Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

is this a big red flag? Or am I a big red flag?

648 replies

aquickfiresidechat · 25/01/2020 23:19

I've been dating someone for a year. He works in the Geneva office of my company and he travels to London, and I to Geneva, once every other week, so it works out that we have seen each other for a period of days (2 or 3) each week staying at each other's flats/or hotels.

In the company we have a bulletin that goes round daily saying who is in which office within Europe. New man and I also have access to each other's calendars so some days I like to see what he is up to and imagine him going about his day and I always imagined he liked this too.

Anyway, we both went away separately for Christmas and came back early January. We were talking and chatting regularly on the phone like we always do about when we could next see each other. He then went on a business trip and was busy with meetings and time difference, so we did not get a chance to speak much.

Two weeks ago, I noticed on the company bulletin that he was due to be in London the next day. I assumed he had just forgotten to mention it being so busy and that he would make arrangements with me shortly. The next day came and he was not in the office. I double clicked on his diary and saw that he was in meetings in London but not coming into the office.

I sent him a message and said "why didn't you tell me you are in London? Can we see each other tonight?" He texted back a bit short and told me to meet him for a drink after work.

I arrived and asked him how he was. He said, "shocked." I said "why shocked?" he said "because you have been going through my diary and checking up on me." I said "but we have access to each other's diaries, I saw you were in London, and I assumed we'd see each other?" He sat there open mouthed for about 10 mins while I tried to justify why I had looked at his diary and questioned him.

When I got upset he became softer and said he wanted to make me happy and he was sorry for not telling me, but he had terrible jetlag, was completely underwater with work and not yet recovered from Christmas and just felt he needed a night to sleep. He cancelled his client dinner and we spent most of the evening talking about it. I was actually crying because I was so shocked at the sudden attitude change. He asked me to stay the night and I was still quite upset and said no, and we went our separate ways and he flew back to Geneva the next day. We agreed that we would communicate openly about when he is in London going forward.

The next morning he rang me before his flight, quite agitated and said that he had not slept a wink because he felt quite angry that I would demand he see me every time he is in London. He said it had nothing to do with seeing anyone else or not wanting the relationship, but he would be travelling to the UK more frequently and just the thought that, that would be my expectation every single time he was here felt very demanding. His justification for this was that he was most often knackered and would have evening meetings with clients or customers and therefore would not want to trek over to my flat at 11pm or midnight and then fly back to Geneva the next day. He said "you are my priority, but you cannot be my priority all the time." While I wasn't really happy with this, we agreed that he would tell me when he was in London even if he was not going to see me.

I found this new arrangement quite difficult to understand, as this was obviously not our previous pattern, so I didn't feel I was delusional or imagining the relationship was more than it was, for expecting the previous pattern to continue, even though at the time he was telling me this I was apologising rather than justifying my thought process. I felt that he reset the relationship and bamboozled me into thinking that questioning him or his behaviour was stalker-esque or obsessive.

We carried on speaking on the phone every day and texting a lot (it's always him initiating contact. He calls me about five times a day just to chat,) Three days later the company bulletin came again saying that he was in London. He had not told me this.

I double clicked on his diary only to see that he had codified it. Ie, replaced information with a letter and a number. All bookings and reservations that he usually made and I could previously see were now password protected and then diary entries had been made private. Seeing this made me feel like a stalker and made me think that he thought I was a stalker.

He carried on throughout the day communicating with me as normal. I did not ask him where he was. At around 7pm he said he was off to a client dinner and that he would sign off the the night as it would be late. I assume he thought I thought he was in Geneva.

I don't know what got into me but I felt I wanted to know for sure, so at midnight I went to the hotel he normally stays at while here, and I waited in a bar over the road where I could see the door. Lo and behold, I saw him returning to the hotel and going in late. Alone.

I texted him. "Hey can we talk?" He replied immediately. "Sorry, no. Off to bed."

I felt humiliated and embarrassed of myself and like a true stalker. The next morning I decided it was over. I felt that if I told him the reasons why (I was upset he had coded his diary and I had spied on him outside his hotel) it would give me more reasons to feel embarrassed. So I just stopped communicating with him entirely.

Two weeks went by and I ignored all calls and messages and took a week off work to go away and switched my phone off. When I came back to work, I found him in my office, beside himself. Why had I done this to him? What was my problem? Why had I not replied to him? What did I think I was doing? He had been in London looking for me etc.

I've agreed to chat to him about it all on Wednesday when I am next in Geneva. I don't trust him. I cant tell him why.

I don't know anymore whether his behaviour is the red flag or whether mine is.

What do you think??

OP posts:
Fml2015 · 27/01/2020 11:55

*know

QuantomatoBay · 27/01/2020 11:57

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TatianaLarina · 27/01/2020 11:59

Ita been covered many times but people still keep insisting he doesnt know about it, so is thick and thought he would get away with OP not knowing. Depute op not saying anything like that.

Well no, they said he did know about it that’s why he must be thick. But that wasn’t the angle I was referring to - which is that without confirmation from him, it’s possible the bulletin was incorrect in this instance.

Besidesthepoint · 27/01/2020 12:00

At the end of the day there is only one question: does this relationship have a future? Can you grow old with him?

It doesn't sound like it, so stop putting energy into it/him and use your time and energy to find someone else.

Don't make a big dance of how to dump him, you don't trust him anymore so it's over. Don't discuss it. Don't listen to excuses, just say sorry and hang up. If he goes to your office kick him out and if he refuses go to HR.

QuantomatoBay · 27/01/2020 12:01

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

doritosdip · 27/01/2020 12:02

OP How would you have reacted if he'd said he was in London but wanted those 2 nights for himself to sleep or whatever? I think he wants to cool things and thought that his code was too clever for OP to work out.

After his reaction to you checking his diary, I think you should have stopped checking tbh. The code is obviously a passive aggressive "mind your own business" signal,

I think that OP's behaviour is a red flag. If you speak 5 times a day then checking the diary as well seems nuts. Stalking him was the pinnacle of crazy.

His behaviour of trying to avoid OP but being frantic when she ghosts him is also strange but I can see why it caught his attention. Lots of women here are ghosted but think that he's in hospital or died rather than he's done a runner and they should stop chasing him.

Bluntness100 · 27/01/2020 12:04

He did know. I doubt he is "thick" more he wanted to avoid the drama and send a clear message. He handled it very badly clearly. But because he handled it badly doesn't necessitate her going all fatal attraction on him. Two wrongs don't make a right, she could have handled it maturely. She didn't need to be hiding out outside his hotel waiting for him to come back and then texting him as soon as he did, as said, likely so she could get to see him.

Scarsthelot · 27/01/2020 12:04

She didn't mention the bulletin imply because she told him about the diary instead. She assumed that he would knowshewould know he was in London from both the bulletin AND his diary.

Really

'How did you know I am in london?'

The response is 'I checked your diary'

Rather than the truth 'it says it in the bulletin that comes out every morning....every sees it'

Why would she hide hoe she actually found out. OP says the bulletin is something everyone sees.

He thought this because he never reads the bulletin.

Again...totally made up. You have no idea about that. Even if he doesnt read it, that doesnt mean he has no clue it exists. Maybe he just doesnt need or want to read it, if he doesnt read it.

I get that it's hard to believe that people who hold down jobs are this dumb. I did, early in my working life

Get over yourself. I am director in a company that is the biggest in the industry we are in. I know that senior working people come in all different forms. My brother is in mens. Yet a bit dim.

You are patronising as well as just making up stories.

Scarsthelot · 27/01/2020 12:06

Well no, they said he did know about it that’s why he must be thick.

Read the last page of this thread. Some posters definitely believe he doesnt know.

TatianaLarina · 27/01/2020 12:07

From what she has said he didn't tell her because he feels she expects to see him every time and kicks off if he doesn't. So basically he was avoiding the drama, cowardly but there is is.

Nooo Bluntness read the OP. She got upset after he didn’t tell her the first time. He had no way of knowing she would get upset because he hadn’t done this before. He then used her upset as justification of his behaviour in parenthesis. But it was all after the fact.

Who knows why he didn’t just have a sensible adult conversation in the first place. What is certain is that his method, far from avoiding drama, created more.

She wasn't accepting he wouldn't see her at all, so hid outside his hotel to try to get in there anyway.

???? Now you’re just making stuff up. She went to verify that he was in London despite him not having said he would be.

TatianaLarina · 27/01/2020 12:09

Two wrongs don't make a right, she could have handled it maturely.

If he had handled this maturely from the off, the situation would never have arisen. Confused

Scarsthelot · 27/01/2020 12:09

She went to verify that he was in London despite him not having said he would be.

I do wonder what ops response would have been if he had have been open to having a chat

Chewysmum · 27/01/2020 12:10

Tbh both of you have shown "red flag" behaviors and the relationship definitely cannot work in the long run. He was in the wrong first but you took it to a whole new level of wrong IMO. You will never be able to trust this man and that is turning you into a person that you don't want to be so the answer is simple, you must end the relationship.
But simply cutting contact for 2 weeks is childish and rude IMO, just explain that you no longer want to be with him, you don't have to mention the stalking, just let him down gently and walk away.
And maybe some therapy might help you in the long run?

TatianaLarina · 27/01/2020 12:11

Some posters definitely believe he doesnt know.

Did they, I cba to read back. Well they may be right. He’s dim either way.

QuantomatoBay · 27/01/2020 12:12

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Scarsthelot · 27/01/2020 12:14

Did they, I cba to read back. Well they may be right. He’s dim either way.

How? It's entirely possible he is aware of the bulletin. Which is why he didnt bother telling her. Because he knows she reads it and would know.

Scarsthelot · 27/01/2020 12:16

She didn't 'hide' it she just didn't mention it as she said 'calendar' instead

Yet when he just doesnt mention something its lying?

Again, what you are dealing with at wor has no impact on this situation at all.

Non what's so ever. You are just making shit up

QuantomatoBay · 27/01/2020 12:16

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

StreetwiseHercules · 27/01/2020 12:17

There would have been no good or successful way for the guy to have handled any of this with the OP.

The OP wants things to be exactly as she would prefer and if there is any deviation from this in any way, it means drama.

The OP does not care how the guy feels at all. Whatever tiredness or stress etc from work and travel he is feeling is simply immaterial to her. He just needs to toe the line and do what he wants.

He is a thing to her, the purpose of which is to validate her to herself.

I honestly think there are a lot of people in the world who don’t understand that other people are real people and not just abstract things put on the planet to interact with them, the real person.

TatianaLarina · 27/01/2020 12:17

How? It's entirely possible he is aware of the bulletin. Which is why he didnt bother telling her. Because he knows she reads it and would know.

You can’t be this dumb scars. Perhaps you’re just being disingenuous.

QuantomatoBay · 27/01/2020 12:18

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TatianaLarina · 27/01/2020 12:18

Look at HIS response to that!

Quite.

Aridane · 27/01/2020 12:18

To be honest, if I was flying into London, going straight to a meeting, then straight to a work dinner, knowing I wouldn't be done until midnight, I wouldn't be arranging to meet up either. I'd want to flop into the hotel bedroom that had been booked for me, knowing I had to get up early and fly back in the morning. There would neither be time nor headspace for me to want to do anything else.

Would anyone here not feel the same?

Well of course, but different standards are applied to DPs

StreetwiseHercules · 27/01/2020 12:21

“ So basically he was avoiding the drama, cowardly but there is i

There is nothing cowardly about choosing to avoid drama. If someone is going to give you grief about a perfectly legitimate thing you have done, then you are well within your rights to mitigate any impact upon you any way you see fit.

Some people are pains in the arse. Nobody is obliged to submit to these people.

LittleDragonGirl · 27/01/2020 12:22

Everyone keeps coming back to the fact he didnt tell her he was in London the second time.
After having to cancel a client dinner to deal with a huge meltdown, he probably didnt want to take the risk. He was probably meeting the client he had to cancel on, and I frankly dont blame him for not taking the risk as the OP has set the idea she has form for having a melt down if she cant see him. So personally I dont blame the guy, as I cant imagine he would be able to have a successful client dinner if he knows theres a shit storm waiting for him at the end of the phone, and if it's the client he had to cancel he probably had to be on top form for it to make up for the last minute cancellation. It makes complete logical sense why he would keep from OP he was back in london.
And I wouldn't be surprised if he was mildly annoyed if he was having to catch up on what he had to cancel previously and it had made his schedule incredibly tight to try and fit it in.