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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

is this a big red flag? Or am I a big red flag?

648 replies

aquickfiresidechat · 25/01/2020 23:19

I've been dating someone for a year. He works in the Geneva office of my company and he travels to London, and I to Geneva, once every other week, so it works out that we have seen each other for a period of days (2 or 3) each week staying at each other's flats/or hotels.

In the company we have a bulletin that goes round daily saying who is in which office within Europe. New man and I also have access to each other's calendars so some days I like to see what he is up to and imagine him going about his day and I always imagined he liked this too.

Anyway, we both went away separately for Christmas and came back early January. We were talking and chatting regularly on the phone like we always do about when we could next see each other. He then went on a business trip and was busy with meetings and time difference, so we did not get a chance to speak much.

Two weeks ago, I noticed on the company bulletin that he was due to be in London the next day. I assumed he had just forgotten to mention it being so busy and that he would make arrangements with me shortly. The next day came and he was not in the office. I double clicked on his diary and saw that he was in meetings in London but not coming into the office.

I sent him a message and said "why didn't you tell me you are in London? Can we see each other tonight?" He texted back a bit short and told me to meet him for a drink after work.

I arrived and asked him how he was. He said, "shocked." I said "why shocked?" he said "because you have been going through my diary and checking up on me." I said "but we have access to each other's diaries, I saw you were in London, and I assumed we'd see each other?" He sat there open mouthed for about 10 mins while I tried to justify why I had looked at his diary and questioned him.

When I got upset he became softer and said he wanted to make me happy and he was sorry for not telling me, but he had terrible jetlag, was completely underwater with work and not yet recovered from Christmas and just felt he needed a night to sleep. He cancelled his client dinner and we spent most of the evening talking about it. I was actually crying because I was so shocked at the sudden attitude change. He asked me to stay the night and I was still quite upset and said no, and we went our separate ways and he flew back to Geneva the next day. We agreed that we would communicate openly about when he is in London going forward.

The next morning he rang me before his flight, quite agitated and said that he had not slept a wink because he felt quite angry that I would demand he see me every time he is in London. He said it had nothing to do with seeing anyone else or not wanting the relationship, but he would be travelling to the UK more frequently and just the thought that, that would be my expectation every single time he was here felt very demanding. His justification for this was that he was most often knackered and would have evening meetings with clients or customers and therefore would not want to trek over to my flat at 11pm or midnight and then fly back to Geneva the next day. He said "you are my priority, but you cannot be my priority all the time." While I wasn't really happy with this, we agreed that he would tell me when he was in London even if he was not going to see me.

I found this new arrangement quite difficult to understand, as this was obviously not our previous pattern, so I didn't feel I was delusional or imagining the relationship was more than it was, for expecting the previous pattern to continue, even though at the time he was telling me this I was apologising rather than justifying my thought process. I felt that he reset the relationship and bamboozled me into thinking that questioning him or his behaviour was stalker-esque or obsessive.

We carried on speaking on the phone every day and texting a lot (it's always him initiating contact. He calls me about five times a day just to chat,) Three days later the company bulletin came again saying that he was in London. He had not told me this.

I double clicked on his diary only to see that he had codified it. Ie, replaced information with a letter and a number. All bookings and reservations that he usually made and I could previously see were now password protected and then diary entries had been made private. Seeing this made me feel like a stalker and made me think that he thought I was a stalker.

He carried on throughout the day communicating with me as normal. I did not ask him where he was. At around 7pm he said he was off to a client dinner and that he would sign off the the night as it would be late. I assume he thought I thought he was in Geneva.

I don't know what got into me but I felt I wanted to know for sure, so at midnight I went to the hotel he normally stays at while here, and I waited in a bar over the road where I could see the door. Lo and behold, I saw him returning to the hotel and going in late. Alone.

I texted him. "Hey can we talk?" He replied immediately. "Sorry, no. Off to bed."

I felt humiliated and embarrassed of myself and like a true stalker. The next morning I decided it was over. I felt that if I told him the reasons why (I was upset he had coded his diary and I had spied on him outside his hotel) it would give me more reasons to feel embarrassed. So I just stopped communicating with him entirely.

Two weeks went by and I ignored all calls and messages and took a week off work to go away and switched my phone off. When I came back to work, I found him in my office, beside himself. Why had I done this to him? What was my problem? Why had I not replied to him? What did I think I was doing? He had been in London looking for me etc.

I've agreed to chat to him about it all on Wednesday when I am next in Geneva. I don't trust him. I cant tell him why.

I don't know anymore whether his behaviour is the red flag or whether mine is.

What do you think??

OP posts:
Aridane · 26/01/2020 22:37

You sound like Bridget Jones !

no - you sound like Alex Forrest (Glen Close character in Fatal Attraction) or Single White Female or some other [misogynist] archetype of a demented woman

Aridane · 26/01/2020 22:41

I feel really sorry for the boyfriend tbh

For his own sanity, he needs to break up with her. He might also want to give his line manager a heads up in case OP goes more demented (or does more one off recces Grin)

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 22:47

Catch a fkg grip - the guys been happy to see her (and no doubt shag her) every time he's been in London - and every time she's been in Geneva (two days a week in average) for a year.

Then he (got bored? ) and decided to change the status quo to seeing her when he was in London if and when he fancied it, and not to.tell.her he was there so he wouldn't have any 'hassle'. She found out and naturally thought wtf? He agreed to something and then went back on it, deliberately hiding his movements ... But it ending the relationship or having any honest convo about it ... But op's not supposed to react. She probably (and understandably) thought she was in a relationship that could go somewhere and had to come to terms with the fact it might most likely would not ... Which caused her to withdraw (probably to cope with the hurt, disappointment etc.) but she's a psycho stalker. Right.

East when it isn't your heart (or ladyparts) involved.

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 22:51

Oh and people saying she knew he was in London so why did she check him returning to.his hotel - to my understanding she didn't know for sure: she suspected from the now encoded diary (cause Mr. Geneve didn't have the balls to be honest about not wanting to let her know if he was in town - or to just end the relationship) and she wanted to confirm it..she did and sacked him off.

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 22:57

He unilaterally changed the terms and norms of their relationship up to that point, and lied by omission about it .. but op was not supposed to get upset, confused, want clarity, want space to think when ending it etc.

Fwiw I don't think she should have asked him to let her know when he was in London unless he wanted to meet ... However that is a definate downgrade in communication, priority, intimacy etc compared to how it seemingly was between then before ... And most people will get uncomfortable about that if they give a fuck.

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 22:59

I hope op is reading all this and benefitting a bit from it,even if she has (also) ghosted us 😉.

aquickfiresidechat · 26/01/2020 23:15

Hello all. There are a lot of exaggerations on this thread! I have never posted about him before. I have not considered moving to Geneva, so I don’t understand why that slant was put on it by an earlier poster (that I must be the one who was planning on moving to Geneva without consulting her boyfriend!)

Just to explain the diary / calendar thing: We have a daily bulletin in Europe which lists which city we are all in. It’s for the purpose of allocating offices in different countries and keeping up with external meetings so that we do not cross over. Everybody sees this.

Colleagues have outlook diaries which they can choose to share with each other. He and I - when we started dating - chose to share ours with each other. So adjusted settings within our outlook, so the other could see our diaries.

My process of “checking” on him went from seeing his name pop up in the daily bulletin for London. Then thinking, that’s strange, he didn’t tell me. Maybe it’s wrong? So going to his outlook diary to check and seeing that he is in fact in London.

Before Christmas, this guy had told me that he loved me. I had said it back. My expectation was that things would at the very least, stay at the pace they had been. What I got was a huge shock, that the person I supposedly loved and who loved me, was in my city for the night and had not arranged to see me or even told me, despite calling me several times a day to talk about what we had been doing and how we felt. This was counter to every pattern, feeling, declaration and routine we’d had for a whole year.

I agree that standing outside his hotel to know the truth was a real low point, and it is why I questioned in the title whether I am the one with the red flag. But actually some of the posts on here supporting my point of view have made me realise that YES it was a one off so I could know the truth and move on. I wasn’t planning on stalking him every time he was in London. It was an a ha moment. Ie wow. You are lying to me. I didn’t think you would do this. I can never see you the same way again.

OP posts:
GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 23:16

I also suspect that op thought the relationship was "more" than he thought it was, and ending it/staying ended is probably the best thing.

(Unless he's a Swiss ice-hearted, pragmatic, detached Vulcan, in which case average behaviour dies not apply and it might be worth seeing how it pans out a bit longer).

P999 · 26/01/2020 23:17

I think she has. But sod it. Why isn't anyone blasting the dick head for lying in wait IN HER OFFICE? And why didnt it cross diddums poor little head he had pissed her around with his lying by omission, farting around with his calendar to send a message to her and slamming her for having totally acceptable and normal expectations after a year of what doesn't sound remotely casual?

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 23:19

Sorry - cross posted op , so you had told each other you loved one another etc.

I for one think his behaviour was shit .. have you spoken to.him about all this since is your meeting to talk about things still pending?

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 23:23

There are a lot of exaggerations on this thread!

Welcome to Mumsnet - he's also apparently a married cheater you've been taken in by, in spite of the fact you e presumably stated with him.in Geneva during the last year and your work colleagues might happen to know if he was married. Some posters don't even read threads before firing off.

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 23:23

*stayed

BumbleBeee69 · 26/01/2020 23:24

Aahhh OP you're back.. well done.. Flowers

You doing okay ?

Aridane · 26/01/2020 23:28

But sod it. Why isn't anyone blasting the dick head for lying in wait IN HER OFFICE?

Because se vanished off the face of the earth, wasn't answerin calls, wasn't in work - and he wondered what the fuck was going on

Bythecooker · 26/01/2020 23:29

Well done for coming back and correcting all the high and mighties. I think your update and calm response shows that you are totally level headed and most of us have done things that afterwards you give your head a wobble for which is what you started with. Better to be away from a, relationship that goes from feeling strong and secure to making you feel insecure and questioning.

LittleDragonGirl · 26/01/2020 23:29

@aquickfiresidechat have you not considered you may have blown this one off of him not telling you, HUGELY out of proportion?

Maybe this one time he had a very busy day, was seeing clients and meetings until very late, and potentially had a very early flight (when considering how late he was able to go to bed) this time he was in london?

Maybe because I love you had been said he felt secure enough in the relationship that this once due to a very hectic schedule he could chose to not see you and thought that because you knew how deeply he felt you wouldn't consider it as a slight or him not loving you?
Imho when it was all said and done he did cancel a client and offer to spend the night with you when he realised you had become very upset and that would suggest he cares, also he panicked when you went AWOL (which imo was cruel) again suggesting he cares ALOT.

Often when relationships become much more serious the need to sacrifice (including sacrificing sleep and headspace) becomes less as you know the other person understands and cares deeply about your wellbeing, and as such if dealing with late clients and early slights, the loss of sleep is not healthy or potentially good for work performance over a longer period of time so I would assume that if either of you know you will be entertaining a client till late and leaving first thing in the morning that it would become the norm to just not see each other at those times as it's not sustainable in the long term.

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 23:34

this one off of him not telling you

He did it twice, the second time after she told him it made her uncomfortable and they agreed he'd mention if he was in London.

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 23:35

Often when relationships become much more serious the need to sacrifice (including sacrificing sleep and headspace) becomes less as you know the other person understands and cares deeply about your wellbeing, and as such if dealing with late clients and early slights, the loss of sleep is not healthy or potentially good for work performance over a longer period of time so I would assume that if either of you know you will be entertaining a client till late and leaving first thing in the morning that it would become the norm to just not see each other at those times as it's not sustainable in the long term.

All v true, but be honest.

P999 · 26/01/2020 23:36

Glad you're back OP! We've all been getting v worked up in your absence.

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 23:36

Don't be a dishonest, immature twat about it.

And a stupid one - by encoding your diary entries even when the company bulletin will still make it obvious you're in the same town as your gf.

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 23:42

I'm.surw if op.had changed from automatically seeing him every time she was in Geneva with work, to not doing so but not telling him : even having daily conversations on the phone without mentioning it (which is essentially lying by omission) and he'd found out ... He'd be feeling all warm and fuzzy and secure and trusting too.

And then in response to his lfinfung it weird, she'd agreed to tell him if she was in fact speaking from the same city (bit too busy/tired to meet) and followed it up by encoding her diary and not doing what she said ... He'd be delighted and happy to. invest in the relationship, I'm.sure.

Didkdt · 26/01/2020 23:44

If it's the first time you've tracked a partner wearabouts and followed him to a hotel he's probably not bringing out the best in you, and I'm not sure there's a way back from that.
The red flag is the behaviours he brought out in you.

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 23:45

*finding it weird

katewhinesalot · 26/01/2020 23:48

Just tell him the truth. If he doesn't like it you are no worse off. If he knows it's a deal breaker for you then he may reconsider but be prepared to walk away.

GilbertMarkham · 26/01/2020 23:48

Incidentally I've met a French guy whose behaviour in relationships seemed endemically dishonest and disingenuous, it would have driven me mad as a partner.