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Original poster

DH and OW's baby. Can he see the baby without seeing OW?

999 replies

Lovelytea · 30/12/2018 19:50

Husband cheated and got somebody pregnant but i decided to work on forgiving him to keep my family together. Would it be possible for him to have a relationship with the baby without having direct contact with the OW?

He confessed what he'd done himself I suspect because she was going to tell me anyway. We split for 6 weeks whilst i decided how to proceed. During this time I had conversations with the OW and I do believe it was just a one night stand that culminated from an EA and that he was no longer in touch with her. He has been transparent ever since.

He bitterly regrets the affair and cut contact with her before he told me what they'd done. Eventually I agreed to stand by him and we're now going through counselling to work through the problems we were ignoring prior to the EA, of which there were a few.

After coming to terms with the reality of the situation I realise the baby needs it's father. As far as our family goes I'm prepared to facilitate a relationship between our DC and their half sibling, I'm prepared to have the baby over our house and for our DC to slowly get to know them. It will be painful but I'd never begrudge an innocent baby a relationship with its relatives on my watch.

The babies mother has told DH in a series of rambling texts that the baby will have nothing to do with our DC and she won't allow them to come to our house. She wants him to spend time at her house with her and the baby if he wants to know him and that our family are to have nothing to do with him or be involved in discussions.

Unfortunately that doesn't sit right with me because she's made it very clear she wants to be with DH. I've seen messages where she has said as much and she's been particularly vile about me and our DC. I don't think I should have to put up with such vitrol after what they've done and if anything it should be me lashing out which im not. Although he has been unfaithful she isn't entirely innocent and is a manipulative, spiteful and so herself.

She isn't interested in being civil and adult about the situation and has done nothing but cause trouble since it became apparent I'd be standing by him. She was expecting me to leave him and for him to go and be with her and the baby. He has said he wants no contact with her whatsoever but does want to see his baby which I think he should.

So my question is, is there any way he can have a relationship with his baby without having to have direct contact with her?

We're trying to repair after what he did and quite frankly I cannot stomach the thought of him spending any time alone with the woman. I don't want to break up my family so please don't tell me to LTB as for now I've decided to try to make it work. It's been a long and painful period of deliberation but for now I'm satisfied that I've chosen what's best for my family.

A relative dealing with hand overs? A contact centre perhaps? If he took her to court would they support his stance of not wanting to speak to her? Is that even possible?

The baby is 2 weeks old now and he's yet to meet him.

OP posts:
DBML · 01/01/2019 20:28

You would be very unreasonable to expect her to hand a newborn over for contact away from her though.

I don’t think OP was really expecting the new born to be handed over. She’s asking if her DH HAS to visit the baby alone at the OW’s house.
I think OW is unreasonable to expect this as well. So perhaps no contact is best for now.

adaline · 01/01/2019 20:32

She’s asking if her DH HAS to visit the baby alone at the OW’s house.
I think OW is unreasonable to expect this as well.

Why is she unreasonable to expect her baby's father to see the baby alone in it's own home so they can bond?

adaline · 01/01/2019 20:33

The courts won’t allow the OW to claim maintenance and then refuse the DH access to his DC.

Maintenance and access are completely separate issues. Even men who are not allowed around their children are liable for maintenance.

NCwithAvocado · 01/01/2019 20:41

Hi, NC here. I haven't read all the posts but found myself in the OP's position 9 months ago. I actually posted on MN for advice.
Without derailing the thread, I try to be practical and just say what i have done so far.

  1. Posted on MN
  2. Told some trusted friends.
  3. Seen a lawyer.
  4. Started a diary
5.Told an older child (late teen)
  1. Tried a counselling together, did not work
  2. Found myself a cheap counselling which helps
  3. Read around the subject, both books and online
  4. Took long walks to clear my head
10. Filed for divorce. i was also given an option to keep the family together, with H taking time out for his alternative family (they live in another country). It is not for me, as the others said, it is like slow painful death. Also, the betrayal is just too big... So, from what I have read - if both people would like to keep a family, no contact with OW is possible. Child should be taken for contact to the public places like a playground and to be accompanied by a third person. That's when a man had a child. If a woman had a child, the child is usually raised within the current family. In my case, H has no control over the action of the OW at all. He has seen the child once in 26 months of his life. Now OW blocked him completely and he is worried and upset about it. No paternity test has been done so far. He is not on BC.
deepwatersolo · 01/01/2019 20:50

It is unreasonable, because OW denigrated the man‘s wife and children and relayed all kind of details about affair&pillow talk to his wife in an attempt to blow the marriage up, resulting in the man going no contact with OW. Considering this is clearly destructive behaviour it would be unwise to (a) give OW a chance to further berate DH‘s family to him, as the price for him to see the child, (b) give OW leverage to strain the marriage by making up stories about what DH said or did on his visit, stories that are impossible to prove or disprove and that she might try to feed to the wife in order to make the wife go away (something she tried hard to accomplish in the past).

deepwatersolo · 01/01/2019 20:56

adaline DH is not on the birth certificate. There is therefore no basis for maintainance. It would need a DNA test for him to be forced to pay maintainance. At which point a court would be hard pressed to deny DH visitation rights (unless OW goes full bunny boiler and says DH tried to murder her child or so in one of those unsupervised visits in her home she insists on. One reason more not to see her alone Wink).

adaline · 01/01/2019 20:56

Right, so when is he supposed to see his newborn @deepwatersolo? Because to me it looks like the options are a) in it's home with it's primary carer present, or b) he just doesn't see him. Because no court in the land is going to say that she has to hand over her newborn for several hours at a time when there is a perfectly viable alternative.

Even in circumstances where the parents were together, it's very rare for a young baby to be away from it's primary carer for long periods of time at all. If the baby is breastfed, for example, how is that going to work if the mother is at home and the dad has taken it out? Lots of BF babies refuse bottles and not all mum's can express enough for the baby to have breastmilk out of a bottle.

adaline · 01/01/2019 20:58

adaline DH is not on the birth certificate. There is therefore no basis for maintainance. It would need a DNA test for him to be forced to pay maintainance. At which point a court would be hard pressed to deny DH visitation rights

Of course the first step is getting a DNA test and going on the birth certificate.

But assuming he is the father and pays maintenance, that still doesn't give him the right to dictate where access takes place and when. The courts will take the need of the child into consideration and a newborn should be in it's home with it's mum, especially if it's breastfed and has never met it's father before.

deepwatersolo · 01/01/2019 21:05

As you rightly said, the only thing that counts for a newborn is the primary carer. So, no harm done if DH waits until OW feels ready to go to the park where DH can meet the child, in the presence of a mediator. If OW does not agree to do that in the first, say, 3 months, there is obviously an agenda and it will have to go through courts, anyway.

DBML · 01/01/2019 21:37

Why is she unreasonable to expect her baby's father to see the baby alone in it's own home so they can bond?

Because she wants to play happy families with someone else’s husband perhaps?

adaline · 01/01/2019 21:39

Because she wants to play happy families with someone else’s husband perhaps?

That's not the baby's fault though.

MariaNovella · 01/01/2019 21:40

A park in winter is hardly a suitable place for a baby and its father to meet. And there is no justification at all for the presence of a third party (“mediator”) at any meeting at all. A baby and it’s two parents need to be left in peace to form a healthy three way relationship.

DBML · 01/01/2019 21:42

That's not the baby's fault though.

I didn’t say it was. So the baby will lose out thanks to his irresponsible parents.

MariaNovella · 01/01/2019 21:42

Because she wants to play happy families with someone else’s husband perhaps?

You may disapprove but that is not a good enough reason to force a third party into the relationship.

Cassie85 · 01/01/2019 21:43

I honestly can’t believe the amount of hatred and judgment cast at the OW. Obviously she has acted in an appalling way by sleeping with another woman’s husband. It’s unforgiveable.

But a lot of PPs, mostly women, are giving the impression that as she has engaged in this ‘affair’ she somehow deserves to be either:

1 - parted from her two week old newborn, in order to soothe OPs suspicion.

OR

2- have her child unable to bond with it’s father.

I think there is a bigger picture here and that is of what is best for this baby. Also, the husband is a piece of work, it was him who had loyalty to his wife, him who broke their trust. There is generally far too muchof this labelling OW as ‘blowing a marriage apart’. The husband blew the marriage apart when he cheated. And now he is the one who has to live with the consequences of this, they shouldn’t be inflicted on a baby.

I truly am sorry for OP, she deserves none of this.

DBML · 01/01/2019 21:44

A park in winter is hardly a suitable place for a baby and its father to meet. And there is no justification at all for the presence of a third party (“mediator”) at any meeting at all. A baby and it’s two parents need to be left in peace to form a healthy three way relationship.

Rubbish. And have you forgotten about the actual wife and existing new born who should also have been/ be left alone to form a relationship?

DBML · 01/01/2019 21:46

You may disapprove but that is not a good enough reason to force a third party into the relationship

OW is the third party in the relationship. I have no sympathy for her. The baby yes, but he’s just a product of his parent’s stupidity. They are not and never will be a family.

Cassie85 · 01/01/2019 21:49

I think the relationship PP is referring to is the one between child and parents. OW is certainly not a third party in that.

DBML · 01/01/2019 21:50

@Cassie85

OW was not forced into having sex with a married man. She is equally to blame. She knew of his situation and lacked the self respect to give him a wide birth.

She was not using BC properly (as did he not use a condom). She decided to keep a baby conceived with a married man. She has to take responsibility for her actions and accept the consequences.

I don’t rate him either, but as OP is choosing to stay with him, I guess he doesn’t get what he deserves at the moment. I hope he realises how lucky he is.

Cassie85 · 01/01/2019 21:54

She is not equally to blame, he had a wife and a family, he is the prime problem here. I’m not defending what OW has done.

And what are the consequences of her actions? The welfare of her child coming second to the mistrust of OP? I don’t think any mother is going to put what’s best for her child second to anything, which is why I can’t understand why so many posters expect OW to do this. As if by making a mistake and sleeping with someone she shouldn’t have somehow erodes her rights to be a mother. It’s bizarre.

I honestly, am not trying to take anything away from OP, she’s in a horrendous position and none of this is her fault.

My point is that none of it is the baby’s fault either and expecting him to bond with his father under constraints made by OP to make her feel better about the situation is unfair. And OW is perfectly right, as a mother to not agree to this.

adaline · 01/01/2019 21:55

I didn’t say it was. So the baby will lose out thanks to his irresponsible parents.

He doesn't have to miss out though. The three adults in the situation need to put their feelings aside and do what's best for the baby.

Cassie85 · 01/01/2019 21:58

And what’s best for baby, IMO is what OW is suggesting, for dad to bond with baby in its own environment with its primary care giver there too.

I know that’s proper shit for OP. But that’s what’s best for baby unfortunately.

DBML · 01/01/2019 21:58

@cassie85

I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree.
I think both the DH and this ow are a disgrace in equal measure. OP should put herself and her children first and not give the ow a moment of consideration.
If she wants to stay with her husband and he wants to stay with her, it is unrealistic to think that he’s going to be able to have a family relationship with ow and the new baby.
His and the Ow mess. If the consequences are such that the baby doesn’t get that bond with his dad, then they have no one to thank for that but themselves.

Cassie85 · 01/01/2019 22:01

DBML, I’m honestly not condoning what she’s done. I just feel that as the one with the family, the husband has behaved in a worse way. Although tbh, apportioning blame is pointless, let’s just agree they are both in the wrong.

I’m with you that OP needs to boot him out. She deserves better and so do her kids. It’s an awful mess.

DBML · 01/01/2019 22:01

And what if the op’s babies Cassie?
The new baby by the ow should be prioritised?

Say the words to yourself...
Your daddy wasn’t involved because I slept with a married man.
I’d hate both my parents for that one. They are both responsible and should BOTH be compromising...as OP has a baby to consider too.