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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

is this a big red flag? Or am I a big red flag?

648 replies

aquickfiresidechat · 25/01/2020 23:19

I've been dating someone for a year. He works in the Geneva office of my company and he travels to London, and I to Geneva, once every other week, so it works out that we have seen each other for a period of days (2 or 3) each week staying at each other's flats/or hotels.

In the company we have a bulletin that goes round daily saying who is in which office within Europe. New man and I also have access to each other's calendars so some days I like to see what he is up to and imagine him going about his day and I always imagined he liked this too.

Anyway, we both went away separately for Christmas and came back early January. We were talking and chatting regularly on the phone like we always do about when we could next see each other. He then went on a business trip and was busy with meetings and time difference, so we did not get a chance to speak much.

Two weeks ago, I noticed on the company bulletin that he was due to be in London the next day. I assumed he had just forgotten to mention it being so busy and that he would make arrangements with me shortly. The next day came and he was not in the office. I double clicked on his diary and saw that he was in meetings in London but not coming into the office.

I sent him a message and said "why didn't you tell me you are in London? Can we see each other tonight?" He texted back a bit short and told me to meet him for a drink after work.

I arrived and asked him how he was. He said, "shocked." I said "why shocked?" he said "because you have been going through my diary and checking up on me." I said "but we have access to each other's diaries, I saw you were in London, and I assumed we'd see each other?" He sat there open mouthed for about 10 mins while I tried to justify why I had looked at his diary and questioned him.

When I got upset he became softer and said he wanted to make me happy and he was sorry for not telling me, but he had terrible jetlag, was completely underwater with work and not yet recovered from Christmas and just felt he needed a night to sleep. He cancelled his client dinner and we spent most of the evening talking about it. I was actually crying because I was so shocked at the sudden attitude change. He asked me to stay the night and I was still quite upset and said no, and we went our separate ways and he flew back to Geneva the next day. We agreed that we would communicate openly about when he is in London going forward.

The next morning he rang me before his flight, quite agitated and said that he had not slept a wink because he felt quite angry that I would demand he see me every time he is in London. He said it had nothing to do with seeing anyone else or not wanting the relationship, but he would be travelling to the UK more frequently and just the thought that, that would be my expectation every single time he was here felt very demanding. His justification for this was that he was most often knackered and would have evening meetings with clients or customers and therefore would not want to trek over to my flat at 11pm or midnight and then fly back to Geneva the next day. He said "you are my priority, but you cannot be my priority all the time." While I wasn't really happy with this, we agreed that he would tell me when he was in London even if he was not going to see me.

I found this new arrangement quite difficult to understand, as this was obviously not our previous pattern, so I didn't feel I was delusional or imagining the relationship was more than it was, for expecting the previous pattern to continue, even though at the time he was telling me this I was apologising rather than justifying my thought process. I felt that he reset the relationship and bamboozled me into thinking that questioning him or his behaviour was stalker-esque or obsessive.

We carried on speaking on the phone every day and texting a lot (it's always him initiating contact. He calls me about five times a day just to chat,) Three days later the company bulletin came again saying that he was in London. He had not told me this.

I double clicked on his diary only to see that he had codified it. Ie, replaced information with a letter and a number. All bookings and reservations that he usually made and I could previously see were now password protected and then diary entries had been made private. Seeing this made me feel like a stalker and made me think that he thought I was a stalker.

He carried on throughout the day communicating with me as normal. I did not ask him where he was. At around 7pm he said he was off to a client dinner and that he would sign off the the night as it would be late. I assume he thought I thought he was in Geneva.

I don't know what got into me but I felt I wanted to know for sure, so at midnight I went to the hotel he normally stays at while here, and I waited in a bar over the road where I could see the door. Lo and behold, I saw him returning to the hotel and going in late. Alone.

I texted him. "Hey can we talk?" He replied immediately. "Sorry, no. Off to bed."

I felt humiliated and embarrassed of myself and like a true stalker. The next morning I decided it was over. I felt that if I told him the reasons why (I was upset he had coded his diary and I had spied on him outside his hotel) it would give me more reasons to feel embarrassed. So I just stopped communicating with him entirely.

Two weeks went by and I ignored all calls and messages and took a week off work to go away and switched my phone off. When I came back to work, I found him in my office, beside himself. Why had I done this to him? What was my problem? Why had I not replied to him? What did I think I was doing? He had been in London looking for me etc.

I've agreed to chat to him about it all on Wednesday when I am next in Geneva. I don't trust him. I cant tell him why.

I don't know anymore whether his behaviour is the red flag or whether mine is.

What do you think??

OP posts:
HannaYeah · 26/01/2020 13:30

Looking at your significant other’s open calendar is not stalking. She said they agreed to share these.

Expecting to continue mutually sharing your whereabouts with someone after you’ve both done so for a full year is not unreasonable.

Telling someone you call 5 times a day you are in their city is normal behavior. Calling them from their city and hiding your location is not normal. In fact, I’d call it lying by omission.

Telling someone I’m here but busy night so I can’t see you is the adult way to manage the relationship. I’d expect this from a friend, too

Looking for someone where you expect them to be one time is not stalking. If it is, the guy stalked OP by calling her repeatedly and showing up at her desk so that cancels out her one check on him.

He knew about the calendar and forgot when he decided he wanted to be dodgy. He’s a dumbass for that and not realizing she’d see the bulletin.

Lastly, dude will go out of his ever loving mind if OP stops telling him when she’s in Geneva and hides her own calendar. His breakdown at her desk proves that.

Fartnite · 26/01/2020 13:32

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

HannaYeah · 26/01/2020 13:35

Am I the only one that would be annoyed as hell if my DH called me 5 times a day? Sheesh!

Look up stories of people that have actually been stalked. That word has an actual meaning and it doesn’t mean “looking up what my schmookums has on his calendar today so I can say dream about him and not bother him at a bad time.”

I don’t fault the OP for taking a break from the guy. She needed space. He proved they don’t have to share their whereabouts with one another.

StreetwiseHercules · 26/01/2020 13:36

“ Telling someone I’m here but busy night so I can’t see you is the adult way to manage the relationship.”

Unless you have reason to believe the other person will get the hump and/or try to manipulate them into seeing them.

HannaYeah · 26/01/2020 13:41

Fartnite - agree totally.

RandomMess · 26/01/2020 13:42

He wanted the relationship on his terms.

He agreed to let you know when he was in London even if he didn't have time to meet up but he lied about it instead.

He wants the relationship you had for the first 12 months but not more than that.

Whilst your behaviour wasn't great it must have hurt to have it confirmed he was being deceitful and he didn't like that you took back control from him.

I think if you still meet up to chat just tell him you thought the relationship was going somewhere whereas he clearly wants it on his terms so it's over.

Thanks
HannaYeah · 26/01/2020 13:42

@StreetwiseHercules

You are assuming facts not in evidence.

Do you really think it’s normal to call someone five times a day?

BumbleBeee69 · 26/01/2020 13:44

She needed space

is she taking space.. hanging around outside his Hotel ?

P999 · 26/01/2020 13:44

Ugh. People are having a go at OP as sport. She's done sod all wrong. You're all being nasty cos it's anonymous and fun. Nasty, Nasty, nasty.

StreetwiseHercules · 26/01/2020 13:45

“Do you really think it’s normal to call someone five times a day?”

No, I don’t. 😮

Scarsthelot · 26/01/2020 13:45

OP, have you posted about him quite a bit? Was planning on moving there?

zonkin · 26/01/2020 13:46

I'm going on the side of your behaviour is the red flag. Just walk away. This relationship has turned you into this and you recognise that it's not normal behaviour.

HannaYeah · 26/01/2020 13:50

She didn’t accost him, go through his trash, break into his room, follow his car. She watched him walk into his hotel exactly one time.

That the same people who don’t know what an actual stalking looks like are vilifying OP for going on holiday without telling him boggles the mind. Why does she owe him an explanation of her whereabouts? I’ll bet her open calendar showed she was unavailable that week.

RandomMess · 26/01/2020 13:52

Phoning someone 5 times per day and deliberately not telling them your in their city for the day when you have agreed that you would is quite frankly weird, very weird.

You would expect someone to be "I'm in London for 24 hours but I'll be in back to back meetings so I'll be too tired and grumpy to spend time together by the end of them"

I'd be surprised that he didn't invite you stay over in his hotel room so at least you could cuddle/sleep/shag even if there wasn't time for breakfast together 🤷🏽‍♀️

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 13:53

Lastly, dude will go out of his ever loving mind if OP stops telling him when she’s in Geneva and hides her own calendar. His breakdown at her desk proves that.

Yup.

StreetwiseHercules · 26/01/2020 13:53

“He wanted the relationship on his terms.”

And she on hers. So what?

LovePoppy · 26/01/2020 13:53

She wasn't standing outside his hotel. She watched from afar. It would have been creepy if she confronted him, but she didn't.

The fact that you don’t see that this is the same is shocking. And she attempted to confront him by texting him. He just didn’t take the bait

She waited to see if he was lying to her and then dumped him as soon as she found out he was!

She didn’t dump him, she ignored him and then ghosted him.

I don't believe that ghosting was decent of her, but other than that she's done nothing wrong!

Yikes

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 13:54

Ugh. People are having a go at OP as sport. She's done sod all wrong. You're all being nasty cos it's anonymous and fun. Nasty, Nasty, nasty.

That's AIBU and sometimes Relationships too.

Fartnite · 26/01/2020 13:55

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

saraclara · 26/01/2020 14:00

The OP sounds unhinged. I’d password protect my diary as wel if my psycho bf started challenging me as to where I was and why I wasn’t keeping in touch at all times.

..and everything else that @AllHeart1 said.

This thread is MN double standards at its worst. If a woman posted as the man in this situation, about his girlfriend using their work calendar to check up on her, then questioned her because she'd not spent time with him, when she'd just wanted an early night. Then the lurking outside her hotel thing, and the rest...

This thread would have been 100% LTB with not a single person justifying his actions with "well he wasn't really stalking...I mean, he only did it once"

saraclara · 26/01/2020 14:04

Damn. Totally messed that up. I meant:

If a woman posted about her boyfriend using their work calendar to check up on her, then questioned her because she'd not spent time with him, when she'd just wanted an early night. Then the lurking outside her hotel thing, and the rest...

This thread would have been 100% LTB with not a single person justifying his actions with "well he wasn't really stalking...I mean, he only did it once"

onanothertrain · 26/01/2020 14:05

fartnite aren't you a charmer

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 14:06

To what end? Why should he? Why is he accountable to her for his time and location when they are not due to meet and it isn’t relevant?

Basic courtesy & communication to your gf/bf? Most people would've put out by their bf/gf not telling them they're in the same city if they'd been seeing them and been intimate for a year.

Plus him not doing so changed their previous norm.

He probably felt pressured into agreeing to that and then, legitimately, decided not to go along with it.

Yes.

Opentooffers · 26/01/2020 14:07

Yes you were staking. Why? Because by your own admission you were using his diary as a lover, not a colleague so you were using your position to get extra info and he clearly saw this as a step too far so coded things, which seams reasonable.
There's a wave you ride at the beginning of a relationship where you fit in time extra to see the other, but it can be entirely understandable that after a while, things settle and the things you put aside start to need attention so the pattern of seeing someone can also adjust. His problem was poor communication, he should of explained this before you got upset about him being in London, but not seeing you.
When challenged over it, he explained and said he'd let you know but again didn't. It could be that he is too busy with work, in which case, he should tell you this but has not been, for what reason only he knows, or you. It sound like you you gave him a serve the first time and you stalked him the 2nd time. Perhaps give this a miss, date someone whose calendar you don't have access to.

PicsInRed · 26/01/2020 14:08

FFS, they voluntarily shared their calendars with each other...for the purpose of scheduling time with each other. That's not stalking. Hmm

OP did what loads of women in LDRs have been told to do before in Mumsnet threads - stake out his house and find out if he's cheating, married etc. In this case, his house was a hotel.

It's not something I'd do (I'd just dump if his ambivalence and gaslighting was turning my mind soft Hmm) but the OP needed to confirm that he was lying and there was no saving this, did so and promptly broke up with him.

Literally following Mumsnet advice.

Stalker? She dumped him and he's the one who went "Single White Female"! Yeesh.