I am Onit, hear me ROAR. Thread 5!

[onitlikeacarbonnet]

“I am not afraid of the storms for I am learning to sail my ship” Louisa May Alcott.

I was looking for something to call this thread and came across this quote.
It’s not entirely true; yet, but almost 3 years and 5 threads later, I actually almost believe I can do this.

But I still like the last thread title as it still feels fitting.
I’ll save the LMA quote for the next one.

Here’s a link to the last thread.
Hope you all find me, my amazing friends

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3211292-I-am-onit-hear-me-ROAR-occasionally

yes, re DD being physically forced to get in the car, you can say, LCB is not recounting the facts. blatantly lying I had 2 neighbours come to me after the event & ask if I was OK having heard & seen the scene... you can prove it. you also have your following emails
If it happens again, you can tell him he can manhandle her agaist her wishes, as you won't.

I've just caught up with this onit. Hadn't seen it since April.

My, what an utter bollock he is! You deserve a medal and so much more for simply keeping going with the amount of antagonism you suffer from him.

Reading through your posts about how distressed your DC are at handovers and in the days leading up to them, witnessed by you, neighbours, teachers at school, it makes me wonder if it would be worthtaking this much further. I understand that you are in an extremely difficult position and have to follow the court order. But, if I was to witness what you describe, I might be wondering if their father was abusing them physically when he has them. I'm sure you would know from the children if he was, but is it worth raising this with your GP? Is it worth involving social services because of their distress? Perhaps his time with the DC shouldn't be alone with them but at a contact centre where there is always a witness to his behaviour towards them?

I really hope that doesn't upset you, it's certainly not my intention.

The child welfare officer phoned today.
She was apologetic and said that my case may have been misdirected as she exclusively deals with kids who have been or are subject to domestic abuse and the notes she’s been sent don’t show that.
I told her that, while I had no reason to believe their dad was abusing them, he had been abusing to me during our marriage and continued to be abusive since we split. I was concerned about their emotional well-being.
She asked if I’d disclosed this to my solicitor and I said yes but that I had not disclosed it in court. She asked if I had alluded to it in any way that the sheriff would have felt she should be instructed and I told her the sheriff had asked about mediation. That I had said we’d had mediation on a shuttle basis at my request for reasons I wasn’t prepared to go into.
And she said “Bingo! I’m in!”
She explained that the sheriff would have probably seen signs of it, read between the lines, and made the instruction on that basis.
I told her that he doesn’t listen to them when they say something he doesn’t like. That he shouts. So they don’t tell him stuff now.
They don’t understand why they’re not being listened to by anyone but me and though I’ve tried to tell him he denies it and/or refuses to acknowledge it. And I’m powerless because there’s a court order. That I’ve had to carry my DD out to him and watch her being forced into his car screaming so much that my neighbours have come afterwards to check I’m ok and that DD was ok. But that I’ve been told that I have to make them go. Because there’s an order.

We talked a while about her role and what would happen. The dc will meet her at home with me for a short time and again a day later at a neutral venue with a private space for the purpose with toys and art materials etc, 10 days or so before the hearing. She explained that the previous report which was compiled for the sheriff by a solicitor, is not child centred and that her job is to get their voices heard. She can explain the possible consequences of various choices they might make.
She was lovely to me too.
I told her I’d been in counselling at my own expense for nearly 3 years, that I’d spoken to women’s aid and the domestic abuse team at the council. I told her a few examples of his abuse. Not the worst things. I’m not ready for that. I told her how I don’t speak to him, he’s not allowed in my gate, that I only communicate by email and that his emails can be triggering although I am getting better at not letting my feelings show in my replies anymore. That he gaslights me, he manipulates. And she said it’s coercive control.

I feel very pleased that my dc’s thoughts and feelings will be heard by this lady. She is sending me some info about groups which both myself and the dc can attend among other things.
I was so pleased when I got off the phone.

She believed me.

Then I started to panic.
The dc’s views are totally confidential. Only to be heard by her and seen by the sheriff. But if their dad finds out that she is exclusively instructed in domestic abuse cases, he will know I’ve disclosed things. He will go fucking nuts. He will deny it all.
He will call me a liar. He will ask why I didn’t leave, or say anything when we were together, or even after he left.
I’m actually terrified about what is going to happen next.

agatha I don’t know how I missed your post in the middle there.

I did call social services who basically sent me away with a flea in my ear as I have no reason to believe he’s physically abusing them. I asked about their emotional and mental health and was told unless I believed he was physically abusing them (beyond the forcible way dd was being handled into the car which didn’t seem to matter), it was a matter for my solicitor not SW.

I wouldn't worry about him finding out. She is definitely not going to say anything.

I've been there. My youngest DD gave evidence to the judge verbally but refused permission to have it written so he'd not have proof against her. She was 8 at the time. Eldest DD 9 did give the full picture as she could see that this was there chance to get out and they might not get another.

The thing is my dc never saw any abuse. Bloody hell, I never saw it till I was out and not for months afterwards and probably much longer before I accepted the truth of it.
My dc know their dad is a liar and a cheat and are quite vitriolic when they say so but at the same time they appear to enjoy lots of aspects of being with him.
But the things they dislike he refuses to acknowledge and it confuses them and makes them distrust him I think.

Onit you have done the right thing. He’s an abusive bastard. Of course he would deny it - she will know this and so will the sheriff. They come across this all the time.
You take care.

I know that fear too, Onit. That is how he managed to control you for so long and so subtly- that fear "kept you in your place". It is huge progress that you have talked about it and are considering the impact of the abuse on your DC. The person you spoke to sounds very switched on and her input could be very valuable. So keep on pushing through that fear.

Sounds like the sheriff saw through the crocodile tears. It's always a red flag when emails are used as barriers.

Of course he will deny it. It doesn't matter.
You have done absolutely the right thing to open up to this person, & hopefully you will tell her all the worst things too.
It is such a relief to find someone who understands the EA.
This adds a chink of light into the darkness.
Good Good Good.

That's such a great development Onit, I'm so glad your children have someone who will be fighting their corner with you.

He's going to be annoyed and blame you for everyhting no matter what you do, so in a way it doesn't matter if he finds out. My ex apparently still talks about me disparagingly twenty years after we split up. You'll never be able to come to an amicable relationship with him, even if you acquiesce to his every whim, so try to disregard his reactions. Just keep on as you are and let him waste his time ranting away about someone who doesn't care.

It must feel so amazing that the court have validated your concerns. Fingers crossed that you get the right outcome for the kids.

Onit the children's welfare officer sounds really positive. He can't punish you further than he has done already and if he treats the DC any more badly than he does already, that will come out too. The children's views will be totally confidential.

You didn't disclose, the sheriff read between the lines. Fuck him. He can't do anything to you.

How are you, onit? How are the children ?

Dc came back on Saturday night from 9 days with their dad. Both were in good spirits and had a good time. Lots of hugs and chatter. DS especially was very cuddly.

The lady’s coming tomorrow lunchtime to meet with us at home. One minute I’m pleased that they will have their chance to be heard and the next I’m terrified.
The cat is out of the bag. But this is for my dc. Whatever shitstorm rains down.
I want to protect my dc from my reality but it dawned on me today at counselling that I can’t. Because my reality is not independent of theirs. It’s just lived at a different angle. I’ve been so set on them never knowing (and hoping I could ignore the worst things he did to me), that I never really thought I’d properly face it. But it’s not been my choice and I’m not ready. I’ll do what needs to be done for my dc’s sake but I’m so frightened.

Onit:

"he said, she said".

Document, document, document.

And next time? Don't pick them up and struggle. Film HIM doing it. If he won't? He will have to leave empty handed.

I hope the meeting goes okay. I understand the not wanting your child to hear something before you are prepared. IME it was totally fine and the child was okay and I eventually was.

Remember, you didn't cause this. He did. He cheated. He broke up the marriage and upended the DCs family as they knew it. He's been abusive and controlling of you. He's financially controlled you to the point the dc could have gone without. He's bullied you. He's bullied the children. He's been neglectful of the children. He's been a complete shit.

The meeting today went very well. She recognised his behaviour for what it is. Controlling, manipulative, bullying, gaslighting. Recognised the ptsd response I have to emails. I told her about the missed maintenance payment and his response.
More importantly she understood my fear of the repercussions to both me and the dc and has said she will follow up after the sheriffs decision. She said she hadn’t contacted their dad and wouldn’t unless the dc disclosed something to her that meant she had to tell him to stop. She said she could point me to counselling for the dc if necessary.
She listened to me and tomorrow she’ll listen to the dc. She told me I could have support at court from the DASAT team if I asked for it.
I didn’t disclose any sexual abuse. It was in my head but I just couldn’t bring myself to say it.

Why couldn't you say it? Could you explore that which may help make a decision about it.

It could help your case as it shows the whole picture of the kind of man, husband and father he is.

If you can't say the words it would be okay to email it to her.

I was very aware the dc were in the house and, though they were upstairs, I felt it wasn’t appropriate.
I’m aware I should’ve said it. I did tell her the lady at WA had given me the police liaison officers number but, I guess now coercive control is also an offence, she may assume that is why.
I know I need to tell her. It’s not important in this situation how difficult I find it. I will ask her for a few minutes tomorrow before she speaks to the dc. It’s important that she knows so the sheriff gets all the facts.
Then it’s up to the him to decide what’s best.

Apologies, I didn't realise the children were there in the house when you were talking to her. I wasn't blaming you and I'm sorry if it came across as such. Maybe write it down if that would help. At 14 I had to say what someone had done to me. I understand how bloody hard it is .

It’s ok Sunshine
I didn’t take it the wrong way at all. It’s good that you said it because I might not have resolved to say it at all. And it’s very important I do.
Not least because sharing that information not only provides an accurate picture of the dc’s father but also because it chips away some more of what is obviously the very deep denial that he was (and is only) abusive to me. Because it’s not true that everything shitty that he ever did was my fault. I didn’t make him cheat or lie or leave or move away. He chose to do all those things. And I didn’t make him manipulate and gaslight and control and coerce me. He chose to do all those things.
And I didn’t make him rape me. He did that.

Hi onit it haven’t posted for ages but I do read your thread. I was delighted to hear that the meeting with the welfare officer went well and I will be thinking of you and the children today. Fingers crossed.

I have a feeling she probably suspects the sexual abuse and may not be that surprised when you disclose to her today. I have no personal experience of this but I think you will feel so relieved if you manage to tell her.

On a totally different matter I saw a comment from you on a weight loss thread I was reading. Bloody hell woman I had no idea that you had lost so much weight. I know you have mentioned your weight loss before. The fact you have lost that amount and managed to keep most of it off just goes to show how strong and determined you are. I am in total awe of your ability to do that given all you are going through. I keep losing and regaining the same couple of stone and I am thoroughly sick of it. You have inspired me to do better for myself and my family. If you can do it with all the shit you have to deal with then I can do it too. Thank you.

I'm so happy that you've found someone who gets all the issues and will support you with the sheriff. I hope that the DC are able to share honestly with her too.

As for shielding them, sadly it has gone beyond that. If he had been a better man/ father it would never have come to this. HE caused it, never forget that.

I had my DD at CAMHS the other day, she is 14 now, and for the first time I heard her speak about our whole sorry saga. I tried so hard to protect her from it, to keep it to myself, but out it all came ....coercion, lying, gaslighting, intimidation, financial control, bullying, rages, narcissistic behaviour, blaming me, selfishness, abandonment of the DC... everything. And she told him she thought I had PTSD and still lived in fear of him. I was so sad she had to live through all that, gutted that I couldn't protect her from it... but the counsellor said that it was clear I had done everything I could and tried to make up for him for years, tried to make their life better, but at the end of the day he was the one who needed to change, not me, and I had to let that go now.

I think you are in the same place with it all Onit.

On a more positive note, I'm off to find that weight loss thread. Not only am I letting go my attempts to make up for my DC having a crap father, I'm letting go the extra weight I have piled on as a "coping" strategy.

I'm so sorry for all you and your children have gone through, onit.