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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Genuine question - non goady, pls don't shoot me

185 replies

namechanger2436 · 20/05/2019 05:23

So,

Woman is married, starts an affair with married man (instigated by man if that makes a difference). Kids involved (primary school age) both sides. Both marriages 'unhappy' and both couples together largely for the sake of the kids (100% this is the case for the woman).

Woman truly and utterly believes that she could (and possibly will) one day be with the married man and be blissfully happy. Seriously, the connection is insane, sounds all bollocky and la la land but she honestly believes this. Woman is well educated and generally sits on the right side of being rational/real.

Does the 'fairytale' ever happen? Will he leave wife? Will they end up together? Does it ever work out?

I'm the woman, obvs. I can't imagine my future/rest of my life not involving this man. I'm a walking cliche but I believe he's 'the one' and I have never felt this about my dh.

I'm approaching 40, as is he.

Slowly going insane.

Bracing myself for an understandable onslaught of hate, but is there anyone out there who things worked out for?

OP posts:
ScreamingLadySutch · 20/05/2019 17:16

"The most common element driving the power of the affair is fantasy. The essential problem perpetuating the affair is failure to recognize fantasy for what it is. The glaring omission in awareness is that passion in romantic infatuation cannot be compared with intimacy in marriage. When a relationship is sealed off from the difficulties of reality involved in managing daily life, family and the natural cycles of long-term relationships, of course the sex and romance is compelling and easy.

The new relationship is a fantasy, a vacation-like relationship, revolving in its own orbit and, unbeknownst to both parties, usually only works within the context of the man being married. Often when this refuge is gone, the affair relationship typically is not sustainable long-term. Consistently, marriage to the affair partner is a major factor accounting for higher divorce rates in 2nd marriages.

The passion of new “romance” creates the feeling of being “in love” and is compelling like a drug. In fact, recent MRI research on the brain shows that during the infatuation state of romance, the brain shows the same changes as it does on cocaine. Though this evolved because it allows people to stay together long enough to mate, it has obvious drawbacks, especially in the case of romance outside marriage. The driving force behind decision-making becomes acquiring whatever provides the desired “rush,” whether drugs or illicit romance. Judgment is impaired and responsibility, values, and other people become less relevant.

Being immersed in the fantasy goes along with a failure to recognize that the marriage is in fact providing something essential: comfort, safety and security. Unfortunately, when this security is working effectively it’s invisible. It imparts a seamless, stabilizing, protective foundation which enables risk-taking, growth in other areas, and reduced stress.

Security alone may not be enough if there is a feeling of isolation or other unhappiness in the marriage. But without awareness that the marriage is meeting a vital need for stability, the man sees only that the new relationship offers something he does not have, which now feels vital. He harbors an inaccurate formulation of what he’s choosing between, going over the dilemma in his head—whether he should go for passion and magic or settle for a duller life and do the right thing.

To manage the conflict created by acting in ways that go against his values, a process of compartmentalization and rationalization occurs, enabling the man to essentially lead a “double life” without registering the impact of what he is doing. These defenses allow him to temporarily suspend reality and shut out emotional awareness of anything outside the fantasy.

Little does he know at the time that eventually he will be rapidly transported from the dream of “having it all” to the crash of losing everything. When a man tries to have relationships with two women, he soon realizes that he was probably in over his head with one. (What was he thinking?) But until reality sets in he doesn’t do the math, which reveals that this equation is easily reduced to zero.

The power of immersion in fantasy makes affairs much easier to get into than out of. Can these marriages survive? The good news is that marriages can thrive after this crisis, and most do." - Dr L Margolies

BaconRolls · 20/05/2019 17:18

I won’t flame you OP, but I would say that:

A) the likelihood of you both deciding to leave your partners to be with each other is unlikely. Usually one person bottles it. Seen it so, so many times.

B) even if you do both leave, all that lovely passionate affair stuff will be very quickly replaced with the reality of trying to either set up a household together or each run separate households while contending with two disgruntled exes and various traumatised children and all the practical shite that family life involves.

It’s never the fairytale ending. Ever.

If you love each other enough to end your marriages and face up to reality, do it. But don’t for a minute think it will be easy.

Moralitym1n1 · 20/05/2019 17:27

It is sexist drivel to say "aw, the poor little woman was vulnerable and it's all the fault of the nasty cheating man" which is what that post boils down to.

I didn't take that from that post I have to say.

And I genuinely think the majority of women who have affairs don't do it for sex and excitement. Can't say the same about the majority of men.

YouLikeTheBadOnesToo · 20/05/2019 18:08

My fil & his wife began as an affair. They became ‘official’ about 12 years ago when their respective spouses found out and ended the marriages.

They’ve been married for 7 years now, but neither would tell you it was a ‘fairytale’ ending. They both left their jobs, because they were too embarrassed about what had happened (they met at work), and ended up moving from our town to a nearby village where they could have a ‘fresh start’ because they felt judged by the people who knew their history.

All children were adults. We see my fil about once a month, mainly so he has a relationship with our son. But my dh has very little respect for his dad (dh judged him even more once we got married, and after we had our ds his opinion of his dad was even lower. I suppose he understood more exactly what his dad has done). DH wasn't surprised by his dad’s affair. He’d left dh’s mum 20 years earlier following an affair (ow was who he cheated on this time), he jokes all the time about how long his dad’s current wife will last.
Fil’s wife has had a much tougher ride with her children. Both her adult sons barley spoke to her for years following the affair. She’s built bridges with one (although he is getting married later this year and has specified that he will not have fil in any of the ‘family’ pictures). Her other son still barely speaks to her, as a result she only sees her grandson one or twice a year.

The consequences could be far wider reaching, and longer lasting than you imagine.

Your case is even more complicated because of the young dc. Do you propose to live with the om? How do you think your children would feel about sharing a home with a stranger? Are you prepared for then to want to stay with their dad? And what about his children? If he’s any kind of father he’s going to want regular access (50/50 ideally) you’re going to need a very generous house to accommodate all of these children? Again this assumes that they will be happy to be around you, a stranger?
Even living apart from om will have its problems. Dating will be difficult while being a single parent at least 50% of the time. Trying to find time to spend together between each other’s contact days is going to kill a lot of the romance.

If you’re unhappy in your marriage LEAVE, be single! But don’t devastate everyone by having an affair.

Bluestitch · 20/05/2019 18:22

My good friend - she left her DH for her best friends DH - they are still together now, and her kids are much happier now because they are with 2 people that love each other. Her ex DH and her new DH's ex wife are now with other people and its all worked out.

This is very sanitised. I doubt the reality was quite as 'nice' as you've described such an awful betrayal.

HRMumness · 20/05/2019 18:32

My DH recently left me for his AP. We have two small children (6,4) who have been deeply traumatised. My 6 year old asks me why her Daddy is punishing her when she did nothing wrong. My 4 year old is scared to go into nursery in case I don’t come back.

He was a miserable arse to be around in the lead up to the affair starting, so much so, we all walked around on eggshells because he would fly off the handle. He gaslighted me for weeks about the affair, then finally admitted to it. Spent weeks playing the pick me dance before moving back in under the guise of reconciliation. We were supposed to give it a go until the Summer. He lasted two weeks but not before he told our children he was back for good Hmm and screwed with their heads some more for good measure.

He has left me with all the responsibility of the children and selling our family home. All our friends are thoroughly disgusted with his behaviour towards me and our children.
I have refused to badmouth him to our children but I’m pretty sure they will make up their own minds when they are older about what kind of person he is and who had their back through all this. Hint: it’s not flipping him.

HRMumness · 20/05/2019 18:35

I should add, when there are children involved it is worth trying to do whatever you can to save it if at possible. If it is still not working, end the marriage.

Having an affair is a brutal, graceless way of ending a marriage. I will never forgive my DH for how he has treated myself and my children.

ThatCurlyGirl · 20/05/2019 18:47

@HRMumness

God some people really are cunts aren't they?

I'm sorry you've had to deal with that and is a testament to you that you haven't bad mouthed him to the kids at a low point - so sad your little one worries you won't come back when you drop them off. Breaks my heart.

FWIW you sound like you're dealing with it amazingly and with your dignity firmly intact Thanks

CarolsBiggestFan · 20/05/2019 18:48

I think the kindest and right thing for you to do for your husband, would be to leave him.

I can guarantee your sneaking around, gaslighting and general overall behaviour will be contributing more significantly than you realise, to his poor mental health.

SchnitzelVonKrumm · 20/05/2019 19:12

I imagine the husband's mental health would be much improved by getting shot of the OP.

NottonightJosepheen · 20/05/2019 19:16

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

onefootinthegrave · 20/05/2019 20:47

My good friend - she left her DH for her best friends DH - they are still together now, and her kids are much happier now because they are with 2 people that love each other. Her ex DH and her new DH's ex wife are now with other people and its all worked out

This is very sanitised. I doubt the reality was quite as 'nice' as you've described such an awful betrayal

Bluestitch no, of course initially it wasn't. The kids were primary school age and it was really hard for them to begin with, as it was for friends DH and her friend. However, the kids involved are 20 and 17 they are doing we - 1 of them not so much, but there are a lot of other factors involved, not just the fact that her parents got divorced. My friends kids have thrived the last few years because new man is so much more calm, stable and reliable that their dad is. Yes they got hurt initially.But I think they would have also been affected if they had spent their whole childhood with parents that didn't love each other and weren't happy.

Honestly, I think it's hard either way. But situations like these aren't black or white.

VirtuallyConfused · 20/05/2019 21:00

Ah the unicorn of the affair world.

I thought I had found this - and then you realise that you will always come second to his commitment to his children and his primary life.

I can't hate him for it, and it was a lovely dream, but the road between now and you being together is very very long and hard.

LizzieSiddal · 20/05/2019 21:15

Op you say you don’t know how your H will cope if you leave, therefore you don’t.
But if/when he finds out you’ve had an affair, this will make his mental healthy fat worse.

Leave him now before he finds out about the affair. It’s the descent thing to do.

Closetbeanmuncher · 20/05/2019 23:17

This is just limerence, an escape to fantasy land to avoid facing your problems.

If you're that unhappy in the marriage and it isn't fixable do the decent thing and end it.

If your husband or his wife uncovers the truth there will be a lot more than "him moving away" to contend with.

The reality of this fantasy you have will be a completely different kettle of fish...you don't need a crystal ball to see that.

RantyAnty · 21/05/2019 05:22

So you're not really staying for the children.

You're staying because you want to make sure you have another branch to swing to.

ncforthis7654 · 21/05/2019 08:01

OP I was you several years ago. My relationship was awful. I wasn't allowed to leave, couldn't have my own bank account, wasn't allowed to meet friends for coffee / buy our kids new clothes / do anything without permission etc (I worked part time so did contribute)

I met my "soulmate" and had an affair. It was everything you described above.

My now ExH found out and was beyond devastated.

I caused that. He was broken, and I promise you I will never, ever, ever forget that. The guilt will live with me forever.

I am still with the OM - perhaps by default - and it's ok, but the guilt has absolutely wrecked any chance of a happy carefree relationship.

9 months after he discovered my affair I had a total breakdown due to the guilt and knowledge of what I had done. My mental health took a real Plummet.

It affected friends, family and those around me. I lost friends, and a lot of respect from other people.

My ex and I are in a good place now, but that is purely down to his good will (and my grovelling) - for a long time I let him do whatever he wanted with the finances and access to children - based on my guilt.

Don't do it OP. Learn from people on here telling you - it's a terrible thing to do to another human being. Leave by all means - but for your own reasons.

ncforthis7654 · 21/05/2019 08:06

Just to add - if I could turn the clock back I would - like a shot. It's the worst thing to do to someone.

itwasalovelydreamwhileitlasted · 21/05/2019 08:22

Marry the mistress and create a vacancy

I wouldn't trust him (or you for that matter!) not to do it again when the fairytale you're so desperate for doesnt materialise. It says a lot about a persons moral character when they cheat and quite honestly he won't give you the fairytale you're looking for because he will always think your easy

You've destroyed you're family and it doesn't matter that your DH has depression - maybe you've contributed to his depression by being so baseless and untrustworthy and he can sense your true colours are coming out and it is making him miserable

Huskylover1 · 21/05/2019 08:25

Soupdragon Married women, who are totally and utterly in love with their husbands, and who are getting their sexual needs met at home, in my experience never go cruising for extra cock, just for the sake of it.

On the other hand, there is a certain breed of male, who will take any bit of extra sex on the side that he can get, even if he loves his wife and is having sex at home. These men are quite predatory and can compartmentalise. Believe me, I was married to one, for a very long time.

So yes, I do believe that if a married woman is up for an affair, there is something very wrong at home. Yes, if that woman then chooses to have an affair, it is her choice, but it's coming from a very different place than a predatory male. She is most likely looking to fill the void in her marriage somehow and make a genuine connection, whereas the married men she would hook up with will be looking for no strings attached sex.

Men and women aren't the same. It's silly to pretend otherwise.

Long story short, I think that if Op was to leave her DH for her OM, she would be dumped like a hot potato by him within, ooh... about 3 minutes.

Bluestitch · 21/05/2019 09:28

My friends kids have thrived the last few years because new man is so much more calm, stable and reliable that their dad

And what about her best friend, and this 'great' guy's kids? I'm sure they were thrilled.

NottonightJosepheen · 21/05/2019 09:46

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

roxi09 · 21/05/2019 13:41

ncforthis7654

I've name changed too (back to the one I had when it was all going on).

I had a similar experience, my exH was controlling and abusive.

I met someone, he was single. We had a short fling. It was never discovered.
It gave me the strength to leave my marriage.

I divorced and me and OM got together after the divorce, about 3 years after I met him. We didn't see each other in between.

We've been together ever since and get married next year.

I would never in a million years cheat on him. Monogamy is really my default.

I had an exit affair, end of and I do regret it, it's not a good way to go about things.
Wish I'd been strong enough to know my worth and leave earlier.

onefootinthegrave · 21/05/2019 17:42

And what about her best friend, and this 'great' guy's kids? I'm sure they were thrilled

Well one of her daughters now lives with my friend and her bio dad full time because she didn't get on with her mum - I'm not going to go into any more detail because clearly you think I'm minimising, or not being honest which isn't true as I have no agenda, I'm just saying what happened. I've also said that a lot of kids must suffer as a result of affairs, I can see both sides. It doesn't look like you can.

onefootinthegrave · 21/05/2019 17:44

And he is one of the most kindest, decent men I've ever met, and I am so glad that she ended her first marriage and they got together. Because he was deeply unhappy with his wife - it's not always men that are abusive. So you can put 'great' in italics if you want ,but actually that's just what he is.

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