Debt and my husband have fucked our future

[Smidgen15]

Hi All

Im heartbroken

I found out this morning that my husband had 4 secret credit cards....
I knew of some debt but not any of this.

We are supposed to be starting IVF (for a sibling for my DS) in 2weeks.

I feel robbed of potentially owning a house, my son has been robbed of a sibling.

I cant eat or sleep. Im mess

I’d always go through with my husband when it comes to finances. It’s not about trust, but that I want to take responsibility as well.

You need to snap out of the self pity and take responsibility for making changes.

Currently you’re in shock and your angry. Which is understandable.
But I wouldn’t say this was relationship ending stuff. I would say this a wake up call for you and him in your relationship.

Oh yeah and as he is 55 and clearly had a lot of loans in his life. I would imagine that he might be owed some PPI
look into that first thing tomorrow (not with a company)
I got 25k

Exactly how much debt does he have with store accounts?

Have you looked at his very account and littlewoods account and Amazon also do credit... Exactly how much debt does he have with online store accounts?

Any overdrafts?

You need to use today to get an absolutely clear and complete picture of the amounts owed and who they are owed too.

Then you work out the minimum you need to live on (2 adults and one child can get their family shop down to £20 if you meal plan and go very very simple - there are lots of threads on here for that). You need to cut out everything; and he needs to hand over control of all his eBay and shopping accounts to you.

I wanted my son so very much, i cant not give him the things he deserves to enjoy his little life.

"the things he deserves to enjoy his little life"

I was full of sympathy until I read that. He's a child. You're in debt. You and your husband 'deserving things' is what has you in a mess.

OP. You thought the consolidation loan last year had the debt fully under control, so of course you are upset that there's further debt, and DH hasn't been upfront with you. As other posters have said, you need to do a proper detailed budget to work out everything going in and out of both your accounts - as on the face of it, your joint income looks pretty healthy, and your rent isn't that time.

Cut up his cards.
Sell one car.
Resell all ebay shit and put all funds from resales into debt repayment.
Go on Freecycle (sign up to your nearest wealthy area as well as local area) for beds etc. You can get new or next to new things free.

Cut bills. Food bill is easiest to cut. Don't eat out, buy takeaways etc. Buy basics and cook from scratch. Get rid of landline ifyou have mobile contracts. Get rid of Sky if you have it, renegotiate utilities and mobile contracts.

Make a huge list of fun stuff you can do as a family for free or almost free: parks, galleries, museums, walks, local festivals, picnics, netflix and popcorn nights at home, cycling, free music events etc. Look up free local events online.

You can pay this money off. It's not horrendous. It's manageable.

WHat children deserve to enjoy life is your time, play8ng with them not expensive things. A trip to the park.

You do seem have pushed responsib8lity for finance to your dh which is unfair. you asked him “can we afford this” . putting all the pressure on him. And then get upset when it goes wrong.

You earn over £50K between you - £20K worth of debt should not be insurmountable with that kind of income.

You should go to MSE website and look in the 'debt-free wannabe' forums - they will go through your expenditure, show you where you can save, and suggest ways of reducing your debt quickly. TBH I'd be a bit surprised of the debt management charities would be willing to take you on when you have a decent income.

Previous posters have suggested you start to write down every single penny you spend - this is the quickest and easiest way of seeing where your money goes - you'll probably be horrified .

As far as the IVF goes, only you can make that decision. If it was me, I probably wouldn't do it for the following reasons:
You already have one beloved boy;
There are no guarantees the IVF will be successful - in fact it is more likely statistically that it won't be;
You have no savings to cushion your maternity leave - how would you feel about having to return to work only a few weeks after giving birth;
If your DH is 55 now, he could be 56/7 by the time a baby comes along. He will be looking at retirement in 10 years, before your children have left school, in his early seventies by the time your existing son goes to university, mid seventies when your second child goes - again, you appear to have no savings so how will you help your children out financially during the expensive teenage years and then into university?

So everyone who is telling your 55yo DH to "get a second job"
My DH and are are 52 and would find it physically and mentally knackering to work our regular jobs then do a few evenings over time . You are asking for a complete mental burnout .

Your DMum will look after the New Baby so no childcare costs. Oh that always works out well doesn't it ? What if she is ill, cannot manage a newborn/toddler , just doesn't want to.

Your job could change like your DH.

You say he's 55 , but what is your age? Your fertility years are more of an issue.

If you are successful in having your 2nd baby and end up with altered hours, no childcare and a burned out DH.......what then?

Are you 100% sure he is on board (I just asked mine and he said "No way would I want a baby at 55" ) He might be subconciously sabotageing (sp) things

I just can’t get over the fact you were considering IVF when you’re in £14k of debt and were going to be using debt to fund it too.

The urge to procreate is a strong one but at a certain point you do have to take a step back, assess your situation and ask if you’d be having a child because you can provide for them and give them what they deserve, or if you’re selfishly putting your own desire for a baby above the reality you’d be bringing the baby into.

To proceed with trying for another child in this position or the position you believed you were in is selfish in the extreme. I’m sorry you’re in shock finding out about this extra debt (and on your incomes you’re in a LOT of debt) but I think it’s a blessing in disguise if it has made you pump the brakes on trying for another baby before it was too late and you’d gone through with it.

Smidgen15 Here is a link to Martin Lewis’s site. They have a great budget form there that covers everything like child care and petrol as well as rent and utilities. It will help you if you then get in touch with one of the various charities about a DMP: forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=76. Try to have a rest and when you feel better, have a go at filling it in, ideally together. One of the nice things about reading the posts there is that you will find many couples have what they call ‘a lightbulb moment’ and that once they do this, it is much easier to live on their budget. As your son is nearly 4, I’d love it if a relative with a little child suggested bed contributions for his birthday. That way I’d know I was getting something he really needed. This is a horrible thing to have happened but now you have a chance to turn things round instead of finding yourself a year down the line when the debt is even worse.

I would advise against an IVA as I believe it I for five years and you have to live on a very very tight budget. The allowances in bankruptcy are more generous and even if he gets an IPA (income payments arrangement where you pay your monthly surplus to the official receiver to distribute amongst your creditors) it is only three years. Definitely seek advice from one of the debt charities mentioned by others though, good luck.

Do think about what your son “having the best” really means, and how that will benefit him.
My eldest was in a weird situation where she was at private school paid for mostly by non-resident dad, but living with me on a budget because I wasn’t a high earner. Her dad wouldn’t buy her the best because once the divorce order came, he even resisted buying things like shampoo for her at his house as I should get it.
When my daughter occasionally asked for things like a mobile, or a mobile with a camera (10+ years ago) or a particular brand, I’d just say , sorry, we couldn’t afford it and her friends’ parents probably had more money than us. She understoood. She’d get the odd Ted Baker type thing she’d lusted after for birthday and Christmas but normal clothes, shoes etc were cheap high street as were mine.
What she did have, was bedtime stories until she was old enough to think them too babyish, fun cheap days out with picnics , - I called them “mystery tours”, friends welcome round to our terraced house that her friends in vast detached commuter village houses loved because it was in the city and close to stuff. Divorce and aftermath aside it was a happy childhood and adolescence. She has been very successful into adulthood and is very happy.
I changed career when she went to
University and my income dropped further. At 42 I went without a car for 2 years for the first time in my life. Work would have been over an hour’s walk so I cycled in all weathers or got buses. Are you sure you can’t do without one of your cars and drop each other off/walk/use public transport? If DS is only 3, is he even at school yet? Or could you find a childcare provider closer to home.
I think you are still in the reacting stage, which is fair enough, but you need to get into planning mode. I think you are projecting a lot of your own grief and resistance into your son, who will remain oblivious, happy and flourishing if you manage things well.
I wouldn’t do IVF in your shoes, the costs and succes rates don’t add up. If it did work, your son could be deeply upset by a new baby, as my brother was, or the baby could be very high needs or have disabilities that impact on your ability to earn, as my second daughter did. Friends of ours agonised over this after their first IVF baby, ideally they would have loved him to have a sibling, but they decided that their son was so precious they didn’t want to risk his mother’s health (she had a rough time with IVF) or future in any way by changes. Also my friend was 39 and dad mid-forties and that was a consideration. Dad is 50 this year, their DS is the light of their lives and I know they are now very glad they made a decision that wasn’t at all easy at the time. They go on holiday and trips out all the time with close friends with a son the same age and he has loads of friends so he isn’t playing alone in a tower as people seem to think with onlys.

I agree with a pp. You were considering having IVF, knowing you had £14k of debt. Know you know it's £21k. It's bad, but not THAT bad. An extra £7k. I'd still go for IVF.

Plan for how to pay it off. It is manageable. Once you'd sold the drone, the camera, eBay his clothes and anything else you can, it would reduce considerably.

It is your fault that you didn't get a handle on your family debt when you were planning an enormous expenditure.

It's not your fault that your DH hid debt from you. This would constitute a huge breach of trust to me and I am not sure I could get over it.

I really hope that this thread has given you some ideas about budgeting and financial planning. You need to put together an organised plan for ensuring you are not putting yourself in a more vulnerable financial position. You need to start unloading the debt. If something else went wrong (illness, someone losing a job), you currently have no buffer. This is a very precarious position to be in and I think people here are concerned for you as a result.

Are you 100% sure he is on board (I just asked mine and he said "No way would I want a baby at 55" ) He might be subconciously sabotageing (sp) things

^^This.

Also, I do agree to a certain extent with PPs that children are a long-term life goal and debt shouldn't necessarily interfere with meeting this goal - but obviously going through with the IVF would require a lot more penny pinching and financial planning than what you would need to do in your current position.

Allocating fault (to either of you) isn't helping, and I get the impression this thread isn't helping you either. You need practical help. Find the SOA template on MSE and work out all your income and outgoings, and they'll help you make a plan to pay off the debt as quickly as possible, but also in a realistic manner.

forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=76

You say i havent asked the questions... why should i? He is a 55 year old man/father... surely he has a no button.

You took a lower paid job without knowing what the impact would be on your finances. That's a very vulnerable position to put yourself in as you've now found out.

I wouldn’t get him to go bankrupt unless your certain you’ve explored every other option. It’s big and never goes away. It can cause issues depending on what job you do. A debt management plan is good (I’ve been in mine for 14 loooong years) or an iva. A debt relief order is also something worth googling. Step change and payplan are the ones you need to talk to.

But if it’s in his name, he absolutely has to rip that plaster off and sort it, you cannot do it for him.

Sticking your head in the sand for all these years is what has contributed to your anxiety about this situation. It sounds like you have both carried on spending without thinking about your finances very much.
I went on an IVA and it was the best thing I ever did. My exH was the one to suggest it while we were still married. We had a loan and he had various credit cards (one he'd secretly obtained and spent on). He'd criticise me die buying our two children clothes whilst continuing to rack up debt on eBay tat and gaming. Going on the Iva gave us more money to play with each month as we were allotted amounts for clothes, shoes, socialising, emergencies, as well as all the bills. We were much more comfortable and I am now debt free. He has since racked up £3K on a credit card so hasn't learnt his lesson. He's paying out £850 on a car each month so his priorities are all wrong.
My friend has used step change with great results. They help you budget which is hugely beneficial.
My income is half yours, my rent £850 a month and I have 3 children. We have a good life and are not deprived in any way. I'm not sure how you think your child will be living in poverty on over £50K.
Time to take control of things together and make a plan to get rid of your debts. An Iva might not be right for you but there will be some solution. The relief is fantastic once things are under control.

Yeah go for IVF OP. Cause what you need right now is to substantially increase your debt on a gamble that you'll get a second child from it. To a 55 year old man who can't handle money and probably won't be working in a few years. What a great plan for a happy life - for you and your child.

Phone StepChange today and see what they say before assuming it can’t work. I know several family members who have used them to deal with big debts and actually have a better lifestyle afterwards.

You can sell lots of stuff like the drone. Your son can have a second hand bed, it won’t kill him.

It’s all manageable but you need to actually do something proactive rather than just bleat on about how awful life is.

"years ago, my ex made me go on a DMP with stepchange...one of my creditors added interest and it nearly doubled."

I'm sympathetic regarding the baby but it does sound like you're both really bad with money.