Reconciliation after estrangement?

[Albinoni]

I have NC'd for this but have posted in the past about my relationship with DD1 and was grateful for the advice and support which I received. The posts have since been deleted, at my request, but some of you may remember 'Lobster Boy', and my concerns that DD was in a controlling relationship and that I risked losing her.

Unfortunately, my fears were justified as DD seemed to become more and more withdrawn from the family, saying that her BF was her family now. She ghosted all of the family entirely for six months - apparently she just blocked us all - then there were occasional calls and she did send birthday cards etc. She moved house without providing an address and we didn't see her for two and a half years. I cannot begin to describe how painful that period was for me and DH and her sisters, but those of you who have been through this process of living bereavement will understand.

Anyway, the good news is that there has been a reconciliation following a lunch on neutral ground, in a restaurant, earlier this year (she lives hundreds of miles away from us). Prior to that, she had provided her address, so that we could send some books to her which are relevant to a course which she is intending to take next year. At the lunch, she said that they had married the previous year, and we said how pleased we were, and contact continued to improve.

The following month they asked if they could borrow some money to put towards buying a property and we agreed. Shortly after that, DD told me she was expecting a baby (due any day now), which I was overjoyed about. Then, a few weeks after that - and this is the part I am really struggling with - we received a letter from DD and SIL enclosing photos of the 14 month old which they already had. The accompanying letter was quite upsetting as it said they hadn't told us about DGC because they didn't want her to experience broken relationships and they hadn't been sure whether or not they wanted us involved at all, but they felt guilty at taking our money and not telling us about DGC.

DD and I subsequently had an emotional conversation and, since then, DD has been in contact with me virtually every day with messages and photos and is behaving almost as though nothing has happened. She says I can't think about the past or what I have missed and clearly wants to move forward. I know that she is right in that we cannot change the past and she assures me that she definitely does want us to be involved.

But I am in such turmoil over this. Obviously I am thrilled and excited about the reconciliation and the DGC, but I feel so desperately hurt and upset that she didn't tell any of us about all of these things, especially as I believed that we were close before. I am really struggling, to be honest, although it's early days and there is a lot to come to terms with.

We haven't met DGC1 yet as I think we both felt that it would be better to wait for the baby to be born and then meet them both together, when the emotions have died down a bit. The last thing I want to do is cause her any stress at this time and I sense that they are anxious at our meeting her PILs for the first time. I am also anxious about it, although they sound like lovely people and have been very supportive to DD. But goodness knows what they must think of us. I am also worried about becoming attached to the DGC in case they are taken away from me. I just couldn't put myself through all that again.

So I was wondering if anyone could give me advice if you have been in a similar situation. How easy was it to reconcile? Did the whole family reconcile or was it a piecemeal process? Did you involve any professional help, such as a counsellor or family mediator? Has it worked out? Are things the same and can the relationship ever really recover or is it just different? I really don't want to mess this up, as I have realised how fragile relationships can be, but I am feeling a bit overwhelmed.

[VictoriaBun]

I wish you well and the the very best to you and your dh.

[SirVixofVixHall]

I think of you often and I am sending love and good wishes for your DHs treatment. ❤️💐💐💐

[RandomMess]

You're truly welcome

Really hoping for the best for you, DH and the DDs x

[Albinoni]

Thank you Gutterton for your wonderful links, especially in relation to the mended ceramics being more beautiful - I will cling to that thought.

Thank you Grohnjant, wibble, billy and Moviestar for your recent posts and to everyone who has given me such amazing support on this thread. It has been a very rocky few months, but you have all helped me to get through it.

More than that, you have given me your independent views and a greater sense of perspective, at a time when I have often felt so conflicted and muddled that I have feared that I am losing the plot. You have helped me to regain my self respect and my confidence at a time when I felt completely lost. You have been true friends to me and I wish you all well.

I may start another thread at some stage, but I think things will probably be static for a while (aren't we all? )

I know that I have taken up such a lot of your valuable time, but I appreciate it so, so, so much!

Thank you!!!

[Moviestar]

Albinoni ,just joining in to also wish you strength and fortitude in the days ahead. Sincere best wishes and prayers for you and your lovely DH.

[billybagpuss]

Albinoni if you don’t start another thread I wish you all strength and hope that things go as well as they can do for you.

Gutterton, you are awesome. Thank you for the kintsugi link.

[wibblewobblejiggle]

Just incase this is the end of you posting @Albinoni I just wanted to say I genuinely do hope things look up for you and DH soon. I've name changed but been commenting since the original LB debacle.
You have had to endure some true horrors and somehow have been a true life wonder throughout.
You are an extraordinary mother and wife and they are all lucky to have you.
I hope that through all of this and whatever the outcome you know that you deserve to be treated well. You deserve respect and love and appreciation.

Above all. I just hope that however your relationship with LB and DD1 goes. I hope you know your worth.

[Gutterton]

www.lifegate.com/people/lifestyle/kintsugi

[Gutterton]

I am so sorry to hear that your lovely DH is struggling today. I hope he has a calm and restful night. I understand from other chemo regimens that each week in the 3 week cycle is different. So hard to watch your loved ones in pain and distress.

Kintsugi is a Japanese art form of repairing broken pottery with new gold leaf joins. So the reformed is more beautiful than the original. That’s your strength and wisdom. Google some images.

I also read this link today - all about boundaries and how “anger” is our truth.....however what you choose to do with it will determine how you cope.

www.alturtle.com/archives/173

[Grohnjant]

Just sending love and best wishes and hope you DH continues to feel well again . How frightening for you.

Of course your feelings for DD1 are going to fluctuate. Her past behaviour, for whatever reason, has been appalling and I admire you for not responding angrily and giving her some “home truths” . Now is not the time for that though . It would just cause YOU more anguish and you certainly don’t need any more of that .

If you are finding this thread helpful would it be an idea to start a new one and link this one ( like a PP said ) as this one will be full soon?
💐 💐 💐

[Albinoni]

SirVix and Grohnjant, billy and all, you make brilliant points as always, as do the rest of you, and I know that in doing so you are re-visiting things which are personally painful. I thank you so much for your understanding and compassion and wish us all healing

[Albinoni]

Thank you so much everybody for your replies and support. Gutterton, you are as eloquent as ever.

DH has been quite poorly over the last 24 hours, so I haven't responded, but he is doing better now.

As always, lots to think about, feeling angry with DD1 today - many daughters want their fathers to walk them down the aisle, she didn't even want him there or to tell us about the marriage. She has messaged to ask after his health and I feel like saying that in reply, but it won't do any good will it? I am like an old, broken record. Returning to the excellent and perceptive comparison with a patched up jug, but a patched up record doesn't make music, does it? Only silence or a scratchy discordant noise.

Sorry, I know I am being negative today, just saying it as it is, as I respect you all too much to pretend otherwise. But just ignore me when I am being too whiny (I prefer 'wine'y' )

I will respond more fully when I am a bit more upbeat/on track!

[Sushiroller]

Honestly i think you should be proceeding with extreme caution.
DD1 is love bombing you and no doubt her and LB will be sniffing around for more cash /"inheritance" in the not too distant future

I also agree with the poster who said she'll get pregnant again in the middle of the pgce or shortly after.

I would be incredibly incredibly wary. She has gone from 0-100 on a verrrrry short space of time.

[forrestgreen]

My thought from the middle of the night was that you've accepted that lb hasn't done anything that doesn't have an ulterior motive. Whether that's direct money, rent, house, control etc.
He's very unlikely to have changed. If he's now accepting of dd new relationship with you, there will be a benefit for him.

[billybagpuss]

I hadn’t actually considered what the others have said about the love bombing and there being no financial gain from the sisters.

I think you’ve handled the money situation brilliantly and whilst I can see where pp’s are coming from, her rational side will know that the way she treated her sisters was appalling and they aren’t going to be so quick to forgive. She won’t admit it to anyone though. So it may not be money related.

My concern for you is as mentioned above lb may be positioning for control of you should anything happen to DH, please take steps to protect yourself, you know where your support network is safest. Sorry I have tried to avoid the more morbid what ifs as this is so hard for you and I want to be supportive, but I do worry that you will be more vulnerable if DH is not able to continue with his treatment.

[Gutterton]

I agree with all of that - LB is always controlling 24/7 for his own gain. If you work with this mindset you won’t go wrong.

His paranoid, plotting brain never shuts down - whether your DD knows she is his puppet or not.

You do have a maternal visceral draw and a connection to her but that has to be balanced with your DH and your other DDs needs and even DD1 own personal growth.

I have this vision of you at the top of a cliff holding abseiling equipment - your DH, DD2 and DD3 are tethered to you behind you - DD1 is down the cliff and you are managing the tension in the rope - she can’t pull you all over the edge - so you have to appropriately and proportionately respond to her tugs......and also know that LB is yanking her chain from the other end trying to mastermind the whole thing.

But she also has her ledges and holding places to keep safe.

From the beginning of this thread you have shown that you are v balanced, can “see” it all and are responding appropriately. But it’s all so exhausting.

[Grohnjant]

Albinoni I am keeping everything crossed that DH is able to get his next treatment on time and that the crisis at the moment in no way impacts him.
It must be so frustrating not to be able to go out and distract yourselves but as you say you have everything you need.

Never try and second guess or feel guilty about any of the things you have done because they have always been done from a place of love and concern .

If you had have persuaded DD1 against the termination who knows how things would have turned out ? Maybe worse than they did ? Then you would have felt guilty about that . They made their own choices and have to take responsibility for the consequences.

I spent hours blaming myself for really innocent things eg paying for DDs driving lessons, and supporting/encouraging her to move out to pursue her dream job in a city 100s miles away. I felt if she’d stayed home or couldn’t drive she wouldn’t have met her BF , but of course I don’t know what would have happened had she stayed at home,The outcome of that could have been even worse and I would have been wishing I’d paid for lessons and helped her move away.
I guess that’s just a long winded way of saying “you’re damned if you do and you’re dammed if you don’t “

I know you wouldn’t try and force a reconciliation between DD1 and DD2/3 . They have been so badly hurt by her and a sibling relationship is very different to a parent /child one . I think in their shoes I would probably find it very hard to forgive her for the hurt she has caused you and DH as obviously they have been witness to the pain and clearly love you very much .

Like SirVix says I think she is “love bombing” you. Not sure of her motivation but I hope it’s honourable. It’s so important to have hope , I understand that , but it sounds like you are sensibly “on your guard “ too

Sending love 💕

Champagne. Best wishes to your DH for a safe and speedy recovery 💐 xxx

[forrestgreen]

I do agree with the thought about another baby after you pay out. Maybe make it monthly direct I think you said, don't be a guarantor, and it's conditional on attendance at uni.

[SirVixofVixHall]

I agree with Random.
I think the fact that your dd is love bombing you, but not her sisters, is telling. I am so sorry to say this but I have a niggling worry that this change of stance is to do with LB sensing your money slipping away. There is nothing material to be gained from your other daughters.
I hope that I am wrong, but this charm offensive while at the same time no grovelling apology , is strange. Generally when people do this it is to make amends, and it comes with huge regret and apologies. You are only getting one chunk of that response.
I think LB is ruthless, cruel, and entirely self serving. He would only be allowing this if he had something to gain. I think your daughter, from distance and manipulation, has lost the compass of you all as a family.
Hopefully, just by being in contact a bit more regularly, she will regain more of your values and behaviour, but I would really hold yourself back OP. We all love our children, but that doesn’t mean allowing cruel behaviour to go unchallenged. All of us sometimes behave less well than we should as we are growing up, and having people who really do love us, parents and siblings, very close friends , make us see that, is a loving thing to do.
I once treated my best friend very casually for a time, as a teenager. I was mixing with a very different crowd, (many of them not very nice people at all in hindsight), and I completely took her for granted. She was very hurt, and one day put me on the spot and made me see what I had been doing and the consequences of my behaviour. I was ashamed and sorry.
If your dd truly wants to build a family again, and have a loving relationship with you all, she will have to see what she has done to destroy that. There can be no proper reconciliation without facing the reality of what has happened, and that isn’t happening. There is an unreal quality to the interactions, and her sisters are not involved at all.
Have you told her how much she has let down and hurt her sisters and close friends ?
I suppose what I am trying to say is that I think this may be more led by LB’s agenda that you think, and that I think he underestimates your intelligence and your grit.
Love your daughter as ever, but hold your boundaries firm , or she could be being used as a Trojan horse.

[RandomMess]

I still can't get my head around that they will use PGCE bursary to repay you the loan for the house and then get the money back from you to pay the rent instead of using the bursary...

It is absurd.

[Gutterton]

If you are finding this thread supportive and want somewhere safe and anonymous to vent - start another threat named “Reconciliation after Estrangement 2” and post the link to this thread in the opening post.

I know that there are likely v many on here who would love to continue to support you and your family at this time.

These situations also really help to inform and support countless others who are enduring similar situations.

[Gutterton]

Albinoni another weapon in LB’s abusive armoury is Reproductive Coercion and Control. This is a deeply misogynistic abuse tactic that signals ownership and enslaves women in their bodies and minds and risks their health. I will link to reports from expert sources later.

This started with the highly irregular demand for an open relationship with no barrier contraception - in fact no contraception beyond the rhythm method.

LB exposed her to STDs and assume mental turmoil if this wasn’t her “scene”.

When she became pregnant the first time LB must have been against the termination because she has to flee to get some headspace to make her decision.

You gave her that space - she thanked and rewarded you for it many months after with a trip. LB went to the termination with her - so neither of them can blame you. And you need to rid yourself of this notion because you are torturing yourself here unnecessarily.

Your guilt is irrational but understandable because you live under his hostility and stonewalling which is emotional abuse and creates alarm in you.

LB would then push on for further pregnancies - he has said 5 is the goal. MIL is cheerleading from the sides. He look your daughter out of hospital against all medical advice when she was v ill after each of her traumatic births putting her life at risk.

She seems “safer” at the moment and it is wonderful that the DDs are bringing her focus, joy, love, structure and purpose. I predict another pregnancy to mess up the PGCE course just when the money has cashed in.

I agree that your other DDs RS with her should not be forced.

What will maybe make them thaw will be seeing you less stressed with DD1.

But you know - your headspace and time has more important things to do. I applaud you for finding your boundaries with DD1 - you are not here to soothe her conscience and meet her emotional needs caused by in part her life choices. That just facilitates and enables their dysfunctional relationship.

Let her get uncomfortable.

Give your finite emotional resources to you DH and other DDs.

[forrestgreen]

I'm sorry if this sounds cynical.
Could lb change of heart be down to the possibility of an inheritance?

[wibblewobblejiggle]

I have no advice. But I am just so so sorry for what you're being put through. Both intentionally and of course unintentionally. Everyone is leaning on you and I worry that you don't have anyone for support.
Have you contacted McMillan?

[RandomMess]

Hmmmm no idea but I know people that do - copy and paste into Word?