidying up and having drinks/snacks available like any decent host would. I know I do. The nail in the coffin is the smell you mentioned. I can’t do unsavoury smells.

Perhaps the fella is so busy with work/career he’s never bothered about his home environment enough for it to bother him. He chooses to return to this every day after work and what you described is not welcoming, not inviting, not energising, not rejuvenating, not relaxing, not homely and not clean. I dread to think what’s his bedroom/bathroom/sheets & towels are like.

If you like him and it bothers you enough I’d just ask ‘when’s your cleaner due’

If you ever live together then this would be much more of a problem. Take it as a good hint about whether he would do any housework at your house if you did live with him

It’s a no from me. Couldn’t stand it. If he hasn’t got the decency to tidy up and make an effort the very first time you go to his place then it will only get worse.
The clutter pictures 1 or none

I’m with you op....the fact it didn’t smell good either 🤮

I half shut curtain, a picture not hung and a rug not straight doesn’t make a mess.

Was there anything else? Dirty cups on the floor, empty food packets hanging about?

You say it smelt. But, given your very high standards does clean smell of zoflora and fabreeze to you?

What you describe does not equal slob,tip,squalor etc.
The smell is concerning though. How long did you stay that you did not need to use the bathroom or see any rooms except for the living room? I wonder if he's done a "visitor" tidy, aka shove all the shit in various rooms,make one half presentable (livingroom) then shut all the other doors and hope for the best.

Clothes on the floor,dirty dishes, cups left about ,rubbish etc would make it a tip.

The thing is whether your standards are ridiculous or not,it doesn't matter. You're the one that will have to live with him if things go well, and if you couldn't cope or become resentful because you have to do everything because he doesn't "see" it then that's a waste of your time.

I don't think it sounds bad - an unhung picture and a wonky rug? I wouldn't even call that a mess. The curtains are easily rectified (fwiw we often have a curtain drawn in the day when the sun is out in winter as it's so low it shines in and blinds whoever sits on the sofa). I don't know what you mean by a manly smell so I can't comment on that. If it was dirty, stuff all over the place, festering used mugs and bowls left out, dirty laundry strewn everywhere then you'd have a point. I don't see a problem with what you've described.

The thing with an unpleasant smell in a home is it's usually due to a build up of organic matter. Skin cells, body hair, animal hair, food waste and that sort of thing. He will have gone nose blind but it can be a real stunner to an incomer. The trouble with organic matter is that unless it is kept in a very dry environment it develops moulds and they can make you very ill indeed.

I dumped a BF because he was incapable of wiping his own arse and being clean in that respect. That was donkeys years ago and I still vaguely know him. It was not a mistake to dump him, put it that way.

@Querying yes I did, I also refused to use the bathroom 😆

But he knew himself how awful his flat was and had been reluctant to invite me over for ages.

Your description doesn’t sound like an absolute tip.
Curtain half open..are fucking joking?
Pictures not hung up on the wall...he will probably do that later.
No milk in the fridge..he doesn’t drink it.
Get over yourself.

What does 'acceptably untidy' look like to you OP?

OP, I posted a critical comment last night, saying if he didn’t bother to clean up for your first visit then he never would bother, and if you stayed with him you’d either live in a tip or spend your life clearing up after him.

Then I thought - What am I saying? My DH is the untidiest person I know. His place looked like an overstuffed junk shop when i first visited - and he had spent a weekend tidying up before I arrived!

But he is the most loving, generous person and I wouldn’t swap him for anyone. I am always the one who instigates tidying or decluttering, but he joins in and does his share. One of my friends is married to an obsessively tidy man, and she hardly dares put her bag down.

If he’s lazy or arrogant, sure, avoid him. But don’t write him off for a bit of what sounds from your description like fairly minor messiness!

YOU ARE BEING RIDICULOUS

Go back and check out the rest of the place

What does 'acceptably untidy' look like to you OP?

Along with the smell, it was the lack of effort that, I think, got me. My house is far from perfect, but if a love interest was coming over, I would make an effort. Yes, it's a first-world problem that it irked me so much, hence my original post.

And to the poster who said does a clean smell equal febreeze. No, definitely not. But as I mentioned in my original post, it smelt off.

The smell would be the thing that bothers me, rather than things not being show room tidy - if you like him for who he is, and would be OK doing all the cleaning and tidying etc, I wouldn't dump him just yet. Only you can tell if you'd be OK with it, doesn't sound like you're really convinced though, and that's totally fine. You don't need to justify that to anyone else.

I've hung out with a guy who was pretty messy before - to the point where I had to be careful standing up from the bed - he'd leave his expensive games controllers plus other crap on the floor, but at the same time was passive aggressive if I moved things out of the way . He used the bed as a sofa because his comfy chair was broken but he couldn't be arsed to tell the landlord so it could be fixed. I asked him why (LL wasn't exactly an ogre or anything) and he just did this grunting/shrug thing.
I also found mouldy bread (and once even worse, something that was so off it was turning to liquid - not envy!) in the cupboard/fridge more than once.
It's not the main reason I ditched him in the end, but even years later the memories of that flat still make me shudder a little.

Have you considered that what you considered a tip(it wasn't) was actually him making an effort?

According to my mum my flat is a tip, when she comes to visit she always starts cleaning and shit. I stopped making an effort because despite cleaning and tidying for a whole week before she came she still thought it was a tip and there were still things to sort out.

I first called into my now DH place on my way back from a trip - he had about an hours notice I would be passing and calling in. When I got there the place was spotless. I asked him if he had been somewhere else that morning as he was wearing a lovely shirt chinos and nice shoes and he said no. He made all that effort for me calling in for a cup of tea for an hour. I wouldn’t put up with a man who lived like a pig. It’s basic manners to clean up for your guests. Even if he’s very busy in his job he can afford a cleaner if he wanted to which he clearly doesn’t.