Reconciliation after estrangement?

[Albinoni]

I have NC'd for this but have posted in the past about my relationship with DD1 and was grateful for the advice and support which I received. The posts have since been deleted, at my request, but some of you may remember 'Lobster Boy', and my concerns that DD was in a controlling relationship and that I risked losing her.

Unfortunately, my fears were justified as DD seemed to become more and more withdrawn from the family, saying that her BF was her family now. She ghosted all of the family entirely for six months - apparently she just blocked us all - then there were occasional calls and she did send birthday cards etc. She moved house without providing an address and we didn't see her for two and a half years. I cannot begin to describe how painful that period was for me and DH and her sisters, but those of you who have been through this process of living bereavement will understand.

Anyway, the good news is that there has been a reconciliation following a lunch on neutral ground, in a restaurant, earlier this year (she lives hundreds of miles away from us). Prior to that, she had provided her address, so that we could send some books to her which are relevant to a course which she is intending to take next year. At the lunch, she said that they had married the previous year, and we said how pleased we were, and contact continued to improve.

The following month they asked if they could borrow some money to put towards buying a property and we agreed. Shortly after that, DD told me she was expecting a baby (due any day now), which I was overjoyed about. Then, a few weeks after that - and this is the part I am really struggling with - we received a letter from DD and SIL enclosing photos of the 14 month old which they already had. The accompanying letter was quite upsetting as it said they hadn't told us about DGC because they didn't want her to experience broken relationships and they hadn't been sure whether or not they wanted us involved at all, but they felt guilty at taking our money and not telling us about DGC.

DD and I subsequently had an emotional conversation and, since then, DD has been in contact with me virtually every day with messages and photos and is behaving almost as though nothing has happened. She says I can't think about the past or what I have missed and clearly wants to move forward. I know that she is right in that we cannot change the past and she assures me that she definitely does want us to be involved.

But I am in such turmoil over this. Obviously I am thrilled and excited about the reconciliation and the DGC, but I feel so desperately hurt and upset that she didn't tell any of us about all of these things, especially as I believed that we were close before. I am really struggling, to be honest, although it's early days and there is a lot to come to terms with.

We haven't met DGC1 yet as I think we both felt that it would be better to wait for the baby to be born and then meet them both together, when the emotions have died down a bit. The last thing I want to do is cause her any stress at this time and I sense that they are anxious at our meeting her PILs for the first time. I am also anxious about it, although they sound like lovely people and have been very supportive to DD. But goodness knows what they must think of us. I am also worried about becoming attached to the DGC in case they are taken away from me. I just couldn't put myself through all that again.

So I was wondering if anyone could give me advice if you have been in a similar situation. How easy was it to reconcile? Did the whole family reconcile or was it a piecemeal process? Did you involve any professional help, such as a counsellor or family mediator? Has it worked out? Are things the same and can the relationship ever really recover or is it just different? I really don't want to mess this up, as I have realised how fragile relationships can be, but I am feeling a bit overwhelmed.

Albinoni...you sound like such a lovely mum and Im sure deep down your Dd knows she is very much loved .She will have that to fall back on when needs be. I am so sorry to hear of your DHs illness ,and I just wanted to let you know you are all in my prayers,and sending you much love and 💐💐💐💐

Thanks champagne - I am pleased that your DH is on the mend.

Thanks also ghost and movie, much appreciated. The waiting is the worst but we are just taking it a day at a time.

I've followed from the beginning but never posted on your threads. Cancer is a bastard and sadly I have some experience of that. Please can you confirm that your wills are all done and dusted now. And that you personally are as future protected as possible.

You are really going to need to find some MH support sooner rather than later. View it as support for what is to come as well as what has been. I'd imagine you dread sharing all this again - a books worth of information- with someone new. So you could request that they read your threads first which would massively help them get up to speed.

Over time I've seen various psychologists, counselors and one psychiatrist. To be honest the latter was amazing, and the others were a variable lot. But good mental help is life changing, and puts a spring back into your life.

I wish you all masses of luck and strength and hope that LB falls under the front wheels of a fully loaded articulated lorry going 70.

Thank you Wally. I am so pleased that you found good support, even if it took time to find the right person.

Everything just seems a bit surreal at present, or rather it just feels sort of normal as no treatment yet. It's as though nothing has happened, that nothing will happen, that it is all a bad dream which I will wake up from.

I don't wish LB ill, but I hope that he doesn't let DD down. She says that she is happy, so I just hope that she is. I suppose that if she can go through marriage and pregnancy and birth, without telling us, she has enough strength and confidence and we have done our job, in a way. We are surplus to requirements, LB's family are all that they need. I just have to accept that and wish her well, which I do.

You are such a Better person than me.
I am so in awe of your strength, grace and resilience.
I really really hope your story has a happy ending.

Hi Albinoni
Hope your weekend hasn’t been too difficult. So hard in this time of uncertainty. You said earlier that your DH is well in himself, hope that is still the case.
I will be thinking of you all tomorrow for the next biopsy . Hope you don’t have too far to travel to the hospital
Oh and I doubt very much you are surplus to your DDs requirements but I do recognise that feeling . 😭
Anyway, your DH, DD2 and DD3 need you very much . You’re an amazing wife and mum .
Sending love and best wishes 💐 💐 💐

Well he has let her down, and always will, as he is a horrible , abusive and controlling partner. I hope very much that she comes to realise this and leaves him.
Echoing what Grohnjant said, above. Thinking of you and hoping today is ok.
You go to see dd in a week ?

Hope all goes well today.

Thank you so much to you all - drama, Grohn, SirVix and billy - for your continuing support.

Well, the tests are done, although it was a very long day, so now it's a waiting game. It's just me and DH today so we will have a lovely quiet day together, maybe go out for lunch or something. Recent events have made me see how precious life is and how transient happiness can be, so you need to grasp it with both hands where you can. Everything seems more intense and yet, at the same time, less real - if that makes sense.

DD1 has been sending supportive messages, another photo of baby, asking how I am, saying it's hardest for me, inviting me to talk to her, asking if I am excited to meet the DGDs, and generally acting as though nothing has happened over the last few years. She has even told me that the wild garlic will be out when we visit, as she knows how much I love it.

My take on it is that LB has realised that DD still loves her family and that she has also been hurt by the estrangement, so he is affecting concern and saying that of course we must visit and be welcome. Perhaps he knows that if he continues to insist on the estrangement and criticising DD's family, he will eventually alienate her, so he is pretending to be compassionate. Or perhaps he is genuinely sorry and his earlier behaviour stems from immaturity rather than malice. Either way, since they always have to speak as one voice, his change of stance has given DD the green light to behave more naturally.

I really don't know how to respond. I don't want to rebuff what seems like genuine concern or to say anything to prevent the trip from being a happy one, for DH's sake. I like to have love and harmony around me, especially where the family is concerned. I also want to embrace love and forgiveness and I want healing within my family, especially now. But the wound was deep, and there is some scar tissue, which is hard and impenetrable, at least for now. I know I need to trust but I can't help feeling wary.

I am just going to enjoy today with my beloved and keep the rest of the world at bay.

Sensible to feel wary. It would be bonkers to trust them as a unit now, even though your love for your daughter won’t change.
I think LB realises that your priorities and actions have shifted, and wants to charm you to get your money. This shift has come with your DH’s diagnosis, but also very much from your changed behaviour. I don’t believe that men who are that controlling ever change, and that horrible message was only a few weeks ago. He hasn’t matured, he is still manipulating you and your daughter. Please do stay extremely wary, and keep part of yourself protected, because he has the babies, and he will use them to manipulate you all. Don’t make any decisions with your heart, keep a clear head. (i say this as someone very heart ruled, but in this situation you have to protect yourself. Also keeping yourself distanced emotionally as much as possible keeps you in the best place to help your daughter in the future) .

SirVix, I fear you are right and I nearly said it, but it is a thought too awful to entertain and articulate and I thought reflected badly on my deep cynicism. Do you think he already sees me as a grieving and vulnerable widow, desperate for love and contact with my granddaughters, and prepared to pay anything to keep that? Also, maybe he thinks he is almost one step closer to inheritance?

DH is strong and we are being positive but ultimately it's in the lap of the gods. I am generally not religious these days, but I have asked my friends who are, of various religions, to pray for him, as I am - they say there are no atheists on a battlefield

I think he will prey on you if he feels you’re vulnerable and since the diagnosis your posts have shown a strength that wasn’t there before and I’m sure he realises that and it’s worrying him.

He is also I’m sure painfully aware that any funds you now have may be rightly prioritised for care costs as you do not know how this will play out, obviously we are all praying that it will be straightforward and you won’t need them.

It's not cynicism. He's a very dark individual and you have to accept the kind of person you're facing here. Not cynicism at all but sadly realistic.

Sensible to be wary, please stay wary! It's hard when the child who has caused so much pain (albeit as LB's puppet) changes tack and is suddenly the lovely child of old. Phew, difficult to negotiate that emotionally, especially with the underlying and real tension (eggshells..) that it could all change again. So difficult 💐

Thinking of you all and praying for you xx

I agree with billybagpuss and SpringyDaff
You are a lovely person, it shines out of all your posts, I am so sorry that things are so tough, and I am sending all good thoughts and prayers for your DH.

I am sending you this lovely uplifting and joyful Mozart this morning. m.youtube.com/watch?v=hR-PIcYXYM4

I agree with PP.
it sounds horrible. This should be a time of hope. But I wouldn't trust either of them as far as you can throw them.

I believe they are now going to allow you access to the GC so you can fall in love and he now how two new weapons. They will eventually not only expect you to fund the adults but also expect you to treat the GC independently and provide for them.

But your day sounds so lovely. Your optimism and strength are clearly continuing.

I would keep DD1 at arms length again. Don't trust and don't forget what they are capable of.

I’ve just read all your thread for first time - just wanted to say I’m so sorry for your DH’s diagnosis

One thing I am struggling to understand is why she hasn't got on the first train to visit.
If my dad had that diagnosed, I wouldn't care if I was in a full body cast, you couldn't stop me from going to see him.
I know she has 2 kids but neither of them work and they have no reason not to.
I find myself angry at her for that.
But from all the posts I've struggled to understand her thinking from the start.
Sending so much love and strength to you and your family. X

He is a v dark, dangerous, manipulative personality disordered individual.

His history tells you who he is and what he is capable of.

He has not changed because of the diagnosis. He goal has not changed.

However the circumstances have changed so he has had to regroup to revaluate his plan to achieve his goal. Under the surface he will be v v frustrated by this and the cogs in his ugly brain will be whirring as he works out his new strategy.

Be v clear that the manipulation and punishment have not ended. They are just out of visible sight for now. He knows (which we had hoped up thread), that if he doesn’t allow your DD1 some latitude right now this could all blow up in his face. That is the only reason for any “good” behaviour right now. Hence he is still being manipulative. He does not care for your DH or you.

He has always been and always will be manipulative and abusive. He has used various methods on you all to date - the stick, then the carrot.

Be v careful because you have a much more important journey right now. Much more important people need your love and support. This journey even with the best outcome will be exhausting, devastating, painful. It will drain and consume you so that you are emotionally vulnerable. He knows this.

It is a trap.

Don’t fall into it.

Keep detached.

Your DD1 you say is happy, she has her DDs to comfort her right now.

She can wait. Don’t let them sabotage and pollute this precious time now like she sabotaged and polluted has for the last 5 years. You have every right to feel rage towards her right now. But expressing it to her will backfire. But you need to express it.

Put her to the back of the queue. Your other DDs and your lovely DH come first. And to do the best for them you need to preserve and conserve your own finite and diminishing emotional energy.

I have kept a ranting journal of angry thoughts, insights, questions etc just on my phone, during my recent trauma which has parallels of being emotionally abused, unjustly treated, powerless to do or say anything as it makes everything worse. It has really helped to get the clatter out of my head. Even if it is a random one word swear word! I re-read my notes for the first time at the weekend at it really helped as I didn’t sound as unhinged as I felt at the time. This thread is a good record of your journey and it’s worth re-reading to see how far you have come. But your words on here are measured and calm - in your journal you can let rip, rant and rave uncensored. That is incredibly therapeutic and freeing.

Every word you have posted on here has shown a gracious wife and mother with an enormous heart. It’s just unfortunate that you, your family and your DD1 have become entangled in the dark, irrational web of a psycho who is driven to rob you of your money, your daughter, your DGDs and your dignity and punish you at the same time.

Damage limitation and protecting yourself emotionally is important.

Your second guessing and confusion as to whether your emotional reactions are proportionate suggests that “gas-lighting” is going on.

Your feelings are always valid - you should never feel the need to JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain) them - that is just minimising your reality. Feel the depth of your feelings - get them out - that is processing them and is healthy. That doesn’t mean verbally snapping at your DD or LB. What is unhealthy is repressing or minimising your feelings as that is when you put yourself at risk of snapping. So shout, scream, rant and rave.

Thinking of you and your DH and wishing you all of the strength and serenity that you need right now.

Sounds like you have a lovely day planned. Hope the sun is shining with you .

I need to trust but I can't help feeling wary.
Listen to your instincts here . You really don’t need to trust , Could you anyway, after everything that has happened.? As you and PPs have said you do need to be very wary and somewhat detached. Protect yourself from further heartbreak from them . Its doubtful that he has changed and things could turn again so easily. You really don’t need the drama of it all at the moment .

Hopefully they will both be on their “best behaviour” and steer clear of the subject of finances when you visit so it can be a positive experience for you and DH .

As others have said you sound so much stronger now and your love for ALL your DDs and your DH really does shine through .

As always sending love and strength 💐

Absolutely remain wary, do not let them drag you back to that dark place keep detached.

Thank you all for taking the time to post. I find it amazing that a group of people I have never met can be so kind and understanding. Thank you also, SirVix, for another wonderful piece of music - its beauty and timelessness were really uplifting.

I will take all of your advice and remain wary - actually, that is my default position.

Strawberry, I agree - I don't know why she wasn't on the first train, but she has never visited our house and we have lived here for two and a half years. We have seen her once, for lunch, after we travelled to her nearest city, in just under three years. When my mother had a heart attack in Majorca, many years ago, I was on the first plane out, even though I didn't know which hospital she was in - I just got a taxi to drive round until I found her.

Gutterton - you articulate my feelings very well, as ever, but you are totally right that I cannot allow the past to pollute the present. I think that the visit will be fine, although I have some trepidation, as you know. It will be long enough to meet the DGDs and to take lots of photos with DH, but not too long so that I form any deep attachment, as that could all blow up in my face later.

DD3 is here for a few days and I am seeing some close friends for lunch later, so hopefully today will pass quickly and pleasantly and we will be one step further towards climbing out of limbo land.

Wishing you all a lovely day.

LB taking control of every decision, every part of her life, has left her oddly passive and childlike I think. Your instinct to get to your Mum asap is the normal feeling, and her waiting and asking for updates but not acting, is very strange behaviour. She is ruled by LB, and so doesn’t make her own choices, like a normal adult woman, but instead has become accustomed to waiting and doing what someone else tells her to do.

I can see you getting yourself to a mental place of “indifference” with regards to him which is much healthier emotionally and a lighter load to carry. Anger and rage can be exhausting and burdensome to hold on to - feel then but just let them pass through your mind and body like a hot flush.

Indifference is a powerful stance for you to take. You get there when you understand his PD motivations and manoeuvres - they are v predictable and not unique (listed out in the DSM - V) so you are ready, defended and not surprised by his odious and tedious behaviours. Drop the rope, turn your back on toxicity, detach and reach out and immerse yourself in all of positive, caring, loving people in your life.

You will conduct the visit beautifully because you are miles ahead of him, you will not fall into his trap. I would love to be a fly on the wall watching you chuckling at the set up any nonsense stunts he pulls - he will watching you intently for a chink of weakness - but he has miscalculated your strength. You didn’t achieve all you have in life by being a wet wipe. You are a formidable woman of integrity and honour - he is nothing more than some shit on your shoe.

It’s inevitable that in the run up to the visit your anxiety will increase even if you are not aware of it - so build in some breathing, yoga, grounding, journaling, walking or swimming etc whatever works for you.

But take comfort from the fact that often the anticipation is worse than the event.

Also wonder if your DH will be advised not to travel due risk of contracting coronavirus which would delay compromise any surgery and chemo he might need.