Confronting DH about his sulking

[jamaisjedors]

To cut a long story short, we went away for the weekend for my birthday plus the anniversary of a family bereavement for me and DH gave me the silent treatment and sulked all day Saturday and pretty much all weekend.

We sat down and discussed our point of views about the weekend and I have expressed how lonely and hurt I felt. He has expressed that he felt I was ungrateful and ruined his weekend and failed to ask what was wrong with him.

It's been left there. I think he thinks that's that, done but I can't get past it and feel really distant from him.

This is not the first time he's done it, and actually I swore never to let him get away with it again, yet I'm still here.

I'm not perfect and this is what he will bring up if I confront him but I'm not sure how to bring it up without taking it all over again.

I'm thinking of leaving but maybe that's overdramatic, seems ridiculous to end a 20+ year relationship and shake up my kids lives for this - maybe I need to get a thicker skin?

What towel says.

...his parents, in particular his mother, never let him decide for himself.

I'd take that with a pinch of salt iiwy.

Abusers are in a whole other league, jamais. Normal rules don't apply.

That @TowelNumber42 has got it in one

(and... knows where her towel is)

Finally Lately in real life I have been doing a great job of knowing where my towel is and knowing the answer to life the universe and everything while actually being somewhat confused and not entirely sure what the question is. Hence the name change

The thing with his mum is something he has said before but never in relation to me, I am the one making the link with our relationship and the way he is with me and he agreed that there was probably something in it.

But thinking about that now I realise I am just seeking more excuses for his behaviour.

It's a kind of cognitive dissonance, he is so successful, dynamic, and all round admired that I can't quite think that the problem is HIM and not me.

Some personality traits that make a person successful in work make them disastrous in relationships. It is remarkably common.

So if he has these deep childhood issues, what is he doing to rectify this? Is he seeking counselling for himself, buying self help books etc or is just for you to feel sorry for him and change your behaviour so he isn't triggered? Have you met his mother and observed their relationship for yourself?

OP you seem like an amazing person and you are trying to do the right thing but a relationship really shouldn't be this difficult.

You shouldn't have to establish and guard your boundaries so rigorously. It sounds more like a battle than a loving partnership.

It doesn't matter if you have children and many years together, a relationship should never get to the stage where you have to police it like this.

Time to leave and live without the constant watching and analysing. 💐

@blackcat86 up til now, no he has always said it was me with the issues, and as I do have some of my own, I was tempted to believe him.

I am stronger now, and have gained in self-confidence due to certain things in my career so I'm less inclined to believe that now.

I guess I wavered and agreed to try for another six months because he finally did admit he needed to go to counselling and has now been for his first appointment. I thought that that was such a huge step that I had been waiting for so long for, that I agreed to stay.

But now, particularly from reading "Should I stay or should I go?" about the cost of staying, and the risk that even if the other person changes, YOU/I won't feel the same, I'm wondering if I want to stick around while he "works on himself".

His point was that he had a very bad shock with a health diagnosis 2 years ago and that until now he has not been available mentally to work on himself and our relationship because he has been coming to terms with that (plus a bereavement earlier this year).

Again, this convinced me that I was being unreasonable to expect him to change up til now, and that he was serious about it now.

@Isthisit22 I have periodically wondered whether it was normal to always be on my guard about my boundaries, and usually concluded that it was because of my issues.

Again, now I think you are probably right and I wish I had seen this 10 years ago, or to be honest, even during the first 10 years when things were mostly great but dealing with conflict was always problematic.

That makes sense OP. It's really tough when you're with someone to makes you feel so guilty for wanting normal things and to be treated with love and decency. It's great that he's accessing counselling but that doesn't mean you can't still and the relationship and separate whilst he works on himself. Of course you have issues, we all do! Everyone has their stuff.

Think about whether it's reciprocal. In healthy relationships we would care for our partners and support them through hard times BUT would receive the same back. Have a think about whether this is the case or are you expected to shelve how you feel in order to support him again?

I don't have much wisdom or advice to offer, so I'll offer my opinion

He doesn't take responsibility for himself at all. Everything is your fault. You provoked him, you were busy for two weekends (WTAF?!?!), you didn't do what he needed. Where is his part in all this? There is absolutely no self reflection or awareness.

And he's doing it again.

He had a tough medical diagnosis. None of this is his doing because he had a bereavement. He hasn't been emotionally available because of coming to terms blah blah blah.

Every time you've had the spotlight on you (birthday weekend), he switches on the abuse. It's a conscious decision. You don't toe the line? Well here come the sulks.

It is all about controlling you and taking no responsibility for his actions.

I agree with springydaff about whether his mum really did control him as much as he says. I reckon not. Yet another excuse.

Unless he acknowledges these things as the core root of all evil, nothing much is going to change, and I worry that he'll continue to blame you while taking no responsibility.

And if he does work on himself and change, is it enough? Has your relationship been damaged too deeply?

Anyhow, I think you're strong, clear headed, thoughtful, analytical, responsible and entirely deserving of living free from EA.

Thing is this behaviour was there before his health diagnosis wasn't it? Was it more you felt too guilty to end it in the aftermath of the diagnosis...

@eddielizzard thanks - your opinion is pretty wise too!

And if he does work on himself and change, is it enough? Has your relationship been damaged too deeply?

This is the question I had never asked myself until recently, it always felt savable and worth fighting for and I felt partly responsible. And now I'm not at all sure it is.

It's kind of like waiting and holding out for something to happen, and then when it does, realising that it's not really that great.

His behavious over my birthday weekend showed me that even with plenty of effort on my part to adapt to him, he STILL puts the responsibility on me.

When we talked and I agreed to give it another go, I THOUGHT he had admitted that this was his fault and had taken some responsibility for it. It turns out talking about it again now, he doesn't see why he should apologise because in a relationship there is always give and take/equal responsibility.

@RandomMess - yes the behaviour was there before that. And yes I couldn't walk away from someone who had just had that diagnosis.

But now, although the health issue is still there, it's under control and I don't feel obligation linked to that.

So your logic is his pain = he can be a shit to you. You should be extra kind and understanding despite the shitty behaviour because he is sad, which trumps all else. He cannot be expected both to manage the external shocks and make any effort to be not a total dickhead.

You had a bereavement. Where was his extra kindness and massively going out of his way to enable you to be 100% selfish for a while? Several years of total selfishness seems to be the norm you apply to him.

Your logic seems to follow a one way street. His issues mean he's allowed to be a shit and you would be unreasonable to expect anything different because he has issues. Your issues mean he's allowed to be a shit and you would be unreasonable to expect anything different because you have issues. Your head is bonkers (meant with kindness).

This is what he's said to me all along and I think I bought it because my mum made the same excuses for my dad when we were younger.

Funnily (not really!) enough, his sister pointed out that his behaviour after his diagnosis was because he COULD.

She talked to a doctor friend of hers who said that often men fall apart like this and take it out on their loved ones BECAUSE THEY CAN whereas women have to hold it together for everyone else.

I am now asking myself "what am I waiting for to leave?"

I think I am just curious to see what happens in the marriage counselling and also want to talk it through afterwards with my psychologist.

But really the crunch comes down to me being brave enough to make the decision by myself, and not have to be told to do it by a counsellor or whoever else.

And I need to be brave enough to take responsibility for the fact that noone else will ever understand how things were in the marriage and that I don't have to justify myself to them.

Oh, that and trying to explain it to the DC who will be devastated because I've done such a good cover-up job all these years (and I hate myself for that now).

I caught myself covering for him last weekend when he decided he wanted to start trying on shirts in the sales after DC2's birthday lunch.

DC was complaining (only to me, not to H) that he wanted to go home and relax and that it was his birthday, and I found myself justifying H's behaviour by the fact that his family don't celebrate birthdays much and so he doesn't really realise why we like to have a special day.

I actually hate myself for that too because I'm just teaching the kids to put up with selfish behaviour by giving "excuses".

I planned on leaving my DH a few years ago after a few years of awful behaviour from him (ironically due to ill health). I remember how hard it was to reach that decision, how painful and I had to wait it out several months to but a newer more efficient car.

What those months have me was time to detach by the time I told him I wasn't that upset because I'd spent a least 2 years grieving etc. He had also made me very unwell with his gaslighting and complete withdrawal from me.

He had an epiphany hence still together and also he wasn't an abusive arse prior to him being unwell.

Sorry you had to go through that but glad he had the epiphany.

I though H had had an epiphany but I'm less and less sure now.

Which is why I'm waiting it out to be sure that I'm right.

And I am a lot more rational and rested now than in early January when I hadn't slept for a month and was racing around getting everything in order.

Just the fact of knowing that my bank account, lawyer, etc. are all there for me makes it easier and less urgent.

I have time to think clearly about where I want to live (and the house I saw is still available along with some other ones which I might visit next week).

As you say, there is no rush but the danger is getting sucked back in and keeping up the hope of an epiphany.

Children are not stupid. The "nice" adults made excuses all the time to me. I knew something was wrong. It was a great relief when I learned that I wasn't unreasonable to be upset at bad behaviour. "Nice" adults pressured me to fake being not upset like they did. I am not stupid. Nor are your children.

He did actually piss them off with the shirt trying on. You did not cover it up like you think you did. You see, it actually happened. They experienced it. They had feelings. Your cover up changes none of that. All you did was tell them it is not OK to call o
it out or express unhappiness. You did not stop it happening to them. They still had the experience and the feeling.

When you tell them you've had enough of his shit (in child friendly terms) that's going to be quite a shock to them. Not because they think everything is lovely but because they think nobody is allowed to complain.

They will have a shock, and it's heart-wrenching to think of it.

But I know I can't be "dissing" their dad to them so I can never really explain why I left.

And I have a feeling that if I don't cooperate for the time being and at least TRY the counselling, then H will tell them (and everyone else but I care less about that now that I would have done in the past) that I am the one who left, and that I am the one who abandonned the relationship.

This will be entirely reasonable to him because it's what he's saying to himself right now too.

I think I have some vague hope that in counselling there will be some recognition that we are both responsible for the state of the relationship. I doubt there will be recognition of his responsibility but I could be wrong.

It is true, age appropriate and ok to say "your Dad chooses to sulk even though he knows it is hurtful/unkind to me, I have asked him to stop but he still does it. Dad is also selfish towards me and refuses to change"

It is good for you to label his behaviour so they are not duped into thinking is ok and they are the cause. Your DC need to be empowered to say , for example, that they want to spend their birthday/Christmas with you because they know their Dad will be bad badly behaved.

You are in an alternative reality with your children.

He spoiled their weekend away remember? They've seen him be cold to you their lovely mum. There will be loads of other things he did to them.

Your idea of I've done such a good cover-up job all these years is a complete fantasy. A cruel one.

These boards are full of child survivors like me who can tell you this.

I have to admit I get angry when I see people fooling themselves that their children are not hurt because of brilliant hiding and cover up by the enabler parent. No. The children still experience it. All you do is brush aside their hurt, their confusion, dismiss it, make it unspeakable.

The only thing you covered up in shirt-gate was your unwillingness stand up for your children. They'll have got the message. Shut the fuck up kids, which is what you were doing. It worked too, right? They shutted the fuck up, yes?

Your children are real human beings that are separate to you. They experience life as it is no matter how much you tell them to stuff down the bad feelings and stay shutted up.

Please do continue to get angry, I don't need pandering or delusion.

Have you ever talked to your children about how they feel about the bad things they experience? At all?

I guess you've never let them speak freely and you just listen. I guess any attempts by them to reach out to you have been met by you explaining why they are not permitted to be cross/sad/diminished.

Counselling could be a good place to discuss learning to allow your children to express feelings you want to pretend don't exist. That will be bloody hard.

Yes I completely agree that it's good to call things what they are. Personally I think that is more comforting to acknowledge it and speak the truth rather than airbrush.

You can tell them in a non-blamey way like RandomMess suggested. You didn't like dad's behaviour and so you need a break. You're not saying HE'S horrible, just what he does.

Because exactly as TowelNumber42 says, they do notice. They just know they can't react.

I do try to talk to them about and encourage them to express their feelings, or at least to explain to the person they are angry with what the problem is.

Particularly with DS2 who tends to sulk, I have talked to him a lot about telling us exactly how he feels and how angry he is rather than just running away or stomping about.

I think actually I encourage them to tell ME how they are feeling and say they are allowed to be angry/annoyed/cross with me.

With H I have encouraged them to tell him clearly but I have also made excuses for him in the past or 'fixed things" myself.